Fordy62 Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 We're struggling, yes. I understand that. But I think it'd be an unwise move to sack Cotts. We were brilliant last year. That was Cotts' doing. The personnel has remained largely the same and they're capable of being that good again. There have been a few really bad results and those cant be ignored. But people seem to be forgetting us matching Brighton, dominating Cardiff and Forest. Honestly we have had some terrible luck Cotts and his team had a poor show over the summer. He's not the sort of man who'll let that happen twice. We owe him the transfer window to see what he can do. People talk about players not wanting to come, but do we genuinely believe that league position is the most important thing? It isn't. Money is. We saw that Cotts was after the right calibre of player over the summer and he will be again. Yes, there'll be those of you that'll use hindsight and say we should have never offered for Gray, but if you don't ask you don't get. I for one am sticking by the manager. I know I'll get stick for it. But I'm not yet giving up on the man who gave us so much joy last season. Here's to a happier new year. I believe in Cotts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
archie andrews Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 7 minutes ago, Fordy62 said: We're struggling, yes. I understand that. But I think it'd be an unwise move to sack Cotts. We were brilliant last year. That was Cotts' doing. The personnel has remained largely the same and they're capable of being that good again. There have been a few really bad results and those cant be ignored. But people seem to be forgetting us matching Brighton, dominating Cardiff and Forest. Honestly we have had some terrible luck Cotts and his team had a poor show over the summer. He's not the sort of man who'll let that happen twice. We owe him the transfer window to see what he can do. People talk about players not wanting to come, but do we genuinely believe that league position is the most important thing? It isn't. Money is. We saw that Cotts was after the right calibre of player over the summer and he will be again. Yes, there'll be those of you that'll use hindsight and say we should have never offered for Gray, but if you don't ask you don't get. I for one am sticking by the manager. I know I'll get stick for it. But I'm not yet giving up on the man who gave us so much joy last season. Here's to a happier new year. I believe in Cotts. good post that........although I think sc gonna throw his toys out the pram and jack Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 I'm a big fan of his but am no longer sure. I didn't expect anything today but 2 points from 12 isn't good enough and no one is unlucky every week.. To me at present the biggest reason to stick with him is any new bloke will hardly know the players by the time the January transfer window closes, that is hardly a ringing endorsement, is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonL Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 There is no time for sentiment in football. Just think what Watford and Southampton did to the mangers that got them to the premier league. Time to do the same at City. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 Why did he insist on playing the same eleven , bar Bryan , 48hrs after the Charlton match ? surely even a fringe player with energy is better than a first teamer running on empty ! I am leaning towards the Cotts out camp . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chairman Mao Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 2 wins at home 4 wins in 24 21 points out of 72 Goal Difference of -21 1 win in 9 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nellie Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 He will save the club a few quid by not buying anyone just like the summer ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spoons Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 16 minutes ago, Fordy62 said: We're struggling, yes. I understand that. But I think it'd be an unwise move to sack Cotts. We were brilliant last year. That was Cotts' doing. The personnel has remained largely the same and they're capable of being that good again. There have been a few really bad results and those cant be ignored. But people seem to be forgetting us matching Brighton, dominating Cardiff and Forest. Honestly we have had some terrible luck Cotts and his team had a poor show over the summer. He's not the sort of man who'll let that happen twice. We owe him the transfer window to see what he can do. People talk about players not wanting to come, but do we genuinely believe that league position is the most important thing? It isn't. Money is. We saw that Cotts was after the right calibre of player over the summer and he will be again. Yes, there'll be those of you that'll use hindsight and say we should have never offered for Gray, but if you don't ask you don't get. I for one am sticking by the manager. I know I'll get stick for it. But I'm not yet giving up on the man who gave us so much joy last season. Here's to a happier new year. I believe in Cotts. matching Brighton??? We lost. I went, we were good for 55 minutes and then retreated and conceded 2. Same old story all season. SC to stubborn and loyal, also inept at making substitutes. Unfortunately last season is a long way away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samo II Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 I'm in the stick-not-twist camp, but I think it is the height of naïveté to think that the current squad will hit the same levels as last year in this division. We lost (or never owned in the first place in some cases) significant figures, both in terms of leadership and on-pitch performance in the shape of JET, Elliot, Tavenier and Matt Smith, and only brought in one or two