Rbs Bosses Bonus

[Barrs Court Red]

Are the banks to blame for I'll thought out PFI's? Are they to blame for the unsustainable public spending? Selling off our gold reserves? The stifling red tape?

Te banking crisis simply kicked over the ant mound, they didn't force the government of the time to bankrupt the country.

Sick of the left blaming the city and trying to duck out of the simple fact that public spending was left to grow out of control.

[screech]

Same old Labour Party, bankrupt the country, then blame the Tories for years of cuts. Same old Tories, screwing the poor while continuing to feed the rich. Round and round we go. Never mind though, after two terms of the Tories, the voters will be so desperate for change after years of them saving, they will vote the Labour party back in to spend the money all over again.

[Red-Robbo]

That's what I found so hilarious about Miliband's rant at the Tories allowing it was that the agreement was made by the last labour government.

There was no agreement made by the last government to say "he must be given whacking great bonuses every year" just one saying that any future bonuses would be optional. In other words, it ISN'T in his contract that he be given these shares.

[Mr Mosquito]

the recent euro agreement crisis stemmed from the fact that Cameron couldn't allow to see his mates (and funders) in the city get put under regulation that would help stop them gambling like they did before.

The last thing we need is for the hopelessly corrupt and criminal led European Union project to be given any more sovereignty over British affairs. I'm hoping that David Cameron's stance over EU meddling in London city finance is the first step toward this country's exit door of the EU. I totally agree with David Cameron vetoing the EU, even if it was to help his Tory buddies in the city of London. You've only got to look at the shambles that is the EU Euro currency to know that European Unionists haven't got a clue on financial matters.

[marshy]

There was no agreement made by the last government to say "he must be given whacking great bonuses every year" just one saying that any future bonuses would be optional. In other words, it ISN'T in his contract that he be given these shares.

But it was in his contract that the Board should make the decisions as to his remuneration and options.

[Red-Robbo]

He's not taking the bonus now.

The fact that RBS chose to pay a bonus just a fraction under the £1m amount that Cammy said was his "line in the sand" over which he'd intervene to take action shows what a pisstake it was.

[Barrs Court Red]

So if it's under....it's a pisstake how exactly?

[RedWitch]

Bit like the installation of the new computer system at North Bristol Trust. IT director gets a pat on the back and the support staff are walking out of their jobs whilst being blamed for the failure of said IT system.

[Fiale]

Great - so as part owners of RBS our investment has lost over £320 million of value over this issue. Talk about shooting ourselves in the foot - I guess peoples envy does trump all - that we are all willing to lose £320 million over envy that some execs were getting a few million in bonuses (most of which would have ended back in the treasury as it would have been taxed into oblivion as opposed to corp tax which would be just 20%)

Hester wasn’t going to get his hands on his bonus for over a year, it wasn’t even going to come directly from treasury funds and most of it would have ended up in Treasury coffers, yet this morning £320m has been wiped off of the value of the British taxpayers’ forced investment. With mob mentality over-ruling contracts, there are obvious jitters around the banks this morning.

[Nibor]

Great - so as part owners of RBS our investment has lost over £320 million of value over this issue. Talk about shooting ourselves in the foot - I guess peoples envy does trump all - that we are all willing to lose £320 million over envy that some execs were getting a few million in bonuses (most of which would have ended back in the treasury as it would have been taxed into oblivion as opposed to corp tax which would be just 20%)

Hester wasn’t going to get his hands on his bonus for over a year, it wasn’t even going to come directly from treasury funds and most of it would have ended up in Treasury coffers, yet this morning £320m has been wiped off of the value of the British taxpayers’ forced investment. With mob mentality over-ruling contracts, there are obvious jitters around the banks this morning.

It's alright, it's an easy job that a civil servant could do for a tenth of the price.

[Barrs Court Red]

Fingers crossed this is exactly the sort of thing that the Tories will highlight - Yet again Labour has cost the taxpayer millions at yet another attempt at vote grabbing.

