REDOXO Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 Goals was one( as I stated) of Flints attributes among others that Webster does not possess, there are others which Webster does possess that Flint isn't as good as, that is clear and what I said...And it is fair that the OP draws a comparison. However other comments on this thread include....Webster is a better player (I've already said as others its not a fair comparison....although Boro have conceded just 18 goals) Flint Jumped Ship, Flint not on the same page, Lower half Championship defender etc etc...The bloke lived and breathed this club and none of that is fair and why I said all these comparisons . 34 minutes ago, AppyDAZE said: Better at defending. Fair for people to say so. Loved Flinty, got goals, but the OP is talking about defending. 46 minutes ago, REDOXO said: Exactly! All this better than Flint blah blah blah. They have different attributes and one of Flints is goals...a lot of goals....This is a CB that got 16 in a season (if I am not mistaken) including a hat trick... Webster is a class act, that is obvious, but all these comparisons are a bit pony really! However, Like for Like, he is reminiscent of Gary Collier without a doubt! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Up The City! Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 43 minutes ago, steviestevieneville said: I'm amazed no other clubs were in for him . I was never a fan of flint defensively . The main reason we are much better at the back imo Always said this. Because he scored goals his defensive abilities were over looked imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 1 hour ago, Silvio Dante said: One of my best mates is an Ipswich fan and attends Portman Road regularly. He's fairly depressed at the moment and that isn't helped by me continually telling him how good Webster is. The thing that narks him is that at Ipswich, Webster was seen as a bit of a sick note -- I told him about Stoke and basically fighting to get on the pitch. He's come to the conclusion that Mad Mick basically left him out and may have used the injuries as an excuse (if they even existed). On a side note, he's not confident about league one next season and Lambert is going spare. As for AW - a phenomenal upgrade on Flint. I won't repeat my thoughts on the latter save for that I called a lot of his limitations - and Webster has none of those. The only thing I'd take AF over AW on is ability in the opposing box - as for everything else, different bloody gravy. Me too, but he was still a very decent CB for us, and his partnership with Baker pre-Xmas last season was very solid. In an ideal world he needs a quick CB alongside him who can allow he to get tight, especially against the ones who like it into feet and spin their runs. Most CBs at this level will have weakness areas, and Flint was a talisman for us over 3 seasons back in the Champ. Webster is looking mighty fine though.... 58 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: We were very very lucky to have Flint Webster is class The anti Flint comments on here are simply embarrassing ....but not ready to dump on Flint like the next poster. 49 minutes ago, JBFC II said: Flint lived off of his cult hero status which came off of his goal scoring exploits. As a defender he was lower half championship standard, as is now being shown at Boro. Webster is defensively miles ahead of him That’s a shocking comment....where are Boro in the league. How many goals have they conceded this season? We are a strange bunch of fans. Reminds me of a youngish lad on twitter, who every week is hassling the players for their shirts every game, and then slagging them off on Facebook. We need to treat players like Flint with a bit of credit and courtesy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stortz Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 Apparently sick as dog before the game too- from the Guardian: https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/jan/05/bristol-city-huddersfield-fa-cup-match-report Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 1 minute ago, Stortz said: Apparently sick as dog before the game too- from the Guardian: https://www.theguardian.com/football/2019/jan/05/bristol-city-huddersfield-fa-cup-match-report Fair play Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
steviestevieneville Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 42 minutes ago, REDOXO said: Exactly! All this better than Flint blah blah blah. They have different attributes and one of Flints is goals...a lot of goals....This is a CB that got 16 in a season (if I am not mistaken) including a hat trick... Webster is a class act, that is obvious, but all these comparisons are a bit pony really! However, Like for Like, he is reminiscent of Gary Collier without a doubt! The definition of a defender is to keep the ball out as you well know . Webster is by far a better defender than flint . I was always one who had a pop at flint , especially against tricky strikers. Webby makes the game look so easy whereas flint made it look like a chore .im amazed no one was looking at him before , if they weren’t then they know about him now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 19 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: You are way off the mark with Flint and make some laughable comments IMHO For one so tall and dominant in the air , he wasn’t bad on the floor , improved dramatically , and clearly worked hard on his game Hes a very good Championship Centre Half and And you will understand his value if you ever manage He was a warrior , a natural leader by inspiration , priceless You know that I think Flint was/is overrated. I saw him as a typical 1970s “head it and kick it” CB. Good in the air but weak against tricky strikers. No doubt he improved massively under LJ who basically told him to ‘keep it simple’ and he stopped hoofing it and started playing simple passes to a more skilled team mate. Imv Webster is a far better footballing CB who can and does bring the ball out. What we miss of course is the goals Flint bagged but we don’t miss his defensive capabilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 44 minutes ago, REDOXO said: Exactly! All this better than Flint blah blah blah. They have different attributes and one