England Vs Norway Match Thread

[Ciderhead433]

Is anyone going to watch this shower of shit in the Euros.

Yes i shall go to the pub full of confidence.

[Southport Red]

Thats fair comment from you, living up there you obviously know how the "real" Liverpool support feel. I can only go on what the "plastic" fans down here are saying.

IMO Gerrard us not an international player, he's decent on a cold Tuesday night at Anfield but he just can't grasp that in International football it's all about patience and ball retention.

We didn't even qualify for Euro 2008, then we totally failed in WC2010, how long do we continue playing him.

All I want is a manager/coach to have the balls to tell him to "just play it simple".

Worrying thing Bill is that, you may be 100% spot on about him but he is still amongst the best we have. The influx of foreign superstars into the Premier League is surely good for the PL but it is surely stunting the development of players we need to replace the likes of Gerrard. I mean, we are going into the Euro's with a Third choice goalie who is 19 yo and has only played for Cheltenham.

Gerrard may not be International class any more but we don't exactly have a line of players better than him lining up to take his spot. If Gerrard gets injured, who have we got? Lampard? Parker? Barry? Until Wilshere gets fit ( and assuming he doesn't 'do an Owen' ie come back as a shadow of his former self), Gerrard is, I fear, the best we have.

I'm not disagreeing with your point Bill but Stevie G is probs the best we have right now, and I think th PL is to blame

[bcfcbs20]

May I remind you of Oxlade-Chamberlain, Wilshere, Hart, Walker, Richards, Welbeck, Phil Jones, Powell, Gibbs and a few others. They all need to improve but they are all very talented young players.

They said the same about our current crop of shite 10-15 years ago. I very much doubt I will see a championship winning England team in my lifetime.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Nearly broke someones ankle? It was a good tackle and would have been a fantastic tackle a few years back. He won the ball = good tackle.

So all of the 4 TV pundits are wrong? and you are correct with your assumption about that tackle?, they all pretty much said that it was at minimum a yellow and in the prem could easily have been red, they all also agreed it was reckless and unnecessary.

But hey i'm sure you know best.

[Brizzle Jordan]

So all of the 4 TV pundits are wrong? and you are correct with your assumption about that tackle?, they all pretty much said that it was at minimum a yellow and in the prem could easily have been red, they all also agreed it was reckless and unnecessary.

But hey i'm sure you know best.

Like they all think Gerrard is world class and is worthy England captain but you disagree? Still you know best.

[wayne allisons tongues]

Work with 2 Liverpool fans and they aren't sure Gerard is best for the team. He came back from injury after Xmas and there league form dipped from when he came in. They reckon in one off cup games he's alright but can't do it enough now during a league season now. There examples 2 pens man city cup semi both legs and the derby in the league against everton, apart from that he has been pretty anonymous. Both these guys have season tickets for Anfield and I work in Salford so they travel across daily, so aren't armchair fans.

[Abraham Romanovich]

"Norway's expensive, I want to go home"

Apparently £8 for a half,.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

Like they all think Gerrard is world class and is worthy England captain but you disagree? Still you know best.

They also think that Downing is worthy of his place in the squad, it's called the 'gravy train', as a pundit you can comment about individual incidents like Gerrards tackle, but do not criticise individual players personally, just blow copious amounts of smoke up their individual arses because they may refuse to tell us how far over the moon or how sick as a parrot they are feeling by refusing to give post match interviews, throughout the game that tosser Townsend was telling us how well Carroll was playing, don't get me wrong Carroll certainly works hard for the team especially tracking back and in defence, but how many saves did he force the Norway goalkeeper to make? and why was that?, because Downing and Milner were/are both totally incapable of getting the ball past the first defender, Gerrard kept giving the ball away, Young drifted in and out of the game and when he came Walcott morphed into SWP ran around very fast, giving the ball away and taking the wrong option, thankfully Oxlade-Chamberlain looks like a breath of fresh air.

[Judge Roughneck]

Gerrard may not be International class any more but we don't exactly have a line of players better than him lining up to take his spot. If Gerrard gets injured, who have we got? Lampard? Parker? Barry? Until Wilshere gets fit ( and assuming he doesn't 'do an Owen' ie come back as a shadow of his former self), Gerrard is, I fear, the best we have.

I'm not disagreeing with your point Bill but Stevie G is probs the best we have right now, and I think th PL is to blame

Liverpool supporters love Gerrards style and not so impressed with more prosaic yet more productive (over 90 minutes) footballers like Mcallister, Hamman and Lucas.

In Gerrards autobiography, he does mention his propensity to make hollywood passess and constantly give the ball away in persuit of glory. Macallister and Hammann would advise him to "keep it next time". He would of course roundly ignore them.

English players lack what is called a "football brain". They do not know when the hold onto the ball and retain possession or to take a risk by playing a through pass or attempt a dribble.

However Brendon Rogers, Roberto Martinez and especially Roy Hodgson have all proved that you can teach the average Englishman to use their brain instead of playing like a mindless automaton with the effect of transforming their game IF THEY ARE PREPARED TO LEARN.

Owen's game was based on outsprinting turning defenders, once his hamstring went for the second and third time he was always going to be ineffectual. Wilshere's game isn't reliant on pace.

I'm not sure Gerrard is the best. Look at the goals that Lampard created for chelsea against barcelona. The only time Gerrard has played through balls like that at International level was when putting Thierry Henry through in 2004. But your point is right. If after all these years of failing at International level, those two are still the best option available then England fans had better get used to regular non qualification, or first round embarrassment.

