Great Win But Still The Same Problem

[CotswoldRed]

My god, when I look at everything Gary has achieved and the positivity and belief he has spread through the dressing room, through the club and through the support, I can only be grateful that knife-twisting poison like I read on here is roundly ignored by those who matter, whilst they go about the business of giving us a team and a football club we can be proud of.

Spot on. This is easily the best period in the time since I've been following City since the mid-eighties.

I've also been re-reading a number of books recently, chronicling the bumpy ride that is the history of this fantastic club. Bar the late 70's we've never had it so good.

When you think of the number of City fans in our history who have never tasted any real success, its quite scary.

Looking across the last hundred years, its easy to imagine that we might never be promoted to the top level in all of our lifetimes. For that reason alone, we ALL need to get on and enjoy what we currently have as it might be the pinnacle of our success for decades to come.

[worthyred]

And they've been a tad quieter of late. I wonder why?

Oh Cheese come on......at least two appeared after the Doncaster defeat!!

[worthyred]

Yet you still have the audacity to call them not good enough.

Take a look at this:

http://news.BBC.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/e...ble/default.stm

Listed there, in order of points gained whilst playing each other is all the Championship sides this season.

Look at the names - Charlton, Derby, Southampton, Watford, Crystal Palace... I could go on.

All clubs with aspirations of getting promoted in August, all trying to do everything possible to achieve that goal, all employing managers and players who have that as their aim and over half of them with larger gates than us and larger incomes. Yet look where we are - fourth.

Now, Alex Ferguson could manage all of those teams and have the same standard of player available in each, but three would go up and three would go down.

You know why that is? Because this isn't some exact science, it's sport. There are a million variables and situations to be handled and managed during a season. It is not simply 'loan him in and we'll go up'. If it was, we would do it. But then, someone else would as well and so would someone else and we're back to it being sport not science.

I'll tell you this now. One day, we will all look back and say this was one of the greatest periods to be a Bristol City fan. Yet some people are determined not only not to enjoy it, but to attempt to pull it to pieces.

My god, when I look at everything Gary has achieved and the positivity and belief he has spread through the dressing room, through the club and through the support, I can only be grateful that knife-twisting poison like I read on here is roundly ignored by those who matter, whilst they go about the business of giving us a team and a football club we can be proud of.

Sums up my thoughts exactly, after years of mediocrity we are where we all dreamed of being after years in the wilderness of League 1. Yet certain people will never be happy.

[SE23Red]

We got 3 games starting with Blackpool now I can't see Adebola playing a full part in all the game and as it was shown at Donny we struggle to score without him playing.

Can I quickly congratulate you on your 3,500 posts and make a small request - please try and say something positive just once in the next 3,500. Who knows, you might even enjoy it.

[havanatopia]

Yet you still have the audacity to call them not good enough.

Take a look at this:

http://news.BBC.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/e...ble/default.stm

Listed there, in order of points gained whilst playing each other is all the Championship sides this season.

Look at the names - Charlton, Derby, Southampton, Watford, Crystal Palace... I could go on.

All clubs with aspirations of getting promoted in August, all trying to do everything possible to achieve that goal, all employing managers and players who have that as their aim and over half of them with larger gates than us and larger incomes. Yet look where we are - fourth.

Now, Alex Ferguson could manage all of those teams and have the same standard of player available in each, but three would go up and three would go down.

You know why that is? Because this isn't some exact science, it's sport. There are a million variables and situations to be handled and managed during a season. It is not simply 'loan him in and we'll go up'. If it was, we would do it. But then, someone else would as well and so would someone else and we're back to it being sport not science.

I'll tell you this now. One day, we will all look back and say this was one of the greatest periods to be a Bristol City fan. Yet some people are determined not only not to enjoy it, but to attempt to pull it to pieces.

My god, when I look at everything Gary has achieved and the positivity and belief he has spread through the dressing room, through the club and through the support, I can only be grateful that knife-twisting poison like I read on here is roundly ignored by those who matter, whilst they go about the business of giving us a team and a football club we can be proud of.

Nice one Ed. ditto that for Cotswold.

