Player's reaction

[MC RISK77]

8 hours ago, Cardy said:

Marlon Pack ultimately cost Cotts his job missing that penalty against Charlton.

What a ridiculously bizarre statement

[djb6162]

7 hours ago, Harry said:

Take the piss as much as you like folks. I'm thick skinned. 

Truth is, a lot of people don't like him. Lots of comments in other threads about SL finding him a difficult personality and hard to work with. He's not the only one. 

Hes arrogant, rude, stubborn and obnoxious. He's selfish. A control freak. Difficult to work with. People in high positions in the club are scared of him and afraid to challenge him. In his 2 years here he's given zero thought to the future. He's refused youngsters going on loan as he wants control. He's refused to play players others have brought in because it wasn't his call. He's fallen out with players and banished them from the squad, even though we can't fill a bench. He's refused on a few occasions to fill our bench by giving an academy lad a taste of the first team squad on matchday. Has had no idea the damage this has done to parents perception of the player pathway and thus put youth recruitment back a couple of years. Ask Mr Burns Snr how interested he's been in the u21's or academy. The icing on the cake was his post-match comments at West Brom. When forced into bringing an 18 year old keeper on he claimed "we give the youth a chance at this club", yet he seemingly ignored the fact he refused to fill the bench with a youngster! It'd be funny if it wasn't so cringingly bad an impression of our club to give. 

I'll cut it there. Hope that's the kind of comments some of you were looking for. 

Note that when he was in charge I've never posted anything to this degree as it would've been wrong. Yes I've been critical, but only of the on-field stuff, there is stuff that I rightly feel shouldn't be said whilst he's here. So hopefully some people don't label this as poisonous (as I've seen one poster quote recently). 

And before others criticise Harry, he hasnt even begun to tell you what he really should say.

[MC RISK77]

3 minutes ago, djb6162 said:

And before others criticise Harry, he hasnt even begun to tell you what he really should say.

Agreed

[Bristol Rob]

7 hours ago, MarcusX said:

Nothing worse than a ITK "I know something you dont know" poster. if you arent going to elaborate why say anything at all?

I'd say genocide was worse.

[djb6162]

6 hours ago, NickJ said:

Have to say mate very disappointing to see such an unnecessary character assassination. Number of points.

1. If SL found him difficult to work with whose fault is that, the manager with this clubs best ever win ratio, or the owner who has continued the cycle of mediocrity with the occasional successful blip.

2. If people in high positions were scared of him, ******* good, they are responsible for the mess this club constantly finds itself in.

3. His condition of coming here was total control, this was accepted, so if he refused to play players brought in over his head that is the fault of the people that did this not his - they brought in mediocrity not Messi for Christ sake.

4. Refused to fill the bench a few times - really mate, which games?

5. As for Mr Burns Snr - guess what, when I played, if the manager left me out I thought the manager was a *****.

6. As for arrogant, rude, stubborn and a control freak - attributes of quite a few decent managers I would say.

Finally Harry, you don't know Cotterill, you are just repeating (we have to take your word for that) what others have told you. Nobody is liked by everybody. Personally I don't make judgments about a mans character unless I have met him.

I think you will find that culpability for this dogs dinner of a club, and our current league position, does not lie at Cotterill's door.

Still, no doubt our beloved leaders will find us a "nice" manager to lead us to relegation instead of a nasty one, I'm sure that will make us all feel better.

"trully i tell you, this very night before the rooster crows you will deny me thrice"

 

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, djb6162 said:

"trully i tell you, this very night before the rooster crows you will deny me thrice"

 

I like your posts and would completely acknowledge that you are very reliably informed and take that as a given. I reluctantly say this as I don't want to seem I'm digging you out or questioning your credibility, because I'm not, but it's hard to take you totally impartially because even I would agree your lad was very poorly managed by him. 

The thing is as I said above I can quite understand why SC was taking the stance he was. It's a huge leap of faith for him to get promoted and then have faith in the younger prospects. I think in Wes' case he was wrong, but being sacked so soon after delivering great success shows just how fragile the job is. In that case him taking the board on and trying to press them into backing a man who had one perm signing post promotion I actually accept and to some extent commend. I can see why some think it wrong though. 