[chipdawg]

I'm not entirely sure what all the pissing and moaning here is about. We've not been a top team for years and will not become one before Euro2012. People seem to be complaining that we're being boring and then complaining that we can't keep the ball and play it simple- in the same post. Not mutually exclusive things but we can't have it all. Hodgson is hamstrung by the squads his predecessor picked and by te fact that most of the young players he might wanted to take are injured. It's an English pastime to try and knock our players and manager incessantly, but it was a friendly played by the 2nd string of what is nowhere near a full strength squad and we all the records will say is that we won 1-0. Improvement needed but improvement may yet come

[Brizzle Jordan]

They also think that Downing is worthy of his place in the squad, it's called the 'gravy train', as a pundit you can comment about individual incidents like Gerrards tackle, but do not criticise individual players personally, just blow copious amounts of smoke up their individual arses because they may refuse to tell us how far over the moon or how sick as a parrot they are feeling by refusing to give post match interviews, throughout the game that tosser Townsend was telling us how well Carroll was playing, don't get me wrong Carroll certainly works hard for the team especially tracking back and in defence, but how many saves did he force the Norway goalkeeper to make? and why was that?, because Downing and Milner were/are both totally incapable of getting the ball past the first defender, Gerrard kept giving the ball away, Young drifted in and out of the game and when he came Walcott morphed into SWP ran around very fast, giving the ball away and taking the wrong option, thankfully Oxlade-Chamberlain looks like a breath of fresh air.

Oxlade-Chamberlain should start against France imo. He's 18 and better than Walcott already because he can pass, shoot and has a brain.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

I'm not entirely sure what all the pissing and moaning here is about. We've not been a top team for years and will not become one before Euro2012. People seem to be complaining that we're being boring and then complaining that we can't keep the ball and play it simple- in the same post. Not mutually exclusive things but we can't have it all. Hodgson is hamstrung by the squads his predecessor picked and by te fact that most of the young players he might wanted to take are injured. It's an English pastime to try and knock our players and manager incessantly, but it was a friendly played by the 2nd string of what is nowhere near a full strength squad and we all the records will say is that we won 1-0. Improvement needed but improvement may yet come

You make good valid points, our problem is when compared to the best european international teams, their coaches seem able to mould far better technically gifted individuals into a 'team' England have for far too long played as individuals, I cannot remember the last time we looked like a 'team' and not just a collection of individuals and until the coach can actually crack that particular nut and mould the England squad into a 'team' the longer we will stutter along in the manner that we have for probably the past 20 years.

if the players of the best teams in europe can leave their respective egos on the team coach, why can't we?.

[Esmond Million's Bung]

double post

[Taylor10]

You make good valid points, our problem is when compared to the best european international teams, their coaches seem able to mould far better technically gifted individuals into a 'team' England have for far too long played as individuals, I cannot remember the last time we looked like a 'team' and not just a collection of individuals and until the coach can actually crack that particular nut and mould the England squad into a 'team' the longer we will stutter along in the manner that we have for probably the past 20 years.

if the players of the best teams in europe can leave their respective egos on the team coach, why can't we?.

Maybe Roy is the man to change that? Who knows?

Regardless of the performance last night, it was a bit of a pointless friendly given that we all knew so many would be missing. He has been with the squad a matter of days with the squad. As you rightly say, no manager has been able to mould a team out of our players over what 20 years? Well then to do so I think Roy is going to need more than three days. He has a lot of work to do.

[chipdawg]

You make good valid points, our problem is when compared to the best european international teams, their coaches seem able to mould far better technically gifted individuals into a 'team' England have for far too long played as individuals, I cannot remember the last time we looked like a 'team' and not just a collection of individuals and until the coach can actually crack that particular nut and mould the England squad into a 'team' the longer we will stutter along in the manner that we have for probably the past 20 years.

if the players of the best teams in europe can leave their respective egos on the team coach, why can't we?.

I think perhaps there are a number of 'cultural' reasons why we don't produce the technically gifted players, though I do think that's changing. As unpopular as it may be, the main beneficiary of the new academy system may be the English national team as the best young players get the best coaching from an earlier age. I am quite excited about the young players coming through at the top level now as not only do some of them appear very talented, they seem to regard themselves as athletes first, celebrities second; something that the Terrys, Ferdinands, Gerrards don't seem to. Oxlade-Chamberlain is the one I really rate, seems a sensible, intelligent lad too. Rodwell, Wilshere, Jones & Smalling all also seem to be quite sensible chaps and I really rate Sturidge though he does perhaps need an attitude adjustment.

At the end of the day a lot of the players in the England set up deserve criticism, but it seems utterly redundant to say "we have a shit squad" and then criticise them for being shit. England are in transition right now and we just have to hope that the next golden generation is better than the last

[Judge Roughneck]

As you rightly say, no manager has been able to mould a team out of our players over what 20 years?

42

[Carey 6]

Mediocre is one word to sum England up. 6 players from a team that finished 8th in the Prem last season.

[BCFC Jordan]

So all of the 4 TV pundits are wrong? and you are correct with your assumption about that tackle?, they all pretty much said that it was at minimum a yellow and in the prem could easily have been red, they all also agreed it was reckless and unnecessary.

But hey i'm sure you know best.

I'm not sure if you were aware, but it was ITV!

[Esmond Million's Bung]

I'm not sure if you were aware, but it was ITV!

yes of course how silly Peter Reid, Gareth Southgate, Roy Keane and Andy Townsend have never played the game at international, european or Premier League level have they?, WTF would they know?, where as you on the other hand?.

[Brizzle Jordan]

Which of these youngsters do we think will actually go on to become international stars: All are 22 and under.

Goalkeepers:

Jack Butland - Birmingham - 19

Jamal Blackman - Chelsea - 18

Right Backs:

Nathaniel Clyne - Crystal Palace - 21

Kyle Walker - Tottenham - 21

Jon Flanagan - Liverpool - 19

Martin Kelly - Liverpool - 22

Jamal Lascelles - Nottingham Forest - 18

Left Backs:

Joe Bennett - Middlesbrough - 22

Jack Robinson - Liverpool - 18

Luke Shaw - Southampton - 16

Keiran Gibbs - Arsenal - 22

Centre Backs:

Phil Jones - Manchester United - 20

Chris Smalling - Manchester United - 22

Steven Caulker - Tottenham Hotspur - 20

Ryan Bennett - Norwich - 22

Craig Dawson - West Brom - 22

Lewis Dunk - Brighton - 20

Eric Dier - 18 - Sporting Lisbon

Nathaniel Chalobah - Chelsea - 17

Centre Midfielders:

