Re-Vamped Stadium Crowds

[Pheasant plucker]

During the quiet close season on a rather quiet OLTIB day a thought crossed my mind ( and for once it didn't include 2 scantily clad buxom blondes.........................) where was I........ oh yes stadium!

It's widely accepted that a nice shiny new stadium will boost crowds for a few seasons ( unless your playing non league football if course.....lmfao )

But do you all think when the glorious Gate is finished it will have a simalar effect?

[Cider red]

Potentially. I think a new stadium would have had more of a wow factor, a redevelopment loses its wow factor due to going up in stages. It all depends on the team. If we can get to the championship and be competetive theres no reason we won't get 20k plus a lot of games.

[havanatopia]

Potentially. I think a new stadium would have had more of a wow factor, a redevelopment loses its wow factor due to going up in stages. It all depends on the team. If we can get to the championship and be competetive theres no reason we won't get 20k plus a lot of games.

 

History generally tends to tell us that a completely new stadium increases attendances more than redeveloping when comparing like for like capacities. Your wow factor obviously playing a significant part in attracting a new genre of supporter that every club needs. How well City manage to attract a significantly greater number as well as type of fan, due to the stadium revamp alone vis a vis AV, is the big question and might explain, in part, why the new capacity is going to be 27k instead of 32 at the Vale.

[Cowshed]

History generally tends to tell us that a completely new stadium increases attendances more than redeveloping when comparing like for like capacities. .

History doesn't tell you much as there are so many variables to consider. If Newcastle and Wolves are used as examples attendances increased by hundreds of %. Colchesters attendances in a new stadium are at the level of their previous ground. Derby and Reading still have attendances well above previous homes. Shrewsburys attendances are heading back to those of Gay Meadow. Darlington imploded!!

The easiest trend to spot is: Increases attendance in new stadia and re-developed ones is sustained by results, quite obvioulsy.

[havanatopia]

I assumed my remarks would be taken in the context of a team moving forward not backward.

[Pickle Rick]

Potentially. I think a new stadium would have had more of a wow factor, a redevelopment loses its wow factor due to going up in stages. It all depends on the team. If we can get to the championship and be competetive theres no reason we won't get 20k plus a lot of games.

 

I think part of our problem at AG is accessability for some and parking. It's also the whole hustle and bustle trying to get out when it's busy.

 

And yes, a factor would be to do with our 'loyal' fanbase numbers.

 

Though I do still agree that our average gate will increase post-development.

[Pickle Rick]

History generally tends to tell us that a completely new stadium increases attendances more than redeveloping when comparing like for like capacities. Your wow factor obviously playing a significant part in attracting a new genre of supporter that every club needs. How well City manage to attract a significantly greater number as well as type of fan, due to the stadium revamp alone vis a vis AV, is the big question and might explain, in part, why the new capacity is going to be 27k instead of 32 at the Vale.

 

Redevelopment restrictions and having an uneven structure of stands/heights?

[havanatopia]

Scrumpy... No doubt that is the public reason and part of the real reason but it may remain under wraps why the capacity was not pushed higher for other reasons... One of which as I said is the idea we will simply not fill it anywhere near so easily.

You have again raised what many of us, me included, have emphasised in the past; totally inadequate parking provision.... It may be the reason many will stay away. My Dad, for example, is way too old to walk any distance now and paying a fiver is ok for ground parking but not every single match.

[Aizoon]

Scrumpy... No doubt that is the public reason and part of the real reason but it may remain under wraps why the capacity was not pushed higher for other reasons... One of which as I said is the idea we will simply not fill it anywhere near so easily.

You have again raised what many of us, me included, have emphasised in the past; totally inadequate parking provision.... It may be the reason many will stay away. My Dad, for example, is way too old to walk any distance now and paying a fiver is ok for ground parking but not every single match.

 

I'm honestly surprised more people don't use the bus. Very reasonably priced and free for us old pharts...

[cityloyal473]

Scrumpy... No doubt that is the public reason and part of the real reason but it may remain under wraps why the capacity was not pushed higher for other reasons... One of which as I said is the idea we will simply not fill it anywhere near so easily.

