Who has stepped up to the plate ?

[BS30 Reds]

13 minutes ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

 Reid was knackered in the 2nd half at M'Boro according to RB commentary and had ceased being effective long before he was subbed in the 78th minute.

Wouldn't have said he was knackered. he became less effective as city got deeper and deeper until basically staying put on the edge of the box. So when he picked the ball up he either hit it long to kodijia or he tried to dribble with it and just got tackled a few times.

I would just say it just turned in to a game he couldn't effect...

[Nogbad the Bad]

1 minute ago, BS30 Reds said:

Wouldn't have said he was knackered. he became less effective as city got deeper and deeper until basically staying put on the edge of the box. So when he picked the ball up he either hit it long to kodijia or he tried to dribble with it and just got tackled a few times.

I would just say it just turned in to a game he couldn't effect...

Sounds like he wasn't capable of adapting his game, and being replaced by the supposedly unfit Wagstaff strongly indicates Cotts. agreed with RB that Bobby had nothing left to give.

My main point was he didn't in fact play the full 90 minutes, contrary to what Kid said, but I would add no excuses such as yours above, with no criticism, are put forward in Freeman's defence if he is less than effective for 90 minutes.

As ever with Bobby it sounded very much like he had a good spell in the first half, then faded badly and started giving the ball away, leading to an inevitable substitution.

Freeman can be relied on to keep going for 90 minutes, always looking for the ball, every single match, even if he's not playing at his best.

[BS30 Reds]

1 minute ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

Sounds like he wasn't capable of adapting his game, and being replaced by the supposedly unfit Wagstaff strongly indicates Cotts. agreed with RB that Bobby had nothing left to give.

My main point was he didn't in fact play the full 90 minutes, contrary to what Kid said, but I would add no excuses such as yours above, with no criticism, are put forward in Freeman's defence if he is less than effective for 90 minutes.

As ever with Bobby it sounded very much like he had a good spell in the first half, then faded badly and started giving the ball away, leading to an inevitable substitution.

Freeman can be relied on to keep going for 90 minutes, always looking for the ball, every single match, even if he's not playing at his best.

I agree wasn't saying that Bobby should play instead, I do think Freeman will come good, but in the same breath I do think it needs to be sooner rather than later or maybe SC will have to change something to do with the situation we are in.

Your point about wagstaff... We went to a back 7 with Wes as a 'rwwb' and wagstaff as a 'lwwb'. IIRC Wagstaff got injured after the Boro game?

[Nogbad the Bad]

6 minutes ago, BS30 Reds said:

I agree wasn't saying that Bobby should play instead, I do think Freeman will come good, but in the same breath I do think it needs to be sooner rather than later or maybe SC will have to change something to do with the situation we are in.

Your point about wagstaff... We went to a back 7 with Wes as a 'rwwb' and wagstaff as a 'lwwb'. IIRC Wagstaff got injured after the Boro game?

My understanding is Wagstaff hes not been fully match fit all season, and has been basically making up the numbers on the bench.

Re. Freeman/Reid: I'd be quite happy for Bobby to get 25 mins. off the bench if LF is struggling, but my guess is Cotts.believes Freeman will play his way out of this disappointing spell, and LF is an important player for him and the team even when underpar.

I think he's suffered through the suspension, and a couple of glaring misses, and a goal would probably go a long way to him rediscovering his best form.

[Kid in the Riot]

12 minutes ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

Sounds like he wasn't capable of adapting his game, and being replaced by the supposedly unfit Wagstaff strongly indicates Cotts. agreed with RB that Bobby had nothing left to give.

My main point was he didn't in fact play the full 90 minutes, contrary to what Kid said, but I would add no excuses such as yours above, with no criticism, are put forward in Freeman's defence if he is less than effective for 90 minutes.

As ever with Bobby it sounded very much like he had a good spell in the first half, then faded badly and started giving the ball away, leading to an inevitable substitution.

Freeman can be relied on to keep going for 90 minutes, always looking for the ball, every single match, even if he's not playing at his best.

How on earth can you come to a conclusion like that based on the commentary of that useless goon on RB and footballing expert Adam Baker?

Aside from scoring a deflected goal at Ipswich and getting himself stupidly suspended for 3 games and significantly contributing to our 4-2 defeat to Brentford, could you outline exactly what Freeman has achived this season in a BCFC shirt?

Bobby played a large part in our win at the Riverside, directly contributing to the goal and also helped change the game at home to Leeds with an assist and was again involved in the second.

He's more than shown that he is a faster thinker than Freeman, he uses the ball quicker than Freeman and often better when actually given the chance.

