Ivorguy Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 1. Why were only two players signed in the summer - one of whom left quickly under still unexplained circumstances ? This is particularly relevant given that last season's squad was seriously weakened by those players, who for one reason or another, left. Moreover, the manager said on appointment that if the Club was promoted he would need about six new players. Finally, three of the present squad were deemed unsuitable for League One, only months ago, and were loaned out to clubs in League Two where they hardly set the world alight.2. Why did the club bring in one loanee who has only started one game in ten? Surely a loan of a player who would strengthen the team rather than the squad would have been a better option.3. Why was the manager appointed without normal recruitment procedures being followed?4. Why keep making the decades long City error of not reinforcing success? We again have a star striker isolated in a poor team - shades of the late great Big John.5. Why has the Club been so reluctant to engage with fans this season? Does it only communicate in the good times? Are there answers to any of these questions? I would submit that the first important appointment to make is that of a professional football consultant to The Board, and take it from there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest harvey Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 Don't get Q3, please elaborate, interested to see the reply from BCFC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lack of Action Man Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 don't get Q3, please elaborate I assumed it refers to SC being the only candidate interviewed for the post. Although in context to the direction of the other questions, this one seems a little irrelevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivorguy Posted October 4, 2015 Author Share Posted October 4, 2015 My understanding is that there was no open recruitment or competitive interviews.I remember raising my concerns with the Club at the time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivorguy Posted October 4, 2015 Author Share Posted October 4, 2015 The point I am trying to make is if due process had been carried out the issue of the manager's suitability for the Championship would have been explored, and the length of his contract.Further when the next manager is appointed we need The Board to adopt normal practice Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM91 Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 My understanding is that there was no open recruitment or competitive interviews.I remember raising my concerns with the Club at the timeAnd then being quite as we won two trophies and had one of the best seasons we've ever had?Get a grip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donkeeebles Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 1. Why were only two players signed in the summer - one of whom left quickly under still unexplained circumstances ? This is particularly relevant given that last season's squad was seriously weakened by those players, who for one reason or another, left. Moreover, the manager said on appointment that if the Club was promoted he would need about six new players. Finally, three of the present squad were deemed unsuitable for League One, only months ago, and were loaned out to clubs in League Two where they hardly set the world alight.2. Why did the club bring in one loanee who has only started one game in ten? Surely a loan of a player who would strengthen the team rather than the squad would have been a better option.3. Why was the manager appointed without normal recruitment procedures being followed?4. Why keep making the decades long City error of not reinforcing success? We again have a star striker isolated in a poor team - shades of the late great Big John.5. Why has the Club been so reluctant to engage with fans this season? Does it only communicate in the good times? Are there answers to any of these questions? I would submit that the first important appointment to make is that of a professional football consultant to The Board, and take it from there.Akinde? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 Akinde? did he die? or did your joke fall on its ass? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoons Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 My understanding is that there was no open recruitment or competitive interviews.I remember raising my concerns with the Club at the timeThe board had a target interviewed there number 1 target and gave him the job... Oh and then he delivered a record points total and two trophies and attacking football!!! What do you mean you raised you concern at the time??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 The point I am trying to make is if due process had been carried out the issue of the manager's suitability for the Championship would have been explored, and the length of his contract.Further when the next manager is appointed we need The Board to adopt normal practiceI'm really amazed by this. At the time of SCs appointment championship suitability should have been very low on the agenda: who can keep us up first and foremost. As for length of contract it hasn't been a problem has it? In fact wasn't it perfect..? He has 18m left (only 6 months more compo than a rolling deal). If his deal was one year shorter arguably we'd have been in a tough position re his tenure. He could reasonable have expected a renewal this summer and we could've feared someone picking him up for little compo. I like you disapproved of the process but I have nil complaints re the result. If the process had been different I'm not sure anything more would've/could've been achieved. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donkeeebles Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 did he die? or did your joke fall on its ass? To be fair it wouldn't be the first time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter O Hanraha-hanrahan Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 The point I am trying to make is if due process had been carried out the issue of the manager's suitability for the Championship would have been explored, and the length of his contract.Further when the next manager is appointed we need The Board to adopt normal practiceIn fairness, at the time of Cotterills appointment it looked more likely that we would be leaving L1 through the other door. He kept us up and followed that with the best season in my memory so imo the board deserve credit for bringing in and backing SC who was clearly the right candidate for the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chappers Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 Think it's pretty well commented on that City screwed up pre-season big time, just hope lessons learned and we can dig ourselves out of the hole. Think we went for marquee signings, overlooking the obvious fact that the squad needed a few large tents as well!Post would be a lot better without Q3. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivorguy Posted October 4, 2015 Author Share Posted October 4, 2015 Think my Q3 got lost in translation! I think The Board's action is symptomatic of wider issue of how it manages the Club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chappers Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 I see your point, but we did the thorough sift bit twice and got it wrong. SC did the job he was appointed to do in keeping us up, then we had quite a good season last year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 I suspect the vast majority of professional league clubs are mis-managed to some extent.When results are good, it's swan above the water that we see.When results are bad, it's the legs frantically paddling away that we see.For some reason football and business is a weird combo, and only a few clubs can be successful each season, and that doesn't mean they've been successful financially either. Have a read of David Conn's books, if you want to get an insight.....pretty shocking stuff.i can only offer an answer to q2....the manager doesn't think he's better than the starters.I think this season is showing us fans at our fickle best - perhaps we get what we deserve?I'm probably rose tinted....but I'd rather we focus on getting behind the club (staff and players) than keep going over the same ground. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 The board had a target interviewed there number 1 target and gave him the job... Oh and then he delivered a record points total and two trophies and attacking football!!! What do you mean you raised you concern at the time??? Lots were concerned about that at the time. It has worked; but shouldn't set a precedent for recruitment in the future for managers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 The board had a target interviewed there number 1 target and gave him the job... Oh and then he delivered a record points total and two trophies and attacking football!!! What do you mean you raised you concern at the time??? I don't think he delivered a record points total, in 1954/55 we won 30 and drew 10 - the equivalent of 100 points today.Can't really compare the days of two points and three points for a win I know, but it's worth pointing out....and 30 wins in a season is some achievement... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoons Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 I don't think he delivered a record points total, in 1954/55 we won 30 and drew 10 - the equivalent of 100 points today.Can't really compare the days of two points and three points for a win I know, but it's worth pointing out....and 30 wins in a season is some achievement...bit picky !! Think the record books say 99 points so I will go with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoons Posted October 4, 2015 Share Posted October 4, 2015 Lots were concerned about that at the time. It has worked; but shouldn't set a precedent for recruitment in the future for managers.far from setting a precedent this was the first time I recall that this has happened. It was Keith Dawes decision and SL backed him. I'm sure in futre it will revert to normal practice. I actually thought it showed good management, identifying your target and securing him quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 far from setting a precedent this was the first time I recall that this has happened. It was Keith Dawes decision and SL backed him. I'm sure in futre it will revert to normal practice. I actually thought it showed good management, identifying your target and securing him quickly. No, I said it shouldn't set a precedent in the future - it only sets a precedent if it happens again! It worked this time but it's not good practice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CyderInACan Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 1. Why were only two players signed in the summer - one of whom left quickly under still unexplained circumstances ? This is particularly relevant given that last season's squad was seriously weakened by those players, who for one reason or another, left. Moreover, the manager said on appointment that if the Club was promoted he would need about six new players. Finally, three of the present squad were deemed unsuitable for League One, only months ago, and were loaned out to clubs in League Two where they hardly set the world alight.2. Why did the club bring in one loanee who has only started one game in ten? Surely a loan of a player who would strengthen the team rather than the squad would have been a better option.3. Why was the manager appointed without normal recruitment procedures being followed?4. Why keep making the decades long City error of not reinforcing success? We again have a star striker isolated in a poor team - shades of the late great Big John.5. Why has the Club been so reluctant to engage with fans this season? Does it only communicate in the good times? Are there answers to any of these questions? I would submit that the first important appointment to make is that of a professional football consultant to The Board, and take it from there.Fairly sure he's referring to Stern John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extonsred Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 I agree with 5 -- I think the media dept and thus the club have been very poor this season. The player interviews have been woeful -- nothing insoiring whatsoever and the routine questioning has been robotic -- so so predictable. No special features about players in depth.But more alarmingly the OP has I feel identified a big gap in the communications this year. We should routinely have had interviews with SL JL KB -- i have only seen on this season from JP. It does all suggest to me that there is a lack of clarity, cohesion, objective at the top and no we dont have a right to know but in respect to the fans there should be some engagement. It would also help to know that there is some sort of plan to put things right because if not the writing is clearly on the wall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
