Fordy62 Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Evening all, I keep reading on here that people would drop Ayling to allow Baker, Moore & Flint play together. He's almost progressing to some sort of forum scapegoat, granted not a scapegoat to Marlon Pack's magnitude, but a scapegoat nonetheless. People seem to forget the countless times you'll see "off the line from Ayling" this season on matchday threads. I also think that he provides a very good link between defence and midfield, or even defence and attack, such is his comfort on the ball. We need someone like him, they can't all be row Z types a la Flint & Baker. I'm an Ayling fan. And I think we're better off with him! (although his facial hair could do with some work). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Moore's loan finishes soon. If it's not renewed that 3 (Baker, Flint, Moore) probably won't end up starting a game together anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 My only criticism of him (and I`m a huge fan of his BTW) is that he does tend to get caught upfield after his runs forward and gives them a free run at that side. Personally I`d like to see him tried in midfield with a proper RB/RWB in the side but I guess if we did that, what would we do with Eliott Bennett? Agree about the facial hair though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 2 minutes ago, CITYAREREDANDWHITE said: Started together at Birmingham From now until January I meant. I think Moore can play that role of taking the ball out of defence and sadly we will probably only just begin to see what he can do after his injury as his loan comes to an end - assuming we can't renew. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bar BS3 Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 I don't think many if any are turning him into a scapegoat, but thank god (or Aden Flint) that his nievely foolish challenge didn't cost us as much as it could have done. I'm a fan a Luke Ayling, after initial doubts, and he's decent enough but certainly needs to learn from yesterday's mistake. Mind you, had Pack not let their midfielder just stroll up the pitch unchallenged...! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shtanley Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Personally I wouldn't play baker for a bit barring injuries/suspensions Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 34 minutes ago, Red Right Hand said: My only criticism of him (and I`m a huge fan of his BTW) is that he does tend to get caught upfield after his runs forward and gives them a free run at that side. Personally I`d like to see him tried in midfield with a proper RB/RWB in the side but I guess if we did that, what would we do with Eliott Bennett? Agree about the facial hair though. 12 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said: I don't think many if any are turning him into a scapegoat, but thank god (or Aden Flint) that his nievely foolish challenge didn't cost us as much as it could have done. I'm a fan a Luke Ayling, after initial doubts, and he's decent enough but certainly needs to learn from yesterday's mistake. Mind you, had Pack not let their midfielder just stroll up the pitch unchallenged...! Spot on the system should be if a defender ventures into an attacking position either Smith or Pack should drop into his position and if they fail to do so that is their mistake. and for the record I thought the Huddersfield penalty was rather soft as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archie andrews Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 gotta bring back baker for the experience factor alone.... but id hate to see a winning side changed and this game is one where we should take the game to derby..no good sitting deep allowing them to come at us all the time.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 So any player who fans suggest are not good enough are scapegoats? I guess we better all say Ayling is top quality defender then who has not put a foot wrong all season... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordy62 Posted December 13, 2015 Author Share Posted December 13, 2015 2 minutes ago, Jonbristol said: So any player who fans suggest are not good enough are scapegoats? I guess we better all say Ayling is top quality defender then who has not put a foot wrong all season... Are you bringing across beef from the Taraabt thread? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Although Ayling has made the odd mistake, I think he's one of the players who's adapted well to life in The Championship. For someone who can't defend, has no pace, gets caught on the ball etc (not my view I hasten to add), I think he's been one of our better players. He is a key part of the way we play out from the back to allow Bennett to get width in an advanced position early in the play. Losing that, loses dome of the effectiveness of Bennett. I'm really torn on whether you bring Baker back in for Moore or not...but not in the camp that says bring him back for Luke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 3 minutes ago, Londoner said: For me he makes too many mistakes. I like him but not convinced at this level. From what i've seen he makes no more than anybody else in the team and especially compared to Pack and or Freeman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 I like Ayling, his attitude, commitment and desire are spot on and he really plays for the shirt. Obviously you'd expect this of every pro footballer but try telling Newcastle fans that their players demonstrated all this earlier this season. Mr Ayling is a refreshing player and he'd always be in my team... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cidered abroad Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 Technically Ayling is a good footballer but he is not disciplined enough to play as the right side of a back three. Or strong enough in the air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robin_unreliant Posted December 13, 2015 Share Posted December 13, 2015 I would prefer him in a defensive midfield role. That way if he bursts upfield ( which I love to see as no-one else seems to try it) and loses it we have cover behind him. Many have suggested in the past that we try Moore as RCB and Ayling in place of Pack. However SC has never tried it yet so I doubt we will ever find out if it would work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roe Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 When he plays as a centre back he's great. When he waddles forward as if he's Ronaldo, he costs the team big time. But you gotta love Luke Ayling. His attitude is brilliant and he seems a great character who always tries his best and is one of the most passionate and likeable players we've had in a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron-Bcfc Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Defensively some people would prefer to see Moore slot into his position to give us more height and a less adventurous but more solid back 3. To say he's being scapegoated for those suggestions is ridiculous. Personally I'm not bothered either way and see the benefits of both players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buckeyed Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 11 hours ago, Aaron-Bcfc said: Defensively some people would prefer to see Moore slot into his position to give us more height Is Liam Moore much taller than Ayling? I wouldn't have thought so.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Same height 6ft 1in according to the ever so reliable Wikipedia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Super Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 jury is still out for me at this level (well same as pretty much all our players) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Numero Uno Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 Not scapegoating Ayling at all but he cost us a penalty and almost three points right at the end on Saturday. Luckily Frank stepped up to the plate with a great match winning save (albeit the kid should have buried it but that's not Frank's issue, he did what he had to do). If he's had a bad game or two then people are entitled to put that opinion across. No different for any player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 5 minutes ago, Numero Uno said: Not scapegoating Ayling at all but he cost us a penalty and almost three points right at the end on Saturday. Luckily Frank stepped up to the plate with a great match winning save (albeit the kid should have buried it but that's not Frank's issue, he did what he had to do). If he's had a bad game or two then people are entitled to put that opinion across. No different for any player. I think Luke's weak points are outweighed by the positives he brings to the team. It is easy to say whoever is the last line of defence, be it the defender or the goalie, "cost" a goal, but the ball was usually given away up the pitch by someone else and the attack usually bypasses a number of other players. Not saying this was the case with this penalty here, but always worth people bearing that in mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aaron-Bcfc Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 3 hours ago, Buckeyed said: Is Liam Moore much taller than Ayling? I wouldn't have thought so.. Fair enough, same height if wiki is to be trusted. Always had Ayling down as being about 5'10, playing alongside Flinty probably makes him seem smaller! Moore is a big lad physically though, I'd fancy him to handle big strikers, like Ishmael Miller from Saturday, better in the air. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old_eastender Posted December 14, 2015 Share Posted December 14, 2015 22 hours ago, Bar BS3 said: I don't think many if any are turning him into a scapegoat, but thank god (or Aden Flint) that his nievely foolish challenge didn't cost us as much as it could have done. I'm a fan a Luke Ayling, after initial doubts, and he's decent enough but certainly needs to learn from yesterday's mistake. Mind you, had Pack not let their midfielder just stroll up the pitch unchallenged...! Spot on, aside from getting caught out losing possession high up the pitch from time to time. Ayling's other weakness is a lack of pace with someone running at him. The pen Saturday was perfect illustration of that, but indeed only happened 'cos their man strolled past Pack as though he was not there and Pack too has not got the pace to track back once someone has gone passed him. What Ayling does do better than any of our other CBs is bringing the ball out and providing that linkage, (as long as he does not overdo it and get caught out), his positional cover is also generally good hence why he has cleared a few off the line. For me he would look at lot better with a stronger CM in front of him :-) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexukhc Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 Did well without Luke tonight..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red-Robbo Posted December 15, 2015 Share Posted December 15, 2015 My thoughts too. He's saved our blushes in games this season. You have to wonder how he would have fared tonight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexukhc Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 6 minutes ago, Red-Robbo said: My thoughts too. He's saved our blushes in games this season. You have to wonder how he would have fared tonight. His experience at this level is invaluable to the team, needs to be playing every game he can, great player for this club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
