Nibor Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 More like £2,000 from what I've heard No, he signed a new contract in the summer for £5-6k along with several other players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dolman_Stand Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 No, he signed a new contract in the summer for £5-6k along with several other players. Really how long was the deal?? In that case all the talk of Elliott being on £4k must be rubbish??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garlicbread Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 Why the F word does it say that he's rumoured to be joining Palace? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 Really how long was the deal?? In that case all the talk of Elliott being on £4k must be rubbish??? Either 2 or 3 years, same structure as offered to LJ, Fonts, McCombe and Orr. Elliott's deal wasn't up for renewal, he was only a year into it (a year in which he'd earned more than all of those players). It's swings and roundabouts, this summer they'll offer Elliott a new deal and he'll either sign it on more than that or refuse in which case he'll be sold. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kah2008 Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 Therein maybe lies the problem ..... alledgedly I agree with you Chessels Chick Noble is by far the most talented player down the gate and i can't see how GJ can leave him out of the side. If i were him i would be looking for another club as his talent is wasted down at Ashton Gate! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CiderHider Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 I cant help but think thay if we started with Noble we would have to radically change formation, and as a result be left with a weaker team. A creative player yes, but for it to work fully we would need to focus the entire team around him, that would leave us exposed and vulnerable, this is why he doesn't play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 I agree with you Chessels Chick Noble is by far the most talented player down the gate and i can't see how GJ can leave him out of the side. If i were him i would be looking for another club as his talent is wasted down at Ashton Gate! Um, I think you may have missed CC's point. Read the post again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 I have been very happy with the way our midfield have performed in the last two games, against two of the best teams we have played against this season. I don't think we would have performed anymore successfully with him in the side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ashton1 Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 I have been very happy with the way our midfield have performed in the last two games, against two of the best teams we have played against this season. I don't think we would have performed anymore successfully with him in the side. With all the talk of midfielders coming in and out, what about young Frankie Artus, I was under the impression he was being groomed for a start, all I hear is good reports Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRaw Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 In my opinion , Noble flatters to deceive when he plays, he offers neither the stability of a midfielder defensively or the creativeness going forward and also lacks pace and fitness (a modern day Tommy Doherty if you like) Noble cannot play in a central midfield position as would leave too much work for the other player, a player who plays in the advanced "in the hole" position needs to be able to 1. Beat players 2. Create numerous chances 3. Score 10-15 goals a season. Noble does none of the above and in the championship is a player who we cannot afford//would not want in the team . The only time he was even minorly effective was when he was wide right and then all seem to agree that we need some pace in the side, Even in the current set up with the 4-3-3 he does not do the work to be one of the middle 3 or have the goal threat to be one of the top 3. All in all I would send him out on loan/sell him/give him away. He has served his purpose here I'm sorry.......is this a thread about Noble or Johnson Jnr because as far as I can see you have just described the deficiences of the latter yet he is first on the team sheet each week. Noble, like Williams, have not been afforded the same opportunities in the middle / time in the side as Johnson yet in my eyes offer the sort of creativity we are screaming out for Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
albert2 Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 I know , Ive got a novel idea , lets hijack every thread and turn it into a " LJ is crap thread" , an opinion was given on Noble, in a thread about Noble not being that good and some try to turn it round to slag off LJ. Must be a new form of Tourettes, some just cant help themselves!