extonsred Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 PS -- I actually agree with most of the rest of the post too -- except perhaps three. The real negligence for me has been the failure to build on the momentum from last season. Should not have been too difficult but they have really screwed up on that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoons Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 No, I said it shouldn't set a precedent in the future - it only sets a precedent if it happens again! It worked this time but it's not good practice. agreed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ashton_fan Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 Think my Q3 got lost in translation! I think The Board's action is symptomatic of wider issue of how it manages the Club. I think most clubs now only sack their manager mid-season if they have a replacement lined up, especially later in the season. While going through a lengthy interview process games are still being played often with points lost as a result making it more difficult for the new manager. Also you have to be sure there's a better manager than the one you've got who's willing to come to the club. If it's done at the end of a season then it's fair enough to interview several candidates but in the situation we were in a couple of years ago that could have been the difference between relegation and survival. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roadrunner Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 We had the longest time this summer of any other clubs in the league, to get the players in that Steve said he needed. The players we bid for, and had excepted were very exciting. But why did we bid when no way could we match their wage demands. Someone wasted time, and had not done their homework.Of course the money clubs get from the premiership when they are relegated I believe is the main problem. Not only for us but PNE and Milton Keynes, as the table shows.That said the signing of Jonathon Kodjia is a great success, and Is the way forward for clubs like ours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 We had the longest time this summer of any other clubs in the league, to get the players in that Steve said he needed. The players we bid for, and had excepted were very exciting. But why did we bid when no way could we match their wage demands. Someone wasted time, and had not done their homework.Of course the money clubs get from the premiership when they are relegated I believe is the main problem. Not only for us but PNE and Milton Keynes, as the table shows.That said the signing of Jonathon Kodjia is a great success, and Is the way forward for clubs like ours.This isn't aimed at you fella...but something worth thinking about across the forum.Burt and SC have been in this game long enough to know how transfers work...they would have spoken to agents of players, to get a ball park figure as to what players wages are. We wouldn't have agreed terms with Clubs for players, if we couldn't afford to pay the wages those players wanted.Players have decided to go to other clubs for various other reasons....not just wages.The one success has been kodijia like you say...poor lad must be wondering what he's walked into.Thankfully we seem to have a decent bunch of players that any manager could work with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
View from the Dolman Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 Have you tried actually asking these questions to the board? In person? By letter? Probably more likely to draw a response than grandstanding on a forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 This isn't aimed at you fella...but something worth thinking about across the forum.Burt and SC have been in this game long enough to know how transfers work...they would have spoken to agents of players, to get a ball park figure as to what players wages are. We wouldn't have agreed terms with Clubs for players, if we couldn't afford to pay the wages those players wanted.Players have decided to go to other clubs for various other reasons....not just wages.The one success has been kodijia like you say...poor lad must be wondering what he's walked into.Thankfully we seem to have a decent bunch of players that any manager could work with.I did wonder that, Spud but I actually think he'll be pretty happy- he's the stand out player- third top scorer after 10 games and has got his foothold in English football whilst still learning the language . If you were his agent- what would you be telling him? " This time next year, Kodders, we'll be millionaires". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 Have you tried actually asking these questions to the board? In person? By letter? Probably more likely to draw a response than grandstanding on a forum.A supporters Q & A seems long overdue now you mention it.I'm sure a number of us have some burning questions to ask the board and SC about what has happened at our football club since May. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 I did wonder that, Spud but I actually think he'll be pretty happy- he's the stand out player- third top scorer after 10 games and has got his foothold in English football whilst still learning the language . If you were his agent- what would you be telling him? " This time next year, Kodders, we'll be millionaires". Who know's mate....footballs a funny game....anything could happen this season, still a long way to go.Like I alluded to in another post....any manager brought into this club would struggle to gain sustainability over a period of time in this league.It's not just about money in this league. So many other elements come in to it. So much has changed in such a quick time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 Who know's mate....footballs a funny game....anything could happen this season, still a long way to go.Like I alluded to in another post....any manager brought into this club would struggle to gain sustainability over a period of time in this league.It's not just about money in this league. So many other elements come in to it. So much has changed in such a quick time.If it's not about the money and not about the Manager and not about the players then I really struggle to understand your inference. The team have played fairly well in most games and I just feel that had we the strength in depth to call on in a larger quality squad , we'd be mid table at the least. We all now know the monumental mess up which has been created at board level and has prevented squad enhancement but you seem to be saying that even had the money been available and new players bought in that we would still be in trouble this season.Why? P.s A simple explanation without breaking confidence will suffice. And we all promise not to tell anyone else Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 If it's not about the money and not about the Manager and not about the players then I really struggle to understand your inference. The team have played fairly well in most games and I just feel that had