Jordan Henderson - Liverpool - 22

Tom Cleverley - Manchester United - 22

Jack Rodwell - Everton - 21

Jack Wilshere - Arsenal - 20

Henri Lansbury - Arsenal - 21

Josh McEachran - Chelsea - 19

Jonjo Shelvey - Liverpool - 20

George Thorne - West Brom - 19

Ross Barkley - Everton - 18

Jacon Butterfield - Barnsley - 21

Tom Carroll - Tottenham - 19

Jordon Mutch - Birmingham - 20

Dan Gosling - Newcastle - 22

Ravel Morrison - West Ham - 19

Wingers:

Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain - Arsenal - 18

Wilfried Zaha - Crystal Palace - 19

Cameron Stewart - Hull - 21

Nathan Redmond - Birmingham - 18

Strikers:

Danny Welbeck - Manchester United - 21

Daniel Sturridge - Chelsea - 22

Connor Wickham - Sunderland - 19

Nick Powell - Crewe - 18

Harry Kane - Tottenham - 18

Max Clayton - Crewe - 17

Raheem Stirling - Liverpool - 17

[TRL]

Which of these youngsters do we think will actually go on to become international stars: All are 22 and under.

Goalkeepers:

Jack Butland - Birmingham - 19

Jamal Blackman - Chelsea - 18

Right Backs:

Nathaniel Clyne - Crystal Palace - 21

Kyle Walker - Tottenham - 21

Jon Flanagan - Liverpool - 19

Martin Kelly - Liverpool - 22

Jamal Lascelles - Nottingham Forest - 18

Left Backs:

Joe Bennett - Middlesbrough - 22

Jack Robinson - Liverpool - 18

Luke Shaw - Southampton - 16

Keiran Gibbs - Arsenal - 22

Centre Backs:

Phil Jones - Manchester United - 20

Chris Smalling - Manchester United - 22

Steven Caulker - Tottenham Hotspur - 20

Ryan Bennett - Norwich - 22

Craig Dawson - West Brom - 22

Lewis Dunk - Brighton - 20

Eric Dier - 18 - Sporting Lisbon

Nathaniel Chalobah - Chelsea - 17

Centre Midfielders:

Jordan Henderson - Liverpool - 22

Tom Cleverley - Manchester United - 22

Jack Rodwell - Everton - 21

Jack Wilshere - Arsenal - 20

Henri Lansbury - Arsenal - 21

Josh McEachran - Chelsea - 19

Jonjo Shelvey - Liverpool - 20

George Thorne - West Brom - 19

Ross Barkley - Everton - 18

Jacon Butterfield - Barnsley - 21

Tom Carroll - Tottenham - 19

Jordon Mutch - Birmingham - 20

Dan Gosling - Newcastle - 22

Ravel Morrison - West Ham - 19

Wingers:

Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain - Arsenal - 18

Wilfried Zaha - Crystal Palace - 19

Cameron Stewart - Hull - 21

Nathan Redmond - Birmingham - 18

Strikers:

Danny Welbeck - Manchester United - 21

Daniel Sturridge - Chelsea - 22

Connor Wickham - Sunderland - 19

Nick Powell - Crewe - 18

Harry Kane - Tottenham - 18

Max Clayton - Crewe - 17

Raheem Stirling - Liverpool - 17

They are all English, so I am guessing 1 maybe 2 at most.

[screech]

We had the supposed golden generation and they proved they were very average, this next generation with the exception of Wilshere and Hart are even worse. Unfortunately they are propelled as World Class before they do anything and you are left scratching your head how it is possible that these World Class players can't do it in major tournaments. You realise after a while that these players are good but are nowhere near the level the major Europeans teams are.

You do get suckered into it when you're young, no disrespect to the younger forum members but I've heard it all before how great these young kids are that are coming through.

[Brizzle Jordan]

We had the supposed golden generation and they proved they were very average, this next generation with the exception of Wilshere and Hart are even worse. Unfortunately they are propelled as World Class before they do anything and you are left scratching your head how it is possible that these World Class players can't do it in major tournaments. You realise after a while that these players are good but are nowhere near the level the major Europeans teams are.

You do get suckered into it when you're young, no disrespect to the younger forum members but I've heard it all before how great these young kids are that are coming through.

There are alot of ex players who think we have some brilliant young players aswell.

[Tins]

Which of these youngsters do we think will actually go on to become international stars: All are 22 and under.

Goalkeepers:

Jack Butland - Birmingham - 19 - Possibly

Right Backs:

Kyle Walker - Tottenham - 21 - Nearly there

Left Backs:

Jack Robinson - Liverpool - 18 - not sure on him yet

Keiran Gibbs - Arsenal - 22 - depends on fitness

Centre Backs:

Phil Jones - Manchester United - 20 - Will be 1st choice in

Chris Smalling - Manchester United - 22 - Will also be 1st choice

Steven Caulker - Tottenham Hotspur - 20 - will be squad

Centre Midfielders:

Tom Cleverley - Manchester United - 22 - depends on fitness

Jack Rodwell - Everton - 21 - Fitness again

Jack Wilshere - Arsenal - 20 - already there

Wingers:

Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain - Arsenal - 18 - Our star man in years to come

Strikers:

Danny Welbeck - Manchester United - 21 - Will be regular soon

Daniel Sturridge - Chelsea - 22 - needs to leave Chelsea, then will be regular

[Portland Bill]

Wouldn't it be nice if some of our young players would go and play abroad for a few seasons. Perhaps they would learn to play a different way than the traditional English way.

This may lead to learning a better (IMO) technical way of playing the game, instead of the panic and rush of the English game.

Unfortunately very very few English players are wanted by the likes of the Spanish,Italian clubs etc.

Joe Cole is the only one I can think of at the moment and he seems to have become the forgotten man regarding England.

[Brizzle Jordan]

Wouldn't it be nice if some of our young players would go and play abroad for a few seasons. Perhaps they would learn to play a different way than the traditional English way.

This may lead to learning a better (IMO) technical

way of playing the game.

Unfortunately very very few English players are wanted by the likes of the Spanish,Italian clubs etc.

Joe Cole is the only one I can think of at the moment and he seems to have become the forgotten man regarding England.