I remember the days when we hit 92nd as i am sure many of you do. Away at Darlington and particularly York were very memorable... cold dark wet and winter nights with the likes of Economou, Musker, and Newman with Cooper coming on in the last 20 to rally the troops to another grinding 1-1 draw and gradually pull us away from the foot....I ran onto the pitch the day we were promoted at Chester and so began the slow, long road back to the top which Gary is now masterminding with superb skill.

Perhaps City should play a video of those days on a big screen inside the new stadium at the first and inaugural match and simply put up the caption.... LEST WE FORGET.

Football clubs that are well run continually need to remind the fans that it is only through patient and careful building that success can be achieved and to ensure we do not fall like we did before or the likes of Leeds, Leicester and Man City did and perhaps how Southampton and Charlton will.

[Lack of Action Man]

Imo, the must for us in the summer is a left back, the younger the better or a player who can operate anywhere along the left (mid or def).

[BCFC_Dan]

We got 3 games starting with Blackpool now I can't see Adebola playing a full part in all the game and as it was shown at Donny we struggle to score without him playing.

We struggled to score at Donny because the whole team played poorly, not simply because Adebola didn't play.

You still haven't offered any proof that last season's so-called "failure" (a ridiculous term to use considering we had a newly-promoted team) was entirely down to a lack of cover.

[SE23Red]

Imo, the must for us in the summer is a left back, the younger the better or a player who can operate anywhere along the left (mid or def).

Yep, another genuine left sided player would definitely add to what we have. Liam has come on so much in the middle in the last year that moving him out to the left should now be considered every bit as undesirable as moving Louis out to the right.

[RED4LIFE]

Yet you still have the audacity to call them not good enough.

Take a look at this:

http://news.BBC.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/e...ble/default.stm

Listed there, in order of points gained whilst playing each other is all the Championship sides this season.

Look at the names - Charlton, Derby, Southampton, Watford, Crystal Palace... I could go on.

All clubs with aspirations of getting promoted in August, all trying to do everything possible to achieve that goal, all employing managers and players who have that as their aim and over half of them with larger gates than us and larger incomes. Yet look where we are - fourth.

Now, Alex Ferguson could manage all of those teams and have the same standard of player available in each, but three would go up and three would go down.

You know why that is? Because this isn't some exact science, it's sport. There are a million variables and situations to be handled and managed during a season. It is not simply 'loan him in and we'll go up'. If it was, we would do it. But then, someone else would as well and so would someone else and we're back to it being sport not science.

I'll tell you this now. One day, we will all look back and say this was one of the greatest periods to be a Bristol City fan. Yet some people are determined not only not to enjoy it, but to attempt to pull it to pieces.

My god, when I look at everything Gary has achieved and the positivity and belief he has spread through the dressing room, through the club and through the support, I can only be grateful that knife-twisting poison like I read on here is roundly ignored by those who matter, whilst they go about the business of giving us a team and a football club we can be proud of.

Fabulous post.

Seriously though Edson, you've been on here for long enough to know its pointless replying to AY. Many of us have tried (and failed miserably) to have an informed debate with him, but have given up due to sheer frustration. For instance, this very thread is now 2 pages long and not one person has agreed with him, yet he STILL keeps spouting the same rubbish ad-nauseum without taking on-board what anyone else has posted :grr:

On a plus note, 'fans' of his ilk are thankfully few and far between and most of us fans are able to enjoy these good times without having to constantly snipe at various facets of the club.

There are even some of us who think this is the start of something big for our wonderful club

[edson]

Sums up my thoughts exactly, after years of mediocrity we are where we all dreamed of being after years in the wilderness of League 1. Yet certain people will never be happy.

And the biggest irony of all?

If, god forbid, we ever end up back in the lower leagues, the likes of ashtonyate will be the first ones on here telling us how good things were under Johnson and how shit we are now.

As I say - poison.

[Lack of Action Man]

Yep, another genuine left sided player would definitely add to what we have. Liam has come on so much in the middle in the last year that moving him out to the left should now be considered every bit as undesirable as moving Louis out to the right.

Spot on, Liam has matured into a fine centre half so let's keep him there. McAllister needs competition but we also need someone to take up the mantle once McAllister hangs up his boots or moves on.

[downendcity]

Great Win But Still The Same Problem.

