Mark Ashton.

[Rob k]

Just now, Kid in the Riot said:

LJ definitely had input. I can't imagine, for example, SL or MA thought "I know, that Marley Watkins looks a prospect!" He was clearly an LJ signing. Brownhill, Webster and Tammy too. 

Yep - fair point. For what it’s worth I’ve always though that LJ should have been much more vocal on recruitment and how it worked

[intercity]

20 minutes ago, Moments of Pleasure said:

Really? Where to?

Jersey maybe...

Seriously though, if he were to sell BCFC, potentially there is a sticking point as the stadium is owned by ashton gate holdings and not the club if my memory serves... I stand to be corrected of course.

[Harry]

39 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Whether we think that MA is a good fit or not for CEO at AG doesn’t matter one iota.

SL is the main man and Ashton does the job that SL isn’t able to do largely down to his tax exile status and partly because his lad is Chairman.

Essentially Ashton is SLs lacky.

 

Naive thinking Robbo. 
SL isn’t making any day to day decisions - he employed Ashton to do that. Ashton has full control of all ‘football matters’. 
SL will still steer the ship financially and ‘other’ matters, such as stadium development, sponsorships, merchandising, corporate etc, but he’s passed footballing decisions onto MA, who somehow has managed to convince SL that he should. 

[Harry]

29 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

LJ definitely had input. I can't imagine, for example, SL or MA thought "I know, that Marley Watkins looks a prospect!" He was clearly an LJ signing. Brownhill, Webster and Tammy too. 

Of course there are players that LJ will have brought to the table, and I’ve never denied that. But in the main, this is MA’s baby. 

[Robbored]

1 hour ago, Kid in the Riot said:

LJ definitely had input. I can't imagine, for example, SL or MA thought "I know, that Marley Watkins looks a prospect!" He was clearly an LJ signing. Brownhill, Webster and Tammy too. 

Of course he did and same applies to DH.

If any player was signed without the approval of the Head Coach then said player would rarely get in the first team squad.

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, Rob k said:

So why did LJ deviate so much from his previous type of player and if he was involved why did he Hardly play some of these players? As someone else has said, nobody in recruitment reports to him either? 
 

1 hour ago, Kid in the Riot said:

LJ definitely had input. I can't imagine, for example, SL or MA thought "I know, that Marley Watkins looks a prospect!" He was clearly an LJ signing. Brownhill, Webster and Tammy too. 

1 hour ago, Rob k said:

Yep - fair point. For what it’s worth I’ve always though that LJ should have been much more vocal on recruitment and how it worked

I totally agree.  And if I was LJ, once I’d got the club stable(ish) and proved myself - sometime between 16/17 and 17/18 -  I would’ve been insisting on more control.

Holden was brought in during Nov 2016 to allow Lee to spend more time on recruitment, so it looks earlier than I suggest.  That’s what Lee and Jamie told us at the time.

If you don’t get your own way, if you think you are being undermined, you either put up with it, or do something about it. If you believe in yourself, you back yourself.

If he allowed MA to make decisions on inbound players, then more fool LJ for putting up with it.  But I don’t think that was the case.  I think it was a bit of both, and a massaging of each other’s ego.

I don’t believe MA should have much say at all on the footballing ability of anyrecruits, but he can input on whether  the fee / contract in line with budgets and manager / head coach expectations, e.g. you can’t spend £5m and £25k on Marley Watkins as a squad player, but you can spend £1m and £12k (or whatever).

[BigTone]

32 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Of course he did and same applies to DH.

If any player was signed without the approval of the Head Coach then said player would rarely get in the first team squad.

Exactly. The Manager / Head Coach identifies a target and then Ashton does the deal.

[Robbored]

16 minutes ago, BigTone said:

Exactly. The Manager / Head Coach identifies a target and then Ashton does the deal.

Why do some posters not understand that Tone?.................

Theres an extensive national and to a lesser degree international coaching network that all feed back to the Head Coach.

[Rob k]

4 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Why do some posters not understand that Tone?.................

Theres an extensive national and to a lesser degree international coaching network that all feed back to the Head Coach.

So do you believe LJ singed Engel, Duric, SS etc and if he did why did he not play them?  
do you not find it slightly strange that a lot of business is done via one agency? 
If there is this extensive network who is our chief scout?

[Harry]

27 minutes ago, BigTone said:

Exactly. The Manager / Head Coach identifies a target and then Ashton does the deal.

100% NOT how it works. 

6 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Why do some posters not understand that Tone?.................

Theres an extensive national and to a lesser degree international coaching network that all feed back to the Head Coach.

No one reports into the Head Coach 

[Davefevs]

4 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Why do some posters not understand that Tone?.................

Theres an extensive national and to a lesser degree international coaching network that all feed back to the Head Coach.

Incorrect....They feed back to The Recruitment Dept.  LJ or DH don’t manage the scouts.

[Red_Alligator]

Oh good grief....

I can't summon anything more.

[Robbored]

10 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Incorrect....They feed back to The Recruitment Dept.  LJ or DH don’t manage the scouts.

The scouting network is too huge for one person to oversee alone which is why there’s a recruitment dept with its own head who when a potential signing comes along ultimately report to DH.

[Robbored]

18 minutes ago, Rob k said:

So do you believe LJ singed Engel, Duric, SS etc and if he did why did he not play them?  
do you not find it slightly strange that a lot of business is done via one agency? 
If there is this extensive network who is our chief scout?

LJ signed numerous players who he never played.

[Davefevs]

1 minute ago, Robbored said:

The scouting network is too huge for one person to oversee alone which is why there’s a recruitment dept with its own head who when a potential signing comes along ultimately report to DH.