[The Kaiser]

We're not all this bad!!

I am in investment banking in the city and to be honest, yeah our bonuses can be obscene to many.

A lot of us do work exceptionally long hours as well.

However, the RBS Chief's bonus (even though it was shares only) was totally inappropriate given the current circumstance of RBS I would agree.

[Red-Robbo]

Great - so as part owners of RBS our investment has lost over £320 million of value over this issue. Talk about shooting ourselves in the foot - I guess peoples envy does trump all - that we are all willing to lose £320 million over envy that some execs were getting a few million in bonuses (most of which would have ended back in the treasury as it would have been taxed into oblivion as opposed to corp tax which would be just 20%)

Hester wasn’t going to get his hands on his bonus for over a year, it wasn’t even going to come directly from treasury funds and most of it would have ended up in Treasury coffers, yet this morning £320m has been wiped off of the value of the British taxpayers’ forced investment. With mob mentality over-ruling contracts, there are obvious jitters around the banks this morning.

Calm down dear. Remember the saying "share prices can rise as well as fall".

If Hester is the one man fiscal superman some on here argue he is, I'm sure that 'paper' value will be recovered and improved upon.

[Fiale]

Calm down dear. Remember the saying "share prices can rise as well as fall".

If Hester is the one man fiscal superman some on here argue he is, I'm sure that 'paper' value will be recovered and improved upon.

Want to try to be even more patronising ?

[Red-Robbo]

Want to try to be even more patronising ?

Sorry Mr F.

What was meant to be humorous does, in second thoughts, sound patronising.

Although we rarely agree on that much (in this section anyway!), I do respect your posts.

[Red-Robbo]

Jeez! I hadn't realised JUST what a great job Mr Hester was doing! http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-17128477

Doubling their losses! That must deserve an extra million on that salary? Hell, if he can triple them next year let's give him a knighthood...

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Jeez! I hadn't realised JUST what a great job Mr Hester was doing! http://www.bbc.co.uk...siness-17128477

Doubling their losses! That must deserve an extra million on that salary? Hell, if he can triple them next year let's give him a knighthood...

Yes but don't forget if the bank doesn't pay bonuses to it's investment bankers, they might leave and go elsewhere and lose money, what can a poor boy do?.

[The Kaiser]

It's market capitalism - supply and demand. That's how the world works - no point in getting mad about it.

By the way my bonus end of 2011 was less than 20% this time - despite the fact there had been days where I didn't leave work until the following day (the infamous investment banking 'all-nighter').

In the defence of banking - how many of you stay at work the entire night after arriving at 6.30am??

I don't think the investment banking bashing that goes on in Britain today is justified, I really don't.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

It's market capitalism - supply and demand. That's how the world works - no point in getting mad about it.

By the way my bonus end of 2011 was less than 20% this time - despite the fact there had been days where I didn't leave work until the following day (the infamous investment banking 'all-nighter').

In the defence of banking - how many of you stay at work the entire night after arriving at 6.30am??

I don't think the investment banking bashing that goes on in Britain today is justified, I really don't.

Jesus mate please live in the real world and you might see how life really is. Armed forces, Old Bill, Fire Brigade, NHS do this a lot of the time when there is an emergency, FFS when was the last time you heard the call "we have an emergency is their an investment banker available". I won't go into specifics but I went on a job for 3 days many years ago, because of the nature of the job I did then the only information my wife got was 'he is alive'. The bottom line the real world cannot understand why anybody especially well paid people should be given a bonus just for doing their job.

RBS lost money last year and nobody at RBS should get a bonus even the profitable bit, when RBS become profitable as a whole once more perhaps that is the time to even think about if bonuses are appropriate, that way we know the whole company is pulling in the right direction and is on the right track.

Please no sob stories from bankers, I for one couldn't give a flying ****.

[screech]

It's market capitalism - supply and demand. That's how the world works - no point in getting mad about it.