Damn right. The same problem is that no matter how well we do, AY can always find something to moan about.

[SE23Red]

Seriously though Edson, you've been on here for long enough to know its pointless replying to AY. Many of us have tried (and failed miserably) to have an informed debate with him, but have given up due to sheer frustration. For instance, this very thread is now 2 pages long and not one person has agreed with him, yet he STILL keeps spouting the same rubbish ad-nauseum without taking on-board what anyone else has posted :grr:

But he serves a very useful purpose. Without his latest ramblings we wouldn't have had an excellent post from Edson. In fact most threads started by AY are among the more positive on here as they generate a response from those with a sense of perspective!

But as you say - don't expect him to ever actually engage in a debate...no matter how many times he replies.

[bcfcbs20]

Great Win But Still The Same Problem.

Damn right. The same problem is that no matter how well we do, AY can always find something to moan about.

whats the saying

you can please some people some of the time

but cant please all the people all of the time

or some s**t like that whats more constructive geting behind the team or being a moaning person I disagree with

[Godzilla]

We're a very good team, and one of the strongest clubs in this division. See the league table for more information.

[TomRitchie'sBoots]

Some teams in the Championship can afford to have big squads from a wages point of view and also the expectations of a swift return to the P/Ship eg Birmingham. City aren't in that category and wouldn't want to have too big a squad for risk of upsetting what appears a very good team spirit and attitude. That said the squad itself isn't that small - in addition to the 16 on duty at Reading you have Styvar, Elliott, Brian Wilson, McCombe, Weale and Akinde. Thats to say nothing of Trundle who if he returns will have the same excellent attitude he has always had and could do a job for us. Admittedly Noble appears out of the picture and some of the above have injuries but that shows that the squad is not that bad. Missing Elliott and McCombe with injuries and still on a fantastic run, Maynard suddenly firing, then injured and not quite back to top form and we still win at Reading. I'm not convinced by the argument for too many loans - would we add anyone to the starting line-up? No. So who would we change on the bench? Or would we bring someone in only on the off chance they'll get a game? Anyone coming in on that basis probably wouldn't be that good a player surely. It's certainly not broke so lets not fix it when we have no current need to do so.

[red man dan]

I am not sure how much longer threads like this can continue to surface in the face of all the good that this club as a whole is now achieving. However i suspect that unfortunately the answer is, that they will always continue to appear regardless of how much we progress we make. Loan players are in my opinion often seen as a sign of panic and disbelief in the players and the squad a manager has. GJ has built his team and squad around the idea of having trust in one another working hard for one another, and to have belief in yourself and your team mates. Consequently we have a solid bunch of players willing to put everything into what they do.

We are in my opinion far from the 4th best squad in this division based purely on footballing ability and natrual talent. I don't wish to do the players we have an injustice by saying this as clearly they ARE good players, on the contrary i feel the attributes they display of commitment, determination and proffessionalism are more commendable than just having ability. Why on earth people want GJ to jeapodise the spirit amonsgt the players by bringing in new players on loan is beyond me. If the right players was available(even though i don't think we need one) then he would have to be extremely talented with the attitude to go with it. He would have to come in and display exactly the same proffessionalism that all of our current squad display or we would run the massive risk of players resenting him and we could concievably see a big drop in moral because of this.

Competition for places is a good thing, BUT it must be the right kind of competition to work in a team like ours that bases its progress on hard work. If a player came in on loan with simply pure ability and began starting in the first team week in week out without putting the same amount of effort and determination into training and on a whole, imagine the discontent this would cause amonsst the current squad? Losing your place to a player you respect and value is not what any player wants, but if you see them giving their all as you do, you can accept it and fight for your chance to win your place back. But if a player minces around and still starts ahead of you, then that is a bitter pill to swallow. All of the City players know they are where they are through sheer hard work, they clearly have a bond that is created through that hard work and to bring the wrong player in, with the wrong attitude would make a mockery of all that GJ and the players and club currently stand for. I for one am happy and confident that he would NEVER EVER do this.

