leepeacock's50phead Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 The class system in this country is still very much in place with - most noteably and surprisingly - Labour Party politicians now establishing themselves as a new self-serving plutocratic elite at taxpayers' (our) expense. but it is not the working class/middle class/upper class thing of old is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Mosquito Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 but it is not the working class/middle class/upper class thing of old is it? I reckon Labour lawyer politicians such as Harriett Harman, Peter Mandelson and Tony Blair slot into the upper middle class bracket of old quite nicely. The current Tory leader - David Cameron - is a textbook Toff from a very wealthy upper class background. If you find yourself in court you could be faced by an upper class Toff judge and upper middle class Crown Prosecution Service lawyers. At a lower class level there are the middle class magistrates. The class system - especially in our armed forces and criminal justice system - is alive and well in this country and you'll easily find it if you just scrape at its camouflage of 'current political and social correctness'. Joe Stalin - the working class son of a cobbler - had the right idea in sending many politicians and landowners to learn the meaning of real work in the Siberian Gulags. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedLionLad Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 You just have to admire the way in which some office workers park their cars in Clifton :noexpression: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Mosquito Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 You just have to admire the way in which some office workers park their cars in Clifton :noexpression: Hmmm...it just goes to prove that some people in Bristol have a lot of money to waste on buying executive Kraut cruisers. If I had the money I'd buy this one to help jam up Bristol's streets.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leepeacock's50phead Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 I reckon Labour lawyer politicians such as Harriett Harman, Peter Mandelson and Tony Blair slot into the upper middle class bracket of old quite nicely. The current Tory leader - David Cameron - is a textbook Toff from a very wealthy upper class background. If you find yourself in court you could be faced by an upper class Toff judge and upper middle class Crown Prosecution Service lawyers. At a lower class level there are the middle class magistrates. The class system - especially in our armed forces and criminal justice system - is alive and well in this country and you'll easily find it if you just scrape at its camouflage of 'current political and social correctness'. Joe Stalin - the working class son of a cobbler - had the right idea in sending many politicians and landowners to learn the meaning of real work in the Siberian Gulags. So what class is someone like ex-council estate girl Cheryl Cole? I imagine if she was to have a child, she would pay for a good education and were she to be successful, you would probably describe her at the very least as 'upper middle class' yet her mum was born on a council estate. Wealth is everything, and its not just the classic 'upper classes' who have it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Mosquito Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 So what class is someone like ex-council estate girl Cheryl Cole? I imagine if she was to have a child, she would pay for a good education and were she to be successful, you would probably describe her at the very least as 'upper middle class' yet her mum was born on a council estate. Wealth is everything, and its not just the classic 'upper classes' who have it. Cheryl Cole definately would 'be with child' if she spent a night with me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pie Eater Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 As a Bedminster resident I am against this There will also be a charge for guests! I have off street parking for 2 cars so would neccessary be charged. When parking is scarse visitors tend to park across my drive in the new system this would be an offense and the car could be towed. On top of all this the council has its own car park so its seems to be a case of we are alright sod the rest of you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Peacock Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 Bristol did have one of the finest tram systems in the country apparently. All ripped up by order of the Government before I was born so I didn't get to benefit from it. Ripped up on the order of Adolf Hitler more like. And what's this sudden dislike of Kraut Kroozers, you were recommending me to buy a Merc SLK? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
windmillhillred Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 Bristol City Council attracts the very worst people in society on the whole, Basically anyone who cant get a job elsewhere, the social misfits, the drug addicts, criminals, the lazy, skiving types, immigrants who flee their own country because they cant be buggered to help fix it, so they come here are screw ours up! Thanks a flippin bunch! but at least we filled our ethnic quota, yey! Brownie points from the Home Office!!! wooo yey. When you say the Far East, do you actually mean the Far East? Because the immigrant bashing would be a tad ironic then... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob k Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 I pay road tax so i will park anywhere i like. If thats outside someones house then I'm entittled to do it. If its that much of a problem you should buy a house with a drive or off road parking. simple. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Mosquito Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 Ripped up on the order of Adolf Hitler more like. And what's this sudden dislike of Kraut Kroozers, you were recommending me to buy a Merc SLK? You might find that a Bentley - as shown in my piccie - is now a Kraut cruiser as well. It's either BMW or VW that bought out Bentley. I'm also pretty sure that Bristol's tram system survived World War 2 - just to save Herr Hitler being blamed for this as well as millions of other misdemeanors. A Merc SLK is a good buy, I'd buy one if I could afford it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olé Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 I work just off North Street and a lot of the residents there don't seem to want it - posters galore in the windows. To be fair it's pretty easy to find a spot in that area. That's true, however, in the exact same area of North Street it's a nightmare to find parking in the evenings or overnight, i.e. when locals are getting back from work, after you've left. There's more cars than spaces. I'm guessing at this point that you work exactly where I live because you're right that many people around here do have the posters up in their windows, unfortunately they're all a bunch of spineless hypocrites. It's presented as some sort of community action but they're all out for themselves. I've seen one couple with the poster in the window and two cars, the first one home parks badly to save a space for when the other gets back. If people did care about the community surely they'd be in favour of a scheme that gives everyone the right to park one car before one household has parked four cars and a van, and probably a skip or two half the year too. Yes a second car is £200 and in Dollymarie's case of a shared house that sounds impractical but for most households surely it makes sense to have a fair equal right to park by penalising those taking up more than their fair share? Red Goblin I understand your reaction to the cost but I'm surprised you don't see some good in the socially-concious effort at protecting everyone's rights rather than it being first come first served and those with the most cars win. God forbid there are nurses working late shifts who have to park round here after a long day. The earliest I get home is 8pm and even then it's rare I can park first time. A controlled scheme sounds officious but it looks out for every taxpayer. Yes paying another £40 is insulting and yes it doesn't guarantee anything, but chances have got to be a lot better. I'd pay the £40 in a heartbeat. When I get home I just want to park, not drive laps of Bedminster side-streets. As for match-day parking, this is only planned for North of North Street so to speak, parking in Ashton will remain unaffected, I don't see the problem, I see spaces on the sidestreets in question on matchdays so hardly that popular then anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olé Posted January 6, 2009 Report Share Posted January 6, 2009 the social misfits, the drug addicts, criminals, the lazy, skiving types, immigrants who flee their own country because they cant be buggered to help fix it, so they come here are screw ours up! Why exactly are you putting immigrants in the same company as the rest of the groups in your list? There are immigrants in all walks of life and since you're so fond of wild generalisations, I'm willing to bet that there are thousands of immigrants who have done far more for this country than you have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lordofthebling Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 I live like 2 mins away from Charlton's ground. I was originally against it when parking permits were first introduced round here - even to the point of canvassing my neighbours, however I could not cope without it now. For me, it costs £40 a car, and I get vouchers (discounted) to give to family or guests that stay over. However, and this is the big however, I live in London - and the buses and trains are what we use up here - so it works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcfcmike Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Mosquito Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 Red Goblin I understand your reaction to the cost but I'm surprised you don't see some good in the socially-concious effort at protecting everyone's rights rather than it being first come first served and those with the most cars win. I see the parking schemes as yet another way that the authorities can extort money from the beleaguered taxpayers. Relatively, Bristol was a far better place to live in my Grandparents' day than now. There was the electric tram public transport system, a city centre that was one of the wonders of Europe with its tropical style gardens and one of the best shopping areas in England on what is now Castle Green. OK, we can blame Hitler's airforce for bombing to dust the Castle Green area shops but it's our own half-wit planners and politicians responsible for the destruction and concreting of the city centre and the dismantling of the tram public transport system that would make people less reliant on cars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 I'm guessing at this point that you work exactly where I live because you're right that many people around here do have the posters up in their windows, unfortunately they're all a bunch of spineless hypocrites. An unsubstantiated comment Ole, aggressively and rudely put. Us locals don't want it because it is not needed and as so many are against it it is odd indeed that the Council have not taken our views into account. It's hard to see where they have altered their proposals to take into account the results of the survey. If the locals are against it, then who is it supposed to help, and if the Council had already made up their mind and are to ignore our views then what exactly was the point of the survey? Yes paying another £40 is insulting and yes it doesn't guarantee anything, Completely pointless then, but the opportunity to raise money, put more ugly signs all over the place, and have uniformed officials throwing their weight around. As for match-day parking, this is only planned for North of North Street so to speak, parking in Ashton will remain unaffected, I don't see the problem, I see spaces on the sidestreets in question on matchdays so hardly that popular then anyway. There are spaces in Southville during non match days as well, despite the council trying to reduce them and deliberately making parking more difficult with completely unnecessary road alterations, pavement widening, and parking restrictions. No doubt Ashton will surely follow in good time as today's Southville parkers migrate outwards from the City Centre. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Man In Black Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 That's true, however, in the exact same area of North Street it's a nightmare to find parking in the evenings or overnight, i.e. when locals are getting back from work, after you've left. There's more cars than spaces. So when all the 'yes' campaigners were on the news last night lambasting the workers and shoppers they were telling slight porkies? I'm just down the road from the Hen & Chicken btw, just in case it's a slightly different area to the one you're thinking. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leepeacock's50phead Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 This is all just about money, if the permits were free I'm sure everyone would be saying 'about time too' I don't think any major City in the UK has a system that charges commuters rather than residents as it would be far too hard to implement. I think you could certainly target the big employers but as I mentioned earlier, this would be incredibly unpopular with the business world and the Government, be in national or local, really doesn't like stepping on their shoes. The system is never going to be free to implement and unfortunately it is the residents who have to foot the bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcfcmike Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 This is all just about money, if the permits were free I'm sure everyone would be saying 'about time too' I don't think any major City in the UK has a system that charges commuters rather than residents as it would be far too hard to implement. I think you could certainly target the big employers but as I mentioned earlier, this would be incredibly unpopular with the business world and the Government, be in national or local, really doesn't like stepping on their shoes. The system is never going to be free to implement and unfortunately it is the residents who have to foot the bill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olé Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 An unsubstantiated comment Ole, aggressively and rudely put. Sorry mate but I've been frustrated by this issue long before this thread arrived. The point is that someone has evidently circulated those A4 Microsoft Word posters in the spirit of collective action, yet everyone who is displaying it is doing so for one person only and that's themselves. Yet by displaying a poster that specifically tells OTHER people to join in with their point of view. Hence the cowardice and hypocrisy I'm pointing out. We've got people whose only interest is protecting themselves alone, displaying posters asking others to join in with their action. How does that work exactly? Why encourage others to hold a view when you're not actually interested in their ability to park one jot, you just want them to support your own right to park as you please? I respect people's right to their view but for heavens sake would people now put up posters saying 'I wish to park as I please' and stop trying to dress up self-centredness as community action. There is no community spiritedness about saying either yes or no to this scheme, it is all about SELF and I wish people would stop pretending otherwise. If I'm aggressive or rude then I apologise but as you'll see from the above, I find these posters offensive and disingenuous. So when all the 'yes' campaigners were on the news last night lambasting the workers and shoppers they were telling slight porkies? I'm just down the road from the Hen & Chicken btw, just in case it's a slightly different area to the one you're thinking. I'm halfway between the H&C and the Tobacco Factory so more or less the same yes, the same side streets I'm sure, not quite as well off as those who actually live on the side-streets but I pay taxes, live here and if something makes sure I have a fairer deal on parking round here, I'm all for it, and that's MY opinion only, I'm not going to stick up posters telling others to defend MY rights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drew Peacock Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 I'm also pretty sure that Bristol's tram system survived World War 2 - just to save Herr Hitler being blamed for this as well as millions of other misdemeanors. 1941 the last tram ran. The bombing destroyed the power supply (as well as a lot of the tracks). Although, to be fair, this only hastened the end as the system was being run down before the war. The original date for stopping the tram system had been October 1939, but the start of the war put this decision on ice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Mosquito Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 1941 the last tram ran. The bombing destroyed the power supply (as well as a lot of the tracks). Although, to be fair, this only hastened the end as the system was being run down before the war. The original date for stopping the tram system had been October 1939, but the start of the war put this decision on ice. OK then, Adolf Hitler and his airforce must take half the blame for the destruction of Bristol's tram network. On the other side of the argument you could contend that Hitler actually helped create more parking spaces as many bombsites in Bristol ended up as carparks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wookey Posted January 7, 2009 Report Share Posted January 7, 2009 I can't understand why people who live in Bristol need a car - they have wonderful free/close to free public transport. Now us that live in the sticks, such as Wookey have no public transport and therefore need a car!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CiderHider Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 When you say the Far East, do you actually mean the Far East? Because the immigrant bashing would be a tad ironic then... Why exactly are you putting immigrants in the same company as the rest of the groups in your list? There are immigrants in all walks of life and since you're so fond of wild generalisations, I'm willing to bet that there are thousands of immigrants who have done far more for this country than you have. Sorry, it was directed more at government policy than particular individuals. I bet there are thousands, possibly more maybe, although I haven't finished quite yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dollymarie Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 I can't understand why people who live in Bristol need a car - they have wonderful free/close to free public transport. I'm sorry but I wouldnt call Bristols transport system wonderful, and considering it now costs £3 on some routes, to get just a few miles, (I would pay that to get from Clifton into the centre) its not anywhere near free and actually makes people use their cars instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Fleuriot Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 I have lived in Bristol for 20 years, owned a car for two of those years and don't own a car now. A friend in Oxford has a residents parking scheme and it's encouraged the use of cycles and public transport, improving the quality of buses and cycle lanes. The main reason i'm posting is that Red goblin, as usual, is dressing his own prejudices up as political activism (a common problem for cliché-driven "radicals"). If you were a true anarchist, socialist, or communist then you would support this scheme as a means to an end. Full implementation of the scheme