By the way my bonus end of 2011 was less than 20% this time - despite the fact there had been days where I didn't leave work until the following day (the infamous investment banking 'all-nighter').

In the defence of banking - how many of you stay at work the entire night after arriving at 6.30am??

I don't think the investment banking bashing that goes on in Britain today is justified, I really don't.

You get paid to do your job to the best of your ability, you have targets, so does everybody who works for a living, why do you need a bonus?

[Spud55]

The problem most people have with these bonuses is the inequality of them, how many general staff of RBS get whopping big bonuses of 50-100% of their salary? when most have had to either take pay cuts, pay freezes or just been made redundant, those in the investement side and senior management levels are able to take £300 million plus in bonuses, which is actually almost doube the pre-tax profits RBS will have made in 2011, which seems a bit counter intuitive to me, "well done lads we made a profit this year, now lets give that all away and then some in bonuses, and now we've made a loss" I am aware that the RBS losses they have made throughout the year are in them trying to rebalance the balance sheet and isn't exactly a monetary loss, and it's nearly balanced and in that respect Hester has done a bloody good Job.

I have no beef with those at the top getting huge pay and huge bonuses, as frankly unlike margaret who works on the cash desk at an RBS branch, they can make a company millions if not billions with their decisions, so thats fine. Sadly it all too often seems the case that they can also loose a company billions and ruin it, then gleefully walk off into the sunset with a monstorous pension and a golden handshake for the pleasure of running a company into the ground, then they usually toddle into another job at the same level with another company to recieve massive pay and bonuses, despite clearly being a person I disagree with.

I have absolutely no beef with people getting paid well and rewarded for success, there is no clamour or moaning about the Bonus that the HSBC bankers are about to recieve (and they will be monumental) but thats because they have just posted record pre tax profits of £13.9 billion.

Currently the anger is directed at the wrong person, and a basic lack of understanding of bonus schemes, Hester is clearly doing a good job at RBS, people moaning at him saying he didn't meet his targets, why's he still getting a bonus are flat out wrong, he did meet his targets, and exceeded them to a level which allowed him a 900k bonus, he didn't exceed them enough to get his full 4 million bonus, but bonus payments are always on a sliding scale, so he did enough to earn 900k don't see much wrong with that to be honest.

The anger should be directed towards morons like Goodwin, a proper bank should never fail to the level RBS did, all banks have inbuilt safeguards so if the investment side or the commercial side or the business side has a complete mare the other sectors should be able to absorb this, no real banks got hammered with the financial crisis, HSBC took a hit but have continually made huge profits, Natwests only issue was that they happened to be owned by RBS, Barclays didn't take much of a hit and the only reason Lloyds had any trouble was that they were pushed for some innexplicable reason into buying the shambles that was HBOS. The "banks" that had the worst issues were the building societies that were allowed access to the money markets without ever having the structure to be able to cope when they got it wrong (which all banks do from time to time).

Goodwins mismanagement for years at the top of RBS making bad decision after bad decision should take the brunt of the stick, as he was at best just an idiot and at worst criminally negligent in his position at the head of RBS.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

The problem most people have with these bonuses is the inequality of them, how many general staff of RBS get whopping big bonuses of 50-100% of their salary? when most have had to either take pay cuts, pay freezes or just been made redundant, those in the investement side and senior management levels are able to take £300 million plus in bonuses, which is actually almost doube the pre-tax profits RBS will have made in 2011, which seems a bit counter intuitive to me, "well done lads we made a profit this year, now lets give that all away and then some in bonuses, and now we've made a loss" I am aware that the RBS losses they have made throughout the year are in them trying to rebalance the balance sheet and isn't exactly a monetary loss, and it's nearly balanced and in that respect Hester has done a bloody good Job.