He should've had more minutes this season. Particularly when we've been at a deadlock ie Cardiff and Bolton games and Freeman has not been affecting games. We know Bobby has a match-winning pass in him. He seems to have found Kodjia with greater accuracy than Freeman has this season too, again, in the limited amount we've seen of him.

Great shame that a young Bristolian who has shown he can perform at this level when given a chance hasn't been given more game time.

[Nogbad the Bad]

3 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

How on earth can you come to a conclusion like that based on the commentary of that useless goon on RB and footballing expert Adam Baker?

Aside from scoring a deflected goal at Ipswich and getting himself stupidly suspended for 3 games and significantly contributing to our 4-2 defeat to Brentford, could you outline exactly what Freeman has achived this season in a BCFC shirt?

Bobby played a large part in our win at the Riverside, directly contributing to the goal and also helped change the game at home to Leeds with an assist and was again involved in the second.

He's more than shown that he is a faster thinker than Freeman, he uses the ball quicker than Freeman and often better when actually given the chance.

He should've had more minutes this season. Particularly when we've been at a deadlock ie Cardiff and Bolton games and Freeman has not been affecting games. We know Bobby has a match-winning pass in him. He seems to have found Kodjia with greater accuracy than Freeman has this season too, again, in the limited amount we've seen of him.

Great shame that a young Bristolian who has shown he can perform at this level when given a chance hasn't been given more game time.

You made a big thing of Reid playing the full 90 minutes at M'Boro. He didn't.

I haven't said Reid hasn't got an incisive pass in him, he has. He's a skilful little player.

His problem is he always fades and starts to give the ball away (he doesn't have the stamina or harrying qualities of Freeman to make up for it) and has a tendency to drift out of games.

Despite all that he can be very effective in short bursts and I agree he should have had more minutes this season. For me that would be off the bench though.

BTW, the fact he's Bristolian should be, and is, irrelevant.

[Bs4Red]

3 minutes ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

You made a big thing of Reid playing the full 90 minutes at M'Boro. He didn't.

I haven't said Reid hasn't got an incisive pass in him, he has. He's a skilful little player.

His problem is he always fades and starts to give the ball away (he doesn't have the stamina or harrying qualities of Freeman to make up for it) and has a tendency to drift out of games.

Despite all that he can be very effective in short bursts and I agree he should have had more minutes this season. For me that would be off the bench though.

BTW, the fact he's Bristolian should be, and is, irrelevant.

Freeman has faded out of games all season, he isn't in the team to Harry opposition, he's supposed to be out attacking quality? He has one goal in 14 games this season from attacking midfield. We already have pack and smith to Harry, I don't think freeman has done anywhere near enough this season and to be honest he still isn't forgiven for the stupidest red card I've seen in a long time.

[And Its Smith]

if the referee gives the Freeman penalty incident against Brighton then we possibly win the game because of Freeman. Perhaps then people's attitudes towards him would be different

Got MOTM against Forest as well I believe

[Fordy62]

Aot of people rating Fielding below average and I really can't see why. I thought he's been holding his own pretty well. I sooner have him than Hamer. 

[bristolcitysweden]

In my opinion only Williams

[bristolcitysweden]

If you have "stepped up" you were not at the same level last season 

[bristolcitysweden]

The pen appeal against BOLTON WAS NOTHING BUT A VER VERY POOR JOKE

[djb6162]

3 hours ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

You made a big thing of Reid playing the full 90 minutes at M'Boro. He didn't.

I haven't said Reid hasn't got an incisive pass in him, he has. He's a skilful little player.

His problem is he always fades and starts to give the ball away (he doesn't have the stamina or harrying qualities of Freeman to make up for it) and has a tendency to drift out of games.

Despite all that he can be very effective in short bursts and I agree he should have had more minutes this season. For me that would be off the bench though.

BTW, the fact he's Bristolian should be, and is, irrelevant.

You know its really getting very boring listening to the same old comments about Bobby.

On this seasons performances , which is what the gaffer should select  against, bobby is a better option, he is more inteligent, and brings others into the game. He also reads the game better than any of our midfield options.

when he gets tired, thats an easy problem, bring him off. Thats what the bench is supposed to be all about.

so I would rather see a clever and creative  performance for 45 minutes than mediocrity for 90.

the problem is bobby is often asked to do all of this when we are two down with 20 mins to go.

just like a number of those warming the seats next to the gaffer.

 

does it really matter what Bobby does in training or as a sub, he wont start, he knows it, the gaffer knows it and so do the opposition

our starting eleven is like UK gold, everyone knows whats coming next win lose or draw.

