Im_over_ere Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 One thing I believe the club could do is just put Pembo in charge for one week. Tell LJ that he can be the observer sat in the stands, and let Pembo select the formation, tactics and team selection. Doing this may help LJ see other methods/options that may be available. It will allow the Board to see if there is a change in attitude that may lead to the ultimate removal of LJ. Based on the game outcome, it could help the ultimate decision process. It may show if the players are really playing for LJ or more prepared to put it all out there for some other coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 1 hour ago, Olé said: I'm wildly over simplifying but instructions that amount to "just go and try and win, I don't care if we get picked off on the break and lose 5-1, just have a go at them, give the crowd something to get behind". Because "have a go" is not a feature of City this season. All this nonsense about fine margins and one goal defeats is meaningless because we don't get forward in numbers or create sustained pressure in the opponents half - of course we only lose by small margins because we put nothing at risk and simply contain. So, if god forbid LJ has more games to coach, knowing it is close to the end, I'd just tell them to attack. You honestly couldn't say we come out of the blocks trying to win a game. You honestly couldn't say what City's brand of football is - unless you defined it by what we don't do. We don't press up the pitch (Forest did a very good job of pressing us high up the pitch yesterday). We don't use width. We don't look to create clear cut scoring opportunities in and around the six yard box (POMO etc) - we design our football to be played around and outside the box. We don't use pace to catch opponents off guard, we are not instinctive, we slow it down and try to fulfil a disciplined shape rather than exploit opposition positioning. So to answer your question (and I have enjoyed yours and other people's contributions in the LJ supporters thread - though clearly don't agree) if LJ somehow manages to be with us for the Sheffield Wednesday game (and good god they are about to sign Jordan Rhodes), I would just tell the players to attack from the start. No problem if you lose by a cricket score. Get the ball forward, put a premium on possession in the opposition half, don't be scared to over commit up the field or make a mistake, just create opportunities to overload opponents, move, run overlaps, take on defenders, do everything to get the ball in the box*. *and if I see another person mention we've created the most chances in the division, I'll have you re-assigned to measuring crowds for Donald Trump, it is the most asinine stat there is, trust what you see with your own eyes, we do not create good clear chances, how often does Tammy get given the ball in the box? I firmly believe that the top priority of our head coach is to stay in games . We lost too many last year by naevely attacking and leaving ourselves wide open at the back . So , keep it tight lads , keep posession . To be fair to a certain extent it's working, sadly at the expense of expansive winning football. We are not being outplayed or thrashed . However the balance is out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cidered abroad Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 I may be totally off the beam but I have a feeling, without any evidence or substance to prove it one way or another, that the arrival of Holden is the key to our spectacular dive to the foot of the table. He is a very inexperienced coach and was with LJ at Oldham. Is he the catalyst for the drastic change in fortunes? A crony too many? Are LJ & Holden outvoting the more senior in experience, John Pemberton? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ivorguy Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 5 minutes ago, cidered abroad said: I may be totally off the beam but I have a feeling, without any evidence or substance to prove it one way or another, that the arrival of Holden is the key to our spectacular dive to the foot of the table. He is a very inexperienced coach and was with LJ at Oldham. Is he the catalyst for the drastic change in fortunes? A crony too many? Are LJ & Holden outvoting the more senior in experience, John Pemberton? I also have wondered this Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strawberry2157. Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 1 hour ago, Port Pete said: I actually think you could put the tea lady in charge if he was sacked and we'd win the next game. Their is a cloud over Johnson now and it'll be very difficult to clear as I see it. New face, new ideas, new voice. Squad should be good enough. Just said exactly the same in a conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reigate Red Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 Get this chap in: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paulcityfan Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 3 hours ago, Ivorguy said: I also have wondered this I'm with you on this. Had a bad feeling about him from the start Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 4 hours ago, 'keepuplino' said: **** this disgrace of a football club.... I truly despair... You're in your element Keepuplino. Enjoy it whilst you can! