Quote From A Doncaster Fan

[dezgimed]

SOD is always making excuses if you think enough about what he says to see through it.

Everything pre-match is about how good the opposition are, and everything is always about "building for the long-term" to try take people's eye off what is happening now.

Interesting no?

[Red Skin]

No.

[GrahamC]

Not really.

From any club if you took a selective quote from one of their fans you could prove anything.

Most Doncaster fans think he is the best manager in their clubs history, no signs so far that he'll repeat that with us but this sort of petty point making is boring.

[Chappers]

I remain open minded,our younger players are OK, but not yet seeing any signs of any of them reaching much above lower Championship quality. Saturday was an experienced team and we still lost. Not sure if we are heading forward or not, but his interviews are a mix of mumbles and sniffs!

[Keep Calm]

Nah

[!james]

Only interesting to those posters on here who clearly have an anti SOD agenda but to any sane person no

[Guest]

Interesting because all opinions are: if only to stop and make you think for a moment.

We'll see, atm all we'll get out of SOD are excuses given the results. If we go on a run (and that seems a very big if to me) then we can form our own opinion, based on the here and now, about how SOD approaches, and reacts to, games.

[dezgimed]

Only interesting to those posters on here who clearly have an anti SOD agenda but to any sane person no

Are Doncaster fans not in a better position to comment on SOD than us?

[cheese]

Not really.

From any club if you took a selective quote from one of their fans you could prove anything.

Most Doncaster fans think he is the best manager in their clubs history, no signs so far that he'll repeat that with us but this sort of petty point making is boring.

Yes, thre are some (or maybe one) on here that call our most successful manager in recent times a "conference manager" for example, would you believe!

[!james]

Are Doncaster fans not in a better position to comment on SOD than us?

Here is a quote from a Doncaster fan I know:

"Stick with SOD, the best manager of Doncaster in my lifetime, we played some outstanding football with a very limited budget. It took time to click with us but will be worth the wait."

Interesting no?

[Mr Mosquito]

Yes, thre are some (or maybe one) on here that call our most successful manager in recent times a "conference manager" for example, would you believe!

Gary Johnson was a Conference manager. It's just the fact that he's taken the 'mighty' Yeovile from the Conference to the Championship. With a little break with us in between of course.

[Maesknoll Red]

His stats have him down as pretty much equal wins to losses in all his jobs (except ours...) and at Doncaster he actually lost more than he won. So perhaps he isn't the new messiah after all, but that said, I can see no point in even contemplating his position, unless we are still in the drop zone in Dec.

Sean O' Driscoll

TEAM FROM TO GAMES WON DRAWN LOST Bristol C 14 Jan, 2013 Present 31 8 8 15 Nottm Forest 20 Jul, 2012 27 Dec, 2012 26 10 9 7 Doncaster 08 Sep, 2006 22 Sep, 2011 268 97 72 99 Bournemouth 19 Aug, 2000 10 Sep, 2006 327 118 99 110

Bloody forum doesn't like posting tables....... try this

http://www.soccerbase.com/managers/manager.sd?manager_id=1629

[Portland Bill]

Are Doncaster fans not in a better position to comment on SOD than us?

Or perhaps Bournemouth fans are in an even better position to comment on him

James Swyer (@jamesswyer) JANUARY 23, 2012 AT 8:59 AM

An excellent piece, thanks.

As an AFC Bournemouth fan, I couldnt agree more with all of the above. He was derided by sections of the AFCB faithful for the having a small side, but played the best football Ive seen in the 20 years Ive been going to Dean Court.

A clever, honest and intelligent man who deserves respect (and time) wherever he goes. Sadly for him, I think he achieved the maximum he could ar AFCB and Doncaster a year or so before his departure, but his unrelenting commitment to the project wouldnt have it any other way. He rebuilt the Bournemouth side 3 times over, having lost Wade Elliott, Brian Stock et al for peanuts and will always have a place in my heart.

Lord knows how hell get on with Cotterill at Forest, their football philosophies couldnt be more different.

Reply

[Portland Bill]

I just found this, it's a LONG read, but is a brilliant read.

Nottingham Forest fans read on, for we are very pleased to welcome back Glen Wilson, steward of Doncaster Rovers Popular STAND Fanzine and late of award winning blog, Viva Rovers. Here Glen provides us with an insight into Sean ODriscoll, recently installed in a supporting role to Steve Cotterill at the City Ground.

The natural state of the football fan is bitter disappointment wrote Nick Hornby and for the most part of course he is right. We are dreamers who specialise in crushing our own dream with pessimistic realism. We could win this but well probably chuck it away in injury time again. We might win the Cup but well probably go out in the 3rd round to a bunch of lower league cloggers. We could ping the ball about like Barcelona but were not likely to be are we? Were just ******* Doncaster.