We are achieving great things way above and beyond what we should be, given its our second season in this division. It is without doubt the best time i can remember in 20 years of supporting City without question. I don't even get to many games at the moment, but the atmosphere and buzz around the whole club is fantastic, it hits you straight away. That is a consequence in my opinion of how GJ has transformed the club from a backwater for playboy footballers wanting to live it up in the little pond with the big team to a club where players want to come and strive day in day out to progress themselves and Bristol City. For me, that means EVERTHING, we are no longer a club that players will look at and think 'yeah, that would be nice, big club in league one, big wages, big city and no pressure really, i can sit pretty there and have a ball'....players look at us now and think 'right this is a great opportunity for me to really work hard with a proffessional bunch of players and an extremely proffessional management team, this is a club who are doing everything to move forward and achieve things and i WANT to be a part of it'....that is why, we need only to bring in players that as GJ says himself, have the same ambitions as he and the club have.

After turning this club into something i could only have dreamed about ten years ago i cannot for one second believe people STILL have doubts about how things are being done and why. TRUST is something we as a club need to learn about, something i sense GJ is slowly bringing aorund to the fans, we ARE maturing as fans, we ARE finding out that our support really can help our club, and slowly we are becoming a UNITED club, all pulling in the same direction. It would appear however, that some of us are learning faster than others. I can add weight to this by telling you, i once reffered to GJ as the 'evil dwarf' who was going to relegate us from league one. I have not always been a lover of GJ. My god how that makes me feel embarrased now, not just embarrassed but also ashamed. But there you have it, proof that some of us, as fans are maturing, and viewing how we support the club in a different light. Things will not happen over night, things will not be perfect through a whole season, but NOW more than ever we are seeing that reserving judgement, and giving things a little more time before crying 'panic' is the way forward. I had no doubt that GJ and the players would turn things around, maybe not quite so much as they have actually, but some people were on the verge of throwing in the towell, of changing the team, the sqaud, and it pains me to say it....the manager.(all be it a minority). Some talked of thanking GJ for what he done, but asked whether he could take us to the next level, some talked of how we cannot think only of the past and therefore forgive for the present(when we were struggling before Xmas), and this is a prime of example of how maturing as supporters shows us that 'yes', we should remember the past as knowing that GJ has pulled through bad pathces before, SHOULD give us the trust in him to do so again.

GJ has moved this club forward in incredible ways, and IMO not just in terms of our league status. He has changed the whole outlook of the club as a whole and i for one am LOVING every minute of it and thank him and all invloved for that.

I guess this whole rather long post could actually be best summed up in just two simple words.

ALWAYS BELIEVE!

[TomRitchie'sBoots]

I am not sure how much longer threads like this can continue to surface in the face of all the good that this club as a whole is now achieving. However i suspect that unfortunately the answer is, that they will always continue to appear regardless of how much we progress we make. Loan players are in my opinion often seen as a sign of panic and disbelief in the players and the squad a manager has. GJ has built his team and squad around the idea of having trust in one another working hard for one another, and to have belief in yourself and your team mates. Consequently we have a solid bunch of players willing to put everything into what they do.

We are in my opinion far from the 4th best squad in this division based purely on footballing ability and natrual talent. I don't wish to do the players we have an injustice by saying this as clearly they ARE good players, on the contrary i feel the attributes they display of commitment, determination and proffessionalism are more commendable than just having ability. Why on earth people want GJ to jeapodise the spirit amonsgt the players by bringing in new players on loan is beyond me. If the right players was available(even though i don't think we need one) then he would have to be extremely talented with the attitude to go with it. He would have to come in and display exactly the same proffessionalism that all of our current squad display or we would run the massive risk of players resenting him and we could concievably see a big drop in moral because of this.

Competition for places is a good thing, BUT it must be the right kind of competition to work in a team like ours that bases its progress on hard work. If a player came in on loan with simply pure ability and began starting in the first team week in week out without putting the same amount of effort and determination into training and on a whole, imagine the discontent this would cause amonsst the current squad? Losing your place to a player you respect and value is not what any player wants, but if you see them giving their all as you do, you can accept it and fight for your chance to win your place back. But if a player minces around and still starts ahead of you, then that is a bitter pill to swallow. All of the City players know they are where they are through sheer hard work, they clearly have a bond that is created through that hard work and to bring the wrong player in, with the wrong attitude would make a mockery of all that GJ and the players and club currently stand for. I for one am happy and confident that he would NEVER EVER do this.