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Donkeeebles Posted January 22, 2017 Report Share Posted January 22, 2017 4 hours ago, Davefevs said: Clean slate for all players. Frank team meeting, all cards on the table. I went to a 'conference' type event on Wednesday and Alex Danson (Women's hockey gold medalist - the blonde one with the gum shield) was the guest speaker. She was a brilliant speaker and let us into some of the insights into their team and team ethics / code. The players were all in it together. 31 players in the squad for 4 years....only 16 made the plane, yet the day after the squad was selected, all 15 unselected turned up for training 5 minutes early (if you're not 5 minutes early you're late attitude) to do the drills to help the overall squad. They'd been offered the opportunity to not turn-up, but all in it together. There were other examples not dissimilar to the Woodward / Johnson (Martin not Lee) era in Rugby. The players policed themselves. i'm not saying it us all down to dressing room unrest, I've no idea. What I am saying is that they need to find a way to start again with all that pre-season enthusiasm...and a bit of luck. You then pick what you feel is your best eleven, and they keep the shirt if they play well. You might give that initial starting eleven two or three games to prove you right. You don't make big changes at half-time, you might tweak things but you have courage in your selection, and you reflect that belief back to the players. Subbing players at h-t (injuries aside) shows you got it wrong most times. To be fair to LJ he has done this a couple of times and turned the game around. He took off Freeman and Kodjia at Fulham last season (I can remember reading the uproar on Twitter at the time) which took balls and turned that game around and Blackburn away he made 2 changes (can't remember who) and we got back in that game so it has worked on occasion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 Just now, Donkeeebles said: To be fair to LJ he has done this a couple of times and turned the game around. He took off Freeman and Kodjia at Fulham last season (I can remember reading the uproar on Twitter at the time) which took balls and turned that game around and Blackburn away he made 2 changes (can't remember who) and we got back in that game so it has worked on occasion. Yep , I'm in the times up for Lee group but in fairness he did make early subsitutions last season and this (Blackburn at AG springs to mind ) and did impact the game Just seems that this ploy tends to work against him now Panic / bad judgements ? Confused players (Too many changes) ? Players as a collective just not doing it's/ playing for him , whatever he tries ? The whole thing is quite bizarre and I end up back at the same place IMHO A combination of confusion and disgruntlement across large sections of the squad (3 above) (For 'whatever' reason ) Massive problem if right - would explain a lot another bizarre episode at AG - after the bizarre post promotion recruitment and the rapid demise of SC we now get this !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Balls Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 6 hours ago, Collis1 said: Do you think he would still be there if he had lost the dressing room? I don't think so because I'm sure SL would have acted if he had. I'm by no means a happy clapper by the way - I just geuniunly have a feeling he could still turn it around. I was one of the first who wanted SC to go! So here is my suggestion of where LJ has been going wrong. In part it comes from what we have seen but also what he has said. Rather than setting up the team in a consistent fashion I.e. Same players in the same formation, LJ spends too much time trying to nullify the opposition, so he tries to put in particular players "to do a particular job". That's why we don't score in the first half. It's all safety first. Only once have we come out all guns blazing in the first 20 minutes (against Preston) then they broke and showed us how you actually score goals by crossing it quickly from out wide. The safety first approach has got even worse as we have fallen further and his losing run has got longer. Then the confidence has just disappeared from the players, such that with 25 minutes or so to go, the doubts really start creeping in, and then we concede. And then we lose. Again! Yes the best teams are based on a sound defence, not conceding too many goals, but the reality is that to win you need to try to score, as its goals that win matches. I think there is at least a middling championship team that can be produced from this group of players, but it needs someone with fresh eyes, new ideas and a different approach to achieve that now. If not then I can see a very clear repeat of the MacInnes / SOD season of 2012/13 when we started so well against 2 teams who were eventually promoted, but by March we were resigned to going down with not so much as even as a whimper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FNQ Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 