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenun Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 As some of you have already mentioned, Paul Gascoigne's catharthic autobiography: Gazza - My Story, contains the following paragraphs written in 2004, referencing David Noble at Boston United, on pages 452 and 453:- Funnily enough, in hospital today, where I happen to be at this moment, who should appear in my room but Ray Wilkins, come on a surprise visit. I played with him for England and he's now assistant manager at Millwall. He asked me what it was like at Boston - and asked me specifically about David Noble, the Boston midfielder. It turned out that Ray had him when he was with Luca Vialli at Watford. He thought very highly of him, but it didn't work out. They found it hard to motivate him. That was interesting, I had similar difficulties with David Noble at Boston. He has such natural talent; I think he has the ability but he just needs to work that little bit harder. Coaches over the years have probably tried to push him. In the games I played with him at Boston, I used to say to him, 'I want you to get a yellow card in this game.' What I meant was get stuck in, put yourself about, throw yourself into it, even if you get booked. Didn't seem to make a difference. He was formerly at West ham, so his talent had been recognised early on, but he hasn't really progressed as far as he should. He's still quite young, only twenty-three, so I suppose there's still time for him to develop and come good. What Gazza didn't mention was that Noble actually started at Arsenal, starring in their 1999/2000 FA Youth Cup winning team against Coventry City. However, if you look at the teamsheet: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FA_Youth_Cup_..._2.E2.80.930.29 all his peers, bar Steve Sidwell and Jeremie Aliadiere have missed the the big time. Failure, early in a player's career can be hard to overcome and in my opinion Noble hasn't displayed the mental aptitude to succeed in the Championship, and that, coupled with his 27th birthday on February 2nd, means it's probably too late for him to bounce back, at this level anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRaw Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 I know , Ive got a novel idea , lets hijack every thread and turn it into a " LJ is crap thread" , an opinion was given on Noble, in a thread about Noble not being that good and some try to turn it round to slag off LJ. Must be a new form of Tourettes, some just cant help themselves!!! No.....the thread was started by someone asking where Noble is and the vast majority of posts have queried Johnson snr's reasons for not playing him and generally shown support of Noble and his abilities.........thats until you shred him to pieces with the very reasons why a lot of people don't rate johnson jnr......I was just highlighting that point, not directly slagging LJ off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon uk Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 that quote from the gazza book just about sums it up for me, he is a plank but Ray Wilkins is a real football man. Having seen Noble with us for a few years I don't think many people will disagree with what is written - very talented, but lacking real determination to succeed. I appreciate different people have different levels of natural fitness but for him as a professional athlete (very much like Tommy D) to be barely able to cope with a 90 minute game isnt acceptable. We all remember the stunner at palace last season, but I seem to recall that Noble himself admitted he was too knackered to run anymore so had a dig. I don't think anything is going to change with Nobes, so I think it would be best for all if he were to move on, and we get some one else in who can offer more of a blend of skill and workrate, and he might find a club who can inspire him further and find a system to incorporate him into. Its a shame though, cause I have some happy memories of noble playing football for us! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seend Red Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 I know , Ive got a novel idea , lets hijack every thread and turn it into a " LJ is crap thread" , an opinion was given on Noble, in a thread about Noble not being that good and some try to turn it round to slag off LJ. Must be a new form of Tourettes, some just cant help themselves!!! Or maybe some of the more honest posters on here have had enough of seeing genuinely creative players being left out of the side and put in the shade at the expensive of others who seem to recieve beneficial treatment. Noble is a quality player who just isn't given the chance to cement a place in the side, it seems that unless you run around like a headless chicken you don't get noticed by the gaffer, it also seems that any genuinely technically gifted central mid player may as well not bother even trying to get in the side as if Elliott and another are fit they play, what happened to competition for places Gary? Or was that just every position other than Central midfild!! Take the Southampton away match where Nobes actually got a game, he bossed that match from start to finish and was the best player on the pitch by a mile, looked real class, if my memory serves me correct he still got subbed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spectator Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 Attitude,Motivation and "Re-fuelling", as Graham Taylor said, and reference from Gazza says it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheese Posted January 20, 2009 Report Share Posted January 20, 2009 Or maybe some of the more honest posters on here have had enough of seeing genuinely creative players being left out of the side and put in the shade at the expensive of others who seem to recieve beneficial treatment. Noble is a quality player who just isn't given the chance to cement a place in the side, it seems that unless you run around like a headless chicken you don't get noticed by the gaffer, it also seems that any genuinely technically gifted central mid player may as well not bother even trying to get in the side as if Elliott and another are fit they play, what happened to competition for places Gary? Or was that just every position other than Central midfild!! Take the Southampton away match where Nobes actually got a game, he bossed that match from start to finish and was the