You have again raised what many of us, me included, have emphasised in the past; totally inadequate parking provision.... It may be the reason many will stay away. My Dad, for example, is way too old to walk any distance now and paying a fiver is ok for ground parking but not every single match.

The club would not go far wrong by setting up a park and ride from the Ashton Vale site.  Amazed no one has thought of this.

[beaverface]

I think part of our problem at AG is accessability for some and parking. It's also the whole hustle and bustle trying to get out when it's busy.

 

And yes, a factor would be to do with our 'loyal' fanbase numbers.

 

Though I do still agree that our average gate will increase post-development.

 

One of the other beauties of remaining at Ashton Gate is the history and location - it's all on top of everything at the moment, which makes you feel part of the community and not stuck out on a limb at a retail park.

 

With regards to larger numbers, AG has had crowds of over 30,000 in the past, how did it cope then? We've obviously got a past track record of larger crowds.

[havanatopia]

The club would not go far wrong by setting up a park and ride from the Ashton Vale site.  Amazed no one has thought of this.

I mentioned it ages ago as I am sure others did but probably best that logic does not get in the way of a farce.

[havanatopia]

I'm honestly surprised more people don't use the bus. Very reasonably priced and free for us old pharts...

I am not that old but i will look into the timetable from Clevedon.

[havanatopia]

One of the other beauties of remaining at Ashton Gate is the history and location - it's all on top of everything at the moment, which makes you feel part of the community and not stuck out on a limb at a retail park.

 

With regards to larger numbers, AG has had crowds of over 30,000 in the past, how did it cope then? We've obviously got a past track record of larger crowds.

It coped at least on the parking front because we did not have a fascist style parking regime that we have now.

[Pickle Rick]

One of the other beauties of remaining at Ashton Gate is the history and location - it's all on top of everything at the moment, which makes you feel part of the community and not stuck out on a limb at a retail park.

 

With regards to larger numbers, AG has had crowds of over 30,000 in the past, how did it cope then? We've obviously got a past track record of larger crowds.

 

Unfortunately, as times change, so does the affordability and practicality of things. Let alone society and culture.

[pongo88]

It coped at least on the parking front because we did not have a fascist style parking regime that we have now.

And because people used to travel by those strange things called buses

[havanatopia]

And because people used to travel by those strange things called buses

Probably ok if u live in Brizzle proper but in the outlying towns I doubt there is sufficient capacity. You also got to consider that a bus from Clevedon, for example, might be rammed and might not stop in a convenient location unless they alter the schedule.

[pongo88]

Probably ok if u live in Brizzle proper but in the outlying towns I doubt there is sufficient capacity. You also got to consider that a bus from Clevedon, for example, might be rammed and might not stop in a convenient location unless they alter the schedule.

In the majority of cases you're right. Live in a village outside Bristol and the only bus that would gets you to Ashton Gate in time for kick off on a Saturday leaves on Friday at noon. There are rare exceptions. There is a regular bus service from Portishead every 15 minutes that stops by the Cumberland Basin. Unfortunately I don't live in Portishead so I travel by car. Next season I'll have to cope with the new Clifton and Hotwells residents parking zones so I'll get fit by having to walk miles to get to the ground.

[Manon]

The club would not go far wrong by setting up a park and ride from the Ashton Vale site. Amazed no one has thought of this.

Do you mean using the actual p & r, or just the surrounding land? The p & r is owned by north somerset CC and there are stipulations regarding it's use. I think I remember that there was some sort of agreement made when AV was given pp that it could be used for matchday traffic as it was part of the same setup and just would've been so nonsensical to refuse that they had to.

Whether a similar agreement could be made with AG, I obviously have no idea, but I doubt it would be straightforward.

The bus rapid transit to AV is still happening though, isn't it? People can park elsewhere in the centre and hop on that.

Hopefully the train station will reopen which, ultimately, will hook the populous up to the greater bristol metro once the four-tracking of filton back is complete.