5 hours ago, Olé said: I'm wildly over simplifying but instructions that amount to "just go and try and win, I don't care if we get picked off on the break and lose 5-1, just have a go at them, give the crowd something to get behind". Because "have a go" is not a feature of City this season. All this nonsense about fine margins and one goal defeats is meaningless because we don't get forward in numbers or create sustained pressure in the opponents half - of course we only lose by small margins because we put nothing at risk and simply contain. So, if god forbid LJ has more games to coach, knowing it is close to the end, I'd just tell them to attack. You honestly couldn't say we come out of the blocks trying to win a game. You honestly couldn't say what City's brand of football is - unless you defined it by what we don't do. We don't press up the pitch (Forest did a very good job of pressing us high up the pitch yesterday). We don't use width. We don't look to create clear cut scoring opportunities in and around the six yard box (POMO etc) - we design our football to be played around and outside the box. We don't use pace to catch opponents off guard, we are not instinctive, we slow it down and try to fulfil a disciplined shape rather than exploit opposition positioning. So to answer your question (and I have enjoyed yours and other people's contributions in the LJ supporters thread - though clearly don't agree) if LJ somehow manages to be with us for the Sheffield Wednesday game (and good god they are about to sign Jordan Rhodes), I would just tell the players to attack from the start. No problem if you lose by a cricket score. Get the ball forward, put a premium on possession in the opposition half, don't be scared to over commit up the field or make a mistake, just create opportunities to overload opponents, move, run overlaps, take on defenders, do everything to get the ball in the box*. *and if I see another person mention we've created the most chances in the division, I'll have you re-assigned to measuring crowds for Donald Trump, it is the most asinine stat there is, trust what you see with your own eyes, we do not create good clear chances, how often does Tammy get given the ball in the box? I don't think that your post is a wild over-simplification at all... Back in August when asked what he said / did to turn things around at HT when losing at home 1-0 to Villa, LJ said..." Honestly, and this is the God's honest truth I told them I don't care if we get beat 5-0.. But please get the ball on the ground and start passing it.... This is what we're good at........... We need to get the ball in the box to Tammy" Now that we have four what seem to be solid additions to the squad who should add the required experience and character and surely help reduce the late game panic and number of individual errors that were / are the route cause of our horror run, now is the time for LJ to get on the front foot and pick what he considers to be his ideal team and not a team that he feels primarily can be best suited to covering each others potential individual errors.... We know we have good players.... and in Tomlin we have on his day a great player... Let's play them, play football on the deck and take the game to the opposition and when we get in front pretend that we're a premier club in the waiting and continue to push on and not sit back.... I'm disillusioned along within everybody else but just about still in the LJ camp, but starting with the Burnley game he really needs to prepare to live or die by the sword and get back to his ideologies because he's almost out of time... SL / MA will need to see a genuine glimmer of real change in fortunes pretty soon if it's already not too late.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr Balls Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 It's not almost too late. It is too late for LJ. Please SL put him and us out of our misery. And if you can't face sacking him, at the very least please just put both LJ & Dean Holden on extended gardening leave until Spring has sprung and the blossom has fallen from the trees.... by which time it's the end of the season!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Up The City! Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 10 hours ago, Olé said: I'm wildly over simplifying but instructions that amount to "just go and try and win, I don't care if we get picked off on the break and lose 5-1, just have a go at them, give the crowd something to get behind". Because "have a go" is not a feature of City this season. All this nonsense about fine margins and one goal defeats is meaningless because we don't get forward in numbers or create sustained pressure in the opponents half - of course we only lose by small margins because we put nothing at risk and simply contain. So, if god forbid LJ has more games to coach, knowing it is close to the end, I'd just tell them to attack. You honestly couldn't say we come out of the blocks trying to win a game. You honestly couldn't say what City's brand of football is - unless you defined it by what we don't do. We don't press up the pitch (Forest did a very good job of pressing