players to replace them, and not in the same roles in some cases (such as the crucial one of Elliot). If SC can extract us from this, it will be in the same fashion he did when he first arrived; i.e. Being supported I'm bringing in players who will shake up the side, and hopefully win us more points to keep us up - the likes of Freeman, Pack etc may end up excellent players at this level, but they will unlikely do this in the final four months, so we need players who might (and it is all a gamble now) help on that front, not faith. We're doing worse than under McInnis just now, and my worry is SC seems unwilling to contemplate or act to correct what is becoming a slow slide into League One - the squad is not big or good enough; we need to move to change that now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChippenhamRed Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 The main reason to stick with him now has little to do with his performance this season and a lot to do with timing. To replace him now would not give a new man any time to assess the squad and make the necessary signings. If it was going to happen, it needed to happen a month ago. As I've just said on another thread, my biggest concern is how we expect a man who failed to make signings during a whole summer, when he has the following wind of a title-winning season, to do it during a single month with the team now in the relegation spots. There is no ideal answer now, but for me it's the lesser of two evils to stick with him. Just. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redfieldred Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 Cannot for the life of me understand why he took so long with subs today! When he finally did it was way too late, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 24 minutes ago, Fordy62 said: We're struggling, yes. I understand that. But I think it'd be an unwise move to sack Cotts. We were brilliant last year. That was Cotts' doing. The personnel has remained largely the same and they're capable of being that good again. There have been a few really bad results and those cant be ignored. But people seem to be forgetting us matching Brighton, dominating Cardiff and Forest. Honestly we have had some terrible luck Cotts and his team had a poor show over the summer. He's not the sort of man who'll let that happen twice. We owe him the transfer window to see what he can do. People talk about players not wanting to come, but do we genuinely believe that league position is the most important thing? It isn't. Money is. We saw that Cotts was after the right calibre of player over the summer and he will be again. Yes, there'll be those of you that'll use hindsight and say we should have never offered for Gray, but if you don't ask you don't get. I for one am sticking by the manager. I know I'll get stick for it. But I'm not yet giving up on the man who gave us so much joy last season. Here's to a happier new year. I believe in Cotts. I like you and think you post some very sensible things but I can't agree with you here. Firstly the fact that the players CAN be better than they're showing is part of the issue. Whatever the faults in the squad, I don't believe we're as bad as we were today or at Rotherham. And yes, we dominated against forest and Cardiff but we thrashed palace and Cardiff the season we went down. We can't cling to our few decent performances when they're becoming more and more a distant memory and the reality is we're now on course for fewer wins, less points, less goals and a worse goal difference than the season we finished bottom of the league. A few weeks ago, I too believed we'd turn things around but the reality is we are on a downward slide and what we saw today was a manager refusing to try anything at all to change that, even when it was clear plan A wasn't working... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeepUpLino Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 9 minutes ago, redfieldred said: Cannot for the life of me understand why he took so long with subs today! When he finally did it was way too late, Really? he never makes ******* subs, 1 trick pony!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 39 minutes ago, Fordy62 said: We're struggling, yes. I understand that. But I think it'd be an unwise move to sack Cotts. We were brilliant last year. That was Cotts' doing. The personnel has remained largely the same and they're capable of being that good again. There have been a few really bad results and those cant be ignored. But people seem to be forgetting us matching Brighton, dominating Cardiff and Forest. Honestly we have had some terrible luck Cotts and his team had a poor show over the summer. He's not the sort of man who'll let that happen twice. We owe him the transfer window to see what he can do. People talk about players not wanting to come, but do we genuinely believe that league position is the most important thing? It isn't. Money is. We saw that Cotts was after the right calibre of player over the summer and he will be again. Yes, there'll be those of you that'll use hindsight and say we should have never offered for Gray, but if you don't ask you don't get. I for one am sticking by the manager. I know I'll get stick for it. But I'm not yet giving up on the man who gave us so much joy last season. Here's to a happier new year. I believe in Cotts. He lifted us out of the depths before, he can again; we have to bring in some new blood though. A barren transfer window will make it extremely difficult to turn things around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 33 minutes ago, SimonL said: There is no time for sentiment in football. Just think what Watford and Southampton did to the mangers that got them to the premier league. Time to do the same at City. and Leicester... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cider red Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 Cotts looks a broken man, clutching at straws after today. He's too stubborn and that will be his un-doing. I wouldn't trust him to buy players or change to a system that makes us harder to play against. All good things come to an end, I wanted him to succeed again this year, but cant see any reasons to continue backing him im afraid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Galley Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 Give him a chance the players are still with him and he has Championship experience, he got Forest out of a worst position than we are in now and he kept Burnley in the top ten. He knows what we need and with the backing in the January transfer window he will turn it around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steve39 Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 He will get us out of league 1. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC Jordan Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 Always amazes me how quick football fans turn, and how the bigger picture is never appreciated. This time it's even worse when considering what he led us to last year. You have my full backing SC, that's for sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
City fan 1982 Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 happy clapping on the cheap into league 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ashtonphil Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 31 minutes ago, BCFC Jordan said: Always amazes me how quick football fans turn, and how the bigger picture is never appreciated. This time it's even worse when considering what he led us to last year. You have my full backing SC, that's for sure. Ok time to be controversial - maybe, just maybe, we did exactly what we were accused of last season. We bought the League 1 title with a big budget and the best players Someone said on another thread that their mum could have managed City last season, whilst that might be stretching it a bit, I don't think it was that difficult. Confidence breeds confidence and winning is easy to replicate. The training ground was always buzzing ( I know this but can't say why so please don't ask!!) but it is not happening this year for whatever reason. Perhaps Cotterill is out of his depth and doesn't have the necessary skills to get City out of the predicament we are in.. We can't buy the Championship, clearly, so have to use nounce and skill... which might be lacking. Just a thought... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
City fan 1982 Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 is this cotts john ward moment ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sargent Pepper Posted December 28, 2015 Share Posted December 28, 2015 To answer the threads title: The players seem to be still putting in the effort. He has given us the best season since GJ's first two full seasons. We still try to play football. Sometimes its better the devil you know. Clutching at straws? Possibly. Sadly the reasons for reliving him of his duties are mounting. I agree with him when he talks about not quite having enough in these games against the top teams. I must admit i half expected this today as i did Derby. The problems are when we drop points against those around us. Lets face it, Bolton, Rotherham, Charlton were all there for the taking and albeit at different stages of the game we let the opposition back in to the game and in the end we got dicked by Rotherham and should have lost at Bolton and threw away leads vs Charlton and MK Dons. We have had spells of good play in the majority of games, but rarely looked a goal threat bar Cardiff and Charlton and we failed to beat either (for all our dominance, Cardiff missed a late sitter too). Of course SC can't take the chances for them but we need to improve the players composure and finishing. I've never been a fan of his post match interviews and i don't wish to get into the reasons we couldn't attract players in over the summer because people point the finger of blame to suite their agenda. The fact is we don't know. But, his constant criticism of refs and opponents doesn't come across well and even the media are taking the piss out of some of his quotes lately, and as someone else said, if we couldn't attract players in the summer it's going to be much harder now. I admire him for not brining in players for the sake of it, but those he has have well most have been poor. At one point we had Robinson, Moore, Cox and Hamer not getting any minutes. I expect all those to return to the clubs (which is a shame in Moores case) and i can't see Bennett really wanting to stay either. Which means not only do we need to improve the number and quality of the squad as it stands today, but to also replace these! The Ryan Fredericks situation was remarkable too. But he wasn't the only player that left within weeks of signing permanently. Once again, we can only speculate to the reasons but the bottom line is it happened on Steves watch. His failings with subs are well documented and straight off the top of my head i can think of two games where it directly cost us and there would probably be more if you analyse it. At Derby he was criticised for almost resting players for a more winnable game. So today when we were 2-0 down and despite what he said about being the better team (which again, is cringeworthy to hear) we were never going to get back into it, he failed to rest anyone let alone the strikers who both had poor games and by his own admission struggle in a week of 3 games let alone 2 games in 3 days with another on the horizon, not to mention the fact we are without Agard. There are no guarantees a new man could turn it around and i'll admit there are a few worrying scenarios going through my mind of people like Warnock coming in but if we could attract and invest in a manager that has the respect of players then