of Flints is goals...a lot of goals....This is a CB that got 16 in a season (if I am not mistaken) including a hat trick... Webster is a class act, that is obvious, but all these comparisons are a bit pony really! However, Like for Like, he is reminiscent of Gary Collier without a doubt! We needed all of Flint's goals because of all the ones we conceded at the other end! When did we last look this strong and secure defensively? Hunt, Kalas, Webster and Kelly look to be first choice and are probably as good as any defensive unit in the championship, but we still have Pissano, Wright, Baker and De Silva in reserve, and they are not too dusty a back 4 on their own! On the EFL show last week the pundits were discussing Leeds and commented that they had a few games when they weren't playing well, but from which they had secured result and that the mark of a good team is when they can win when not playing well. Perhaps we have had a few draws but we have been getting results when not necessarily at our best. That being the case then as long as the defensive side of our game stays strong, then an improvement in the attacking play might just see us surprise a few over the second half of the season - not least our own fans! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDOXO Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 6 minutes ago, steviestevieneville said: The definition of a defender is to keep the ball out as you well know . Webster is by far a better defender than flint . I was always one who had a pop at flint , especially against tricky strikers. Webby makes the game look so easy whereas flint made it look like a chore .im amazed no one was looking at him before , if they weren’t then they know about him now Spot on, Middlesborough have conceded 18 goals, so I Flint must be better by your assessment? Webster is classy on the ball and a brilliant player, no doubt! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frenchay Red Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 9 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Fair play The way he played this evening, I hope he keeps to his present weight! Pure class tonight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shelts Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 A fantastic signing and our best player so far this season. Can’t say I was massively impressed with his start but I can now see an awesome player who can play at the top level Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 10 minutes ago, steviestevieneville said: The definition of a defender is to keep the ball out as you well know . Webster is by far a better defender than flint . I was always one who had a pop at flint , especially against tricky strikers. Webby makes the game look so easy whereas flint made it look like a chore .im amazed no one was looking at him before , if they weren’t then they know about him now All opinions Stevie but I thought Flint was a far better defender than you do , Webster a better defender ? , in some ways not all I also think he was / became a better passer of a ball than Robbo credits him for IMHO Overall , Webster is a far better overall player , to have had one replacing the other is excellent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 10 minutes ago, Davefevs said: Me too, but he was still a very decent CB for us, and his partnership with Baker pre-Xmas last season was very solid. In an ideal world he needs a quick CB alongside him who can allow he to get tight, rsoecialky against the ones who like it into feet and spin their runs. Most CBs at this level will have weakness areas, and Flint was a talisman for us over 3 seasons back in the Champ. Webster is looking mighty fine though.... ....but not ready to dump on Flint like the next poster. That’s a shocking comment....where are Boro in the league. How many goals have they conceded this season? We are a strange bunch of fans. Reminds me of a youngish lad on twitter, who every week is hassling the players for their shirts every game, and then slagging them off on Facebook. We need to treat players like Flint with a bit of credit and courtesy. Dave, You are undoubtedly one of the posters I respect the most here, and I think the slating of Flint is wrong. For me, the key difference is this: We conceded a lot of goals with AF at centre half. Boro are less prone to this but because they have a defensive manager We concede less goals with AW. Not because his manager is per se defensive, but because the defence is better. I actually think that AW wouldn’t be as effective alongside AF because he wouldn’t have the confidence (as with TK) that his CH partner had the game awareness to cover him. In summary, I think AF is a very good defender but needs a very good defence alongside him to be effective. AW is a quality defender and doesn’t need as much support because he’s more positionally aware. In a nutshell, that’s why he’s better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 Flint was an icon for the club and I see no need to criticise him but the fact we sold our two best defenders to bigger clubs in the summer and have ended up with a better defence than last season is a genuine achievement. People too often talk about what the club gets wrong in terms of recruitment but this is an area we have definitely made progress. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDOXO Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 9 minutes ago, downendcity said: We needed all of Flint's goals because of all the ones we conceded at the other end! When did we last look this strong and secure defensively? Hunt, Kalas, Webster and Kelly look to be first choice and are probably as good as any defensive unit in the championship, but we still have Pissano, Wright, Baker and De Silva in reserve, and they are not too dusty a back 4 on their own! On the EFL show last week the pundits were discussing Leeds and commented that they had a few games when they weren't playing well, but from which they had secured result and that the mark of a good team is when they can win when not playing well. Perhaps we have had a few draws but we have been getting results when not necessarily at our best. That being the case then as long as the defensive side of our game stays strong, then an improvement in the attacking play might just see us surprise a few over the second half of the season - not least our own fans! I'm not making a case that Flint is better they have different attributes...Its all in the post. We look sound but that is not just about Webster that's about the way LJ sets us up and Webster is a part of that. Boro have conceded 18 goals as has been said 50 times, so Flint is pretty good defender I would say...Either way are you saying that the goals we conceded when Flint was here were down to him and he was just making up for his errors... Don't answer that, I'm making a point, its easy to rehash the point of a post then make some odd commentary about what was not said! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyTonyTony Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 I don’t get all the Flint knocking. I bet you weren’t having a pop when he made that header off the crossbar against City last year. Show some class. He was a great servant to the club. A rare breed nowadays - most modern footballers are total tarts. He was a genuine rough and tumble defender. Top pro Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Merrick's Marvels Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 55 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: We were very very lucky to have Flint Webster is class The anti Flint comments on here are simply embarrassing Well said, sir. It's perfectly possible to love 'em both, for different reasons. Webster is class on the ball and there are fewer finer sights than your team having a central defender who plays like a rolls royce and whose brain and footballing intelligence make the game look easy. On the other hand, there are also fewer finer sights than your team having a warrior at centre half whose deeds stir the blood and the heart, to the extent he ends up a folk hero. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 2 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said: Dave, You are undoubtedly one of the posters I respect the most here, and I think the slating of Flint is wrong. For me, the key difference is this: We conceded a lot of goals with AF at centre half. Boro are less prone to this but because they have a defensive manager We concede less goals with AW. Not because his manager is per se defensive, but because the defence is better. I actually think that AW wouldn’t be as effective alongside AF because he wouldn’t have the confidence (as with TK) that his CH partner had the game awareness to cover him. In summary, I think AF is a very good defender but needs a very good defence alongside him to be effective. AW is a quality defender and doesn’t need as much support because he’s more positionally aware. In a nutshell, that’s why he’s better. Likewise ()...and I know you weren’t slaying Flint, but some people (not just this thread) have moved on their man-crushes very quickly...too quickly, and I think Flint deserves respect. For the earlier poster to say Lower-Champ irks me. I don’t disagree with your comments, they are pretty similar to my thoughts. It’s certainly not black and white re Boro, you are right they have a defensive manager....and our own H-C has gone a bit more solid too himself. I don’t think Flint was a true leader of the back 4, and I think Baker called the line most of the time. I think Flint’s rise from Alfreton meant he was always aware of his limitations and preferred to concentrate on his own game. No issues from me there. I agree I don’t think AF/AW is a match made in heaven, because I think Webster benefits from Tk’s class and he wouldn’t get the same feedback from AF. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
REDOXO Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 1 minute ago, Merrick's Marvels said: Well said, sir. It's perfectly possible to love 'em both, for different reasons. Webster is class on the ball and there are fewer finer sights than your team having a central defender who plays like a rolls royce and whose brain and footballing intelligence make the game look easy. On the other hand, there are also fewer finer sights than your team having a warrior at centre half whose deeds stir the blood and the heart, to the extent he ends up a folk hero. You Sir Are Spot On....I have ran out of Likes so have a personal one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 1 minute ago, Merrick's Marvels said: Well said, sir. It's perfectly possible to love 'em both, for different reasons. Webster is class on the ball and there are fewer finer sights than your team having a central defender who plays like a rolls royce and whose brain and footballing intelligence make the game look easy. On the other hand, there are also fewer finer sights than your team having a warrior at centre half whose deeds stir the blood and the heart, to the extent he ends up a folk hero. And in return I really like those two paragraphs Nailed Nailed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 2 minutes ago, Merrick's Marvels said: Well said, sir. It's perfectly possible to love 'em both, for different reasons. Webster is class on the ball and there are fewer finer sights than your team having a central defender who plays like a rolls royce and whose brain and footballing intelligence make the game look easy. On the other hand, there are also fewer finer sights than your team having a warrior at centre half whose deeds stir the blood and the heart, to the extent he ends up a folk hero. That performance v Brighton in 16-17 when we won 1-0 away was colossal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 2 minutes ago, Davefevs said: Likewise ()...and I know you weren’t slaying Flint, but some people (not just this thread) have moved on their man-crushes very quickly...too quickly, and I think Flint deserves respect. For the earlier poster to say Lower-Champ irks me. I don’t disagree with your comments, they are pretty similar to my thoughts. It’s certainly not black and white re Boro, you are right they have a defensive manager....and our own H-C has gone a bit more solid too himself. I don’t think Flint was a true leader of the back 4, and I think Baker called the line most of the time. I think Flint’s rise from Alfreton meant he was always aware of his limitations and preferred to concentrate on his own game. No issues from me there. I agree I don’t think