Or so we thought. Turns out some dreams can come true. Even an unfashionable pub team like ours could play football. Not just as a one-off either, like the time we retained possession against Nuneaton for a whole 48 seconds before Dean Walling shanked it into the Town End. But proper passing football. Regularly. Sean ODriscoll came to my town. And he made it possible. He built a team that passed and moved, played fluid football, and all within sight of the chimney at Peglers Works. And Ill always be indebted to him for that.

Five years ODriscoll was at Doncaster and though it took a while to introduce the style of play he had in mind indeed a 0-2 loss at S****horpe in that period was one of the most woeful Rovers performances Ive ever seen the patience was eventually rewarded. We lifted the Johnstones Paint Trophy. We won at Wembley against Leeds. We reached the second tier. And were still here four years on.

Its one thing to ping the ball about to get to these highs; its another to do it to survive. The expectation of a side punching above their weight, particularly a Northern one, is to become a disciple of Tony Pulis. Hoof it. Punt it. And play the percentages. But why try and capitalise on others weaknesses when you can play to your own strengths? Rovers got to the second tier playing a fluid brand of football and set out to stay there in the same manner, something that surprised people from day one, not least Paul Merson - A different class of passing the ball - and it was.

In this brilliant interview with Goalfood, ODriscoll gave a fascinating insight into the side he had developed: We never do passing drills in training. We try to give people options on the ball and the thing Im trying to coach is for the player to pick the right option, which is what the better players do. I get scouting reports which say he gives the ball away too much but Im trying to train the scouts to ask was it the right ball to play? Footballs about giving the ball away but was it the right pass at the right time? Sometimes Im more concerned about that than I am about whether or not he completed the pass. I cant buy someone for a million quid but I want to get someone in who can see options and can take the right one. Im in a market where I can afford a player because hes cheap but I have to know that I can develop him because he has the raw materials I can work with. Right pass, right time thats two out of three and I can work on the rest.

And work on the rest he did. Something which meant he was able to get more out of players others had given up on like John Oster, and Brian Stock (who went from Prestons reserves to a heralded international performance under ODriscoll). And also nurture unlikely talents, like Mustapha Dumbuya, who had hitherto been travelling the London non-league scene like The Littlest Hobo, and Sam Hird, released by Leeds 150 Rovers appearances ago.

As great as the football was (and it was often phenomenal), throughout his time at Rovers ODriscoll had his critics. It was suggested that he had no plan B. That passing football was all he knew. But of course passing the ball about is not in itself a tactic, its just a means to an end. The diversity of footballing approaches is too often simplified and too easily bracketed into formations, something ODriscoll himself talked of in an interview in 2010, When people say, Theyre a well-organised team, what exactly does that mean? Is 4-4-2 rigid? Weve just had an England team lambasted for that. People think 4-4-2 is tactics; its nothing to do with tactics, its a structure. Within the structure you can do whatever you want. It could be the most fluid system in the world. The problem with England was that their 4-4-2 was rigid. They needed to be fluid. But when youre playing against Spain, do you need a fluid 4-4-2? Do you ****. You need to be rigid because theyre better than us. All I can do is send out a team with certain values and the players operate within that

Of course the downside of ODriscolls approach was that Rovers squad was, in stature at least, decidedly lightweight. Theres a reason for the incredulity in which were told a player has a decent touch for a big man and thats big lumps who are good in the air dont tend to be able to deftly move the ball around midfield. As such Rovers often came unstuck against more physical opponents, and we spent five years being unnerved whenever opponents forced a corner, or a free-kick, or a throw-in, or a kick-off. Some of us were willing to forgive that Achilles heel in exchange for the flowing football going in the opposite direction. Others, perhaps understandably, were not.

But to suggest that ODriscolls teams were hampered by only having one system is wrong; he built a side of intelligent footballers and as such it was not just the football which was fluid. The system was too. And so Rovers would not be averse to changing approach minutes into a game. After an away victory in November 2010 the opposition told reporters that Rovers had altered their set-up after quarter of an hour and that his side had needed to adjust to this at half-time. By the time he had been able to implement his changes Doncaster led 2-0. That manager? Steve Cotterill.

This fixture between ODriscolls Doncaster and Cotterills Portsmouth highlights just what a juxtaposition of styles Nottingham Forest have now employed. ODriscoll is a thoughtful realist. Cotterill, a paranoid blame merchant, as reflected by the post match interviews in which the latter perplexingly chooses to pin the blame for Carl Dickinsons knee high assault on James Hayter on David Healy and the referee. If you watch Cotterills post-match interviews regularly then youll have noticed how unfortunate he has been. The whole world continues to conspire against him. Just as it did last week. And every week before that.