Real Madrid were keen on Adam Johnson when he was at Boro. The young players want to play in England which is probably why the spanish/italian clubs don't really bother. Also they wouldn't get any game time at Barca/Real.

[Harry]

Really looking forward to watching us play Belgium.

Belgium are going to be one of the best teams in Europe in the next couple of years with their young talents.

Keepers:

Thibaut Courtois - 20 - Chelsea/Atletico Madrid - Going to be world class and has won Europa League

Simon Mignolet - 23 - Sunderland - Great shot stopper

Defenders:

Toby Alderweild - 23 - Ajax - Good ball playing centre half

Jan Vertonghen - 25 - Ajax - Clever defender who can also play in the holding midfield role

Thomas Vermalean - 26 - Arsenal - Quality centre half

Vincent Kompany - 26 - Man City - World class and a leader of men

Dedryck Boyata - Man City - Young but has potential

Midfielders:

Marouane Fellaini - 24 - Everton - Solid box to box midfielder who is brilliant in the air

Axel Witsel - 23 - Benfica - Playmaker who has a few tricks

Dries Martens - 25 - PSV - Goalscoring winger who scored 21 in 33 games this season

Steven Defour - 24 - Porto - Centre midfielder who can pass, tackle and score goals. Sir Alex Ferguson is a known admirer

Nacer Chadli - 22 - Twente - Tricky winger

Moussa Dembele - 24 - Fulham - Second striker who has had a very good season for Fulham

Kevin De Bruyne - 20 - Chelsea - New signing from Genk but dubbed to be a real prospect

Eden Hazard - 21 - Lille - World class, scored 17 and assisted 17 this season from the wing.

Strikers:

Jelle Vossen - 23 - Genk - 47 in 102 goals for Genk

Romelu Lukaku - 19 - Chelsea - Powerhouse who when given time at Chelsea will be their new Drogba type player.

Yep, I've been saying for a while now that we need to look out for the Belgians. Stick your money on them to win Euro 2016 - seriously!

They had a tricky qualifying group this time around with defeats to Germany twice and Turkey, so this was maybe a couple of years to soon. They'll qualify for WC 2014 from a group containing Serbia, Croatia and Scotland, and will grow as a team. Look out for them in 2016 I say.

[Brizzle Jordan]

Yep, I've been saying for a while now that we need to look out for the Belgians. Stick your money on them to win Euro 2016 - seriously!

They had a tricky qualifying group this time around with defeats to Germany twice and Turkey, so this was maybe a couple of years to soon. They'll qualify for WC 2014 from a group containing Serbia, Croatia and Scotland, and will grow as a team. Look out for them in 2016 I say.

I agree, they will be a force. A team of:

GK: Courtois

RB: Alderwield

CB: Kompany

CB: Verthonghen

LB: Vermalean

DM: Defour

CM: Fellaini

CM: Witsel

RW: Martens

LW: Hazard

ST: Lukaku

That will be as good as there is imo.

[Harry]

Gerrard has not been worth a place in the side for several years. Far too many over ambitious passes and constantly giving the ball away which you simply can't afford to do in international football. As far as i'm concerned he is a liability, shouldn't be in the starting line-up, let alone captain.

In regard to the Gerrard debate - I also think his time has passed. However, I think he deserves to be at Euro 2012 as he is still one of very few available in midfield who can potentially win a game for us. Sounds like I'm going to argue with myself here - which I probably am.

Gerrard has done some quite outstanding things in his career but I have to agree that his style of play simply does not suit the international game. As has been said, he tries far too many glory-balls and thus gives the ball away too much. At international level we need to keep possession as generally once we give it away we don't get it back for 5 minutes. We can't score if we don't have the ball.

He's all well and good in the hustle bustle high tempo more direct style Premier League, but he doesn't cross-over well to international style in my opinion.

I'm looking forward to a future of Wilshere's composure, Cleverly's artistry and perhaps Rodwell's/Jones' solidity in our centre midfield. These guys are much more suited to the international style - where it is a patient thinking man's game, not a glory-ball seeking game.

Saying that (and this is where I contradict myself!) - he does get his fair share of goals. So let him have this tournament (which we are not going to do very well in anyway), and then get rid of him, start again and bring the kids through.

[chipdawg]

England's future depends on the attitude our young players develop; if they concentrate on becoming celebrities like the last lot then we'll have no chance. If they realise their potential then who knows? For example..

Gk: Hart

Rb: Walker

Cb: Jones

Cb: Caulker

Lb: Gibbs

Mid: McEachran/Rodwell

Mid: Wilshere

Mid: Cleverly/Barkley

Lm: Oxlade Chamberlain

Rm: Sturridge

St: Welbeck

They won't all become great but there's definite potential there

[Brizzle Jordan]

England's future depends on the attitude our young players develop; if they concentrate on becoming celebrities like the last lot then we'll have no chance. If they realise their potential then who knows? For example..

Gk: Hart

Rb: Walker

Cb: Jones

Cb: Caulker

Lb: Gibbs

Mid: McEachran/Rodwell

Mid: Wilshere

Mid: Cleverly/Barkley

Lm: Oxlade Chamberlain

Rm: Sturridge

St: Welbeck

They won't all become great but there's definite potential there

That team has alot of talent.

[Harry]

Which of these youngsters do we think will actually go on to become international stars: All are 22 and under.