AF/AW is a match made in heaven, because I think Webster benefits from Tk’s class and he wouldn’t get the same feedback from AF. Agree Dave For all my admiration for Flint My pairing if I was managing would be Webster / Kalas , who knit beautifully as a pair Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 6 minutes ago, TonyTonyTony said: I don’t get all the Flint knocking. I bet you weren’t having a pop when he made that header off the crossbar against City last year. Show some class. He was a great servant to the club. A rare breed nowadays - most modern footballers are total tarts. He was a genuine rough and tumble defender. Top pro I don't think people are knocking or criticising Flint. He and Webster are different players with different playing styles. Flint was the blood and guts defender who got stuck in, laid his body on the line and became a folk hero because of his exploits at the other end. He is just the type of player you wonder how you will replace when he leaves- which is how most of us thought in the summer. Flint was also a better footballer than many gave him credit for. Webster is more of a thoroughbred, whose awareness means he reads the game well so doesn't need to make flying tackles and put his body on the line ( other than with his own teammates!!) I mentioned comparison with Gary Collier in an earlier post, but perhaps there is also something of a Bobby Moore in him? The other factor this season is that Webster is playing in a much more solid defence than was Flint, and a subtle change in our playing style this season has made the team stronger on the defensive side compared with lasts season's pressing game. Webster is the last player I would have thought could have replaced Flint, but he has and , with no disrespect to Flint, is an upgrade. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 13 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Agree Dave For all my admiration for Flint My pairing if I was managing would be Webster / Kalas , who knit beautifully as a pair If they were both staying longer term ( sadly doubtful) what about Webster and Kelly - given that central defence is meant to be Kelly's preferred and best position? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Army 87 Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 1 hour ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Different players , different qualities I was and am a massive massive Flint fan , made the absolute best of everything he had and I really respect that - One of the best Adam Webster is a more natural , and better footballer which speaks for itself after the above Completely agree Bob. I think the easiest way to assess things is that Webster is more suited to the way Johnson wants us to play, so therefore he appears superior and thrives on the way we play. Flint is an excellent defender and I can see why it was good business for us, Boro and himself that he made the move. We should never forget his contribution over the years and comparisons to Webster are a little off imo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 2 minutes ago, downendcity said: If they were both staying longer term ( sadly doubtful) what about Webster and Kelly - given that central defence is meant to be Kelly's preferred and best position? We can only have a punt on Kelly’s potential and development but IMHO potentially a Premiership pairing and a pair that you should be able to base a serious promotion challenge on Not sure we can keep either too long , let alone both , though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 Think that playing in front of Maenappa must be helping everyone Make no apologies mentioning him again Wasnt convinced by his signing , based on his career But ......fair play......been flawless , virtually, solid as ***** To me he is looking more and more assured by the week Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC11 Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 Both are excellent at what they do, said it when we signed Webster that the only thing we’ll miss is AF’s goals at the other end but we’ve got a better defender on our hands who is still young and will only improve. Flint will always be a legend in my eyes. FLINT SAID NO, NO,NO!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 59 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: I’d be amazed if he’s not on some Premier Clubs radar Believe he is. Have also heard he feels the best he ever has physically here at City. He's on a special training regime that should ensure his previous injuries aren't aggrevated. I must admit though, I watched him very closely v Rotherham and noticed he made quite a few little errors on the ball, one of which led to a v good Rotherham chance in the first half. I haven't seen enough of him this season to comment fully but he has been a fault for at least a couple of goals so isn't infallible. Flint would have been chastised for making similar errors! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted January 5, 2019 Report Share Posted January 5, 2019 1 minute ago, BobBobSuperBob said: We can only have a punt on Kelly’s potential and development but IMHO potentially a Premiership pairing and a pair that you should be able to base a serious promotion challenge on Not sure we can keep either too long , let alone both , though Agree Bob. Amazing that in the summer we thought we'd bought another dud - sick note player- from struggling Ipswich. Now we are starting to worry as to whether we can hold on to him and speculating about how much we might get for him if he goes ( my guess is he would top Bobby Reid's fee). For all LJ's criticism, he made the switch with Bobby Reid and turned him into a £10m player. He's bloodied, and developed, Lloyd Kelly so that he is already a £10m+ player and within 6 months and has bought in Webster and in 6 months turned him from a £3.5m player (think I'm right) into probably another £10m player. It's not that long ago that we never sold anyone for what we paid for them, let alone a profit, so this new world is a very different one from City's transfer activity in the past. The key for the future is being able to identify and bring in the next Webster, Kelly etc Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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