sh1t_ref_again Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 Now I ask this as it has already been stated many times our downturn in form seemed to coincide with the arrival of Dean Holden, I am not ITK but picking up on the statement made by MA that LJ had stated some time ago that JP would not be part of the team next year, makes you wonder was their a rift between them or just very different idea's, had JP down tools because Holden had come in and his role had been diminished, was LJ's jibe the other week about pockets of groups relevant to JP? As many other fans I like JP and very sad to seem him go, but we as fans only see a tiny fraction of what goes on at our club and this whole scenario of appointing another coach and then eventually sacking another seems very strange and much more to it. I do not believe he has been made a scapegoat, because without a change in results the pressure will not come off LJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 We have a manager that is incapable of winning football matches, but it quite clear that it's everyone else's fault and not his! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFChayden Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 It's clear the Johnson love relation is keeping him at the club Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tangle Foot Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 I've been told that Pembo is a really nice a guy, but is a lazy s**t. This came from a source close to Steve Cotterill. Make of that what you will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 I heard he was the only coach who commanded any respect from the players…that will breed contempt, if nothing else! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shelts Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 Gotta b Johnsons fault Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChubStixx Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 I don't know the answer to any of the questions, but have any of the players given him a public goodbye (e.g. on twitter)?? Not seen anything said? Perhaps they've been told not to? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
southvillekiddy Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 1 hour ago, sh1t_ref_again said: Now I ask this as it has already been stated many times our downturn in form seemed to coincide with the arrival of Dean Holden, I am not ITK but picking up on the statement made by MA that LJ had stated some time ago that JP would not be part of the team next year, makes you wonder was their a rift between them or just very different idea's, had JP down tools because Holden had come in and his role had been diminished, was LJ's jibe the other week about pockets of groups relevant to JP? As many other fans I like JP and very sad to seem him go, but we as fans only see a tiny fraction of what goes on at our club and this whole scenario of appointing another coach and then eventually sacking another seems very strange and much more to it. I do not believe he has been made a scapegoat, because without a change in results the pressure will not come off LJ If LJ didn't want Pembo the time for him to go was when Johnson arrived. but as usual nothing is ever that simple at BCFC. I thought it was barmy to have 2 assistant managers with Holden arriving. how could that possible work? So Pemberton and Johnson : on one hand you have an experienced, respected man who helped us achieve the double in League 1 and has already saved us from relegation from the Championship on the other you have an inexperienced person who has achieved virtually nothing in Management. It shouldn't be a difficult choice if you have your head on and are not playing games and indulging in favouritism as an owner of a football Club if you are looking for someone to save us from relegation. I believe most fans would have preferred Johnson and not Pemberton to get the boot. All the lies told my Ashton yesterday prove that Pemberton is indeed being used as a scapegoat. There's no pressure on Johnson, he can lead us into oblivion next season and for ever more with the blessing of all the scoundrels who are running our Club. (Can anybody see into SL's mind? He wants "dynamic inexperience" rather than experience. Is this a major step in his eventual departure. If he cannot change then i look forward to that day) We will find out on saturday if the "dynamic duo" can get us a win Away at another struggling Club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon uk Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 Not being argumentative, but does anyone know holdens coaching background? He is being scapegoated for the losing run, he might have a history with burnley, bournemouth etc which would make him perfect for us? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonM88 Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 8 minutes ago, simon uk said: Not being argumentative, but does anyone know holdens coaching background? He is being scapegoated for the losing run, he might have a history with burnley, bournemouth etc which would make him perfect for us? He's coached at Oldham, with Johnson, and at Walsall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