across all of Bristol will most likely encourage a less bourgeois interpretation of property, and increase the likelihood of car share schemes or multiple occupancy households all getting insured and sharing a single car. It will result in less car ownership, allowing more access to the streets for cyclists (once called the greatest socialist invention), and possibly help turn them back into communal spaces. It will decrease comfort for the commuter belt from woodspring, and south glos, who are predominantly more your middle class types. It will also mean that the taxpayers in Bristol aren't paying for the upkeep of roads that are being used more by outsiders whose council tax goes to winning floral display awards and keeping out rehab centres. I'm not saying all this will happen as a consequence, I'm saying that it's what I think could happen, that we should try something, and that if red goblin had an ounce of integrity his argument would be along similar lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Mosquito Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 I have lived in Bristol for 20 years, owned a car for two of those years and don't own a car now. A friend in Oxford has a residents parking scheme and it's encouraged the use of cycles and public transport, improving the quality of buses and cycle lanes. The main reason i'm posting is that Red goblin, as usual, is dressing his own prejudices up as political activism (a common problem for cliché-driven "radicals"). If you were a true anarchist, socialist, or communist then you would support this scheme as a means to an end. Full implementation of the scheme across all of Bristol will most likely encourage a less bourgeois interpretation of property, and increase the likelihood of car share schemes or multiple occupancy households all getting insured and sharing a single car. It will result in less car ownership, allowing more access to the streets for cyclists (once called the greatest socialist invention), and possibly help turn them back into communal spaces. It will decrease comfort for the commuter belt from woodspring, and south glos, who are predominantly more your middle class types. It will also mean that the taxpayers in Bristol aren't paying for the upkeep of roads that are being used more by outsiders whose council tax goes to winning floral display awards and keeping out rehab centres. I'm not saying all this will happen as a consequence, I'm saying that it's what I think could happen, that we should try something, and that if red goblin had an ounce of integrity his argument would be along similar lines. As you've mentioned me in your reply I'd better respond. Would a true anarchist really support Government? My idea of an anarchist is someone that would overthrow a Government and definately would not support its tax raising policies aimed at those often least able to pay. I support Communist/Stalinist policy in so far as I'd like to see our Toff ridden and anti-democratic national and local Government transported from Avonmouth docks to a Siberian Gulag in order to learn the meaning of real work in minus 40 degrees centigrade of frost. I do not support the failures that are our anti-democratic and anti-football local and national Governments - does that really make me a Communist/Anarchist or someone displaying some common sense? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 Sorry mate but I've been frustrated by this issue long before this thread arrived. The point is that someone has evidently circulated those A4 Microsoft Word posters in the spirit of collective action, yet everyone who is displaying it is doing so for one person only and that's themselves. Yet by displaying a poster that specifically tells OTHER people to join in with their point of view. Hence the cowardice and hypocrisy I'm pointing out. We've got people whose only interest is protecting themselves alone, displaying posters asking others to join in with their action. How does that work exactly? Why encourage others to hold a view when you're not actually interested in their ability to park one jot, you just want them to support your own right to park as you please? I respect people's right to their view but for heavens sake would people now put up posters saying 'I wish to park as I please' and stop trying to dress up self-centredness as community action. There is no community spiritedness about saying either yes or no to this scheme, it is all about SELF and I wish people would stop pretending otherwise. If I'm aggressive or rude then I apologise but as you'll see from the above, I find these posters offensive and disingenuous. I haven't mentioned anything about community spiritedness or collective action and I'm not personally involved in any group apart from having a poster in my window which happens to succinctly display my opinion on a local issue. As far as I'm concerned displaying one simply gives an overt indication of the number of local people against the scheme. When it is pushed through anyway, despite local opinion being against it, the Council cannot say they have implemented it with the support of, or in the best interests of, the locals. I wouldn't be swayed to vote for a particular political party because someone had a poster in their window 'telling me to' and this is no different. If you want to talk about SELF, then you are the selfish one because this scheme would make life easier for YOU despite an apparent majority being against it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Mosquito Posted January 8, 2009 Report Share Posted January 8, 2009 As far as I'm concerned displaying one simply gives an overt indication of the number of local people against the scheme. When it is pushed through anyway, despite local opinion being against it, the Council cannot say they have implemented it with the support of, or in the best interests of, the locals. I wouldn't be swayed to vote for a particular political party because someone had a poster in their window 'telling me to' and this is no different. It's the way that this country is now run, the politicians and planners could not give a damn about local and national opinion as they stick to their own anti-democratic agenda regardless. Don't be fooled folks, having to pay to park a car outside your own house is nothing to do with solving traffic/parking problems - it's just another means to raise money to bail out dodgy banks and pay for politicians' pay rises and expenses. I'm still wondering what happened to the vote we were promised on the EU Lisbon Treaty - Oh - the politicians signed it anyway behind our backs !!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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