robin for life

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

 

And if you count Semenyo and Massengo future transfers as Johnsons, you can’t include Kelly, Bryan, Reid, Flint, Kodjia, etc.  That is called “having your cake and eat it”!!  Semenyo and Massengo also weren’t worth £25m last season (that’s the year of £39m loss).  Personally I don’t think they’re worth that today either.

 

I didn't count Kodji, but I would count Kelly, Reid, Semenyo and Massengo. These were players LJ signed or promoted to the first team and gave their chance to, without LJ here, there's a chance they wouldn't have been purchased or promoted. Bryan & Flint fair enough, but both improved under LJ and got their big moves because of LJ's training. LJ was a very good coach, he just lacked the people skills needed with some, but he was influential with the youngsters and helped a lot of players develop. We could do a lot worse than have him scouting for youth players and managing our U-23s, a job I think he would be perfect for and would be a lot less pressure for him and I think both parties would mutually benefit from. He is a got spotter of young talent, he has shown that at Barnsley, here and at Sunderland.

I may be considered Pro Lee Johnson and it will anger most, but he is a better manager than what we have now. People chastise his recruitment but its actually nonsense. We played better football under Johnson and looked like a top half team, we now look like relegation awaiting to happen. People go on about the £39m loss, as if its all his fault, are people forgetting COVID!!! He was sacked in the season that had to be broken down because of Covid and at a time clubs had no money to buy players and it was behind closed doors. The fact was when he was preparing for the 19/20 season I doubt anyone expected Covid to come along, this meant purchases made that season were based on a normal budget and also with the expectation, that come the following summer certain players would be sold on. The world of football changed, and the clubs outlay and income was massively affected. You can't put the blame of £39m losses on a managers head, when Covid crippled it in more ways then one! When you look at Johnson's signings how bad really were they, I've broken them down here in each Full year he was in charge. My opinion his recruitment was not as bad as people think,

2016 - 2017 Season

Lee Tomlin - Fans demanded this, brilliant on loan, ultimately big flop, but LJ is not the blame for this, the fans wanted this signing more than anyone , plus we didn't lose much on him, by selling to Cardiff
Magnússon - Good quality defender for City, ended up being sold on for profit - Positive Signing
Djuric - Big flop admittedly but was at the right age and price (1.6m) that had it worked out, would have had sell on value
Taylor Moore - Huge flop but 1.5m at the time for an England under 20 player, no one was whining about him when we signed him but he was a flop. 
Engvall - Probably Johnson's worse signing, decent money paid, showed nothing, left for peanuts Negative Signing
O'Dowda - Highly rated when signed for 1m, may not be the standard we need now, but had 5 years here and been a first team player the whole time. For £1m, he has been a solid signing.
Matt Taylor - Signed to piss off the Gas, no other reason. Didn't lose money, wasn't bad or good for us.
Hegeler - Brought in cheaply because of top flip experience in Germany, wasn't very good but at 250K he wasn't expensive.
O'Neill - Done a job for the time he was here, he was free and played a number of games and was OK at this level.
Brownhill - Signed on a free, sold for massive profit - Excellent Business
Girolamo - Cheap buy for academy, never progressed, no loss no profit
Paterson - Quality signing for us, and was key player for 4 years. Still solid at this level - Positive Signing
Bailey Wright - Decent captain at this level for us, wasn't expensive and was a solid part of our defence for 3 seasons - Not good or bad signing
Adam Matthews - Loan Signing who was good the year before, but poor, - Negative Signing
Cotterill - Cheap loan, understand why we done it, didn't work out, but was low risk and wasnt bad or good.
Giefer - Came in to put pressure on Fielding, was shit. - Negative Signing
Tammy - Probably the best player I've seen at the gate in a long time - Positive Signing
Ekstrand - Short term, injury prone, cheap. Neither good or bad
Vyner - Signed on potential and cheaply. Hasn't been bad for us, and whilst not up to this level, hes not cost the club big money

2017 - 2018 Season

Diedhiou - 5.4m questionable but was not Johnson's fault he left on a free, and done well in his 3 years at the club. Positive Signing
Baker - Injury prone but was solid in first 2 years here and Pearson renewed his contract. Positive signing
Eliasson - Very good for us and sold for near enough what we paid for him - Positive Signing
Walsh - Paid 1m which looked good business at the time, was too lightweight for this level - Negative Signing
Pisano - Solid for the time we had him
Steele - Good backup keeper 
Diony - Glad we only loaned him, he was the worse striker I've seen since Bas Savage - Negative Signing
Kent - May have been shit for us, but was considered a coup at the time, now a class player at Rangers, not Johnsons fault it didn't work out
Leko - Struggled at this level but was only on loan
Woodrow - Didn't work out here, again cheap loan

Worth noting that during this season Johnson promoted Bobby Reid and Lloyd Kelly to the first team, players  who we would go on to make massive profits on. 