So you were wrong then....you now agree with me that the Scouts report to the Recruitment Dept.

[Robbored]

1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

So you were wrong then....you now agree with me that the Scouts report to the Recruitment Dept.

Of course I agree ......... I didn’t see it as necessary to mention another layer in the scouting system, so technically I’m not exactly wrong.

[Davefevs]

Just now, Robbored said:

Of course I agree ......... I didn’t see it as necessary to mention another layer in the scouting system, so technically I’m not exactly wrong.

If you say so

[BigTone]

46 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Why do some posters not understand that Tone?.................

Theres an extensive national and to a lesser degree international coaching network that all feed back to the Head Coach.

Beats me TBH

[BigTone]

39 minutes ago, Harry said:

 

No one reports into the Head Coach 

Didn't say that though did I.

[Harry]

Just now, BigTone said:

Didn't say that though did I.

I never said you did Tone. That was a reply to Robbored’s post. 
You see, I quoted 2 posts in one reply, and put my relevant comment under each one in turn. 
Catch up boss.

[robin_unreliant]

I reckon MA has been pretty much fireproof thanks to the big money sales he's made. You have to accept we have been on a different level from previously over the last couple of seasons. I'm sure that has gone down very well with SL. 

However it looks to me like we've reached the end of that cycle. I honestly don't see much value in the squad now. So maybe he will start to come under pressure from the Lansdowns in the near future. 

[BigTone]

1 minute ago, Harry said:

I never said you did Tone. That was a reply to Robbored’s post. 
You see, I quoted 2 posts in one reply, and put my relevant comment under each one in turn. 
Catch up boss.

Not me who needs to catch up old sock. Robbo didn't say it either if you read his post in the context intended.

[BigTone]

1 minute ago, robin_unreliant said:

I reckon MA has been pretty much fireproof thanks to the big money sales he's made. You have to accept we have been on a different level from previously over the last couple of seasons. I'm sure that has gone down very well with SL. 

However it looks to me like we've reached the end of that cycle. I honestly don't see much value in the squad now. So maybe he will start to come under pressure from the Lansdowns in the near future. 

With Covid etc I think that applies to the squads of most teams.

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

I totally agree.  And if I was LJ, once I’d got the club stable(ish) and proved myself - sometime between 16/17 and 17/18 -  I would’ve been insisting on more control.

Holden was brought in during Nov 2016 to allow Lee to spend more time on recruitment, so it looks earlier than I suggest.  That’s what Lee and Jamie told us at the time.

If you don’t get your own way, if you think you are being undermined, you either put up with it, or do something about it. If you believe in yourself, you back yourself.

If he allowed MA to make decisions on inbound players, then more fool LJ for putting up with it.  But I don’t think that was the case.  I think it was a bit of both, and a massaging of each other’s ego.

I don’t believe MA should have much say at all on the footballing ability of anyrecruits, but he can input on whether  the fee / contract in line with budgets and manager / head coach expectations, e.g. you can’t spend £5m and £25k on Marley Watkins as a squad player, but you can spend £1m and £12k (or whatever).

It's increasingly like this in the modern game, I'm sure of it.

Sevilla is a good example. Hasn't worked too badly for them over two decades.

That example aside, I wonder to what extent football is heading in this direction of travel.

Might managers increasingly have to like it or lump it to some extent.

[Harry]

59 minutes ago, Robbored said:

Why do some posters not understand that Tone?.................

Theres an extensive national and to a lesser degree international coaching network that all feed back to the Head Coach.

 

7 minutes ago, BigTone said:

Not me who needs to catch up old sock. Robbo didn't say it either if you read his post in the context intended.

Ummm, yes he did. 

[BigTone]

5 minutes ago, Harry said:

 

Ummm, yes he did. 

No he didn't if you look at the context of his post in response to others previous. 

[BigTone]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

Incorrect....They feed back to The Recruitment Dept.  LJ or DH don’t manage the scouts.

I would be certain that the Head Coach has a level of contact with the scouting network.

[Davefevs]

21 minutes ago, robin_unreliant said:

I reckon MA has been pretty much fireproof thanks to the big money sales he's made. You have to accept we have been on a different level from previously over the last couple of seasons. I'm sure that has gone down very well with SL. 

However it looks to me like we've reached the end of that cycle. I honestly don't see much value in the squad now. So maybe he will start to come under pressure from the Lansdowns in the near future. 

When was his last big sale?  Brownhill.  In 19/20s accounts.  None this year.  And who would it be if he did need to make a sale?

1 minute ago, BigTone said:

I would be certain that the Head Coach has a level of contact with the scouting network.

Yep.

[Harry]

11 minutes ago, BigTone said:

No he didn't if you look at the context of his post in response to others previous. 

We’re gonna go round and round Tone. 
 

To me, if he wrote “there’s an extensive network that all feed back to the head coach”, then I’m gonna read that to mean exactly what it says and reply that no one feeds back to the head coach, they all report (and thus ‘feed’) to Ashton. 
 

Remember - and I’ll quote the man himself -“I am in charge of all football matters” 

[BigTone]

8 minutes ago, Harry said:

We’re gonna go round and round Tone. 
 

To me, if he wrote “there’s an extensive network that all feed back to the head coach”, then I’m gonna read that to mean exactly what it says and reply that no one feeds back to the head coach, they all report (and thus ‘feed’) to Ashton. 
 

Remember - and I’ll quote the man himself -“I am in charge of all football matters” 

So you honestly think the Head Coach has no contact with the clubs scouting network or the nationwide scouting network that exists.  Remember there are freelance scouts out there also.