Goalkeepers:

Jack Butland - Birmingham - 19

Jamal Blackman - Chelsea - 18

Right Backs:

Nathaniel Clyne - Crystal Palace - 21

Kyle Walker - Tottenham - 21

Jon Flanagan - Liverpool - 19

Martin Kelly - Liverpool - 22

Jamal Lascelles - Nottingham Forest - 18

Left Backs:

Joe Bennett - Middlesbrough - 22

Jack Robinson - Liverpool - 18

Luke Shaw - Southampton - 16

Keiran Gibbs - Arsenal - 22

Centre Backs:

Phil Jones - Manchester United - 20

Chris Smalling - Manchester United - 22

Steven Caulker - Tottenham Hotspur - 20

Ryan Bennett - Norwich - 22

Craig Dawson - West Brom - 22

Lewis Dunk - Brighton - 20

Eric Dier - 18 - Sporting Lisbon

Nathaniel Chalobah - Chelsea - 17

Centre Midfielders:

Jordan Henderson - Liverpool - 22

Tom Cleverley - Manchester United - 22

Jack Rodwell - Everton - 21

Jack Wilshere - Arsenal - 20

Henri Lansbury - Arsenal - 21

Josh McEachran - Chelsea - 19

Jonjo Shelvey - Liverpool - 20

George Thorne - West Brom - 19

Ross Barkley - Everton - 18

Jacon Butterfield - Barnsley - 21

Tom Carroll - Tottenham - 19

Jordon Mutch - Birmingham - 20

Dan Gosling - Newcastle - 22

Ravel Morrison - West Ham - 19

Wingers:

Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain - Arsenal - 18

Wilfried Zaha - Crystal Palace - 19

Cameron Stewart - Hull - 21

Nathan Redmond - Birmingham - 18

Strikers:

Danny Welbeck - Manchester United - 21

Daniel Sturridge - Chelsea - 22

Connor Wickham - Sunderland - 19

Nick Powell - Crewe - 18

Harry Kane - Tottenham - 18

Max Clayton - Crewe - 17

Raheem Stirling - Liverpool - 17

There are some good young 'uns there. Not all will make it and some will bomb completely, but a number of those should be members of the full England squad for a long time to come.

I think we need to have a more long-term goal once these Euro's are over. We really need to get rid of the old and ring in the new. We have to plan for the Euro's in 4 years time in France. Anyone already over 30 is highly unlikely to be around for those, so we have to forego the Brazil World Cup in 2014 and plan for the 2016 tournament instead.

Of the current squad, that means once these Euro's are done with, we have to bomb out Green, Cole, Terry, Gerrard, Lampard, Barry & Parker. I know Cole remains one of the best left-backs in the world, and maybe if we had to keep one experienced player it could be him.

We can also bomb out Johnson, Lescott, Jagielka, Baines, Downing, Milner, Henderson & Defoe - all are not good enough I'm afraid to say. I'd arguably chuck Walcott out too though would give him a chance to see if Wenger can actually turn him into a player with product and not just pace.

So, of the current squad that will leave us with : Hart, Butland, Cahill, Jones, Kelly, Walcott, Young, A.Johnson, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Rooney, Welbeck & Carroll.

We need to add the following to the squad and get them more experience at international level now, not wait until they are in their late 20's : Richards, Smalling, Walker, Cleverley, Rodwell, Wilshere, Sturridge.

Of the rest of the listed youngsters, perhaps throw in Flanagan, Gibbs, Caulker, McEachran, Barkley, Frimpong (not listed), Wickham, Kane & Powell.

I'd love to see a starting line-up of :

GK - Hart

RB - Walker

LB - Cole/Gibbs

CB - Cahill

CB - Jones

DM - Frimpong

CM - Wilshere

ACM - Cleverley

LW - Young

RW - Oxlade-Chamberlain

ST - Rooney

Probably won't happen but that's my opinion anyways!!

[Roger Red Hat]

There are some good young 'uns there. Not all will make it and some will bomb completely, but a number of those should be members of the full England squad for a long time to come.

I think we need to have a more long-term goal once these Euro's are over. We really need to get rid of the old and ring in the new. We have to plan for the Euro's in 4 years time in France. Anyone already over 30 is highly unlikely to be around for those, so we have to forego the Brazil World Cup in 2014 and plan for the 2016 tournament instead.

Of the current squad, that means once these Euro's are done with, we have to bomb out Green, Cole, Terry, Gerrard, Lampard, Barry & Parker. I know Cole remains one of the best left-backs in the world, and maybe if we had to keep one experienced player it could be him.

We can also bomb out Johnson, Lescott, Jagielka, Baines, Downing, Milner, Henderson & Defoe - all are not good enough I'm afraid to say. I'd arguably chuck Walcott out too though would give him a chance to see if Wenger can actually turn him into a player with product and not just pace.

So, of the current squad that will leave us with : Hart, Butland, Cahill, Jones, Kelly, Walcott, Young, A.Johnson, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Rooney, Welbeck & Carroll.

We need to add the following to the squad and get them more experience at international level now, not wait until they are in their late 20's : Richards, Smalling, Walker, Cleverley, Rodwell, Wilshere, Sturridge.

Of the rest of the listed youngsters, perhaps throw in Flanagan, Gibbs, Caulker, McEachran, Barkley, Frimpong (not listed), Wickham, Kane & Powell.

I'd love to see a starting line-up of :

GK - Hart

RB - Walker

LB - Cole/Gibbs

CB - Cahill

CB - Jones

DM - Frimpong

CM - Wilshere

ACM - Cleverley

LW - Young

RW - Oxlade-Chamberlain

ST - Rooney

Probably won't happen but that's my opinion anyways!!

Definitely wont happen, Frimpong is going to play for another country, that I cant recall the name of, I believe.

[Brizzle Jordan]

Definitely wont happen, Frimpong is going to play for another country, that I cant recall the name of, I believe.

He's chosen to represent the country of his birth which is Ghana.

[Harry]

Definitely wont happen, Frimpong is going to play for another country, that I cant recall the name of, I believe.

You're right - my mistake. He has pledged himself to Ghana. But I say have a word with him now and change his mind. He's not been called up for Ghana yet so can still play for England if we persuade him.

[Andy082005]

That team has alot of talent.

It does...but not "World Class" talent is it?

[chipdawg]

It does...but not "World Class" talent is it?

Give them a chance; the point is that they're largely young players who have yet to reach their full potential. The problem we tend to have in this country is that players never reach that potential

[Southport Red]

WRT Gerrard and 'Hollywood passes" I read in the paper last week that Roy was vv keen on "5 passes max then get it forward" seems he is not a proponent of the possession for possession's sake school. Consequently, do not be surprised if we see an awful lot more of the long ball over the next two/ three weeks. When they come off they look inspired and visionary, they just don't come off anywhere near often enough.