I have no beef with those at the top getting huge pay and huge bonuses, as frankly unlike margaret who works on the cash desk at an RBS branch, they can make a company millions if not billions with their decisions, so thats fine. Sadly it all too often seems the case that they can also loose a company billions and ruin it, then gleefully walk off into the sunset with a monstorous pension and a golden handshake for the pleasure of running a company into the ground, then they usually toddle into another job at the same level with another company to recieve massive pay and bonuses, despite clearly being a person I disagree with.

I have absolutely no beef with people getting paid well and rewarded for success, there is no clamour or moaning about the Bonus that the HSBC bankers are about to recieve (and they will be monumental) but thats because they have just posted record pre tax profits of £13.9 billion.

Currently the anger is directed at the wrong person, and a basic lack of understanding of bonus schemes, Hester is clearly doing a good job at RBS, people moaning at him saying he didn't meet his targets, why's he still getting a bonus are flat out wrong, he did meet his targets, and exceeded them to a level which allowed him a 900k bonus, he didn't exceed them enough to get his full 4 million bonus, but bonus payments are always on a sliding scale, so he did enough to earn 900k don't see much wrong with that to be honest.

The anger should be directed towards morons like Goodwin, a proper bank should never fail to the level RBS did, all banks have inbuilt safeguards so if the investment side or the commercial side or the business side has a complete mare the other sectors should be able to absorb this, no real banks got hammered with the financial crisis, HSBC took a hit but have continually made huge profits, Natwests only issue was that they happened to be owned by RBS, Barclays didn't take much of a hit and the only reason Lloyds had any trouble was that they were pushed for some innexplicable reason into buying the shambles that was HBOS. The "banks" that had the worst issues were the building societies that were allowed access to the money markets without ever having the structure to be able to cope when they got it wrong (which all banks do from time to time).

Goodwins mismanagement for years at the top of RBS making bad decision after bad decision should take the brunt of the stick, as he was at best just an idiot and at worst criminally negligent in his position at the head of RBS.

HSBC as far as I am aware did not need or take a penny of public money. RBS are pretty much public owned and all of the staff should be dealt with the same as all public sectors workers have in the past 5 years, no bonus and no pay rise.

[Nibor]

HSBC as far as I am aware did not need or take a penny of public money. RBS are pretty much public owned and all of the staff should be dealt with the same as all public sectors workers have in the past 5 years, no bonus and no pay rise.

Two points

Every area of the public sector has had pay rises in the last five years and most of the people at the top of those organisations have also had bonuses.

RBS isn't a public sector organisation, it's a public limited company in which the government owns a (temporary) stake.

I agree largely with spud, the anger here is misdirected. People who fail shouldn't be getting bonuses, that's the problem. Not that the market dictates reward, that's capitalism. Of course capitalism isn't fair per se, it's just the best of a bad bunch of systems we have. If someone comes up with a better system, fine - start a revolution. There isn't one I'm aware of though.

[Red-Robbo]

The problem most people have with these bonuses is the inequality of them, how many general staff of RBS get whopping big bonuses of 50-100% of their salary? when most have had to either take pay cuts, pay freezes or just been made redundant, those in the investement side and senior management levels are able to take £300 million plus in bonuses, which is actually almost doube the pre-tax profits RBS will have made in 2011, which seems a bit counter intuitive to me, "well done lads we made a profit this year, now lets give that all away and then some in bonuses, and now we've made a loss" I am aware that the RBS losses they have made throughout the year are in them trying to rebalance the balance sheet and isn't exactly a monetary loss, and it's nearly balanced and in that respect Hester has done a bloody good Job.

I have no beef with those at the top getting huge pay and huge bonuses, as frankly unlike margaret who works on the cash desk at an RBS branch, they can make a company millions if not billions with their decisions, so thats fine. Sadly it all too often seems the case that they can also loose a company billions and ruin it, then gleefully walk off into the sunset with a monstorous pension and a golden handshake for the pleasure of running a company into the ground, then they usually toddle into another job at the same level with another company to recieve massive pay and bonuses, despite clearly being a person I disagree with.