[RedM]

1 hour ago, Robbie_Turner said:

We didn't lose against Charlton !?

Sorry, obviously you are right. It's just one of those games we felt like we lost. A bit like the 'win' my heart tells me we had against Leeds. 

[Numero Uno]

17 minutes ago, 29AR said:

I like your posts and would completely acknowledge that you are very reliably informed and take that as a given. I reluctantly say this as I don't want to seem I'm digging you out or questioning your credibility, because I'm not, but it's hard to take you totally impartially because even I would agree your lad was very poorly managed by him. 

The thing is as I said above I can quite understand why SC was taking the stance he was. It's a huge leap of faith for him to get promoted and then have faith in the younger prospects. I think in Wes' case he was wrong, but being sacked so soon after delivering great success shows just how fragile the job is. In that case him taking the board on and trying to press them into backing a man who had one perm signing post promotion I actually accept and to some extent commend. I can see why some think it wrong though. 

Should parents of contracted players be coming on here spouting their opinions? Not sure they should tbh. The club will know full well who they are and what they are saying, trust me on that, and you do wonder whether a parent is benefitting his boys career by doing that? 

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

Should parents of contracted players be coming on here spouting their opinions? Not sure they should tbh. The club will know full well who they are and what they are saying, trust me on that, and you do wonder whether a parent is benefitting his boys career by doing that? 

To be fair I think his comments were rather mild and actually I think he and/or Wes has reason to feel aggrieved. But for me that could cloud opinions is all I'm saying so whilst I don't defend SC on that count the opinion is one end of the spectrum and is taken by me as such - although not as an untruth by any means. 

But I do genuinely hope whoever comes in gives Wes the chance to play his way in to the squad for France and I wish SC had too. 

[Harry]

7 hours ago, Nogbad the Bad said:

The opinions of the players are the most important and it's clear from their demeanour they respected Cotterill and enjoyed playing for him.

The petty grievances of half a dozen easily replaceable, perhaps even lowly, club employees who nobody would miss if they left the club tomorrow are irrelevant.

 

Lowly club employees? You'd be surprised who I'm talking about Noggers. Lowly they are not. 

As for the players, perhaps this bunch are professional enough to give their all regardless of their manager? Unlike that spineless lot we had last time in this league. 

[The dastardly red]

10 hours ago, Harry said:

Don't know about the players, but I know a fair few club employees who are overjoyed. 

No you don't, yet more hot air and bluster pours from between your chops

[Club and Country]

Believe there is a interview out today where wilbreham describes cotts as the best manager he's ever played for 

awkward 

[Harry]

7 hours ago, NickJ said:

Have to say mate very disappointing to see such an unnecessary character assassination. Number of points.

1. If SL found him difficult to work with whose fault is that, the manager with this clubs best ever win ratio, or the owner who has continued the cycle of mediocrity with the occasional successful blip.

2. If people in high positions were scared of him, ******* good, they are responsible for the mess this club constantly finds itself in.

3. His condition of coming here was total control, this was accepted, so if he refused to play players brought in over his head that is the fault of the people that did this not his - they brought in mediocrity not Messi for Christ sake.

4. Refused to fill the bench a few times - really mate, which games?

5. As for Mr Burns Snr - guess what, when I played, if the manager left me out I thought the manager was a *****.

6. As for arrogant, rude, stubborn and a control freak - attributes of quite a few decent managers I would say.

Finally Harry, you don't know Cotterill, you are just repeating (we have to take your word for that) what others have told you. Nobody is liked by everybody. Personally I don't make judgments about a mans character unless I have met him.

I think you will find that culpability for this dogs dinner of a club, and our current league position, does not lie at Cotterill's door.

Still, no doubt our beloved leaders will find us a "nice" manager to lead us to relegation instead of a nasty one, I'm sure that will make us all feel better.

Hi Nick. 

Havent got much time as about to start work, but wanted to quickly say re your opening remarks. 

