Derby takeover ....

[Mr Popodopolous]

I think the Admin/Liquidation speculation is surely overstated despite my fairly excitable post when I saw the article but their position doesn't seem good.

11 hours ago, GreedyHarry said:

I’m not very clever at all this but in the analysis they say refinancing Pride Park would push the sale through. How would that help as I thought they don’t own their ground any more?

From reading here and there, perhaps they haven't been paid for it yet- one theory I saw was to forgive the debt the MM company owes them for Pride Park as part of the takeover- however that feels problematic for a variety of reasons...sure the EFL would have plenty to say for a start! To say they are owed it is problematic given what the Accounts state- either it's offset against loans or it's been paid for- in which case in the former, the Cash Flow should surely remain empty or the Loans offset should be the precise amount and it seems not to be entirely the case...non-cancellable operating lease as well, in their Accounts for 2018- Land Registry suggests it is 20 years, they can't have it all ways.

To answer your q directly though, I believe that maybe the mooted £60m would be to- Pay down debt, few million for Mel, would include the Club, the parent, the overall Parent, and the 3 other companies within the Group under the Parent- plus the company who purchased the Ground and possibly the controlling company of that.

In other words:

Quote

The Derby County Football Club Limited- The Club

Controlled by

Gellaw Newco 203 Limited- Top of the Chain

Then:

Quote

Club DCFC Limited

Derby County Academy DC Limited

Stadia DCFC Limited

Controlled by

Sevco 5112 Limited

Which in turn is controlled by

Gellaw Newco 203 Limited- Top of the Chain- although Confirmation Statements for the Club appear to cast doubt.

Then you have:

Quote

Gellaw Newco 202 Limited- The company who purchased Pride Park- Technically not within the Group.

Direct Controlling Company

Gellaw Newco 204 Limited

You could consolidate all of this into one on Group or similar purchase, but I could see the EFL having a real issue with this given the 2018 Transaction plus taking into account some of the Terms and Conditions that appeared in the EFL Hearing.

Might also add, Sevco 5112 Limited has not submitted its most recent Confirmation Statement.

Having said all that, there is murkiness about Gellaw Newco 203 Limited- bits about Change of Control and then change of Details.

Quote

Followed by:

Quote

 

 

Very curious goings on.

[downendcity]

13 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

I think the Admin/Liquidation speculation is surely overstated despite my fairly excitable post when I saw the article but their position doesn't seem good.

From reading here and there, perhaps they haven't been paid for it yet- one theory I saw was to forgive the debt the MM company owes them for Pride Park as part of the takeover- however that feels problematic for a variety of reasons...sure the EFL would have plenty to say for a start! To say they are owed it is problematic given what the Accounts state- either it's offset against loans or it's been paid for- in which case in the former, the Cash Flow should surely remain empty or the Loans offset should be the precise amount and it seems not to be entirely the case...non-cancellable operating lease as well, in their Accounts for 2018- Land Registry suggests it is 20 years, they can't have it all ways.

To answer your q directly though, I believe that maybe the mooted £60m would be to- Pay down debt, few million for Mel, would include the Club, the parent, the overall Parent, and the 3 other companies within the Group under the Parent- plus the company who purchased the Ground and possibly the controlling company of that.

In other words:

The Derby County Football Club Limited- The Club

Controlled by

Gellaw Newco 203 Limited- Top of the Chain

Then:

Club DCFC Limited

Derby County Academy DC Limited

Stadia DCFC Limited

Controlled by

Sevco 5112 Limited

Which in turn is controlled by

Gellaw Newco 203 Limited- Top of the Chain- although Confirmation Statements for the Club appear not to indicate that this is the case.

Then you have:

Gellaw Newco 202 Limited- The company who purchased Pride Park- Technically not within the Group.

Direct Controlling Company

Gellaw Newco 204 Limited

You could consolidate all of this into one, but I could see the EFL having a real issue with this given the 2018 Transaction.

Might also add, Sevco 5112 Limited has not submitted its most recent Confirmation Statement.

Ive said this before, in relation to Derby and the Pride Park “sale”, but it’s worth repeating.

As Billy Shakespeare said “ Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive” 

[Mr Popodopolous]

Ah yes @GreedyHarry the bit I forgot in my post when trying to unpick a bit of their structure.

Basically when ground back in Club Ownership with debt paid down or maybe with MSD debt still there, Alonso proposed to mortgage it in order to fund player recruitment. Not sure about that Business Plan!?