YorkshireSection Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 I'd play him instead of Pack, not that I'm a Pack brasher I just believe Ayling to be the more talented player, both defensively and moving the ball forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shelts Posted December 16, 2015 Share Posted December 16, 2015 Ayling unfortunately is one of our best ball players but defensively he is poor and naive and playing in the wrong position Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fordy62 Posted December 20, 2015 Author Share Posted December 20, 2015 Just watched he highlights from yesterday and he was pretty much at the heart of everything going forwards. We look a better team with him in it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samo II Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 13 minutes ago, Fordy62 said: Just watched he highlights from yesterday and he was pretty much at the heart of everything going forwards. We look a better team with him in it. He links well with Bennett, and often is further forward than the likes of Pack and Freeman, both for good and for ill. I think he certainly takes risks in terms of his positioning, and doesn't possess the pace to cover for this issue; at least twice yesterday Baker bailed him out by being more aware of play, and striding over to catch the player Ayling should have been on. BUT when we play with the intensity and momentum we showed towards the end of both halves (and played with in abundance last year), in the system we play, he can cause countless problems for the oppositon; QPR simply we're not prepared for him driving into the midfield at times yesterday, and he helps maintain pressure well in those scenarios. As other have said; Jury is out on the long term future, but he certainly applies himself and brings decent ability to the side, despite his flaws. Would never play him as a wing back, but as a right back behind Bennett in a 442 it would be interesting to see how he faired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shtanley Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 Him and Bennett have a very gold understanding especially with when to play the throug ball etc. Ayling had a similar thing with Little maybe Ayling's just very good. Shame the same link up play isn't happening on both flanks though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 I said yesterday that for the first time really we didn`t look in too much trouble when he bombed forward and eventually lost the ball as there was always someone seemingy covering the potential runner. It looked to me like we`d identified it as a problem and taken steps to deal with it but why it took 22 games to realise what was happening I`m not entirely sure! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnclosureSurge Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 On 12/13/2015 at 18:26, Fordy62 said: Evening all, I keep reading on here that people would drop Ayling to allow Baker, Moore & Flint play together. He's almost progressing to some sort of forum scapegoat, granted not a scapegoat to Marlon Pack's magnitude, but a scapegoat nonetheless. People seem to forget the countless times you'll see "off the line from Ayling" this season on matchday threads. I also think that he provides a very good link between defence and midfield, or even defence and attack, such is his comfort on the ball. We need someone like him, they can't all be row Z types a la Flint & Baker. I'm an Ayling fan. And I think we're better off with him! (although his facial hair could do with some work). I'm an Ayling fan, too. But, most probably, us Ayling fans are fans of his ability with the ball. We don't need that this year. We need someone, of proven ability at this level, to just keep the bloody thing out of the goal/box. And that isn't Ayling. Look how their tiny no 23 out-muscled him in the build-up to the chance where he hit the bar at 1-0. I'm afraid his talents lie with a part of the game we have had to jettison in favour simply of big/fast blokes to boot the ball away. Yes, we have sunk as low as that, but that might just keep us up. Just. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shelts Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 Quite simple for me playing in the wrong position. Good on the ball , good passing can beat a player. Has a few mistakes in him when playing in a three, not a natural defender and average in the air. Could he play as a wing back....I think so. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted December 20, 2015 Share Posted December 20, 2015 Of course Ayling can have the odd bad game at the back (like all of defenders have this season) but I don't think he's as inept defensively as people make out. The focus of his attacking skills can cloud the view of his defensive abilities. Part of it is the system, there will always be holes in behind the wingback. I think he is decent in the air. Think it was the Wolves game where I don't think him, Baker or Flint lost a header all night. But although I've said the system is part of it, it is also the springboard to getting forward too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.