Playing devils advocate........

[Tipps69]

So, all you that want LJ out, metaphorically you are LJ & it's up to you to sort out the results.

You have tried different players in their preferred positions, you have tried a few in different positions & you've even changed formation to try & fit all of your best players into a team. You've even been given the freedom to sign nearly half a team since you've been on this bad run & the players are so good that the supporters are happy with each of the signings.

So what do you do differently to change things for the better?

For the record, I think LJ is the right man for the job (or we shouldn't get rid of him), so metaphorically I don't have the answer.

[MarkRed!]

Resign... no more ideas.

[Poshtottie]

Sometimes its just the presence of a coach and his know how. Look what happened to English Rugby when Eddie Jones stepped in! Same players! Difference is Eddie Jones is worth  points before the game starts!

[funky monkey]

Take a man management course ??

[Portland Bill]

Make the pitch 75 yards wide, rather than the 40 we use at the moment.

[Londoner]

He is beyond the point of return. Needs to be sacked. Wont be.

[BCFC Jimmer]

Just now, Londoner said:

He is beyond the point of return. Needs to be sacked. Wont be.

He will rightfully be given a bit more time to see if he can make things 'click' with the new signings. We should know how SL's brain works by now.

 

[KeepUpLino]

3 minutes ago, Collis1 said:

He will rightfully be given a bit more time to see if he can make things 'click' with the new signings. We should know how SL's brain works by now.

 

Yes SL lets someone ruin his business... He'll be gone tomorrow, if not i can see a very toxic atmosphere building at Ashton gate before next Tuesday

[Londoner]

Just now, 'keepuplino' said:

Yes SL lets someone ruin his business... He'll be gone tomorrow, if not i can see a very toxic atmosphere building at Ashton gate before next Tuesday

Zero chance he will be gone IMO, not before Rotherham.

[Olé]

I'm wildly over simplifying but instructions that amount to "just go and try and win, I don't care if we get picked off on the break and lose 5-1, just have a go at them, give the crowd something to get behind". Because "have a go" is not a feature of City this season. All this nonsense about fine margins and one goal defeats is meaningless because we don't get forward in numbers or create sustained pressure in the opponents half - of course we only lose by small margins because we put nothing at risk and simply contain. So, if god forbid LJ has more games to coach, knowing it is close to the end, I'd just tell them to attack.

You honestly couldn't say we come out of the blocks trying to win a game. You honestly couldn't say what City's brand of football is - unless you defined it by what we don't do. We don't press up the pitch (Forest did a very good job of pressing us high up the pitch yesterday). We don't use width. We don't look to create clear cut scoring opportunities in and around the six yard box (POMO etc) - we design our football to be played around and outside the box. We don't use pace to catch opponents off guard, we are not instinctive, we slow it down and try to fulfil a disciplined shape rather than exploit opposition positioning.

So to answer your question (and I have enjoyed yours and other people's contributions in the LJ supporters thread - though clearly don't agree) if LJ somehow manages to be with us for the Sheffield Wednesday game (and good god they are about to sign Jordan Rhodes), I would just tell the players to attack from the start. No problem if you lose by a cricket score. Get the ball forward, put a premium on possession in the opposition half, don't be scared to over commit up the field or make a mistake, just create opportunities to overload opponents, move, run overlaps, take on defenders, do everything to get the ball in the box*.

*and if I see another person mention we've created the most chances in the division, I'll have you re-assigned to measuring crowds for Donald Trump, it is the most asinine stat there is, trust what you see with your own eyes, we do not create good clear chances, how often does Tammy get given the ball in the box?

 

 

 

[KeepUpLino]

Just now, Londoner said:

Zero chance he will be gone IMO, not before Rotherham.

**** this disgrace of a football club.... I truly despair...

[BCFC Jimmer]

Just now, 'keepuplino' said:

Yes SL lets someone ruin his business... He'll be gone tomorrow, if not i can see a very toxic atmosphere building at Ashton gate before next Tuesday

For some reason I seem to be the only one in the 'give him some more time' camp. And I was at Ipswich when we were completly hopeless. I don't think there is much harm in giving him a few more games for the new players to settle in. 

[Londoner]

Just now, Collis1 said:

For some reason I seem to be the only one in the 'give him some more time' camp. And I was at Ipswich when we were completly hopeless. I don't think there is much harm in giving him a few more games for the new players to settle in. 

Or alternatively with a fa cup fixture coming the perfect chance for a new man to get valuable training time

[Top Robin]

6 minutes ago, 'keepuplino' said:

**** this disgrace of a football club.... I truly despair...

Stick with it keepuplino, BCFC Utopia is just around the corner

[KeepUpLino]

Just now, Top Robin said:

Stick with it keepuplino, BCFC Utopia is just around the corner

With word that Johnson might be staying/ Appleton etc i think Oblivion is around the corner...