The days of passing it around, waiting for an opening are gone though so Hollywood it will be. On the ( not common enough) occasions that Gerrard get it right ( think when Torres was at Liverpool) it is fab and very effective, when he gets it wrong- well, you saw on Saturday.

Either way, expect to see more of the same.

[Jesus]

My issue is the passion of the England players. This is why I wanted Rednapp in charge. The England job is like no other job in football. Its not about signing players or huge tactics, its about motivation and desire. Look at Greece a few years ago. 99% of the England squad wanted Rednapp in charge, and I believe this to be another blunder by the FA. I've watched every single England home game for the past 3 years, and the football under Capello was woeful. I was hoping for another Euro 96 where everyone was on high and what we lacked in footballing ability we made up in team spirt and desire. Undet Roy I can't see this happening.

Also, what on earth id Henderson and Downing doing in the squad? Surely Andy Johnson is a millon times the player that Downing will ever be. Why can nobody see it?

[The Fat Controller]

Also, what on earth id Henderson and Downing doing in the squad? Surely Adam Johnson is a millon times the player that Downing will ever be. Why can nobody see it?

I'd add Barry and Green to the other too - nowhere near world class.

[chipdawg]

WRT Gerrard and 'Hollywood passes" I read in the paper last week that Roy was vv keen on "5 passes max then get it forward" seems he is not a proponent of the possession for possession's sake school. Consequently, do not be surprised if we see an awful lot more of the long ball over the next two/ three weeks. When they come off they look inspired and visionary, they just don't come off anywhere near often enough.

The days of passing it around, waiting for an opening are gone though so Hollywood it will be. On the ( not common enough) occasions that Gerrard get it right ( think when Torres was at Liverpool) it is fab and very effective, when he gets it wrong- well, you saw on Saturday.

Either way, expect to see more of the same.

The "5 passes and forward" thing was misreported; it was a training match to test the defence and Hodgson has since said that instruction was just to make sure the defenders were getting more time on or close to the ball. Hodgson will have us counter attack though, he's a conservative manager in that respect. Personally though, I think the personel we have are for more suited to counter-attacking football than the possession game anyway

[TRL]

My issue is the passion of the England players. This is why I wanted Rednapp in charge. The England job is like no other job in football. Its not about signing players or huge tactics, its about motivation and desire. Look at Greece a few years ago. 99% of the England squad wanted Rednapp in charge, and I believe this to be another blunder by the FA. I've watched every single England home game for the past 3 years, and the football under Capello was woeful. I was hoping for another Euro 96 where everyone was on high and what we lacked in footballing ability we made up in team spirt and desire. Undet Roy I can't see this happening.

Also, what on earth id Henderson and Downing doing in the squad? Surely Andy Johnson is a millon times the player that Downing will ever be. Why can nobody see it?

I give you Keegan. Worst disaster of a England maanger for a long time. he was all about passion. i firmly believe Rednapp would have caused the same mess.

Euro 96 we were awful, there is some sort of Myth that the messiah El tel did a great job, he didn't, we were rubbish for pretty much the whole touranment apart from the dutch game. We struggled and looked poor and spawned ourself to a semi. With everything in our favour we still looked awful. i do not and never have looked baclk at euro 96 with misty eyes, it was our last real chance at international level to do something and we failed miserably playing poorly through most of it. I think people got carried away by the euphoria of it all and remember it differently to what it actually was.

[Tins]

I'd add Barry and Green to the other too - nowhere near world class.

Barry won the league.

There isn't many ENGLISH keepers better than Green.

[Tins]

At least we didn't get hammered by USA.

How embarrassing for the mighty Scotland, noticed Jock hasn't mentioned it........

[Guest sportingmad0209]

I give you Keegan. Worst disaster of a England maanger for a long time. he was all about passion. i firmly believe Rednapp would have caused the same mess.

Euro 96 we were awful, there is some sort of Myth that the messiah El tel did a great job, he didn't, we were rubbish for pretty much the whole touranment apart from the dutch game. We struggled and looked poor and spawned ourself to a semi. With everything in our favour we still looked awful. i do not and never have looked baclk at euro 96 with misty eyes, it was our last real chance at international level to do something and we failed miserably playing poorly through most of it. I think people got carried away by the euphoria of it all and remember it differently to what it actually was.

I do NOT agree with this! We were Gazzas studs away from the final. Seamans saves and Pearces penalty v Spain in the shoot out. Gazzas goal against the Scots. Our 4-1 demolition of Holland is my all time favourite England match.

Our best tournamant for years.

Note to Roy: Please practice penalties (although I'm not sure we will get that far)...

[TRL]

I do NOT agree with this! We were Gazzas studs away from the final. Seamans saves and Pearces penalty v Spain in the shoot out. Gazzas goal against the Scots. Our 4-1 demolition of Holland is my all time favourite England match.

Our best tournamant for years.

Note to Roy: Please practice penalties (although I'm not sure we will get that far)...

We were Awful, like I said apart from the Dutch game, we were garbage, and it matters not how you dress it up, we could have quite easily not have made it out of the groups.

We played spain, and both teams were poor and we scraped through on penalties, and then we lost again in penalties against The germans where we played okay.

Take away a Okay game against the Germans and a great game against the Dutch, there was really very little to shout home about.

Like I say people remember it as being far better than it actually was. What made it good was that it was in our country and the euphoria that went with it. What went on , on the pitch was another thing entirely.

[Monkeh]

some of this is a bit ott,

We won 1-0 the first win against Norway in 32 years,

it was our b team and we played poor throughout but thats what friendlys are about 8 of that starting 11 won't play in the euros that was all about fringe players getting a bit of time,

Roy is the man to bring through the younger generation the old "Goldern" generation lacked workrate and liked the celebraty life style too much,

Get that out of the next generation and we will be a quarter final team again

[Guest sportingmad0209]

We were Awful, like I said apart from the Dutch game, we were garbage, and it matters not how you dress it up, we could have quite easily not have made it out of the groups.

We played spain, and both teams were poor and we scraped through on penalties, and then we lost again in penalties against The germans where we played okay.