Yes, this is a sad character assassination to put in writing, but as I said, I've never said this publically whilst he was in charge as I felt that was wrong and unfair.  Wasn't gonna go into detail on here either, but some were asking for it, now they don't like what they read, claiming it's all untrue. 'Fraid to say, it's all true. 

[BobBobSuperBob]

16 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

Should parents of contracted players be coming on here spouting their opinions? Not sure they should tbh. The club will know full well who they are and what they are saying, trust me on that, and you do wonder whether a parent is benefitting his boys career by doing that? 

Dreadful post IMO

How rude -  completely disagree with you

First of all whether he comes on here is djb's right and choice

DJB certainly doesn't 'spout' any opinions 

Always thought how sensible his posts are and how sensible he is to stay away from certain subjects and threads when he must be bursting to comment or put fact to fiction

 

[Robin1988]

29 minutes ago, Harry said:

'Fraid to say, it's all true. 

It's not. There's a ton of excuses in your initial post. Not that you're not passing on what people have said, just that they're talking out their arses and I could (but won't) hazard a guess at who you've been speaking to.

[Cider red]

2 minutes ago, Harry said:

Hi Nick. 

Havent got much time as about to start work, but wanted to quickly say re your opening remarks. 

Yes, this is a sad character assassination to put in writing, but as I said, I've never said this publically whilst he was in charge as I felt that was wrong and unfair.  Wasn't gonna go into detail on here either, but some were asking for it, now they don't like what they read, claiming it's all untrue. 'Fraid to say, it's all true. 

I heard similar over the summer, apparently his relationship with SL became poor over this period. At that point things should have been sorted or he should have gone Imo. I'd imagine that has a lot to do with our awful transfer dealings this season. Typical city to have such a poor season after setting up to do well.

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, Harry said:

'Fraid to say, it's all true. 

Doesn't mean all unjustifiable though. 

[The dastardly red]

3 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Dreadful post IMO

How rude -  completely disagree with you

First of all whether he comes on here is djb's right and choice

DJB certainly doesn't 'spout' any opinions 

Always thought how sensible his posts are and how sensible he is to stay away from certain subjects and threads when he must be bursting to comment or put fact to fiction

 

Who is djb?

[myol'man]

10 hours ago, Harry said:

Sorry. Can't say any more as its their jobs, not fair to reveal names. But I know 6 persons employed by the club in some capacity and I know their opinions. 

It's only the players/coaches and manager who really count. All the rest are just pen pushers/bib carriers/suits and coat fillers and can be replaced easily.

 

Sad day for the club when last seasons hero can be dis'd so soon.

[BobBobSuperBob]

8 minutes ago, The dastardly red said:

Who is djb?

Decent polite poster who appears to understand his football

 

Also,related to one of our players

[Red Exile]

Fascinating thread. And the more fascinating for reading what both Nick J and Harry have to say. What emerges is a picture - however partial - of SC as a very committed and single minded individual…possibly not someone who doubts how right his approach is. We'd all recognise that in his public interviews. Probably not the easiest of people to manage…I've managed lots of people and many of the most talented and creative, who won us all the awards, were precisely that sort of character. You need them.

What also emerges is a picture of a club led by people unable to harness what SC brought. Unable to manage him to deliver their "strategy" - whatever that might be. As a result we have too few players and this season has been a disaster.

I'm with Nick in concluding that the fundamental problem lies at Board level. SC will manage other clubs very successfully and I wish him well. You'd need to know what you were taking on with him for things to end well. I'd have to conclude that, yet again, our Board has exposed its weakness…despite their protestations they have no clear and consistent strategy to deliver long term success. They're a group of yes men of limited experience dominated by SL's wealth, owing their positions to him for good or ill. Personally I've never thought that fit for purpose…events have proved time and again that, despite their best efforts, they are out of their depth.

[djb6162]

55 minutes ago, 29AR said:

I like your posts and would completely acknowledge that you are very reliably informed and take that as a given. I reluctantly say this as I don't want to seem I'm digging you out or questioning your credibility, because I'm not, but it's hard to take you totally impartially because even I would agree your lad was very poorly managed by him. 