18/19 Season

Webster - Outstanding for us, sold for big profit - Positive Signing
Wiemann - Bought for 2m and worth every penny, Positive Signing
Hunt - Wasn't awful for us but 1,5m was too much - Negative Signing
Watkins - 1m seemed cheap from Norwich but wasn't good enough - Negative Signing
Eisa - Wasn't good enough, but worth the risk, sold and didn't make a big loss
Maenpaa - Done okay when called upon, shouldn't have extended his contract though
Adelukan - Cheap purchase, wasn't good enough, no profit / no loss
Kalas - Been solid for us and has won promotion with every club hes been at in this league, was brilliant on loan - Positive signing
Palmer - Looked good on loan 
Dasilva - Again looked good on loan
Marinovic - Came in as cheap cover for short term, not bad, not good
Semenyo - Promoted from youth team by Johnson

That summer Johnson sold Flint for 7m off the back of 2 good seasons under Johnson, hes not worth 10% of that now. Got 10m for Bobby Reid, off the back of one good season and sold Bryan for 6m, a player Johnson improved over the time he was here for 6m. 18/19 was a great business season for Johnson.

19/20 Season

Kalas - 8m signing, but was quality on loan and was the sort of central defender we needed. Hes been solid for us and still key player - Positive Signing
Massengo - Bought as a long term sell for profit type player, we will prob break even as club have not got him to extend contract. - Positive Signing
Wells - 4m for a quality player at this level was good business. We may not make money on him, but it is not LJ fault Wells is not wanted by Pearson because he doesn't his style of play. He has neither been bad or good.
Palmer - 3.5m and Probably one of Johnson's biggest flops. Great on loan, but shocking since and we will struggle to offload - Negative Signing
Dasilva - 2m good signing and been decent enough for us. Only 24 and wont lose money on him when we sell him on.
Bentley - 2m and quality keeper, been brilliant for us. Positive Signing
Nagy - 1.8m didnt work out, and we sold him on for a small loss. Neither good or bad
Szmodics - Waste of money for us, but been solid elsewhere - Negative signing
Williams - Quality one season for us, not on big money - Positive signing
Gilmartin - Wasnt good enough, but cheap
Rowe - Wasnt good enough but cheap
Cundy - Signed cheaply and now broken into first team
Benkovic - Loan deal, wasnt good or bad
Afobe - Quality until injured, was not Johnsons fault

Got 900k for Pack who was going out of contract, good recovery of some funds. Got 20m for Webster, 9m for Brownhill and 13m for Kelly.

Now when Johnson signed Massengo, Kalas, Wells, Palmer, Bentley and Dasilva for 27m collectively and probably good wages, no one in their right mind expected Covid and pre Covid we were still flirting with the playoffs. City signed these thinking that at least 3 of them would have strong sell on value and that 2 of them added quality we needed.
The fact Covid came along, killed the transfer market and meant players we had signed pre covid left for free, bare in mind we have not received a fee for a player in the last 18 months! This is not Johnsons fault. He is blamed for 38m of losses, but spent 27m pre covid, it is not his fault Covid happened and players were unable to be sold.
Without Covid we would have prob sold Diedhiou for about 3m, and could have been in a strong position to sell progressing players for profit, Also account for losses from no gates and so on.

Whilst spending 27m on players that summer has accounted for much of the big loss, what happened 6 months after most were signed should not be blamed on Johnson.

If you look above his transfer dealings kept us competitive and he signed more good players than bad, but a lot of neutral players.

The reason we lost 38m was not because of Johnson, but because Covid crippled the transfer system and we were unable to sell players we would have normally tried to sell, and were left with some high purchases on decent wages at a time the club was hit with a pandemic.

Selling Semenyo, & Massengo for about 25m collectively, would count as profit from Johnson players, and would bring that 38m loss down to 13m loss, factor in covid at say 6m and thats 7m loss, which is about normal for this club.

Johnson's transfers didnt cripple this club, covid did and inability to sell anyone the last 2 years.

One could argue the players that Holden and Pearson have signed, albeit without fees to pay, have not been good enough to impact the team at all!

Nothing wrong with our strike force in Wiemann, Martin, Wells & Semenyo and Conway breaking through. I think if Wells had more minutes he would prove that rotating Martin and himself is a way forward and would enable us to blood in Conway. If Semenyo is sold, we may have to add one more, but then thats a bridge to cross if it happens. 