[BCFC Jimmer]

3 minutes ago, Londoner said:

Or alternatively with a fa cup fixture coming the perfect chance for a new man to get valuable training time

I think that LJ has some very strong attributes and qualities which are worth persevering with.  If he was a rash and all over the place in the media then I would agree he should go now.

Also, no evidence he has lost the dressing room. Players still seem to be trying for him.

[Engvall's Splinter]

I actually think you could put the tea lady in charge if he was sacked and we'd win the next game. Their is a cloud over Johnson now and it'll be very difficult to clear as I see it. New face, new ideas, new voice. Squad should be good enough. 

[Top Robin]

1 minute ago, Collis1 said:

I think that LJ has some very strong attributes and qualities which are worth persevering with.  If he was a rash and all over the place in the media then I would agree he should go now.

Also, no evidence he has lost the dressing room. Players still seem to be trying for him.

I could cry

[Numero Uno]

He has failed abysmally in trying to sort out the last 16 results so what more can he change? In fact it was his insistence on change, even when we were picking up results at the start of the season, that has put him in the position he is now.

Johnson isn't any closer to knowing his best team or formation than he was in August which suggests to me the job is too much for him. If the last sixteen matches isn't "enough" to judge him on then what is the magic number we have to wait for before we say enough is enough. Are we waiting to get beat by Rotherham before we even think about acting?

[BobBobSuperBob]

1 minute ago, Collis1 said:

I think that LJ has some very strong attributes and qualities which are worth persevering with.  If he was a rash and all over the place in the media then I would agree he should go now.

Also, no evidence he has lost the dressing room. Players still seem to be trying for him.

Can I ask you seriously

What these are In your opinion

and 

Do you genuinely believe the second bit, in particular the last two words ?

 

[Numero Uno]

He has failed abysmally in trying to sort out the last 16 results so what more can he change. In fact it was his insistence on change, even when we were picking up results at the start of the season, that has put him in the position he is now.

Johnson isn't any closer to knowing his best team or formation than he was in August which suggests to me the job is too much for him. If the last sixteen matches isn't "enough" to judge him on then what is the magic number we have to wait for before we say enough is enough. Are we waiting to get beat by Rotherham before we even think about acting?

[Eddie Hitler]

2 minutes ago, Top Robin said:

I could cry

[Davefevs]

Clean slate for all players.  Frank team meeting, all cards on the table.

I went to a 'conference' type event on Wednesday and Alex Danson (Women's hockey gold medalist - the blonde one with the gum shield) was the guest speaker.  She was a brilliant speaker and let us into some of the insights into their team and team ethics / code.

The players were all in it together.  31 players in the squad for 4 years....only 16 made the plane, yet the day after the squad was selected, all 15 unselected turned up for training 5 minutes early (if you're not 5 minutes early you're late attitude) to do the drills to help the overall squad.  They'd been offered the opportunity to not turn-up, but all in it together.  There were other examples not dissimilar to the Woodward / Johnson (Martin not Lee) era in Rugby.  The players policed themselves.

i'm not saying it us all down to dressing room unrest, I've no idea.  What I am saying is that they need to find a way to start again with all that pre-season enthusiasm...and a bit of luck.

You then pick what you feel is your best eleven, and they keep the shirt if they play well.  You might give that initial starting eleven two or three games to prove you right.

You don't make big changes at half-time, you might tweak things but you have courage in your selection, and you reflect that belief back to the players.  Subbing players at h-t (injuries aside) shows you got it wrong most times.

[Numero Uno]

6 minutes ago, Collis1 said:

I think that LJ has some very strong attributes and qualities which are worth persevering with.  If he was a rash and all over the place in the media then I would agree he should go now.

Also, no evidence he has lost the dressing room. Players still seem to be trying for him.

Ole got it spot on. The players may be trying but the style of football is dreadful, no width in our play, only one player in the box when a cross is slung in. Combine poor football with 12 defeats in 13 or whatever it is then the amount of effort given is an irrelevance.

You only have to look at Chelsea today, coming unstuck against a resolute Hull side then they get it out WIDE to Moses with BODIES in the box and bingo, game won. I bet Conte or his players didn't need PowerPoint to work that out!!

[Davefevs]

21 minutes ago, Olé said:

I'm wildly over simplifying but instructions that amount to "just go and try and win, I don't care if we get picked off on the break and lose 5-1, just have a go at them, give the crowd something to get behind". Because "have a go" is not a feature of City this season. All this nonsense about fine margins and one goal defeats is meaningless because we don't get forward in numbers or create sustained pressure in the opponents half - of course we only lose by small margins because we put nothing at risk and simply contain. So, if god forbid LJ has more games to coach, knowing it is close to the end, I'd just tell them to attack.

