View from the Dolman Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 4 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said: You can't group the two. It's naive to think it would be down to a factor like a coach coming in. You could say then, seeing as he's forward coach, that he's been successful already. Abraham has scored 5 goals in 10 games since he arrived after being in a bit of a rut in October. Stats work both ways but that one doesn't fit the bizarre agenda against him. But this is the new age where there has to be someone to blame, fuelled by the endless overhyped sensationalist media. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 11 hours ago, Davefevs said: I always loved this advert. It shows the ability of top professionals to transfer and translate their skills. Judging by the results, they both make excellent coaches on this aspect of the game at least. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Head Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 I agree. I don't know anything about football management - I don't play computer games - but I know a bit about managing in another sphere. Some research into effective schools showed that the optimum period for a headteacher was 3-7 years - less and there wasn't time for leadership to take effect, more and change became increasingly difficult. The average time in post for a Championship manager in 2014-15 was 319 days. I'm not saying a football club is like a school but how can the development of young players, making the right signings, getting the tactics and formation right against a variety of opponents, knowing how to motivate each individual etc be perfected in less than a year? I've mentioned it before about how close Fergie was to the sack early on but would the team of Beckham, Scholes, Giggs etc have emerged in today's cut-throat world? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Port Said Red Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 19 minutes ago, View from the Dolman said: But this is the new age where there has to be someone to blame, fuelled by the endless overhyped sensationalist media. Along with how his playing career has anything to do with his coaching ability. Whatever position he played is irrelevant to the coaching skills he possesses. I train people for a living, I have trained Management skill courses ( I have never been a Manager), I have been training people on Payroll software for the last 10 years, despite never having run a Payroll, I get very few complaints about my lack of experience in my feedback, in fact I would go as far as to say that unless I tell them, non of my delegates are aware of this. I have developed my knowledge in the subjects by reading, taking in information from delegates and Payroll experts withing my company, I am sure that Dean Holden will have learned using similar methods as he has gone into coaching. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 14 hours ago, tinman85 said: Check out their forums and twitter. Walsall fans were having a party when he left. Right cause the mighty Sadlers have been playing crap football for years and not producing and selling good solid pros each year to make ends meet. He obviously had nothing to do with all that . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 14 hours ago, Phileas Fogg said: Even by Otib standards I find it absolutely bizarre so many people are SO sure he's not a good coach when there's no proof. Really really strange. Playing Devils Advocate PF Where is the evidence he is ? Is he someone Lee gets on with ? or one of the best up and coming coaches in the country ? (MA was clear about recruitment policy in all areas ) (I don't know the answer but can see zero evidence of good coaching from anyone atm) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phileas Fogg Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 12 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Playing Devils Advocate PF Where is the evidence he is ? Is he someone Lee gets on with ? or one of the best up and coming coaches in the country ? (MA was clear about recruitment policy in all areas ) (I don't know the answer but can see zero evidence of good coaching from anyone atm) I think that illustrates my point that none of us know either way. I think a 'good coach' is subjective too. Players at Man United may work really well with one of Mourinho's coaches but that same coach may not do very well at Newport for example as they can't work with more limited players as effectively. It's probably like a manager, some coaches 'fit' at clubs better than others. I'd never heard of Holden before he came here but for me it's just about trusting the management to get appointments correct. I think Holden is getting a particularly hard time because there was a misconception he was replacing or was his role was more senior than Pemberton who's very popular. The dual assistant manager thing isn't that common in lower league clubs and I don't think people quite grasped what was happening. I think you've got to give coaches, like managers, a good few months before you see the results of their work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted January 9, 2017 Report Share Posted January 9, 2017 3 minutes ago, Phileas Fogg said: I think that illustrates my point that none of us know either way. I think a 'good coach' is subjective too. Players at Man United may work really well with one of Mourinho's coaches but that same coach may not do very well at Newport for example as they can't work with more limited players as effectively. It's probably like a manager, some coaches 'fit' at clubs better than others. I'd never heard of Holden before he came here but for me it's just about trusting the management to get appointments correct. I think Holden is getting a particularly hard time because there was a misconception he was replacing or was his role was more senior than Pemberton who's very popular. The dual assistant manager thing isn't that common in lower league clubs and I don't think people quite grasped what was happening. I think you've got to give coaches, like managers, a good few months before you see the results of their work. All good,and fair points there mate ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gillies Downs Leeds Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 Still favourite for the Chesterfield job. Journalist from that area, on twitter, reckons that we have refused them permission to speak to him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 57 minutes ago, Gillies Downs Leeds said: Still favourite for the Chesterfield job. Journalist from that area, on twitter, reckons that we have refused them permission to speak to him. Yep, Rob Staton from BBC Radio Sheffield wasn't it? It still amazes me that Chesterfield has a Sheffield postcode yet it's in Derbyshire?