The article in the post is pretty clear We had the option to extend it by one year if we wanted to. Not Martin could extend it if he wanted to. Pearson has stated its about rewarding his play. Its not an extension based on appearances and so on, its basically, that we could trigger an extra year on the same terms in his final season of contract if they wanted to. Basically when Martin signed here, he agreed terms and wages and so on, and would have had in place, that in the final year of the contract, the contract can be renewed on the same terms for another 12 months if the club wanted to. That will mean next year is again his final year of contract, so next season if we wanted to, we could renew it on the same terms. A lot of older players sign contracts like this, as they dont have to renegotiate wages with clubs to extend a contract. I,e say you sign at 30, and 3 years later you're out of contract, the club may offer you less money to stay, so quite often a player leaves to look for a new role. The way Martin has done it means that he agrees a 2 year deal on x amount a week, but makes it clear I am happy to see my career out on these terms, as long as he stays fit, plays well and is deemed value for that wage the club will keep extending it and he's got a contract he's happy with. Had he wanted a 4 or 5 year deal a couple of years ago, the club wouldn't have signed him, but by agreeing a 2 year deal, with a standard activation clause to renew on the same terms for another year in the final 12 months at the clubs request, he could end up getting 4 or 5 years at a club and see out his career on the terms he wanted, because he's played well and been good value to the club. Quite a few 30yo+ players do deals like this if they know their legs will hold up and they want to play and are not greedy. I seem to recall Barry Bannan at Sheffield Wednesday is on a rolling contract now, he signed for 2 years with a year add on each year if the club wanted it. When they got relegated I remember reading he didn't know if Sheff Wed could honour is contract and offered to be sold if they wanted him to leave, but stated his desire to play. 

Its all about whether a player is looking for a pay day, or a play day!

Makes sense. Good team player, not on a huge wage, settled at the club, not injury prone and happy to fight for his place. He's been reliable for us and although we would rather a more natural striker, he has earned the extension. Whether hes a starter or back up next season, it was a low risk decision and a sensible one. 

You clearly don't remember the strike force of Andy Smith and Phil Jevons. Have they scored a goal yet?

6 minutes ago, Johnr1986 said:

Ideal Scenario

players out  

Palmer, Baker , Vyner , king , James, Martin. Bakinson, Klose, Cundy , Moore, O’dowda.

new  CB x2, RB , DCM , RW, LW, CF x1

keep

, Scott , Semenyo , massengo  and wells (just give him a start) 

 

Why get a player like Cundy to develop, break into the team, then let him go? Cundy would be solid back up at this level. Also Klose has been brilliant since he came, and is very solid at the back. He has the experience we need at the back, and he is only getting to full match fitness now. He was a cheap signing and I personally would give him another year, even if he isn't a starter, he wont be on a huge wage at his age, and he would be excellent cover should we get injuries and s solid at this level.

Agree with the others.

I would cash in on Semenyo, he isn't as good as the hype and if theres 15-20m on the table, bite their hands off, he can be replaced with half that money. Scott has a long contract so we dont need to sell yet. Massengo I doubt will sign a new deakl, so we have to sell in the summer to try and recoup what we paid for him. 

One positive was Nahki Wells was brilliant again off the bench. Sadly come Saturday he'll still be on the bench until he gets another 15 minute cameo, where its too late to do anything. 

The same people who want Lansdown to sell are the same people who would be gutted if he sold to someone like Mike Ashley, but realistically its only that sort of owner  we would have any appeal to. Lansdown wants City to succeed, but at the same time he knows we are not financially in a position to do so. No matter what owner you have that wont change.  The new ashton gate is lovely and all that but is definitely a huge contribution to the financial mess we're in. 

2 minutes ago, grifty said:

Players like Andy King, Matty James, Danny Simpson, Chris Brunt, Gary O'Neil?

No, players who are not regressing. There will be teams promoted this year and they will release players who wont make it in the prem, these are the players to go for, solid Championship players.

Every year there are loads of good free agents and the same clubs snap them up, yet we pick up injury prone players all the time. Gary O'Neill imo done well for us.

Warnock at every club hes gone to signs sensible free agents, so has Wilder,  We seem to be late to the party and get the dregs of the barrell and then pay them massive wages and cause a bigger problem.

Just now, Ivorguy said:

You don’t know with a good owner we would be in League 2.

The owner selected the managers with no proper procedures in place.

The owner has damaged the club by his personal obsession with Bristol Sport 

The owner interfered, eg signing of James, the worst goalie I have seen in a City shirt in my over 70 years of supporting

From certain comments from LJ and Cotts we know there have been problems

SL needs to go so the club can reset and really aim for top division

LJ was a good coach and he got good young players to develop and he was very intelligent. Problem was he didn't know how to and couldn't deal with players who thought they were bigger than the club and it was his undoing. If we had got in an old head as manager and had LJ as assistant or the guy coaching and doing tactics we wouldn't have had a problem. Half of LJ's squad are now playing top flight football or been sold to bigger and better clubs, that should not be forgotten.