As a partnership then ODriscoll and Cotterill are the odd couple, the sort of pairing only usually thrust together in a sit-com, or a clichéd cop show. Cotterill the brash hot-headed detective. ODriscoll the mild-mannered thoughtful sidekick. It seems the Forest board stumbled across a couple of old episodes of Dalziel and Pascoe and decided that was just what they needed. That a club would want ODriscoll involved given his track record is understandable, its the partnership with Cotterill which is most surprising.

Cotterill is an old school tracksuit manager. He shows passion, that great virtue which supporters long for, albeit one which boils down to showing signs of mental illness on the touchline. ODriscoll on the other hand is a thinker in casual slacks and he encourages his players to think too: They can agree or disagree but if they disagree it needs to be logical. They cant just disagree because someone in the stands or on the telly said something. But theres no thought, people do things because theyve always been done. If you speak to Harry Redknapp, hell tell you I drove him mad. I dont know what players know, Im gobsmacked at times by what they dont know. Theyre never asked to think. We breed players from eight years old who never ask Why are we doing this? or How does this work? thinking players, who evolve. All our coaching philosophies here are about understanding your responsibilities. Some players fly with it, some find it difficult, some of the older ones want to be told.

Unfortunately modern day football managers are no longer solely judged on their ability to manage. For reasons Ive never understood great importance is also given to the manner in which they display their self in front of a camera or microphone. Call me old fashioned but as long as a manager is proving effective at his primary role then whenever grilled by a reporter he can hum the speeches of Hitler for all I care. ODriscoll has little time for the media spotlight; and as a result the media had little time for him. His lack of clichéd rhetoric was often derided as being negative rather than the frankness it actually conveyed. Indeed Taylor Parkes in When Saturday Comes once summed up his style in interviews as that of a man whos just been told his dog has three weeks to live.

As Mike Whalley chronicled after a 6-0 defeat to Ipswich, ODriscoll sat down in the press room and said to reporters Go on, someone ask me a stupid question. The second question he faced was How disappointed are you, Sean? Thats a stupid question, ODriscoll replied. I am this disappointed. He held his hands a couple of feet apart to indicate how disappointed he was, then got up and walked out. Daily Mail columnist Martin Samuel subsequently accused ODriscoll of being arrogant. Yeah, Martin Samuel. A rare case of the pot calling the kettle a pot.

When Rovers were winning ODriscolls manner in interviews was viewed as pragmatism, as realistic honesty. When they started losing it became dour and negative, pessimistic even, and was eventually used as another rod with which to beat him, despite there actually being no real change in the content of his interviews. His replacement at Doncaster Dean Saunders has been lauded by the club and supporters for his enthusiasm when he talks to the media. Hes a breath of fresh air were told as he delivers more soundbites on the passion of supporters and the importance of youth. Whilst managers are being trumpeted for how they say things rather than what they say perhaps a behind the scenes role is a much better fit for Sean.

Prior to this week Sean ODriscoll had spent his thirty years in the professional game at just three clubs; Fulham, Bournemouth and Doncaster. In terms of stature and expectation there can be no arguments that becoming involved at Nottingham Forest is a higher step. Forest of course have underachieved in recent seasons, something which has not been helped by a succession of managers keen to pass the buck. The Forest squad of last season was one of the strongest in the Division but Billy Davies constant bleating at underfunding was so persistent that ultimately it was taken as fact and created an even more divisive atmosphere at the club as the blame shifted to a board who had already stumped up more investment than most.

We are not or rather I am not, driven by the desire to get Doncaster Rovers promoted to the Premier League, ODriscoll told the Irish Daily Mail a year ago. Too many clubs set that as a target and use that as the sole arbitrator of success. The result being poor, hasty decisions made for the wrong reasons, which in any industry is a recipe for disaster. When even at Rovers this realism was viewed by many as a lack of ambition maintaining the clubs second longest second tier stint in its history seemingly not ambitious enough then you have to wonder how Forest fans, the name of Brian Clough literally looming large over every game at the City Ground, will take to such pragmatism.

However as ODriscoll has said: To stay in this division and avoid relegation you need to do certain things. To win promotion you need to do certain things. Write a list and theyd be no different except for money. Theyd be things like organisation, attitude, discipline, so why treat it differently? But you have to articulate it: what does organisation look like to a Championship team? We think we know. At Rovers ODriscoll didnt have, or wasnt trusted with, the money to turn a side surviving in the second tier into one pushing for the first and so he set his targets accordingly. At Forest that element is available.