Take away a Okay game against the Germans and a great game against the Dutch, there was really very little to shout home about.

Like I say people remember it as being far better than it actually was. What made it good was that it was in our country and the euphoria that went with it. What went on , on the pitch was another thing entirely.

That is what makes football so great... It is full of opinions. You have yours, I have mine, and everybody else has theirs!

The first game v Switzerland was poor granted, but we never play well in the first game, but after that it was a good tournamant (IMO).

[TRL]

That is what makes football so great... It is full of opinions. You have yours, I have mine, and everybody else has theirs!

The first game v Switzerland was poor granted, but we never play well in the first game, but after that it was a good tournamant (IMO).

Indeed, would be a very boring world if we all agreed.

But as Holloway said "You are Wrong!"

[TRL]

some of this is a bit ott,

We won 1-0 the first win against Norway in 32 years,

it was our b team and we played poor throughout but thats what friendlys are about 8 of that starting 11 won't play in the euros that was all about fringe players getting a bit of time,

Roy is the man to bring through the younger generation the old "Goldern" generation lacked workrate and liked the celebraty life style too much,

Get that out of the next generation and we will be a quarter final team again

I think that the fringe players shouldn't have ben a apart of this, it should have been his 23 (discarding injuries). He has little time to form an opinion, but he has formed it enough to pick his squad, I see there is very little to gain from playing players who will not be going, this is the time that the players should be together preparing for the Euros.

It was a pretty bland performance, but to be honest, unless you are completely off your head, I doubt anyone would have expected any different. A win in Oslo is good. In terms of performance, that is pretty much what we are going to get throughout the Euros, as the players we have are just not that great. So it is best we get used to it, and see if Roy can make us hard to beat and snatch goals. Judging by this game, he has started out okay, he did just that. If people are expecting fast free flowing football, I would suggest they haven''t watched england in the past 30 years!

[Guest sportingmad0209]

Indeed, would be a very boring world if we all agreed.

But as Holloway said "You are Wrong!"

Oh no I'm Not!

[Andy082005]

Give them a chance; the point is that they're largely young players who have yet to reach their full potential. The problem we tend to have in this country is that players never reach that potential

By all means, im not slating the young players. Fingers crossed for players like smalling, Jones, Johnson etc....I just have n ofaith in English football and the way we nurture and coach players from grass roots level, all the way to the top.

The Premier League and its money men has played a massive part in destroying the English National set up, and by concentrating on making it a "global brand" it has brainwashed so many people into thinking certain Premier League players are "World Class". Like someone else has mentioned on here, you can count on one hand the amount of Enlgish players who have moved abroad to a top European team over the last 10-15 years. Why? because they are not good enough

Players like Terry, Gerrard, Lampard....not to mention Barry, Glen Johnson, Downing....all over rated dog sh*t.

Its also a case of "when your face fits". Players who play for certain teams definately get picked on "who they play for" rather then "how good they actually are". Downing and Henderson both playing for England?? absolutely shocking. It makes no sense to pick them?

Crouch and Heskey....England squad regulars when at Liverpool.....move to Stoke and Birmingham, out the squad they go!

Paul Robinson....joined Blackburn...out the squad he went. Instead of keepers like Rob Green and Ben Foster?

Finally...and my last rant, I promise....but half of the England squad are vile, who I genuinely dont think gives two sh*ts about winning for the country. Rooney and Cole....horrible human beings....cant stand them. I may be looking back through "rose tinted eyes" but payers like Shearer, Sheringham, Ince, Campbell...all players who, despite failing at major tounaments, Ialways got the impression they had massive pride in playing for England.

I cant wait for this "golden generation" to finally **** off.....Lampard, Terry, Gerrard, Beckham, Ferdinand.....stroll on

[TRL]

By all means, im not slating the young players. Fingers crossed for players like smalling, Jones, Johnson etc....I just have n ofaith in English football and the way we nurture and coach players from grass roots level, all the way to the top.

The Premier League and its money men has played a massive part in destroying the English National set up, and by concentrating on making it a "global brand" it has brainwashed so many people into thinking certain Premier League players are "World Class". Like someone else has mentioned on here, you can count on one hand the amount of Enlgish players who have moved abroad to a top European team over the last 10-15 years. Why? because they are not good enough

Players like Terry, Gerrard, Lampard....not to mention Barry, Glen Johnson, Downing....all over rated dog sh*t.

Its also a case of "when your face fits". Players who play for certain teams definately get picked on "who they play for" rather then "how good they actually are". Downing and Henderson both playing for England?? absolutely shocking. It makes no sense to pick them?

Crouch and Heskey....England squad regulars when at Liverpool.....move to Stoke and Birmingham, out the squad they go!

Paul Robinson....joined Blackburn...out the squad he went. Instead of keepers like Rob Green and Ben Foster?

Finally...and my last rant, I promise....but half of the England squad are vile, who I genuinely dont think gives two sh*ts about winning for the country. Rooney and Cole....horrible human beings....cant stand them. I may be looking back through "rose tinted eyes" but payers like Shearer, Sheringham, Ince, Campbell...all players who, despite failing at major tounaments, Ialways got the impression they had massive pride in playing for England.

I cant wait for this "golden generation" to finally **** off.....Lampard, Terry, Gerrard, Beckham, Ferdinand.....stroll on

Nail head firmly Struck.

Until top English players go and ply their trade abroad, we are never going to get the experience to truely compete on a European or World stage. trouble is, who wants them?

As uich as they look good in the prem, they do not have the required technique to really get a bid from other top European leagues, and that is a sad enditment of English football.

When people role out the argument, we why should they go abroad, we have the best League! Well I would say 1 name..... Ronaldo, probably the best player we have had in the Premier League, and because he was good enough, got taken away from the Premier League. Like plenty of other good players from the premeirship, when they hit the heights, they tend to go back to Spain or Italy, I add messer Alonso Fabregas Henry etc etc, all classed as top quality in the Premier League, but all left. That suggests to me that the Premier League is not the best league, as the best of the best players leave. funny how none of these best player are English!