simon uk Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 4 minutes ago, JasonM88 said: He's coached at Oldham, with Johnson, and at Walsall. Just googled him, found an oldhams fans forum... mentions include old fashioned, unintelligent, and my personal favourite, our form has been terrible since he arrived, and hes not a very good coach! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unan Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 3 hours ago, Tangle Foot said: I've been told that Pembo is a really nice a guy, but is a lazy s**t. This came from a source close to Steve Cotterill. Make of that what you will. Didn't do him too badly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dunsteral Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 assistant manager It would appear to me that lee johnson bringing in holden as a coach has resulted in john pemberton, a coach who i believe the majority of city fans had a lot of respect for, losing his job. Why has lee johnson appointed jamie mcallister in his place, and not appointed holden if he holds him in such high regard. This move will hopefully upset holden and result in him leaving as well, because the results we have had since he arrived indicate that he has had no positive influence at all. If lee johnson is still here next season with mcallister as his assistant, what price on aaron wilbraham getting the under 23 job? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strictly Obi Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 Holden is the attacking coach....... We haven't struggled to score. Pemberton was the defensive coach........ Uh you work it out! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 4 hours ago, southvillekiddy said: If LJ didn't want Pembo the time for him to go was when Johnson arrived. but as usual nothing is ever that simple at BCFC. I thought it was barmy to have 2 assistant managers with Holden arriving. how could that possible work? So Pemberton and Johnson : on one hand you have an experienced, respected man who helped us achieve the double in League 1 and has already saved us from relegation from the Championship on the other you have an inexperienced person who has achieved virtually nothing in Management. It shouldn't be a difficult choice if you have your head on and are not playing games and indulging in favouritism as an owner of a football Club if you are looking for someone to save us from relegation. I believe most fans would have preferred Johnson and not Pemberton to get the boot. All the lies told my Ashton yesterday prove that Pemberton is indeed being used as a scapegoat. There's no pressure on Johnson, he can lead us into oblivion next season and for ever more with the blessing of all the scoundrels who are running our Club. (Can anybody see into SL's mind? He wants "dynamic inexperience" rather than experience. Is this a major step in his eventual departure. If he cannot change then i look forward to that day) We will find out on saturday if the "dynamic duo" can get us a win Away at another struggling Club. Pemberton saved us from relegation? I was under the impression LJ was our manager from last February or did I imagine that and he only joined in May? Nice little rewrite of history there. I liked Pemberton but, as with LJ, questions have to be asked as to how well he was doing his job. Pemberton was here for 4 years as a defensive coach, in that time we were defensively terrible under 3 different managers. 3/4 of his time here he either wasn't doing well in his job, or his good work was being undone by 3 separate managers. The one good season of his time here was when our side was so good we didn't really have to worry about the defensive side of things because we could outscore anyone. As for the timing, it isn't that difficult to reach a logical conclusion. The following is speculation, but fits the little we have been told and is a pretty sensible way to go about things. LJ was willing to have a go with Pemberton, but realised earlier during the season (maybe there was a fall out, maybe not) that he would rather bring in his own man (not unreasonable, lots of managers do). For the benefit of the side, he said to the board he would wait until the summer to minimise disruption during the season. I know someone will bring up Holden in response to the last sentence, but bringing in 1 new person is a lot less disruptive than getting rid of one person and rushing to bring in another. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Up The City! Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 5 hours ago, Portland Bill said: We have a manager that is incapable of winning football matches, but it quite clear that it's everyone else's fault and not his! Oh come on, so the other 30+ people who are involved in the first team are entirely blameless and the blame lays firmly at LJ's feet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
havanatopia Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 Steve Cotterill was happy to work with JP when he came in; they did rather well together. All was fairly rosy until Holden came in then it went south in very quick fashion. I would strongly suggest that JP was not part of the problem. How people cannot see that baffles me and if they have bought into the moniker of JP being the defensive coach and DH being the attacking one and saying 'Oh thats the reason then' they may wish to consider MA spin. Project Ashton, Johnson and latterly Holden are, quite simply, not fit to polish most footballers boots. Only when they have all gone can we have our club back. End of story. I think we will win on Saturday not because of any influence from any of them; because the players will turn the tap of talent on exactly when they want to. We will probably just stay up so they protect their livelihoods all the while trying desperately to do enough to get LJ and co sacked because it is plain as the day that they largely dislike them all. Bit of a no brainer all round if you ask me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leadman Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 shame that lee j will still be here next season imho. also in the interviews lee j claims it was a club decision but ashton says it was lee who made it. very odd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