best player on the pitch by a mile, looked real class, if my memory serves me correct he still got subbed. He could hardly boss the game until the finish if he wasn't on the pitch at the finish then could he. So your memory does you a disservice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 In the hope he will see the light. I know why you disagree, you want to see him play, so do I, but unless he gets fit or you pick the team, it is not going to happen. I simply don't believe that. GJ is not the sort of bloke to offer a new contract to a player who he thinks is "social" or not keeping himself as fit as he can. And if I'm wrong and he offered him the contract knowing that, and now doesn't play Noble because he's not fit, then that is a disgrace. The player should have been released. We can't afford to pay people who are not going to play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Stand Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 I simply don't believe that. GJ is not the sort of bloke to offer a new contract to a player who he thinks is "social" or not keeping himself as fit as he can. And if I'm wrong and he offered him the contract knowing that, and now doesn't play Noble because he's not fit, then that is a disgrace. The player should have been released. We can't afford to pay people who are not going to play. But what if he rates Noble so much he thought it was worth persevering with him to get him to see the light ? It's damned if you do etc really. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 I simply don't believe that. GJ is not the sort of bloke to offer a new contract to a player who he thinks is "social" or not keeping himself as fit as he can. And if I'm wrong and he offered him the contract knowing that, and now doesn't play Noble because he's not fit, then that is a disgrace. The player should have been released. We can't afford to pay people who are not going to play. Maybe it is isn't as simple as the way he "refuels", perhaps he just needs more of that self motivation to go that extra step to the highest level of fitness. Perhaps GJ thought he had achieved that, perhaps his judgment was clouded by Nobles performances towards the end of the season. I think a lot of people thought he had turned a corner in those last few games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 But what if he rates Noble so much he thought it was worth persevering with him to get him to see the light ? It's damned if you do etc really. Noble's been here for 3 and a half years. GJ has no excuses on that front. He should either have offered him a new contract and considered him for selection or let him go and by now he should know which he's going to do. It's unacceptable to give a player a new contract and then sit him in the stands with no intention of considering him because it's a complete waste of money that could be spent elsewhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 Maybe it is isn't as simple as the way he "refuels", perhaps he just needs more of that self motivation to go that extra step to the highest level of fitness. Perhaps GJ thought he had achieved that, perhaps his judgment was clouded by Nobles performances towards the end of the season. I think a lot of people thought he had turned a corner in those last few games. Myself I don't buy that Noble has fitness or attitude problems. He played 90 minutes for us often enough when given the chance. It doesn't really matter what the thought process was, it is clearly flawed because we have a player who will not be considered for selection on a brand new expensive contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Stand Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 Myself I don't buy that Noble has fitness or attitude problems. He played 90 minutes for us often enough when given the chance. In that case why do you think he hasn't gone somewhere else then ? Someone else posted that the mere fact that someone with so much talent seems relatively content not to play, tells it's own story. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 Myself I don't buy that Noble has fitness or attitude problems. He played 90 minutes for us often enough when given the chance. It doesn't really matter what the thought process was, it is clearly flawed because we have a player who will not be considered for selection on a brand new expensive contract. That's fine if you don't buy it, I don't think there have been any direct quotes from GJ saying so, like all of us on here I am only making a supposition. My impression is that he often fades from games just at the point you would think he could start exploiting space, but I have no evidence of that either as I have never been one for keeping stats etc on players. To be honest, I have trouble remembering more than a handful of games in any season in detail. On the second point, if the figures on here are true then, yes I think that is quite high. I think though that all the criticism that GJ fields for not picking him, would have been more than doubled if we had let him go in the summer, especially after that goal at Palace (which by DN's own admission only came about due to him being "too tired to run any further) and his other contributions in the last few games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 In that case why do you think he hasn't gone somewhere else then ? Someone else posted that the mere fact that someone with so much talent seems relatively content not to play, tells it's own story. Well, not seeking a move could be a lack ambition perhaps. I don't know. But a lack of ambition doesn't mean he wouldn't be fit enough to play for our first XI or do his best when he does. I doubt