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slartibartfast Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 1 hour ago, Gillies Downs Leeds said: Still favourite for the Chesterfield job. Journalist from that area, on twitter, reckons that we have refused them permission to speak to him. I don't think that's very fair on him ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lrrr Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 On 08/01/2017 at 21:47, spudski said: I was watching the warm up session yesterday...some of the striking of the ball and hitting it cleanly was appalling. Duric was the most consistent by a country mile. Says enough that in the warm up before the Reading game Kelly looked the most consistent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchay Red Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 21 minutes ago, BS4 on Tour... said: It still amazes me that Chesterfield has a Sheffield postcode yet it's in Derbyshire?! Going of topic a bit, but WSM has BS postcode, but is in Somerset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Londoner Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 On Mon Jan 09 2017 at 11:18, Richard Head said: I agree. I don't know anything about football management - I don't play computer games - but I know a bit about managing in another sphere. Some research into effective schools showed that the optimum period for a headteacher was 3-7 years - less and there wasn't time for leadership to take effect, more and change became increasingly difficult. The average time in post for a Championship manager in 2014-15 was 319 days. I'm not saying a football club is like a school but how can the development of young players, making the right signings, getting the tactics and formation right against a variety of opponents, knowing how to motivate each individual etc be perfected in less than a year? I've mentioned it before about how close Fergie was to the sack early on but would the team of Beckham, Scholes, Giggs etc have emerged in today's cut-throat world? Are you a head teacher? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unan Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 6 minutes ago, Frenchay Red said: Going of topic a bit, but WSM has BS postcode, but is in Somerset. Part of Brean is BS and the other part is TA, don't know who draws the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS4 on Tour... Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 8 minutes ago, Frenchay Red said: Going of topic a bit, but WSM has BS postcode, but is in Somerset. Well historically, a lot of Bristol is also in Somerset.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bcfc2009 Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 8 minutes ago, Frenchay Red said: Going of topic a bit, but WSM has BS postcode, but is in Somerset. Not since 1974 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southvillekiddy Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 On 9 January 2017 at 12:33, BobBobSuperBob said: (I don't know the answer but can see zero evidence of good coaching from anyone atm) Agreed. City don't seem to believe that we can improve players. They stay at the same level they arrived, if they are lucky. Many are de-skilled coming to us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southvillekiddy Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 On 9 January 2017 at 12:48, Phileas Fogg said: I think that illustrates my point that none of us know either way. I think a 'good coach' is subjective too. Players at Man United may work really well with one of Mourinho's coaches but that same coach may not do very well at Newport for example as they can't work with more limited players as effectively. It's probably like a manager, some coaches 'fit' at clubs better than others. I'd never heard of Holden before he came here but for me it's just about trusting the management to get appointments correct. I think Holden is getting a particularly hard time because there was a misconception he was replacing or was his role was more senior than Pemberton who's very popular. The dual assistant manager thing isn't that common in lower league clubs and I don't think people quite grasped what was happening. I think you've got to give coaches, like managers, a good few months before you see the results of their work. It's more difficult - it must take a greater range of skills and imagination to develop a less naturally gifted player. A gifted teacher can do this with less able children For me this has been the weakness with City for decades. We tend to de-skill players Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Head Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 48 minutes ago, Londoner said: Are you a head teacher? Was! Now retired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mike Hunt-Hertz Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 1 hour ago, BS4 on Tour... said: Yep, Rob Staton from BBC Radio Sheffield wasn't it? It still amazes me that Chesterfield has a Sheffield postcode yet it's in Derbyshire?! I lived near Lichfield (in Staffs), and had a Derby postcode! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reddoh Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 34 minutes ago, Richard Head said: Was! Now retired. Richard , love your name if your parents really named you that, then love them even more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tinman85 Posted January 12, 2017 Report Share Posted January 12, 2017 Let him go and see if Keith fancies a return. At least Keith has coached at the top level recently. Our form has been woeful since this appointment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard Head Posted January 13, 2017 Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 18 hours ago, reddoh said: Richard , love your name if your parents really named you that, then love them even more. Not my real name happily. Even my parents weren't that dumb. I think my avatar is a clue! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NOTBLUE Posted January 13, 2017 Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 44 minutes ago, Richard Head said: Not my real name happily. Even my parents weren't that dumb. I think my avatar is a clue! Ha ha ,got it doh! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lanterne Rouge Posted January 13, 2017 Report Share Posted January 13, 2017 22 hours ago, Mike Hunt-Hertz said: I lived near Lichfield (in Staffs), and had a Derby postcode! We`re three miles from Cornwall and have an Exeter postcode as has Bude. Padstow has a Plymouth one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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