we the strength in depth to call on in a larger quality squad , we'd be mid table at the least. We all now know the monumental mess up which has been created at board level and has prevented squad enhancement but you seem to be saying that even had the money been available and new players bought in that we would still be in trouble this season.Why? P.s A simple explanation without breaking confidence will suffice. And we all promise not to tell anyone else No I didn't fella....I said any manager would struggle to sustain this Club in the Championship over a longer period of time....not just 'this season'.Tbh....I actually thought, with momentum from last season, that we would be doing better than we are. But I've never thought that SC would be the man to sustain it for a longer period.Have you not noticed, that regardless of managers, players, coaching staff, millions of $'s thrown at the club, we as a club never sustain momentum. We peak....then drop. Our history has proven that.We do not have the 'set up' right at this Club to sustain it for a long time in the Championship. We have at League 1 level....mainly down to money.But our coaching, technology, scouting and way we are run as a Professional football club is not on a par with many others in this league.When you get disharmony....these cracks start to show themselves.Often your position in the league is a reflection on the 'health' at a club. Not just the football being played. For sure if we had recruited better, replaced key players, not had injuries, and not had to play people out of position and injured.....then i'm sure we would probably be doing better. As you say....we haven't been over run in games.But sustainability over a period of time....in this league....until things change....I think not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchay Red Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 Burt and SC have been in this game long enough to know how transfers work...they would have spoken to agents of players, to get a ball park figure as to what players wages are. We wouldn't have agreed terms with Clubs for players, if we couldn't afford to pay the wages those players wanted.Players have decided to go to other clubs for various other reasons....not just wages. As far as Gray is concerned the deal fell through apparently because the agent wanted a deal that the club felt was too greedy.Source? A chance meeting with the manager, out shopping, who quite rightly wouldn't be drawn on it but did say deal was agreed, better wages than Brentford were paying were agreed, but the agent's demands were too greedy to finalise things.I guess parachute payments benefit the relegated clubs and agents of players subsequently signed by those clubs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 No I didn't fella....I said any manager would struggle to sustain this Club in the Championship over a longer period of time....not just 'this season'.Tbh....I actually thought, with momentum from last season, that we would be doing better than we are. But I've never thought that SC would be the man to sustain it for a longer period.Have you not noticed, that regardless of managers, players, coaching staff, millions of $'s thrown at the club, we as a club never sustain momentum. We peak....then drop. Our history has proven that.We do not have the 'set up' right at this Club to sustain it for a long time in the Championship. We have at League 1 level....mainly down to money.But our coaching, technology, scouting and way we are run as a Professional football club is not on a par with many others in this league.When you get disharmony....these cracks start to show themselves.Often your position in the league is a reflection on the 'health' at a club. Not just the football being played. For sure if we had recruited better, replaced key players, not had injuries, and not had to play people out of position and injured.....then i'm sure we would probably be doing better. As you say....we haven't been over run in games.But sustainability over a period of time....in this league....until things change....I think not. Thanks for the reply and explanation and it would be hard to disagree.I remember a kid at school who was amazing at winning the ball in Rugby- but he was always so surprised he didn't know what to do next and invariably lost the advantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 As far as Gray is concerned the deal fell through apparently because the agent wanted a deal that the club felt was too greedy.Source? A chance meeting with the manager, out shopping, who quite rightly wouldn't be drawn on it but did say deal was agreed, better wages than Brentford were paying were agreed, but the agent's demands were too greedy to finalise things.I guess parachute payments benefit the relegated clubs and agents of players subsequently signed by those clubs. That maybe the case Frenchay....maybe the board weren't willing to pay the agents demands. But that doesn't mean the player also wanted to come here. I've heard Burnley actually offered less than us, and the player chose to go to Burnley instead, as the 'package' was good enough, and he felt the Club was a better fit for him. So not purely down to money alone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 Have you seen my glasses ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchay Red Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 That maybe the case Frenchay....maybe the board weren't willing to pay the agents demands. But that doesn't mean the player also wanted to come here. I've heard Burnley actually offered less than us, and the player chose to go to Burnley instead, as the 'package' was good enough, and he felt the Club was a better fit for him. So not purely down to money alone.Maybe the player going to Burnley was put forward as a better career fit for the player and, oh guess what, better financial fit for the agent! Who knows? But it wouldn't surprise me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 Maybe the player going to Burnley was put forward as a better career fit for the player and, oh guess what, better financial fit for the agent! Who knows? But it wouldn't surprise me.Yet...the bloke who dealt with the financial dealings gets the boot...funny old business football ;-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RumRed Posted October 5, 2015 Share Posted October 5, 2015 A supporters Q & A seems long overdue now you mention it.I'm sure a number of us have some burning questions to ask the board and SC about what has happened at our football club since May.Can us exiles do this by e-mail? Guess so but if someone could pass it on that'd be great. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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