You honestly couldn't say we come out of the blocks trying to win a game. You honestly couldn't say what City's brand of football is - unless you defined it by what we don't do. We don't press up the pitch (Forest did a very good job of pressing us high up the pitch yesterday). We don't use width. We don't look to create clear cut scoring opportunities in and around the six yard box (POMO etc) - we design our football to be played around and outside the box. We don't use pace to catch opponents off guard, we are not instinctive, we slow it down and try to fulfil a disciplined shape rather than exploit opposition positioning.

So to answer your question (and I have enjoyed yours and other people's contributions in the LJ supporters thread - though clearly don't agree) if LJ somehow manages to be with us for the Sheffield Wednesday game (and good god they are about to sign Jordan Rhodes), I would just tell the players to attack from the start. No problem if you lose by a cricket score. Get the ball forward, put a premium on possession in the opposition half, don't be scared to over commit up the field or make a mistake, just create opportunities to overload opponents, move, run overlaps, take on defenders, do everything to get the ball in the box*.

*and if I see another person mention we've created the most chances in the division, I'll have you re-assigned to measuring crowds for Donald Trump, it is the most asinine stat there is, trust what you see with your own eyes, we do not create good clear chances, how often does Tammy get given the ball in the box?

 

 

 

Funny isn't it, how sometimes attacking the opposition means they get pushed back and have to resort to changing things....rather than us!

[BCFC Jimmer]

6 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

Can I ask you seriously

What these are In your opinion

and 

Do you genuinely believe the second bit, in particular the last two words ?

 

Do you think he would still be there if he had lost the dressing room? I don't think so because I'm sure SL would have acted if he had.

I'm by no means a happy clapper by the way - I just geuniunly have a feeling he could still turn it around. I was one of the first who wanted SC to go!

 

 

[BobBobSuperBob]

5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Clean slate for all players.  Frank team meeting, all cards on the table.

I went to a 'conference' type event on Wednesday and Alex Danson (Women's hockey gold medalist - the blonde one with the gum shield) was the guest speaker.  She was a brilliant speaker and let us into some of the insights into their team and team ethics / code.

The players were all in it together.  31 players in the squad for 4 years....only 16 made the plane, yet the day after the squad was selected, all 15 unselected turned up for training 5 minutes early (if you're not 5 minutes early you're late attitude) to do the drills to help the overall squad.  They'd been offered the opportunity to not turn-up, but all in it together.  There were other examples not dissimilar to the Woodward / Johnson (Martin not Lee) era in Rugby.  The players policed themselves.

i'm not saying it us all down to dressing room unrest, I've no idea.  What I am saying is that they need to find a way to start again with all that pre-season enthusiasm...and a bit of luck.

You then pick what you feel is your best eleven, and they keep the shirt if they play well.  You might give that initial starting eleven two or three games to prove you right.

You don't make big changes at half-time, you might tweak things but you have courage in your selection, and you reflect that belief back to the players.  Subbing players at h-t (injuries aside) shows you got it wrong most times.

Best potential solution I've read /  heard @Davefevs  

(Certainly if we are keeping LJ for now). 

What I was trying to get at some other threads in that we need the players to bond tight for now and play for each other and the club even if there is disharmony with LJ

Im praying that in Wilbs we have the character to,rally the dressing room

I actually think it's our best hope , whether under LJ or somebody new

[BobBobSuperBob]

Just now, Collis1 said:

Do you think he would still be there if he had lost the dressing room? I don't think so because I'm sure SL would have acted if he had.

I'm by no means a happy clapper by the way - I just geuniunly have a feeling he could still turn it around. I was one of the first who wanted SC to go!

 

 

What do you see in him quality wise - genuinely intrigued

As for the dressing room - there is obvious discontent with some at least and IMHO sides don't lose 8 in a row unless their squad is,pitifully poor and they simply aren't up to the level they are at or they aren't in it together

Its not the first

[Davefevs]

It's almost like we need a Divvy (Mark Saunders) moment to be a catalyst.  #ripdivvy (didn't know you so hope I'm not offending you or your friends / family by using your pre-match talk as an example)

For all Cotts faults, he found a way to help galvanise a suffering squad who doubted their ability.

[man in the middle]

start working with and motivating the talented players I have rather than trying to rebuild the squad halfway through the season, it's almost like he's hoping if he keep chucking new players at it with no direction he may get lucky at some point. A good coach can improve players.