Gavin Williams

[WellRedPhil]

you were basing him on being poor based on 49 games, imply that's how many he played to prove that he's not good enough, when in fact he's start less than half so distorts a balanced view.

Particulary Poor at QPR. Yes much like the entire team on that day in what was a dreadful overall performance, (technically though he did get an assit) Prime example of Williams luck at City, one bad game and out the team, whereas others will get 2/3/4 games do nothing and keep their place.

just another central midfielder who was mismanaged for spells during his time at City in favor of others....much like Noble/Carle/Hartley

He did have a poor game that day but we actually played quite well and probably should've won! Agree on your point that he never got much of a chance, Cardiff was the prime example, came on for 15 mins and scored, then doesn't get picked again for ages in a period where we couldn't beat anyone!

[WellRedPhil]

With Skuse, Elliot and Hartley in the squad I think appearances will be limited for both Johnson and Williams. We certainly don't need both of them and Johnson is a better all-rounder to have as cover.

That's interesting because I actually think Williams is a lot better than LJ. He has started nowhere near as many games as him in the last 2 seasons but I'd say has provided more complete performances. For example last season when Williams came off the bench against Barnsley and was fantastic, I just can't see LJ being able to have a serious impact on a game when coming off the bench whereas I do think Williams could. I think he's much more positive than Johnson and he does always try to drive at the opposition, I honestly believe if we keep hold of him we will have a decent set of central midfielders to choose from in Eliiot, Skuse, Hartley and Williams. (Assuming Sno goes back).

[BCFC_Dan]

That's interesting because I actually think Williams is a lot better than LJ. He has started nowhere near as many games as him in the last 2 seasons but I'd say has provided more complete performances. For example last season when Williams came off the bench against Barnsley and was fantastic, I just can't see LJ being able to have a serious impact on a game when coming off the bench whereas I do think Williams could. I think he's much more positive than Johnson and he does always try to drive at the opposition, I honestly believe if we keep hold of him we will have a decent set of central midfielders to choose from in Eliiot, Skuse, Hartley and Williams. (Assuming Sno goes back).

I agree that Williams is a better impact player but I think Johnson is a better option as cover for one of the three main midfielders.

I know Johnson is a bit lightweight and could hardly be described as "solid" but he does get about the pitch well and can generally be counted on to at least make a nuisance of himself, whilst Williams has a tendency to disappear from games completely. I've no problem with keeping him as an option but I see him as an expensive luxury and I think we have better impact players in the likes of Sproule, Campbell-Ryce, Akinde and Haynes (depending of course on which of those has started the match).

Johnson also has a vastly better fitness record than Williams.

[NickJ]

With Skuse, Elliot and Hartley in the squad I think appearances will be limited for both Johnson and Williams. We certainly don't need both of them and Johnson is a better all-rounder to have as cover.

Not quite sure how you're defining better all-rounder but in terms of things that affect the game I'd say Williams is miles better.

Goalscoring - Williams

Assists - Williams

Tackling - Williams

Ability to drive forward and take players on - Williams

Flair/entertainment - Williams

Long passing - Williams

Short passing - Johnson

Fitness - Johnson

First touch - both

Pace - neither

Defending - neither

I would like to have seen Williams brought back and given a regular impact appearance as sub for the rest of the season however I think the loan has been extended to end of season?

[BCFC_Dan]

Not quite sure how you're defining better all-rounder but in terms of things that affect the game I'd say Williams is miles better.

Well I think Johnson is more reliable and consistent. He's also better at getting around the pitch and coming back to defend as well as attacking.

Fundamentally, though, I don't think either is good enough to provide a real option at the level City aspire to. However Johnson's availability record and willingness to work make him a better option as cover.

[Mrdeady]

He has had one run in the team and that was last season, we went on a run and looked like threatening the play-offs, he was are best midfielder last season by some way but then didn't get a look in. I don't think anyone can really say he has had a fair crack of the whip when players like Johnson and Elliot have been mostly ineffective for a season and a half, yet they have played far more games.

[Nibor]

Well I think Johnson is more reliable and consistent. He's also better at getting around the pitch and coming back to defend as well as attacking.

You sure?! He hardly ever gets back behind the ball.

Fundamentally, though, I don't think either is good enough to provide a real option at the level City aspire to. However Johnson's availability record and willingness to work make him a better option as cover.

Largely agree, if Williams hadn't had injury problems for the last few years I think he has the ability but he hasn't played the solid numbers of games necessary to get consistent.

[BCFC_Dan]

You sure?! He hardly ever gets back behind the ball.

He's done his share in the games I've seen. He's not the most effective defensive player due to his size but he gets in there and makes a nuisance of himself until someone else can help out.

Largely agree, if Williams hadn't had injury problems for the last few years I think he has the ability but he hasn't played the solid numbers of games necessary to get consistent.

He's had "injury problems" for a long time. He might be very unlucky or he might not have the drive and desire to work at his fitness. I suspect the latter but I'm sure the coaching staff will have a good idea of the truth.

From what I've seen of the two players I'd say that if we were going to have a talented but unfit midfielder we'd have been better off keeping Noble and losing Williams. We really need someone who's a step up from both of them, and Johnson, now.

[NickJ]

Well I think Johnson is more reliable and consistent. He's also better at getting around the pitch and coming back to defend as well as attacking......

........Johnson's availability record and willingness to work make him a better option as cover.

More reliable and consistent? At what?

- Scoring? No.

- Creating chances? No.

- Driving forward? No.

- Tackling? No.

Better at getting back to defend and attacking?

- Take attacking first, if Willims is better at scoring, shooting, creating chances and driving forward, which most people would say is the case, how does that make Johnson better?

- As for defending, Williams isnt the greatest but Johnson is no better, hopeless in fact.

Availability record?

Williams was nearly always available, for some reason the ex-manager just wouldnt pick him....

[Garland-sweden]

Went down yesterday with a few Millwall mates and thought Williams was quality and deserves another chance with us.

With the new management staff coming in, I for one hope that they bring back Williams because there's no doubting his class, but he wasn't given much of a chance here - much like Noble.

Williams is a classplayer i think. Remember Nickys wondergoal vs QPR, the ball came from Gavin, very intelligent. Think it was Carey that said Williams was the best player he ever played with when he came to our club. Maybe hes the one who feeds Maynard and Haynes With the right passes next season, its just thougt but i think he is a real playmaker. Always believe.

[bucksred]

had enough chances and when he started delivered little - think LJ a far better bet personally and would prefer him in next season's squad.

No chance. Gavin is a way better all round player and a damn sight more consistent.