he's happy not playing. You could suggest Tinnion had a lack of ambition staying with us so long when he could clearly have played in the tier above, didn't stop him being a very good player for us. I think this one's quite simple really, if he was deemed good enough (and hence fit enough and professional enough) to be offered a contract worth between £5k and £6k a week then he should be considered for selection. When he doesn't make an 18 man squad despite being one of our most talented players and isn't given a chance when his main rival for the creative midfield spot is injured, that makes it plain that something is wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William Stand Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 Well, not seeking a move could be a lack ambition perhaps. I don't know. But a lack of ambition doesn't mean he wouldn't be fit enough to play for our first XI or do his best when he does. I doubt he's happy not playing. You could suggest Tinnion had a lack of ambition staying with us so long when he could clearly have played in the tier above, didn't stop him being a very good player for us. The Tinnion e.g is not comparing apples with apples. Arguably Tins could've played at a higher level, but he was virtually a permanent fixture in our team. Put it this way would Tins have stayed for so long if he was a bit part player like Nobes ?? In my view absolutely no way. Playing at a level below yourself may be a lack of ambition, but having great talen & not even playing is borderline criminal! Similarly the likes of Orr, Johnson & McIndoe who are all less "talented" than Noble, would not hang around if they were so far from the 1st 11. It seems inevitable that Noble will leave soon. Be honest, if I gave you £50 would you bet that Nobes would make a success of himself & forge a career at CCC level or above or would he continue to fritter away his talent in the depths of leagues 1 & 2 ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 That's fine if you don't buy it, I don't think there have been any direct quotes from GJ saying so, like all of us on here I am only making a supposition. My impression is that he often fades from games just at the point you would think he could start exploiting space, but I have no evidence of that either as I have never been one for keeping stats etc on players. To be honest, I have trouble remembering more than a handful of games in any season in detail. I would tend to agree that he can fade from games - many more creative players do when we're on the back foot. I wouldn't claim he suffers from an excess of stamina either, he clearly doesn't have as good an engine as Elliott or LJ. I just think his ability on the ball and passing is superior enough to make a difference despite that. Myself I reckon he'd do a better job than LJ has done this season overall but that's not really what I'm getting at here - whatever you think of his ability as a player it must surely be easy to agree that we shouldn't have offered a new deal to a player the manager has no intention of playing. On the second point, if the figures on here are true then, yes I think that is quite high. I think though that all the criticism that GJ fields for not picking him, would have been more than doubled if we had let him go in the summer, especially after that goal at Palace (which by DN's own admission only came about due to him being "too tired to run any further) and his other contributions in the last few games. I'm fairly sure of the figures. There were five or so players given new deals in the latter part of last season and all got offered similar terms - GJ said as much in the article on Orr being listed. On the Palace thing, yeah, I'm sure he was knackered and I'm sure the comment was a bit tongue in cheek too. It was in injury time which kinda makes the point he can last a game and still affect it right at the end. If GJ had sold him in the summer I'm sure there would have been some disappointment but I doubt it would have been a big backlash because he wasn't playing much last season - particularly if we had signed a replacement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 Be honest, if I gave you £50 would you bet that Nobes would make a success of himself & forge a career at CCC level or above or would he continue to fritter away his talent in the depths of leagues 1 & 2 ? I think Noble could be a success at this level but I doubt he will get a move to another club at this level since he isn't playing much - so no, I wouldn't take that bet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vincent_bcfc Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 If Noble wanted to he could be a real ashton gate legend. his passing is excellent and his shooting is also very good unfortunately he does have fitness problems a reason why he rarely plays games i rate him very very highly and i think to get his fitness up he should play games also to reply to the '10-15' goals a season quote how do you know he cant do that? he has never had a full season to prove it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Seend Red Posted January 21, 2009 Report Share Posted January 21, 2009 Where did all this Noble has fitness problems come from, it seems it's been said so many time's on here it's now fact. What a pile of tosh!! Noble trains with the rest of the squad on daily bases and I'm sure if he wasn't putting in the work GJ would of moved him on long before now and not offered him a contract in the summer. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out the real reason why he doesn't play more matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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