LJ AGAIN

[FlintSaidNo]

57 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said:

True

The fact that the East End was a building s site  and the capacity at the time with the Old Williams and original Dolman  , is the only reason it is ...... 

Which was why I said ‘could have hoped for’, do you actually believe that we would have regularly had 20000 in League 1?

and I really need to stop responding about this, because it really was not my point!

[1960maaan]

7 hours ago, Esmond Million's Bung said:

I agree in essence with everything that you say, I don't agree that Pack is missing Smith, it's deeper than that the centre midfield is lacking a proper football brain, all 3 are very good players in their own right, but collectively they are not and will never be a cohesive unit. There is little or no communication, organisation and discipline is poor, whoever plays out of 3 choices, opponents only need to contain us for 45 minutes and be patient and eventually we will take chances where both our centre midfielders will get caught out ahead of the ball, with 2 full backs bombing on, 2 wide men and 2 strikers in attacking positions, *1)that is 8 players out of the picture and the inevitable ball over the top can be devastating as proved in many defeats under LJ.

I agree totally about Diedhiou, I have said as much from day one but I have been shouted down on this, he's built like a beast but plays like a pussie, he must be a centre backs dream to play against, *2)he is easy to shift off of the ball, so doesn't hold the ball up nearly enough, he goes down far too easily, poor first touch, takes up odd positions in the opponents box, I have been disappointed by him, cost a lot of money as well.

But I would add that if playing him is like playing 10 men then playing *3)Paterson and him is like playing with 9 men, neither are helpful in a struggling team, I am not sure about DeSilva but i'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt for now.

I would like to mention Hunt and Baker, Hunt is ok going forward but mixed bag defensively, far too often he has no idea where his man actually is and *4) Iwonder sometimes how actually committed Baker is to the cause, he can be far to casual.

I worry about the LJ 'identity' tag, because to me that is exactly what we have in centre midfield, a midfield built in his image as a player, weak, negative and unimaginative and playing as individuals not a fully functioning cohesive unit, a unit who cover for each other and doesn't leave the defence without cover, a unit who controls the full backs and wing backs ensuring that there is always adequate cover once our attacking move breaks down and not *5) 8 individuals chasing back (many running through treacle) because our opponents have patiently waited and sussed out our achilles heel.

*1) Funny enough that was what did for Cott's in the end. We attacked with 8/9 men and while we got away with it on L1 , got found out at this level.

*2) Last weekend there were 2 or 3 moments of real quality, a turn , a dummy or bit of hold up play where you could see why we bought him. Too many times he looks like a bystander , either that or lately he has taken to holding on to the ball and running up a blind alley.

*3) I am completely baffled as to how he gets a start, that said he was better last week which is not difficult given his form over the previous 6 month.  Not sure what goes on in training where Pato gets a start as he's been so good, but Walsh can't even though Pack says he's the most technically gifted player there.

*4) Another strange one. Last year early season, he was the best defender for me. Then from the first game this year , doesn't even seem to want the ball.

I've been banging on about playing a MF 3 for some time, LJ's fascination with wide men is bizarre as often we seem to encourage them to play narrow and get the FB's to push on. 

*5) That could describe any City game from the past 3 years.

[Davefevs]

Some good posts here, and I sometimes wonder if I'm just fickle with my changing views.  On reflection though, player’s contributions change over time.

Diedhiou - I really liked the thought of us signing him, having seen a bit of him at Angers (on tv).  Took a while to settle, then looked good, got injured, came back ok, but overall we were playing losing football.  Fast forward to this season, he looked liked a caged tiger on his return, and also v West Brom...but the games he’s started he’s really disappointed me.  Trend: Backwards

Paterson - useful, but inconsistent player throughout his career.  Good spell end of 16/17, good spell first half of last season, insignificant contributions since.  Trend: Nothing new, but currently on a poor run (will we see another good spell)

I could probably go on with other players....Baker, O’Dowda etc.

It does show that there’s little point in making our mind up about a player after one game.  Probably shows we are gonna be none the wiser after 30, 40, 50 either!!!

Woodrow would be having his good spell at this point in the season had he stayed  

[Ivorguy]

Surely a case of up, up and shortly away. 

Very sad for City

[Ivorguy]

Sorry ignore above wrong thread.  Comment applies to LK

Not sure what happened perhaps just a senior moment

[Alessandro]

On 08/10/2018 at 11:16, The Dolman Pragmatist said:

Interesting take, that all this represents passion.  I don't know - I think I'm as passionate as the next person (I've been following City for over 50 years, so something must have clicked) but where I disconnect is with the 'success at all costs' mentality.  I've been part of this forum since it started, but I don't think I've always felt it was the way it is now -  the meltdowns now seem more kneejerk than they once were, but then we are living in different times.  One thing that is causing significant issues for Generation Z, as they are known, is the inability to deal with failure.  Young people are geared up to compete and to succeed, and anything short of success is unacceptable and often something that can be a real problem.  This is part of the issue with the growing incidence of mental health reporting amongst young people - this is an area I know something about professionally - and in my sector we are trying to get young people to understand what they perceive as failure, and to appreciate is an essential and often positive side of life.  There is no doubt in my mind that over years this forum has become more geared towards success being the only goal, and issues abotu the sort of football we are watching and the pleasure we get from following City seem to have taken second place.  Everything seems to be about progress towards something that is hard to define, in an industry that is unrelentingly cruel to anyone  who is not seen to be succeeding, and patience no longer seems to be a virtue.

Sometimes I'm amazed that I've lasted as long as I have too, but City is part of my life which won't go away and of course when things are going well, the moaners tend to be quieter and the experience improves as a result.  The majority of people around me yesterday were pretty positive up until the 60th minute, and then shell-shocked into silence beyond that.  I didn't want a stand up row with blokes behind me at the match yesterday, so at least this forum gives me the opportunity to state my position, which I value.  I find the older I get the more I think (eventually) "You win some, you lose some" and the less I feel suicidal when things don't go our way (even though, like everyone else, it take a good few hours to get over the disappointment of a bad performance). 

Good post but I’d also back up what I think @Olé said that to say it is a ‘generation z’, young person problem, IMO might well be off the mark.

I think actually there is a whole group of older fans, who after decades of watching a mediocre team, have had a tantalising glimpse of the potential to reach the promised land and have become equally impatient. The experience of past disappointments isn’t always making them philosophical, but stoking years of pent up squashed pride and emotion, boiling over at the chance to actually be proud of the club you’ve supported for half a century.

Some of the strongest critics on here are clearly of the ‘older’ generation. One post that I read that stuck in my mind was someone writing that they’d never forgive LJ or SL for ruining the best chance we’d had in their lifetime of reaching the premier league and that it was unlucky to happen again - ‘I’m running out of time to see City in the premier league’....impatience that ironically younger fans don’t actually always have, because they’ve got time on their hands, even if they ideally want it yesterday.