 

 

 

 

[Bright Cider Life]

Freeman isn't in the team to harry opponents? Seems to me he clearly is or the manager would pick someone with less defensive responsibility. You may feel Freeman should be given free reign but I'd bet my last quid the manager picks him instead of Bobby because he does harry. If you play toolstation I'm sure you get specific instructions to the detriment of your natural game?

[Kid in the Riot]

4 hours ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

You made a big thing of Reid playing the full 90 minutes at M'Boro. He didn't.

I haven't said Reid hasn't got an incisive pass in him, he has. He's a skilful little player.

His problem is he always fades and starts to give the ball away (he doesn't have the stamina or harrying qualities of Freeman to make up for it) and has a tendency to drift out of games.

Despite all that he can be very effective in short bursts and I agree he should have had more minutes this season. For me that would be off the bench though.

BTW, the fact he's Bristolian should be, and is, irrelevant.

Well, I do apologise Nogbad - I was 12 minutes out! The point remains that in near enough 1.5 games (Boro and Leeds) Bobby made a significant contribution.

I am still waiting for you to furnish me with the actual contributions Freeman has made in 14 appearances so far this season. Bearing in mind he starts on minus points for that clumbsy challenge v Brentford! Whilst I am very grateful for it his goal at Ipswich was very fortuitous.

To accuse Bobby of 'drifting outing of games' when you've seen some of Freeman's non-performances this season is extraordinary.

As for his supposed poor stamina which you have zero evidence of, as djb says, that's what subs are for. If he tires after an hour, bring him off. Not difficult.

Wilbraham has looked shattered after an hour EVERY game he's played this season but still doesn't get subbed.

Bobby won't get a game and I'm afraid it smacks of a manager who has their 'favourites' and is not willing or able to look past certain players, however disappointing their contribution might be.

Finally, I'm genuinely surprised by your comment that Bobby being Bristolian is irrelevant. Particularly after you seemed to be bemoaning the other week that most Bristolians have moved out of Southville and most residents are now from the south east or europe.

I got the impression you were a proud Bristolian and would understand the obvious desire to have local lads breaking through into the first team. It's been said many times about how important it is for there to be a clear 'pathway' for local lads to come through the Academy and make it into the first team.

To have a couple of Academy lads on the bench every week, both of whom have proved to an extent that at the very least they are no worse than some of the players' performances we've seen this season, is very disappointing. It seems you agree we should've seen more of Reid for one, so our only disagreement is that i feel Reid is very, very unlucky not to have had another start following his early season promise.

[Bs4Red]

3 hours ago, Bright Cider Life said:

Freeman isn't in the team to harry opponents? Seems to me he clearly is or the manager would pick someone with less defensive responsibility. You may feel Freeman should be given free reign but I'd bet my last quid the manager picks him instead of Bobby because he does harry. If you play toolstation I'm sure you get specific instructions to the detriment of your natural game?

I understand your point. But if he's in the team to Harry, where is our attacking threat except Kodj? I must agree with KITR, I cannot believe Bobby hasn't managed more starts. If Freeman has to start which it seems he does, what's up with 451? Bobby and Freeman drop Agard and play Kodj on his own, personally not a fan of that as I like to attack but I think Bobby is a creator and has a better football brain and creativeness than freeman. This isn't slating freeman, I hope he comes good but on this season alone. A 70 minute Bobby Reid is more effective than a 90 Freeman

[Shtanley]

People saying BR can't harry, he won the ball and then broke half the pitch to set up Kodjia vs MK. 

[Nogbad the Bad]

14 hours ago, djb6162 said:

You know its really getting very boring listening to the same old comments about Bobby.

On this seasons performances , which is what the gaffer should select  against, bobby is a better option, he is more inteligent, and brings others into the game. He also reads the game better than any of our midfield options.

when he gets tired, thats an easy problem, bring him off. Thats what the bench is supposed to be all about.

so I would rather see a clever and creative  performance for 45 minutes than mediocrity for 90.

the problem is bobby is often asked to do all of this when we are two down with 20 mins to go.

just like a number of those warming the seats next to the gaffer.

 

does it really matter what Bobby does in training or as a sub, he wont start, he knows it, the gaffer knows it and so do the opposition

our starting eleven is like UK gold, everyone knows whats coming next win lose or draw.

 

Boring djb? The average poster, including me, can only give their honest assessment based on watching the games.

You seem to be suggesting Reid should be starting instead of Freeman. A matter of opinion and I disagree for all the reasons given in previous replies.