We are achieving great things way above and beyond what we should be, given its our second season in this division. It is without doubt the best time i can remember in 20 years of supporting City without question. I don't even get to many games at the moment, but the atmosphere and buzz around the whole club is fantastic, it hits you straight away. That is a consequence in my opinion of how GJ has transformed the club from a backwater for playboy footballers wanting to live it up in the little pond with the big team to a club where players want to come and strive day in day out to progress themselves and Bristol City. For me, that means EVERTHING, we are no longer a club that players will look at and think 'yeah, that would be nice, big club in league one, big wages, big city and no pressure really, i can sit pretty there and have a ball'....players look at us now and think 'right this is a great opportunity for me to really work hard with a proffessional bunch of players and an extremely proffessional management team, this is a club who are doing everything to move forward and achieve things and i WANT to be a part of it'....that is why, we need only to bring in players that as GJ says himself, have the same ambitions as he and the club have.

After turning this club into something i could only have dreamed about ten years ago i cannot for one second believe people STILL have doubts about how things are being done and why. TRUST is something we as a club need to learn about, something i sense GJ is slowly bringing aorund to the fans, we ARE maturing as fans, we ARE finding out that our support really can help our club, and slowly we are becoming a UNITED club, all pulling in the same direction. It would appear however, that some of us are learning faster than others. I can add weight to this by telling you, i once reffered to GJ as the 'evil dwarf' who was going to relegate us from league one. I have not always been a lover of GJ. My god how that makes me feel embarrased now, not just embarrassed but also ashamed. But there you have it, proof that some of us, as fans are maturing, and viewing how we support the club in a different light. Things will not happen over night, things will not be perfect through a whole season, but NOW more than ever we are seeing that reserving judgement, and giving things a little more time before crying 'panic' is the way forward. I had no doubt that GJ and the players would turn things around, maybe not quite so much as they have actually, but some people were on the verge of throwing in the towell, of changing the team, the sqaud, and it pains me to say it....the manager.(all be it a minority). Some talked of thanking GJ for what he done, but asked whether he could take us to the next level, some talked of how we cannot think only of the past and therefore forgive for the present(when we were struggling before Xmas), and this is a prime of example of how maturing as supporters shows us that 'yes', we should remember the past as knowing that GJ has pulled through bad pathces before, SHOULD give us the trust in him to do so again.

GJ has moved this club forward in incredible ways, and IMO not just in terms of our league status. He has changed the whole outlook of the club as a whole and i for one am LOVING every minute of it and thank him and all invloved for that.

I guess this whole rather long post could actually be best summed up in just two simple words.

ALWAYS BELIEVE!

yep.bang on

[Simon79]

aaaggghhh!!! We have a good squad,cover in all positions,except possibly left midfielder.Although there are a few who could do a job there.Saturday we had Mcombe,Elliott,Styvaar,Wilson,Noble,Ribeiro out injured.Trundle out on loan and our top scorer on the bench and we have not got a good enough squad? Was I dreaming Saturday,or did we run and play possibly the best team in the league of the pitch? These players that so often get written off on here have now done the business at this level for nearly 2 seasons now,is it about time some gave them and more importantly GJ some credit? There are possibly a few bigger squads in this division,mainly cause of the parachute payments.But I would not swap any for what we have got at the Gate.Individual big names don't make good teams or squads,we have got that.So think yourself lucky!!!

[Guest ashtonyate]

I have said in another post we can put out a good team what I am saying we do not have to much back up if you take adebola out of it we have Akinda that is anything like Dele and if you play any of the other we struggle to score and that is dangerous to our promotion hopes I know the happy clappies are in full flow lets hope they are not brought back to earth with a bump in the next 3 games.

[edson]

I have said in another post we can put out a good team what I am saying we do not have to much back up if you take adebola out of it we have Akinda that is anything like Dele and if you play any of the other we struggle to score and that is dangerous to our promotion hopes I know the happy clappies are in full flow lets hope they are not brought back to earth with a bump in the next 3 games.

You genuinely don't get it, do you?

It's absolutely astonishing.