havanatopia Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 1 minute ago, leadman said: shame that lee j will still be here next season imho. also in the interviews lee j claims it was a club decision but ashton says it was lee who made it. very odd Or very predictable? Or perhaps first signs of a lesion between two of the Ineptitudes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesBCFC Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 2 minutes ago, leadman said: shame that lee j will still be here next season imho. also in the interviews lee j claims it was a club decision but ashton says it was lee who made it. very odd Elements of truth there, but not all of it. Lee J said it was the boards decision, Ashton said Johnson had decided it would happen, Johnson then "agreed" with the board about making it a bit earlier. This was said by Ashton about 2 sentences later. So Lee J made the decision, the board decided the timing. Both statements about it being Lees decision or the boards decision are therefore correct if you take in (and believe) all of what was said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 1 hour ago, JamesBCFC said: I know someone will bring up Holden in response to the last sentence, but bringing in 1 new person is a lot less disruptive than getting rid of one person and rushing to bring in another. Really James ? Check our results pre and post arrival of the '1 new person' Less disruptive ? Doesnt look like it !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Up The City! Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 People often blame the current form on DH but thinking about it in a different way what if Pembo was told at that time he would be leaving at the end of the season and being pissed off he simply stopped trying especially with his replacement already employed by thr club? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fuber Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 2 hours ago, john from high littleton said: Holden is the attacking coach....... We haven't struggled to score. Pemberton was the defensive coach........ Uh you work it out! Wasn't Holden a centre back? That's like LJ training the defence. Actually wait... It all makes sense now. Perhaps Pembo didn't fancy training the team defensively in 6 formations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Up The City! Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 21 minutes ago, Fuber said: Wasn't Holden a centre back? That's like LJ training the defence. Actually wait... It all makes sense now. Perhaps Pembo didn't fancy training the team defensively in 6 formations. I think there is some logic to having a defender as a attacking coach. a defender spends their whole career facing attackers, many different types of attackers, so I think it's reasonable to say they know quite a lot about attackers? Also they will be able to coach a striker how a defender will be thinking, will be trying to do in certain situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redapple Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 3 hours ago, Up The City! said: I think there is some logic to having a defender as a attacking coach. a defender spends their whole career facing attackers, many different types of attackers, so I think it's reasonable to say they know quite a lot about attackers? Also they will be able to coach a striker how a defender will be thinking, will be trying to do in certain situations. What a load of tripe ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 7 hours ago, john from high littleton said: Holden is the attacking coach....... We haven't struggled to score. Pemberton was the defensive coach........ Uh you work it out! Bit unfair, Holden only had one player to deal with then! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 4 hours ago, Up The City! said: I think there is some logic to having a defender as a attacking coach. a defender spends their whole career facing attackers, many different types of attackers, so I think it's reasonable to say they know quite a lot about attackers? Also they will be able to coach a striker how a defender will be thinking, will be trying to do in certain situations. Oh of course, that's why all goalkeeping coaches are obviously ex ............... strikers! Ive never known anyone make things up to suit their own views like you, incredible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 5 hours ago, Up The City! said: People often blame the current form on DH but thinking about it in a different way what if Pembo was told at that time he would be leaving at the end of the season and being pissed off he simply stopped trying especially with his replacement already employed by thr club? Or, what about the FACT that since DH and LJ have worked together at City we have become a laughing stock? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 5 hours ago, Up The City! said: People often blame the current form on DH but thinking about it in a different way what if Pembo was told at that time he would be leaving at the end of the season and being pissed off he simply stopped trying especially with his replacement already employed by thr club? I heard that Pembo and LJ fell out around the beginning of the season, then had another barney last week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SedRA Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 5 hours ago, Up The City! said: I think there is some logic to having a defender as a attacking coach. a defender spends their whole career facing attackers, many different types of attackers, so I think it's reasonable to say they know quite a lot about attackers? Also they will be able to coach a striker how a defender will be thinking, will be trying to do in certain situations. Put it this way, would you have a striker training a goalkeeper because they used to have to play against them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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