[chipdawg]

By all means, im not slating the young players. Fingers crossed for players like smalling, Jones, Johnson etc....I just have n ofaith in English football and the way we nurture and coach players from grass roots level, all the way to the top.

The Premier League and its money men has played a massive part in destroying the English National set up, and by concentrating on making it a "global brand" it has brainwashed so many people into thinking certain Premier League players are "World Class". Like someone else has mentioned on here, you can count on one hand the amount of Enlgish players who have moved abroad to a top European team over the last 10-15 years. Why? because they are not good enough

Players like Terry, Gerrard, Lampard....not to mention Barry, Glen Johnson, Downing....all over rated dog sh*t.

Its also a case of "when your face fits". Players who play for certain teams definately get picked on "who they play for" rather then "how good they actually are". Downing and Henderson both playing for England?? absolutely shocking. It makes no sense to pick them?

Crouch and Heskey....England squad regulars when at Liverpool.....move to Stoke and Birmingham, out the squad they go!

Paul Robinson....joined Blackburn...out the squad he went. Instead of keepers like Rob Green and Ben Foster?

Finally...and my last rant, I promise....but half of the England squad are vile, who I genuinely dont think gives two sh*ts about winning for the country. Rooney and Cole....horrible human beings....cant stand them. I may be looking back through "rose tinted eyes" but payers like Shearer, Sheringham, Ince, Campbell...all players who, despite failing at major tounaments, Ialways got the impression they had massive pride in playing for England.

I cant wait for this "golden generation" to finally **** off.....Lampard, Terry, Gerrard, Beckham, Ferdinand.....stroll on

I agree with a lot of that actually. Part of my (misplaced?!) optimism is that I think attitudes to coaching are changing. Just this morning, the FA have been talking about banning 11v11 games for under 12s to encourage the development of ball skills. The big clubs are starting to realise that they need to be producing their own superstars in light of the new financial regulations and economic climate

I think many of our English superstars are overhyped but we also have a national habit of wanting them to fail. I've done a fair bit of travelling over the years and even talking to knowledgable football fans in Europe where they're exposed to a wider range of Footy, there was great admiration for the Gerrards, Beckhams, Ferdinands, Terrys and Lampards. I don't really question that these people and some of the newer generation wanted to play for their country. I just think that with te advent of the champions league, international football is no longer the pinnacle of a footballers career. I don't think it's money as such, just that the prestige of club competition is greater

I actually find that most footballers I've encountered or heard of are nobheads to one degree or another, I don't particularly care if they play well. That said I especially can't stand Terry, Lampard & Cole so perhaps that's double standards?! Don't really get why people hate Rooney; he continues to make mistakes on the pitch but granny-gate was about 5 years ago and it's not quite shooting the work experience boy with an air rifle or abusing US tourists hours after 9/11 at Heathrow...

[Portland Bill]

We were Awful, like I said apart from the Dutch game, we were garbage, and it matters not how you dress it up, we could have quite easily not have made it out of the groups.

We played spain, and both teams were poor and we scraped through on penalties, and then we lost again in penalties against The germans where we played okay.

Take away a Okay game against the Germans and a great game against the Dutch, there was really very little to shout home about.

Like I say people remember it as being far better than it actually was. What made it good was that it was in our country and the euphoria that went with it. What went on , on the pitch was another thing entirely.

Another thing about euro 96 were the poor crowds, I can remember half empty stadiums for some of the games.

I wonder if FIFA took that into account when it came to us not getting WC 2018

[TRL]

Another thing about euro 96 were the poor crowds, I can remember half empty stadiums for some of the games.

I wonder if FIFA took that into account when it came to us not getting WC 2018

That is a very good point, and something I had completely forgotten about. I wonder if the prices of things in England put people off? For the life of me, i cannot remember the cost of tickets back then, but I am sure they were massively over priced.

[Portland Bill]

That is a very good point, and something I had completely forgotten about. I wonder if the prices of things in England put people off? For the life of me, i cannot remember the cost of tickets back then, but I am sure they were massively over priced.

Obviously the England games, quarters and semis were sold out, but some of the group

Game crowds were very poor.

[chipdawg]

Another thing about euro 96 were the poor crowds, I can remember half empty stadiums for some of the games.

I wonder if FIFA took that into account when it came to us not getting WC 2018

I suspect the well stuffed manila envelopes were taken into greater account when deciding the 2018 WC....

To be fair, we were in the depths of a recession back then and I wonder if people would be paying to watch North Korea v Slovenia (for example) if the world cup was held here at the minute

[Alex_BCFC]

In Euro 96 we had 2 good games (Holland and Germany), 2 poor ones (Switzerland and Spain) and 1 average one against Scotland.

Overall I would say that is a fairly good tournament but the 4-1 drubbing of Holland made it seem better than it was. When you compare it to the Euro tournament before and after it, it was decent.

[Judge Roughneck]

TRL obviously watched most of Euro 1996 and sportingmad has seen the official england highlights.

We were rank against Switzerland, fortunate against Scotland that Mcallister's penalty miss turned into a breakaway goal. Outplayed by Spain who had a perfectly good goal chalked off.

The Germany game was quite open and even and a draw was probably the fair result. We murdered the dutch, but of course about a third of the squad had gone home in a huff by then and the ones who remained could barely look at each other. So 2 good games out of 5, that's about par for England.

[Judge Roughneck]

Another thing about euro 96 were the poor crowds, I can remember half empty stadiums for some of the games.

I wonder if FIFA took that into account when it came to us not getting WC 2018

Some of the crowds were a joke. Ticket prices ranged from £20 - £45. They were incredibly complicated to buy though, if memory serves me right you had to apply for blocks of games through hsbc bank who stupidly noted the dates of england matches on the application form but limited how many tickets overall you could apply for. So, England games massively oversubscribed, others half empty.

Bulgaria against Romania in Newcastle was half empty. Despite the fact that both teams had been among the more attractive sides at the 94 world cup. When you can't get the English public interested in a game that pitted hagi against stoichkov, you have to wonder what you are dealing with.

2 quarter finals were 10,000 below capacity, as was the germany semi final. Even the final didn't sell out. England don't deserve to host another tournament for a very long time, FIFA remember that.