The thing is as I said above I can quite understand why SC was taking the stance he was. It's a huge leap of faith for him to get promoted and then have faith in the younger prospects. I think in Wes' case he was wrong, but being sacked so soon after delivering great success shows just how fragile the job is. In that case him taking the board on and trying to press them into backing a man who had one perm signing post promotion I actually accept and to some extent commend. I can see why some think it wrong though. 

thanks for the comments above, can i clear up one thing

the rather philosophical post i made above, contained no reference to Wes ?

nor did it intend to !!

 so apologies if i mislead you.

My rather biblical reference was a pointer towards people who support somebody whole heatedly and publicly, right up to the moment they are no longer important or indeed no longer a threat or they feel threatened themselves.

we should not be surprised now that people are telling what they know and we should not pillar them for it

its a debating forum

does that make more sense.? i hope so

Nothing to do with players or indeed Wes

As others have said, on that matter i have to continually bite my tongue for obvious and sensible reason.

my thoughts on SC will remain with me and with Wes as far as this forum is concerned.

 

[Cider red]

3 minutes ago, djb6162 said:

thanks for the comments above, can i clear up one thing

the rather philosophical post i made above, contained no reference to Wes ?

nor did it intend to !!

 so apologies if i mislead you.

My rather biblical reference was a pointer towards people who support somebody whole heatedly and publicly, right up to the moment they are no longer important or indeed no longer a threat or they feel threatened themselves.

we should not be surprised now that people are telling what they know and we should not pillar them for it

its a debating forum

does that make more sense.? i hope so

Nothing to do with players or indeed Wes

As others have said, on that matter i have to continually bite my tongue for obvious and sensible reason.

my thoughts on SC will remain with me and with Wes as far as this forum is concerned.

 

Makes total sense and credit to you. Hopefully Wes will get a fair crack now, he showed against Albion what a menace he can be. I'd like to see a 4 3 3 with kodjia agard and Wes Saturday. At least there's a slim chance of that happening sometime this season now!!

[ashton_fan]

28 minutes ago, Harry said:

Hi Nick. 

Havent got much time as about to start work, but wanted to quickly say re your opening remarks. 

Yes, this is a sad character assassination to put in writing, but as I said, I've never said this publically whilst he was in charge as I felt that was wrong and unfair.  Wasn't gonna go into detail on here either, but some were asking for it, now they don't like what they read, claiming it's all untrue. 'Fraid to say, it's all true. 

There aren't many 'nice guy' successful managers (Eddie Howe being an exception). It's the same in business, if you've worked with people who are driven and successful they're not always your favourite person because they can seem arrogant and uncaring. However being a football manager you have to make sure everyone's doing their jobs properly or you'll probably lose yours.

All I can say to those staff who are glad to see the back of him, careful what you wish for ... Nigel Pearson could be with you soon!

[Guest]

6 minutes ago, djb6162 said:

thanks for the comments above, can i clear up one thing

the rather philosophical post i made above, contained no reference to Wes ?

nor did it intend to !!

 so apologies if i mislead you.

My rather biblical reference was a pointer towards people who support somebody whole heatedly and publicly, right up to the moment they are no longer important or indeed no longer a threat or they feel threatened themselves.

we should not be surprised now that people are telling what they know and we should not pillar them for it

its a debating forum

does that make more sense.? i hope so

Nothing to do with players or indeed Wes

As others have said, on that matter i have to continually bite my tongue for obvious and sensible reason.

my thoughts on SC will remain with me and with Wes as far as this forum is concerned.

 

Quite right and I take absolutely no inference other than I presume (very possibly wrongly!!) conversations over dinner etc may not have been complimentary at what even I would perceive as poor management of one individual. Yours and Tetburys are the 'opinions' I pay most heed to, and acknowledge you've absolutely held your tongue and not brought any question on yourself or on Wes and didn't mean to suggest otherwise. 

But seeing your explanation of the reference I see I had the wrong end of the stick anyway! 

If the change has brought one thing I'm hopeful it's that you may get to see your boy get a fantastic opportunity this summer. 