i'm starting to think we should do it. These players may be loyal to SC (but that will only last so long) but as Cotts himself has alluded to, these lads need to stand up and be counted and need a wake up call at times. I believe the majority of the young players in this squad can go on and do well in this league with experience around them and people who can come in and take them out of firing line when necessary. Most of all, i don't want him to stay to long and tarnish that amazing season we had. The same thing happened with Tinnion. Cotts proved me wrong after doubting his appointment and i thank him for some terrific memories last year. But we can't let this memories stand in the way of further progression. Regrettably i haven't seen us progress in the last few months and can't picture that changing in the remaining months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 11 hours ago, John Galley said: Give him a chance the players are still with him and he has Championship experience, he got Forest out of a worst position than we are in now and he kept Burnley in the top ten. He knows what we need and with the backing in the January transfer window he will turn it around. John Galley superstar how many goals have you scored so far Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 12 hours ago, John Galley said: Give him a chance the players are still with him and he has Championship experience, he got Forest out of a worst position than we are in now and he kept Burnley in the top ten. He knows what we need and with the backing in the January transfer window he will turn it around. He took Forest from 23rd to 19th and he never finished in the top ten while managing Burnley...13th and 17th in his two full seasons in charge, and Burnley set a club record of 18 games without a win in his last season. The next guy took those Burnley players straight into the premier league in his first season in charge...Owen Coyle... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityloyal473 Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 8 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said: He took Forest from 23rd to 19th and he never finished in the top ten while managing Burnley...13th and 17th in his two full seasons in charge, and Burnley set a club record of 18 games without a win in his last season. The next guy took those Burnley players straight into the premier league in his first season in charge...Owen Coyle... Despite what people on here will have you believe, he never has been and never will be a successful Championship manager. He has a proven track record of being distinctly below average when managing in the championship, but some people cant see the wood for the trees. Keeping hold of him now will cause long term damage to the club IMO. Thanks for last season and the memories, but time to go SC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Orns Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 Have to say, I'm leaning more and more towards the 'out' camp As others have said, the only reason I'm my head for not doing it is because the new man won't have time before the window to have a good look at what we have and what we need - although I'm sure that wouldn't take anyone with half a brain that long Didnt expect anything yesterday, like Derby, but another 4-0 hammering....not good at all How many clubs have nailed the January window that you can remember? We need to be added to that short list to stand a chance I'm worried Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChippenhamRed Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 34 minutes ago, Woodsy said: Have to say, I'm leaning more and more towards the 'out' camp As others have said, the only reason I'm my head for not doing it is because the new man won't have time before the window to have a good look at what we have and what we need - although I'm sure that wouldn't take anyone with half a brain that long Didnt expect anything yesterday, like Derby, but another 4-0 hammering....not good at all How many clubs have nailed the January window that you can remember? We need to be added to that short list to stand a chance I'm worried Pretty much my feelings exactly Woodsy. The nature of our recent defeats is as much of a concern as the defeats themselves. If we'd had this run of form - with two heavy defeats so close together and one win in 9 - a month ago, I would almost certainly be in favour of making a change. But so close to the window, it's a bigger risk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChippenhamRed Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 2 hours ago, cityloyal473 said: Despite what people on here will have you believe, he never has been and never will be a successful Championship manager. He has a proven track record of being distinctly below average when managing in the championship, but some people cant see the wood for the trees. Keeping hold of him now will cause long term damage to the club IMO. Thanks for last season and the memories, but time to go SC. "Never will be". You don't know that. Really hate the all-knowing tone of some of the posts on here recently. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 36 minutes ago, Woodsy said: Have to say, I'm leaning more and more towards the 'out' camp As others have said, the only reason I'm my head for not doing it is because the new man won't have time before the window to have a good look at what we have and what we need - although I'm sure that wouldn't take anyone with half a brain that long Didnt expect anything yesterday, like Derby, but another 4-0 hammering....not good at all How many clubs have nailed the January window that you can remember? We need to be added to that short list to stand a chance I'm worried What is this seasons aim with more than half the season gone? For me it is now only about staying up. Don't get me wrong, I'd love us to show a bit more and finish well-safe, but I see it being a fight all the way. So, as @GrahamC stated in another thread, we need to finish above 3 other clubs. That might not need a drastic overhaul in the window as we might think. A striker, and a midfielder of proven ability, maybe coupled with a couple of League One gambles in said Pistons might be sufficient. Plus a goalkeeper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChippenhamRed Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 4 minutes ago, Davefevs said: What is this seasons aim with more than half the season gone? For me it is now only about staying up. Don't get me wrong, I'd love us to show a bit more and finish well-safe, but I see it being a fight all the way. So, as @GrahamC stated in another thread, we need to finish above 3 other clubs. That might not need a drastic overhaul in the window as we might think. A striker, and a midfielder of proven ability, maybe coupled with a couple of League One gambles in said Pistons might be sufficient. Plus a goalkeeper. The fact that, despite our poor form, we are still very much in touching distance of safety, is probably the most encouraging thing I can think of at the moment. One win in 9 and yet we're far from cut adrift. As you say, finishing above three teams might not need the drastic improvement some claim - but it does require some improvement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cityloyal473 Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 56 minutes ago, ChippenhamRed said: "Never will be". You don't know that. Really hate the all-knowing tone of some of the posts on here recently. Going on previous form and the current season I'd suggest that my assumption is pretty close to the truth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Orns Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 3 hours ago, ChippenhamRed said: Pretty much my feelings exactly Woodsy. The nature of our recent defeats is as much of a concern as the defeats themselves. If we'd had this run of form - with two heavy defeats so close together and one win in 9 - a month ago, I would almost certainly be in favour of making a change. But so close to the window, it's a bigger risk. Had the chat with mates yesterday, can think of anyone out of work (and realistic) who I could think of to replace SC. Massive risk 3 hours ago, Davefevs said: What is this seasons aim with more than half the season gone? For me it is now only about staying up. Don't get me wrong, I'd love us to show a bit more and finish well-safe, but I see it being a fight all the way. So, as @GrahamC stated in another thread, we need to finish above 3 other clubs. That might not need a drastic overhaul in the window as we might think. A striker, and a midfielder of proven ability, maybe coupled with a couple of League One gambles in said Pistons might be sufficient. Plus a goalkeeper. Absolutely Dave. 21st will do for me this season, which just reminds me how badly we ****** up in the summer. All pretty sad really Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 8 minutes ago, Woodsy said: Had the chat with mates yesterday, can think of anyone out of work (and realistic) who I could think of to replace SC. Massive risk Absolutely Dave. 21st will do for me this season, which just reminds me how badly we ****** up in the summer. All pretty sad really Yes, on reflection, we probably didn't have to go mad, a few gambles from League One, coupled with the Bakers, Bennetts and Kodjias, would have probably given us a better platform and depth. The good thing is that there are still 22 games to go....and we are only in bottom 3 on goal difference, pending today's games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GodEmperor Palpatine Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 4 wins in all 25 games Hideous GD 1 win in 9 7 goals scored in 12 Beaten only 1 side in the bottom 9 The even more worrying thing is fans before calling for calm and judge him on the next 10-12 games pre Fulham (there was a thread here). That was our chance to take some good points of clubs around us, build some momentum etc but we have took less than a point a game in that time. So what now? judge him on the next 10-12 games?? For me, his time has ran out and simply needs to go. This has the hallmarks of Del Boys final few months. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 7 hours ago, City169 said: He also saved Pompey from liquidation, avoiding relegation in the process. Sorry, didn't realise he was solely responsible for saving Pompey from liquidation whilst winning 18 of 61 games in charge in just 12 (football playing) months in charge... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted December 29, 2015 Share Posted December 29, 2015 3 minutes ago, City169 said: obviously he wasnt soley responsible, but as manager he did have a part to play. Also keeping them up that year was a fair achievement given their position was not too dissimilar to Blackpool at the start of last season and we all know how easily they went down Blackpool's squad was far, far weaker than that Portsmouth side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted December 30, 2015 Share Posted December 30, 2015 9 hours ago, City169 said: obviously he wasnt soley responsible, but as manager he did have a part to play. Also keeping them up that year was a fair achievement given their position was not too dissimilar to Blackpool at the start of last season and we all know how easily they went down Fair play, he obviously played a role. He also had some decent (yet ridiculously overpaid) players. I just think his overall record in the championship over a long period of time is showing he is a lower mid table/bottom of the table manager. Some clubs would settle for that. Not sure we want to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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