Northern Red Posted January 5, 2020 Report Share Posted January 5, 2020 14 hours ago, JBFC II said: I’m starting to think a change is needed. We just aren’t progressing at the rate we have done in recent years. LJ has done well to stabilise us, but he’s hit his ceiling. The one thing I don’t like, is fans (a loose term of the word in some instances) who obviously dislike Johnson the person and therefore use personal insults against him personally, instead of critiquing his tactics etc. I don’t think that’s on. The main problem now is, if he does go, who do we bring in? Exactly. There's plenty of stuff to legitimately criticise Johnson for without making stuff up, which is purely down to people who have never liked him refusing to acknowledge any good that he's done in his time as manager. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickJ Posted January 5, 2020 Report Share Posted January 5, 2020 14 hours ago, bbew said: 3. I still don't agree you can just ignore the transfer funds received and only judge Johnson on the amounts he has spent on players, I can see no logic in this. It’s perfectly logical. When appointed Johnson said he would need 3 windows to make it his team; he’s had 8 windows. Johnson has sold all of the players he inherited. And has spent almost as much on his players. So he has done exactly what he said he wanted to do, and because he inherited such a valuable squad has been able to spend what is for Bristol City an eye watering amount on 50 odd players. it’s a mess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTRFTG Posted January 5, 2020 Report Share Posted January 5, 2020 2 hours ago, Charlie BCFC said: Unsure where you got that from, he’s made a profit in net spend last 2 seasons The accounts.....where else? I guess you assume that other than the reported purchase/selling price of players no other liabilities arise? Salaries for the football club last year were £30,460,510. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bcfcredandwhite Posted January 5, 2020 Report Share Posted January 5, 2020 I think they number more than a few hundred, but are still in the minority across the fan base. I posted on a different thread that yes, performances and results have been poor of late and Lee must be held accountable, but sacking him would be an overreaction imho. We have financial stability, 1 win from the playoffs despite recent form and we are in our 4th consecutive season in this league. There’s plenty to be happy about. Imagine how Stoke fans must be feeling!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glen humphries Posted January 5, 2020 Report Share Posted January 5, 2020 2 minutes ago, bcfcredandwhite said: I think they number more than a few hundred, but are still in the minority across the fan base. I posted on a different thread that yes, performances and results have been poor of late and Lee must be held accountable, but sacking him would be an overreaction imho. We have financial stability, 1 win from the playoffs despite recent form and we are in our 4th consecutive season in this league. There’s plenty to be happy about. Imagine how Stoke fans must be feeling!!!! I couldn’t care less how stoke fans feel or any other club, there’s something not right at our club and in my opinion lj must take most of the blame , massively unbalanced squad, no set way of playing, the football is dire , lj spouting bullshit, huge wage bill ,and we seem to be going backwards on the pitch, Johnson out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted January 5, 2020 Report Share Posted January 5, 2020 4 hours ago, Charlie BCFC said: Unsure where you got that from, he’s made a profit in net spend last 2 seasons Net spend is irrelevant these days....it’s wage bills and amortisation of players contracts that matter, both in the accounts and for FFP. Bristol City football club (The Footie club and the Stadium are reported together under Bristol City Holdings), have the following basic finances: Turnover / income : £17.7m (+) Wages / Salaries: £24.6m (-) Operating Costs (what it costs to run the business): £10.4m (-) Amortisation of player contracts (Transfer fee divided by contract years): £8.1m (-) Loss: £25.5m That’s why LJ cannot just spend what he generates in transfer income. He has to take wages and depreciation (amortisation) into account. Take Webster being replaced by Kalas. Net spend: Webster’s profit - £20m fee minus the £2.7m left on his amortised contract (£3.5m / 4 years - 3 years left) minus the sell-on of £1.7m (if 10% to Ipswich), means £15.6m profit Kalas - £7m fee So why can’t LJ spend £8.6m more. Because Kalas is now costing him: £1.75m per year in amortised contract costs (£7m / 4 year contract) £1.25m in wages per year Webster was costing him: £0.875m per year in amortised contract costs (£3.5m / 4 year contract) say £15k per week - £0.75m in wages Thats £3.0m per year that we’ve committed to for the next 4 years. It’s 12% of our wage budget! For one player! Every player he buys has to be thought about in this context. He’s twice as costly as Webster! Now do that with Dasilva, Palmer, etc, and it shows how a big squad becomes a millstone around our necks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