[myol'man]

And remember Harry, no matter who the manager is you are never going to be a scout for Bristol City so just give up now. 

 

OK so you didn't like the manager because he laughed at your 'recommendations' , and you may have found a few on the inside who agreed with you , but no need to come on here and start a character assassination of one of the finest managers this club has ever had.

 

Sid

[Frenchay Red]

It is of course no surprise that his detractors are now coming out with their "inside information". However, even if true, the club should have been well aware of his behaviour traits when they appointed him. I suspect that a lot of the more recent demeanor is as result of him not getting the backing he wanted to add to squad and his subsequent frustration at not being able to improve results with the players he has. Those above him were more than happy to revel in last season's success.

Football management is not a popularity contest. It's a strange world run by a lot of very strong characters who most of us would find difficult to deal with. 

I have not met SC but a friend has and said he was very pleasant and approachable.

Many years ago another friend's son played under Holloway at Rovers. His take on Holloway's style was that he often " lost it" . Shouting and screaming at the players and behaving in a way which to an outsider would seem unacceptable.

A lot of football managers, I suspect, within their club behave in a similar way.

After all if you were managed that way as a player it is bound to lay the foundations. And one final thought, I don't imagine for one moment that all the players are obedient and timid shrinking violets.

[GrahamC]

32 minutes ago, Red Exile said:

Fascinating thread. And the more fascinating for reading what both Nick J and Harry have to say. What emerges is a picture - however partial - of SC as a very committed and single minded individual…possibly not someone who doubts how right his approach is. We'd all recognise that in his public interviews. Probably not the easiest of people to manage…I've managed lots of people and many of the most talented and creative, who won us all the awards, were precisely that sort of character. You need them.

What also emerges is a picture of a club led by people unable to harness what SC brought. Unable to manage him to deliver their "strategy" - whatever that might be. As a result we have too few players and this season has been a disaster.

I'm with Nick in concluding that the fundamental problem lies at Board level. SC will manage other clubs very successfully and I wish him well. You'd need to know what you were taking on with him for things to end well. I'd have to conclude that, yet again, our Board has exposed its weakness…despite their protestations they have no clear and consistent strategy to deliver long term success. They're a group of yes men of limited experience dominated by SL's wealth, owing their positions to him for good or ill. Personally I've never thought that fit for purpose…events have proved time and again that, despite their best efforts, they are out of their depth.

Spot on.

If we do manage to persuade Nigel Pearson here then how do people think he'll behave?

Like Mother Theresa? 

The board (all of them) are utter amateurs, with a terrible history of appointments and no coherent strategy at all. Look at their inability to even employ someone to write a press release. Still all jobs for incompetent, don't rock the boat, mates, eh?

Perhaps we should appoint Tisdale, who currently manages a club in the bottom half of League Two but does seem awfully nice...

[Bristol Rob]

15 minutes ago, myol'man said:

And remember Harry, no matter who the manager is you are never going to be a scout for Bristol City so just give up now. 

 

OK so you didn't like the manager because he laughed at your 'recommendations' , and you may have found a few on the inside who agreed with you , but no need to come on here and start a character assassination of one of the finest managers this club has ever had.

 

Sid

Aside from the fact Harry does scout for the club and has a good relationship with the decision makes he deals with of course.

[Robin1988]

13 minutes ago, Frenchay Red said:

It is of course no surprise that his detractors are now coming out with their "inside information". However, even if true, the club should have been well aware of his behaviour traits when they appointed him. I suspect that a lot of the more recent demeanor is as result of him not getting the backing he wanted to add to squad and his subsequent frustration at not being able to improve results with the players he has. Those above him were more than happy to revel in last season's success.

What Harry says is true, is that there were people inside the business who didn't want to work with him. To relay their opinions as fact about him, and all the negative things they had to say, is not fair. The players backed him but internal politics speak louder. Is that the way to run a football club?

He's been undermined by many quarters this season, by those speaking to Harry but more pressingly by the board. Had targets been moved on when they were brought to the board, we wouldn't be in this mess. Gayle and Gray were only two of them, and they weren't first on the list. Otherwise we wouldn't have been after them in late August.