[cityloyal473]

Do you mean using the actual p & r, or just the surrounding land? The p & r is owned by north somerset CC and there are stipulations regarding it's use. I think I remember that there was some sort of agreement made when AV was given pp that it could be used for matchday traffic as it was part of the same setup and just would've been so nonsensical to refuse that they had to.

Whether a similar agreement could be made with AG, I obviously have no idea, but I doubt it would be straightforward.

The bus rapid transit to AV is still happening though, isn't it? People can park elsewhere in the centre and hop on that.

Hopefully the train station will reopen which, ultimately, will hook the populous up to the greater bristol metro once the four-tracking of filton back is complete.

I was thinking of a club owned/operated P&R on the actual AV site.

[ciderup]

I thought the plan was to have busses from the various park and ride sites to AG on match days?

Living in Longwell Green, the Briz Park and ride would be ideal.

Is that not happening now?

[Monkeh]

Probably ok if u live in Brizzle proper but in the outlying towns I doubt there is sufficient capacity. You also got to consider that a bus from Clevedon, for example, might be rammed and might not stop in a convenient location unless they alter the schedule.

never had a problem with buses from portishead

[Major Isewater]

[pongo88]

[BS34Red]

Living in bs34 obviously I wouldn't use the bus to get to the gate. There is the 75 which is quite regular but you find you get all sorts of low lifes on that route and it takes quite some time to get from here to there plus then you also have the walk from Bemmy to the Gate. Driving is cheaper as there is usually 4 of us, takes quicker to get to the gate and less of a walk from where I park and driving just gives that extra bit of freedom. Sorry but I just get annoyed at stopping at bus stops waiting for people to board.

As for redevelopments I personally think Deepdale is one of the best redevelopments yet they didn't recieve a boost in attendences. However had they built a new ground to the same design they would have seen an increase.

[RedRock]

Ease (and security) of parking is a major issue that the Club need to address.

At the moment, many, including me, use Bedminster Cricket Club and have swelled their coffers by many tens of thousands (wonder if they give anything back to the Club in the form of sponsorship?) Not ideal though as wet weather reduces parking capacity significantly. No doubt the Cricket Club will be laughing all the way to the bank with the revenue from the egg-chasers (although there could be a planning issue over the number of days the site is used for parking).

City did use the P@R once but that stopped. Anyone know why? Seems blindingly obvious solution to me if they can sort the post match exiting issues out.

[Cider red]

I don't understand this whole parking bee people have in their bonnet. Theres plenty of grounds across the country who have similar problems and get bigger crowds than us. And what makes people think AV would have been any better for parking? They were only installing one new car park, not enough for all the masses. There is PLENTY of on street parking if you are willing to walk 15 minutes to the ground.

[sglosbcfc]

I have visited 80 odd league grounds and I really don't see how an out of town new stadium improves the parking situation. It usually means you get yer pants pulled down I.e 8 quid to park at Reading, and then you wait for forty minutes at the final whistle to get away from the jam.

Rovers have cleverly got round that problem by going non league this ensuring gates of sub 5000 meaning that the traffic jams won't be such a problem at UWE.

[Cowshed]

As for redevelopments I personally think Deepdale is one of the best redevelopments yet they didn't recieve a boost in attendences. However had they built a new ground to the same design they would have seen an increase.

I too quite like the basic redevelopment of Deepdale.

The above is not quite true. Prestons gates are still 15 - 20% above the ground pre redevelopment. The redevelopment of Deepdale started in 1995 mind!!

[Pedrowe]

You cannot really compare the AG redevelopment to Preston. Deepdale was redeveloped over 15 years (between 1995 and 2010) and therefore there was never a "new ground" feeling.

 

A better example would be Home Park where three sides of the ground were redeveloped between 2001 and 2002. Before the development the average attendances at Home Park were c. 5k, following the redevelopment the average attendance increased to c. 9k in the same division (an 80% increase). Following promotion to League 1 their attendances increased again to 12k (140% increase).

 

I'm not suggest AG will see similar increases to Plymouth, but in my view attendances will increase to some extent. This is because an improved AG will offer a much more enjoyable experience for supporters, attracting more fans. At the moment, a large crowd at AG means long queues at turnstiles, toilets, and kiosk etc.