I have absolutely no beef with people getting paid well and rewarded for success, there is no clamour or moaning about the Bonus that the HSBC bankers are about to recieve (and they will be monumental) but thats because they have just posted record pre tax profits of £13.9 billion.

Currently the anger is directed at the wrong person, and a basic lack of understanding of bonus schemes, Hester is clearly doing a good job at RBS, people moaning at him saying he didn't meet his targets, why's he still getting a bonus are flat out wrong, he did meet his targets, and exceeded them to a level which allowed him a 900k bonus, he didn't exceed them enough to get his full 4 million bonus, but bonus payments are always on a sliding scale, so he did enough to earn 900k don't see much wrong with that to be honest.

You'll need to re-explain - in plainer terms - how doubling his corporation's annual losses is "doing a good job"?

Even if the losses are one-off "accountancy" write-offs, he's still lead the firm into more debt surely?

I could point out that when you have the British taxpayers big chequebook behind you and lead something that has been officially deemed "too big to fail" you have a fair advantage over those of us trying to sail our little dinghies of commerce unsupported on the choppy financial seas.

[JammyOne]

Why on earth do people think that if a business is owned by the tax payer it should no longer operate as one. Bonuses need to be paid in order to ensure the future of the business. Personally as a tax payer and individual who has shares in RBS, I would like to see a decent return. This of course means paying bonuses to the top performers.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Why on earth do people think that if a business is owned by the tax payer it should no longer operate as one. Bonuses need to be paid in order to ensure the future of the business. Personally as a tax payer and individual who has shares in RBS, I would like to see a decent return. This of course means paying bonuses to the top performers.

Your right it worked so well right up to 2008, didn't it.

[Red-Robbo]

Why on earth do people think that if a business is owned by the tax payer it should no longer operate as one. Bonuses need to be paid in order to ensure the future of the business. Personally as a tax payer and individual who has shares in RBS, I would like to see a decent return. This of course means paying bonuses to the top performers.

But they aren't performing very "top" are they? That's the point.

[JammyOne]

But they aren't performing very "top" are they? That's the point.

There are high performers and low performers. The high performers make a business successful and are rewarded so that they stay with the company. The unsuccessful are usually put on report and managed out. The bonus is for the PERFORMING staff, the ones who are keeping the business ticking over. If you get rid of the high performers, you risk failing the business.

Clearly you don't understand business, so I'll make a simple football analogy: If a player in a squad performs, he is rewarded with awards etc and maintains a place in the squad, if a player has a poor run he is dropped and doesn't get a wage increase. If you took away this principle you would have players who just don't care and you will end up relegated.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

There are high performers and low performers. The high performers make a business successful and are rewarded so that they stay with the company. The unsuccessful are usually put on report and managed out. The bonus is for the PERFORMING staff, the ones who are keeping the business ticking over. If you get rid of the high performers, you risk failing the business.

Clearly you don't understand business, so I'll make a simple football analogy: If a player in a squad performs, he is rewarded with awards etc and maintains a place in the squad, if a player has a poor run he is dropped and doesn't get a wage increase. If you took away this principle you would have players who just don't care and you will end up relegated.

So if the highlighted sentence is true firstly why were bankers taking bonuses right up to and including 2008?, when quite clearly the banks had been failing over a 4 year period, the crisis didn't just happen overnight. Secondly where are all of the bankers who got us into this mess now? oh yes back on the gravy train of course and as for your last paragraph we were relegated pretty much every single one of us and after we are too old to pay our children and their children will still be paying for their mess and why? ******* greed and arrogance. Clearly I don't understand business but by the same token mate I think the same question needs to asked of the people who got us into this mess, do they understand business?, well one thing is for sure they know about ******* bonuses because it's pretty much all that they care about.

Banking = All the thrills of high roller gambling, but with the added bonus of the tax payer footing the bill when the hot streak goes tits up.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

This just about sums it up, from an insider not a wannabe.

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