us high up the pitch yesterday). We don't use width. We don't look to create clear cut scoring opportunities in and around the six yard box (POMO etc) - we design our football to be played around and outside the box. We don't use pace to catch opponents off guard, we are not instinctive, we slow it down and try to fulfil a disciplined shape rather than exploit opposition positioning. So to answer your question (and I have enjoyed yours and other people's contributions in the LJ supporters thread - though clearly don't agree) if LJ somehow manages to be with us for the Sheffield Wednesday game (and good god they are about to sign Jordan Rhodes), I would just tell the players to attack from the start. No problem if you lose by a cricket score. Get the ball forward, put a premium on possession in the opposition half, don't be scared to over commit up the field or make a mistake, just create opportunities to overload opponents, move, run overlaps, take on defenders, do everything to get the ball in the box*. *and if I see another person mention we've created the most chances in the division, I'll have you re-assigned to measuring crowds for Donald Trump, it is the most asinine stat there is, trust what you see with your own eyes, we do not create good clear chances, how often does Tammy get given the ball in the box? I wasn't at the Forest game but the commentators did say we started the game on the front foot. Unfortunately we didn't keep those energy levels up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KeepUpLino Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 10 hours ago, Marina's Rolls Royce said: You're in your element Keepuplino. Enjoy it whilst you can! Oh **** off... how am I in my element? The club I love is in disarray once again!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 Something has gone badly wrong, though I am unconvinced he has yet lost the dressing room- generally when a manager loses the dressing room you will get a few hammerings in a run like this- this hasn't happened yet- may look different in a month, let's see. I sort of agree about the staying in games plan though Villa 2nd half was a notable exception, Wigan 2nd half, all those 2nd half displays early in the season- it seems to be a newer development I think, as we have lost games and confidence has slid. Still though are we always getting what we deserve? Preston at home, defeat seemed harsh. Brentford we hit woodwork twice and vs, Cardiff I think they had 3 shots on target and scored 3 goals It's hard to say what (aside from the obvious that we have lost 11 in 12), but results aside it's hard to see what the exact issue is- not saying there isn't one as there clearly is but wasteful finishing? Defensive lapses, inability to retain ball under pressure? Maybe all 3 and more but have we had that many truly woeful performances in this run? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Son of Fred Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 16 hours ago, Portland Bill said: Make the pitch 75 yards wide, rather than the 40 we use at the moment. Agree,quality winger and right back/wingback please.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 15 hours ago, Collis1 said: I think that LJ has some very strong attributes and qualities which are worth persevering with. If he was a rash and all over the place in the media then I would agree he should go now. Also, no evidence he has lost the dressing room. Players still seem to be trying for him. It all comes down to his coaching and tactics, his are simply not working. Unless he changes then results won't. He's being stubborn with his football ideology, the opposition know how we are going to play, and it's easy to counteract. Im surprised he hasn't got our groundsman to bring the touchlines in 20 yards both sides, because we don't use those areas of the pitch! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marina's Rolls Royce Posted January 23, 2017 Report Share Posted January 23, 2017 16 hours ago, 'keepuplino' said: **** this disgrace of a football club.... I truly despair... AND 54 minutes ago, 'keepuplino' said: Oh **** off... how am I in my element? The club I love is in disarray once again!!! Call me old fashioned but I suspect your two posts are at odds with each other. I've said it before to you several times- you only sing when we're losing- your posts are often vicious and personal towards BCFC and/ or it's employees/owner but in particular to Cotts and Johnson- it's not constructive - it's vindictive. Any sign of anything positive- you withdraw to the shadows until next time. And for the record- no, I won't "**** off". I'm just gonna continue to highlight any post you make which is ,imo, vindictive, vicious, inappropriate and above all childish. Sometimes in life, you will it is better to fight for what you're for -not for what you're against. Why not (just for once) post a reasoned opinion on what the club needs to do? what SL is doing wrong? Who should take over from Lee if that is indeed to happen? I'm sure posters would respect that opinion even id they didn't agree with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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