Forest though have not hired a manager. They already have one, and a very prevalent one at that, bobbing around the technical area like an excitable Jim Henson creation. Theyve instead hired a first team coach who knows the game and who above all possesses an element Forest have been without for all too long; realism. I was 22 before I came into the game and Id been in work so maybe thats why my approach is different. I wouldnt say its analytical I think its just common sense The average tenure of a job is less than 18 months. Youre trying to put something together which is long term and all that really matters is trying to win the next game so **** everything else, managers just need to win the next game. Then you win the next game and youre supposedly a better manager for it, then you win the next one after that and all of a sudden youre going to jump ship because someone else wants you. The whole thing is cyclical.

In my opinion there is no-one in football who deserves to be just another cog in that cyclical approach to the game less than Sean ODriscoll. Though I remain perplexed as to how a working relationship with Steve Cotterill will unfold for him, my reaction to his appointment is one of delight. Quite simply there is no other man in the domestic game thinking like hes thinking, and football was notably poorer for his short absence.

[dezgimed]

Here is a quote from a Doncaster fan I know:

"Stick with SOD, the best manager of Doncaster in my lifetime, we played some outstanding football with a very limited budget. It took time to click with us but will be worth the wait."

Interesting no?

We don't have/arent on a limited budget.

The football currently isnt outstanding.

Time will tell!

[Red-Robbo]

Has it occured to anyone that many managers are successful at some clubs, but not others. That sometimes abilites wane. That one of the surest ways for most people to lose their way is to be surrounded by asskissers who call them a genius.

Now I'm not saying O'Driscoll is any of these things, but let's judge him on what he's done here. His past isn't really relevant.

[Portland Bill]

We don't have/arent on a limited budget.

The football currently isnt outstanding.

Time will tell!

Yes time will tell, at Bournemouth and Doncaster he built brilliant pass and move sides that were a joy to watch, and successful .

The reason he was able to do this, both clubs gave him time.

[Red-Robbo]

Yes time will tell, at Bournemouth and Doncaster he built brilliant pass and move sides that were a joy to watch, and successful .

The reason he was able to do this, both clubs gave him time.

Yet Donny never amounted to much in the Championship. And still don't.

[slartibartfast]

Gary Johnson was a Conference manager. It's just the fact that he's taken the 'mighty' Yeovile from the Conference to the Championship.

And back again !

[dezgimed]

Yes time will tell, at Bournemouth and Doncaster he built brilliant pass and move sides that were a joy to watch, and successful .

The reason he was able to do this, both clubs gave him time.

Bournemouth 2000-2006 (6 years) 36% win rate

2000 P24 W8 D7 L9

2001 P48 W19 D14 L15

2002 P44 W13 D15 L16

2003 P49 W19 D14 L16

Got bored, so first 165 games, won 59, 36% win rate, consistent with his total spell.

Doncaster 2006-2011 (5 years) 36% win rate

2007 P45 W17 D13 L15

2008 P49 W20 D10 L19

2009 P43 W17 D10 L17

Got bored, so first 137 games, won 54, 39% win rate, better than total so must have trailed off in 2010 and 2011.

Bristol City Jan 2013 (9 months) 25% win rate

We all know the story so far...

--------------------------------

So Bournemouth he W1 D1 L1 consistently, and Doncaster same, except they got worse in the final 2 years.

Is that really what we're aspiring to with this 'time' and 'project' and 'transition' thing?

[dezgimed]

Oh and GJ and DW hit the 40%+ mark with us.

[Kenn Loyal]

SOD/Sigh OUT, before its to late. This season mirrors the last one, but in a division below, young team, early days, it will come good, my bottom, take your red tinted specs off.

[Threshersleftboot]

Yes time will tell, at Bournemouth and Doncaster he built brilliant pass and move sides that were a joy to watch, and successful .

The reason he was able to do this, both clubs gave him time.

Then why is he not still there ?

[Aizoon]

We don't have/arent on a limited budget.

The football currently isnt outstanding.

Time will tell!

SCMP?

[The Right Honourable Les Q]

Now I'm not saying O'Driscoll is any of these things, but let's judge him on what he's done here. His past isn't really relevant.

So, Robbo, you are charged with hiring SOD's replacement, just for argument's sake, here. What will you base your selection on, if not on what the candidates have done previously? The cobblers they tell you in interview, perhaps?

[Portland Bill]

Then why is he not still there ?

I would imagine you know the answer , but just in case, he left Bournemouth to manage Doncaster and having initially been very successful was sacked.

[Portland Bill]

Now I'm not saying O'Driscoll is any of these things, but let's judge him on what he's done here. His past isn't really relevant.

I thought managers were hired because of what they have done in the past.

[Aizoon]

I thought managers were hired because of what they have done in the past.

No, they're hired by looking into a crystal ball to see what they'll do in the future

[Kibs]

Maybe Doncaster fans are in a better position to comment.

But taking such notice of one solitary fan is a bit daft really.

Not if thats the only comment that matches his opinion

[Portland Bill]

No, they're hired by looking into a crystal ball to see what they'll do in the future