The players doing well now, were all part of the youth structure Johnson was putting in place as well. Semenyo, Scott, Cundy and co, these were all players Johnson brought into the youth set up.

Pearson has made 1 good signing in Klose. I can't think of one good signing Holden made.

Bristol Sport has affected the club of course, but it has raised the profile of sport n the City. We have a good Rugby team and Womens team, sadly the mens team is faltering but I think the real truth is BCFC is just not sustainable and to compete in the Championship cost too much money. I think the club would rather yo yo from league one to the Championship and hope to get another one off year like 07/08 and maybe one day go up and then be financially set up. It hurst me to say it but until we get relegated again I cant see us progressing. 

1 minute ago, Ivorguy said:

Nothing will fundamentally change until the owner goes

How many more decades of failure on the pitch and poor admin off it?

Sorry but without Lansdown we would be in League Two by now. He has backed every manager we've had. Players come to City and do shit, leave and become good again elsewhere. Thats not the owners fault.

I felt we pressed the eject button too quick on Cotts and Johnson Jnr if I'm honest. Fans expectation is part of the problem. We financially cant compete at this level without being a selling club. A state of the art fancy stadium is all well and good, but something has to pay for it. When Semenyo, Massengo and possibly Scott are sold in the summer to clear the 40m debt, well maybe most of it, the club will be focusing on the next youngsters to develop and sell on.

I personally would rather us go out and sign 7 or 8 aging experienced pros who are solid at this level on frees in the summer and then gradually blood in players. The club needs stability, these kids are burnt out with ten games to go and theres no other players here to help them, yet people are getting on the young players backs after they are knackered from 30 odd games of football when they don't have the experience of full seasons.

Sacking Pearson would achieve absolutely nothing. There is no one worth bringing in to replace him. The only logical choice would be Warnock, but there would go all the youth development.  We're not going down so be glad of that. Lets see what the summer brings, albeit I don't hold out much hope, but keep changing the manager isn't the solution. 

Poor performance all round.

Wells again looks good off the bench.

Semenyo is good build up, but final decision making is lacking.

Playing 2 strikers in midfield in Wells and Wiemann when Martin offering nothing up top. Hope we start with Wiemann and Wells up top on Saturday.

Massengo was awful, nearly as bad as James.

What's happened to Andy King?

3 minutes ago, Port Said Red said:

Those are windows.

But in essence, what's the difference between a door and a window, they do precisely the same thing. Given that Advent Calendars are not see through, and a window by definition is;

1.an opening in the wall or roof of a building or vehicle, fitted with glass in a frame to admit light or air and allow people to see out.

Then it is more likely that its doors on an advent calendar not a window. 

Thought Nahki Wells was brilliant yesterday when he came on. He seems to have been frozen out the team for much of the season and many fans seem to be calling for him to be sold in the summer, stating he doesn't want to be here and that he is a big earner and not delivering. Personally having seen him come on yesterday and make a huge impact and also be our only positive from the game at Blackpool, I wonder why fans are so keen to see him go, and perhaps its worth starting him against Barnsley. I would be tempted to go with him and Semenyo up top with Martin dropped to the bench and Wiemann in behind. Give Alex Scott a game off. On the few chances he has had lately, Wells has been very solid. He clearly seems to want to put a shift in when given the chance, so how about use the last ten games to see if he can be a crucial part of the team. Its likely we'll make a huge loss selling him, and may not get someone to cover his wages if we loaned him out, so perhaps playing him and giving him a chance to prove he could be a solution to our 3rd needed forward situation. Thoughts ?

Has to be doors, just think of advent calendars, 24 doors on them and think how many millions of them get sold each year. 

I find the sad part of this people saying he deserved to get a beating? No one in life deserves to go out for the day and get beaten up.

People say Rugby is different, it really shouldn't be, if anything it highlights the mentality of a few football fans.

Wouldn't happen at Rugby. Fans mix, no set fans sections at a lot of games, and rarely ever trouble. Even when England play Wales.

Whilst the Birmingham fan shouldn't be in the home end, all those grabbing him and punching and so on, should be charged with assault and banned for life from every football ground in the country. Punching him in the head, do they not realise, if he goes home, falls asleep and doesn't wake up, then thats 8 people on a conspiracy to murder charge, or manslaughter at the very least. Plus massive repercussions for the club. Simple solution is alert a steward and they will eject them, no need for violence. Hope all those involved get banned and charged.

In the tune of Go West

Timm Klose he's from Switzerland
Timm Klose he's Nigel Perason's Man
Timm Klose he's solid at the back
Timm Klose will destroy your attack