[Guest ashtonyate]

You genuinely don't get it, do you?

It's absolutely astonishing.

So am I you think the spad is strong enough It is amazing

[Will Rollason]

Why do you all still do it? Even old , seasoned members of this forum who know all about AY still rise to it??

How do you all remain so polite?

Its not as if any of you EVER make him change his mind or admit he's wrong or whatever. Seriously , why?

Edit; yes i see the irony of posting about someone on my ignore list thank you....

[garlicbread]

So am I you think the spad is strong enough It is amazing

Are you seriously on the wind up??? This club is 4th in the league with a decent sized squad with depth.

FFS man, take a night off and enjoy the heady heights of 4th in the CCC. Try and remember where we were between 1980 and 2005!!

[edson]

So am I you think the spad is strong enough It is amazing

I was unaware we'd discussed spads and their relative strengths.

Have a read of the posts that people have taken time and effort to post in response to your bilge. Maybe even attempt to absorb some of the contents of said posts.

You may then be in a better position to reply with something approaching relevance.

At present, you are ignoring everything people have said and have just reposted your opening post in this thread.

The fact you don't even understand my last post, which was only two sentences, only underlines my point, it doesn't challenge it.

[Guest ashtonyate]

Are you seriously on the wind up??? This club is 4th in the league with a decent sized squad with depth.

FFS man, take a night off and enjoy the heady heights of 4th in the CCC. Try and remember where we were between 1980 and 2005!!

I am not trying to wind up anyone we have won a few battles but we haven't won the war yet. I see list of players that poster think are first team players but most of them are either young with little experance or not good enought we must have one of the smallest squad in the CC and not having enough cover I think will be our downfall that's my opinion I hope I am wrong but I don't think I will be.

[Guest ashtonyate]

I was unaware we'd discussed spads and their relative strengths.

Have a read of the posts that people have taken time and effort to post in response to your bilge. Maybe even attempt to absorb some of the contents of said posts.

You may then be in a better position to reply with something approaching relevance.

At present, you are ignoring everything people have said and have just reposted your opening post in this thread.

The fact you don't even understand my last post, which was only two sentences, only underlines my point, it doesn't challenge it.

Well if you don't think we are discussing strength of squads then you haven't been reading my post

[Dollymarie]

I have said in another post we can put out a good team what I am saying we do not have to much back up if you take adebola out of it we have Akinda that is anything like Dele and if you play any of the other we struggle to score and that is dangerous to our promotion hopes I know the happy clappies are in full flow lets hope they are not brought back to earth with a bump in the next 3 games.

But we don't need to take Adebola out of it, because he is playing and he is scoring. Thats just like saying we would struggle to score if half our squad was wiped out overnight in a road traffic accident.

AY, someone famous once said if you have nothing nice to say, don't say anything, and in this case I think that most definitely applies to you. Get off your high horse, stop being a whingebag and ENJOY IT!!!

[edson]

I see list of players that poster think are first team players but most of them are either young with little experance or not good enough

So, are you basing that on our finishing position last season or our current position this season?

Here are the available replies:.

1. I'm basing it on finishing fourth and getting to the Play Off final last season.

2. I'm basing it on the fact we're fourth this season.

3. I'm basing it on both of the above.

[Heathy33]

I am not trying to wind up anyone we have won a few battles but we haven't won the war yet. I see list of players that poster think are first team players but most of them are either young with little experance or not good enought we must have one of the smallest squad in the CC and not having enough cover I think will be our downfall that's my opinion I hope I am wrong but I don't think I will be.

Ok, i, like a few others who have been trying to ignore ashtonyate, have had enough. You are everything that has been wrong with a sizeable chunk of our supporters for as long as i can remember. Miserable, grumpy, illiterate and ignorant fools who are are only happy when running down the good work and thoughts of others.

I am not even going to attempt to argue against the points you have attempted to make, as there are far better posters than me on here who attend far more games than i, who have tried and failed to shut you up and put an end to your negativity. For all the good points about the internet, and the boards like this that it has spawned, the fact it gives a voice to people like you is a huge downside. You do not deserve the chance to broadcast your views.

You are an utter c**k.

And i will happily be banned for saying it.

(Its a fair cop mods. Do your worst.)