Should Bobby be getting more minutes off the bench? From what I've seen, he should, yes.

SC's tried and trusted selection policy, certainly last season, seems to be to try to make as few changes as possible. He won't necessarily drop one out of form player if he feels the mix of the team as a whole is right. He's also been loath to make substitutions, even when he does often leaving it far later than many would like.

Is that a bad thing? Consistent selection, and a team who knew each other inside out, was very productive for the club last season.

SC did nevertheless mix it up up by surprisingly including Agard against Wolves, so he's not entirely intransigent.

Not very encouraging for those on the periphery like Reid. It must be very frustrating for them, and all close to them, but the manager will stand or fall by the decisions he makes, and any squad of 20+ will always have it's share of disenchanted non starters.

Looking at the benches of other Championship clubs, often including very experienced and proven players, being selected for the bench at AG in this division is in itself an achievement, though of course they all want to play. 

It's Cotterill's job to keep the whole squad mentally and physically primed for action but he will select what he feels are the 11 most likely to bring home the 3 points for City in every game, and I've no doubt that's uppermost in his mind.

Frustrating and annoying for the fans when their favourites can't get a place, JET being very much a case in point for me last season.

If Reid had convinced SC in training he could consistently contribute more than Freeman, or anyone else, over 90 minutes then surely he would be selected if an individual continued to disappoint.

The fact every poster might take issue with one or more of the 11 selected on any given week, for any number of reasons, is far from boring imo, it's one thing that makes this forum lively and interesting.

In the final analysis though SC is paid to make those decisions and he knows more about the form, physical fitness, mental state, performance in training etc. of every player than any of us, and as his job depends on results you'd assume he's picking the combination of players he feels most likely to achieve them.

[Nogbad the Bad]

13 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Well, I do apologise Nogbad - I was 12 minutes out! The point remains that in near enough 1.5 games (Boro and Leeds) Bobby made a significant contribution.

I am still waiting for you to furnish me with the actual contributions Freeman has made in 14 appearances so far this season. Bearing in mind he starts on minus points for that clumbsy challenge v Brentford! Whilst I am very grateful for it his goal at Ipswich was very fortuitous.

To accuse Bobby of 'drifting outing of games' when you've seen some of Freeman's non-performances this season is extraordinary.

As for his supposed poor stamina which you have zero evidence of, as djb says, that's what subs are for. If he tires after an hour, bring him off. Not difficult.

Wilbraham has looked shattered after an hour EVERY game he's played this season but still doesn't get subbed.

Bobby won't get a game and I'm afraid it smacks of a manager who has their 'favourites' and is not willing or able to look past certain players, however disappointing their contribution might be.

Finally, I'm genuinely surprised by your comment that Bobby being Bristolian is irrelevant. Particularly after you seemed to be bemoaning the other week that most Bristolians have moved out of Southville and most residents are now from the south east or europe.

I got the impression you were a proud Bristolian and would understand the obvious desire to have local lads breaking through into the first team. It's been said many times about how important it is for there to be a clear 'pathway' for local lads to come through the Academy and make it into the first team.

To have a couple of Academy lads on the bench every week, both of whom have proved to an extent that at the very least they are no worse than some of the players' performances we've seen this season, is very disappointing. It seems you agree we should've seen more of Reid for one, so our only disagreement is that i feel Reid is very, very unlucky not to have had another start following his early season promise.

Kid, you know very well you cited Reid playing 90 minutes at Middlesbro' as proof other posters were 'talking nonsense' that he couldn't contribute for the full 90 minutes. You were wrong to state this so triumphantly, and as such shouldn't be surprised to be pulled up on it. I'm surprised you're labouring the point.

SC had explained that he continued to play Wilbraham due to Agard not being fit. My choice would have been to play Burns in that scenario, for whatever reason SC chose not to.

We'd all like to see Bristolians playing, my point is all players should be picked, or not, on merit, and being Bristolian should be no advantage. Has Bobby done enough to force his way into the team? That's a matter of opinion.

Of course, like all managers, SC will have his 'favourites', tried and trusted performers, who he'll feel are worth persevering with even when underpar. Freeman clearly fits into this category.

You're disappointed we have a couple of Academy lads confined to the bench every week. Presuming the other one you refer to is Bryan, for one reason or another - I think mostly due to the wild challenge on the opening day - he's nowhere the player he was last season and has rightly been taken out of the firing line.

I've no doubt SC will reinstate him as soon as form and fitness allow, not because he's Bristolian, but because he's proved himself over a whole season to be both consistently reliable and a bloody good player.