glen humphries Posted January 5, 2020 Report Share Posted January 5, 2020 2 minutes ago, Davefevs said: Net spend is irrelevant these days....it’s wage bills and amortisation of players contracts that matter, both in the accounts and for FFP. Bristol City football club (The Footie club and the Stadium are reported together under Bristol City Holdings), have the following basic finances: Turnover / income : £17.7m (+) Wages / Salaries: £24.6m (-) Operating Costs (what it costs to run the business): £10.4m (-) Amortisation of player contracts (Transfer fee divided by contract years): £8.1m (-) Loss: £25.5m That’s why LJ cannot just spend what he generates in transfer income. He has to take wages and depreciation (amortisation) into account. Take Webster being replaced by Kalas. Net spend: Webster’s profit - £20m fee minus the £2.7m left on his amortised contract (£3.5m / 4 years - 3 years left) minus the sell-on of £1.7m (if 10% to Ipswich), means £15.6m profit Kalas - £7m fee So why can’t LJ spend £8.6m more. Because Kalas is now costing him: £1.75m per year in amortised contract costs (£7m / 4 year contract) £1.25m in wages per year Webster was costing him: £0.875m per year in amortised contract costs (£3.5m / 4 year contract) say £15k per week - £0.75m in wages Thats £3.0m per year that we’ve committed to for the next 4 years. It’s 12% of our wage budget! For one player! Every player he buys has to be thought about in this context. He’s twice as costly as Webster! Now do that with Dasilva, Palmer, etc, and it shows how a big squad becomes a millstone around our necks. That’s frightening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted January 5, 2020 Report Share Posted January 5, 2020 2 minutes ago, glen humphries said: That’s frightening. The good news is that before we sold Webster. The bad news is we spent Webster’s money (and Pack, Eisa, Freeman - sell-on) and a fair bit more on the transfers and wages of: Bentley, Gilmartin, Dasilva, Kalas, Williams, Afobe, Pereira, Szmodics, Palmer, Rowe, Massengo, Nagy and Rodri Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tin Soldier Posted January 5, 2020 Report Share Posted January 5, 2020 Flipping heck! These stats just shows what a Johnson style big squad mess this club is in. Not good. Assume a lot of Championship clubs are the same though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted January 5, 2020 Report Share Posted January 5, 2020 4 minutes ago, GasDestroyer said: Flipping heck! These stats just shows what a Johnson style big squad mess this club is in. Not good. Assume a lot of Championship clubs are the same though? Yes, many are. There are some exceptions, excluding parachute payments clubs. Leeds for one don’t spend beyond their means. Preston and Brentford are other good examples. Derby, Birmingham, etc are “messy”. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted January 5, 2020 Report Share Posted January 5, 2020 13 minutes ago, GasDestroyer said: Flipping heck! These stats just shows what a Johnson style big squad mess this club is in. Not good. Assume a lot of Championship clubs are the same though? The Championship is a great League...but financially, well where to start! If you are interested, Kieran Maguire has a website named Priceoffootball.com and his Twitter handle is @KieranMaguire. He breaks down Championship accounts plus other clubs too.. @SwissRamble is another. Bottom line is, the losses vary but clubs in the vast bulk of cases are reliant on player sales or unorthodox accounting methods to show a profit. It's crazy! In addition, what @Davefevssaid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozo Posted January 5, 2020 Report Share Posted January 5, 2020 42 minutes ago, Davefevs said: The good news is that before we sold Webster. The bad news is we spent Webster’s money (and Pack, Eisa, Freeman - sell-on) and a fair bit more on the transfers and wages of: Bentley, Gilmartin, Dasilva, Kalas, Williams, Afobe, Pereira, Szmodics, Palmer, Rowe, Massengo, Nagy and Rodri And what we want is a coach who spends wisely, and then organises and motivates the squad to enable them to play their best football. Wilder did it. Franck is doing it at Brentford. Neil might be doing it at Preston. Johnson might not be doing it at City. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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