[havanatopia]

In League 1, in admin and with a skeleton staff and wooney gone they won't need Pride Park. Too costly anyway. They should bunk in with Notts County or Mansfield; good income for those chaps.

Pride Park could be redeveloped for a different sport like Rugby or Cricket.. you know where usually the people running such clubs are a bit more honest.

[havanatopia]

7 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

I think the Admin/Liquidation speculation is surely overstated despite my fairly excitable post when I saw the article but their position doesn't seem good.

From reading here and there, perhaps they haven't been paid for it yet- one theory I saw was to forgive the debt the MM company owes them for Pride Park as part of the takeover- however that feels problematic for a variety of reasons...sure the EFL would have plenty to say for a start! To say they are owed it is problematic given what the Accounts state- either it's offset against loans or it's been paid for- in which case in the former, the Cash Flow should surely remain empty or the Loans offset should be the precise amount and it seems not to be entirely the case...non-cancellable operating lease as well, in their Accounts for 2018- Land Registry suggests it is 20 years, they can't have it all ways.

To answer your q directly though, I believe that maybe the mooted £60m would be to- Pay down debt, few million for Mel, would include the Club, the parent, the overall Parent, and the 3 other companies within the Group under the Parent- plus the company who purchased the Ground and possibly the controlling company of that.

In other words:

Then:

Then you have:

You could consolidate all of this into one on Group or similar purchase, but I could see the EFL having a real issue with this given the 2018 Transaction plus taking into account some of the Terms and Conditions that appeared in the EFL Hearing.

Might also add, Sevco 5112 Limited has not submitted its most recent Confirmation Statement.

Having said all that, there is murkiness about Gellaw Newco 203 Limited- bits about Change of Control and then change of Details.

Followed by:

Very curious goings on.

Hellas Newco 203.... The name alone should tell anyone that whoever came up with it is capable of spinning webs all over the shop 

Ridiculous.

 

[Mr Popodopolous]

On 14/05/2021 at 22:42, havanatopia said:

ditto much of the world Pop.

You have most certainly delved deep that is for sure.

What is the latest on the FL points deduction ?

Because he can't ! . Bit like when I was a youngster and I quite fancied the Rover 800 2 Door Coupe Vitesse; a very handsome vehicle and I took a test drive and said to the salesman, "I'm having that beauty". I went home, spoke to the Accountant and he said bluntly, 'you are not buying it, you don't have enough income or cash' I was crying into my cuppa tea. But he was right. Alonso has 5 beans but needs about 20,000. He got his maths wrong too. I'd say he made a lucky escape though just like me.

Yep, big upheaval for about 7.674bn people! Some countries more disrupted than others of course.

Bit of an interest of mine...

Seems like any possible points deduction would be next year, although there's nothing definitive out there, only the parties and Disciplinary Commission/League Arbitration Panel surely know the full details. Nixon and general media consensus seems to suggest this, but Craig Hope of the Daily Mail said in his article EFL faced a race against the clock to get it done by a deadline for this season (2020/21).

As an aside, surely once the Birmingham tariff of 9 pts was set in March 2019, it should be quite straight forward to match overspend to points deduction based on that precedent- but it seems to drag and drag! There is a tariff on the end of the Sheffield Wednesday Sanctioning Guidelines in Black and White...not at all hard to match overspend to this! Slightly badly written, ie Starting Point of 12 and then points deducted from the deduction based on a scale from £15m downwards but shouldn't be too hard...? We can tell it was written in Shaun Harvey's time! 

Seems backwards, surely a simpler way should be upwards ie £1-1,999m=3 pts and so on up to £15m and 12 points but again- Shaun Harvey! Very badly written if it's by lawyers. Alternatively, Quantum of the Breach bit and sliding scale downwards ie £15m+=12 pts, £12.5m-15m=11 pts and so on down to the lowest level which=3 pts.

https://www.efl.com/siteassets/efl-documents/201920/judgments/efl-v-sheffield-wednesday---decision-on-sanction.pdf

"Deduction from the deduction"- what a laugh, how much are they paid again! I understand what it means, but I don't understand how apparent professionals- professional or not, they're surely quite highly paid in any case- could write Sanctioning Guidelines so badly.

It was implied- or maybe- he seemed to be implying- that the Indonesian backers were the money? No Indonesian backers, no takeover perhaps. Certainly doubt he could have done it off his own back- although his Twitter was entertaining!