Derby County

[REDOXO]

1 hour ago, ExiledAjax said:

Yes, absolutely someone is pulling a fast one. But that doesn't mean Derby/Quantuma didn't have the legal right to sell the contract. It means that a) they should pay Lech Poznan, or b) as @Davefevs says, FIFA should have blocked the sale. Lech Poznan have been done over by the protection Derby have from being in administration. 

It is proper naughty, but possibly not 'illegal'.

They are selling the players registration not the contract. I’m not sure how this would be viewed under DCFC circumstances, but players are sold almost everyday that the club still owe money on. 
 

 

[Merrick's Marvels]

3 hours ago, Davefevs said:

FIFA should’ve blocked the transfer…they should not allow international clearance until Derby pay Lech.

This is shocking.

Mick Harford. 

We sold him to Brum in March 82 for £100K but never saw a penny of it.

Brum sent the money straight to Newcastle - to settle what we owed Newcastle after buying Harford for £160K just 6 months before going bust. 

[GrahamC]

4 minutes ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

Mick Harford. 

We sold him to Brum in March 82 for £100K but never saw a penny of it.

Brum sent the money straight to Newcastle - to settle what we owed Newcastle after buying Harford for £160K just 6 months before going bust. 

Jan Moller too, was sold to Toronto Blizzard in exactly the same circumstances.

People forget now but we were treated harshly by the league, also made to return several loan players (including Aiden McCaffrey from the blue few) because other sides complained.

[Davefevs]

3 hours ago, Merrick's Marvels said:

Mick Harford. 

We sold him to Brum in March 82 for £100K but never saw a penny of it.

Brum sent the money straight to Newcastle - to settle what we owed Newcastle after buying Harford for £160K just 6 months before going bust. 

Yep, I recall that.  And the same should apply here for any repayments due but not paid.

If Jozwiak was £4m, say £1m initially and £1.5m for the next two years…then if Derby sell him and fail to make  their agreed payment, then the transfer should not be allowed.  FIFA control international transfers and payments from Charlotte to Derby should’ve gone through their escrow account.  As the transfer was made after the staged payment was due, the money should’ve gone straight to Lech.

[Davefevs]

From Matt Slater / Athletic:

Derby County still owe Lech Poznan about £2.5 million for Kamil Jozwiak despite selling the Polish winger to Major League Soccer side Charlotte FC last week, The Athletic understands.

The Championship side bought Jozwiak for a fee in the region of €4 million (£3.4 million) in September 2020 but had only paid 25 per cent of that amount when they went into administration last September.

Derby’s administrators Quantuma contacted Lech Poznan in January to ask them if they would agree to defer the next instalment of Jozwiak’s fee, which was due on February 15. 

The Polish side rejected the request but received no further communication from Derby or their administrators.

In fact, that is the only time Lech Poznan have heard from Quantuma despite numerous attempts to ask the administrators about the money still owed for Jozwiak and the Ekstraklasa side only learned of the player’s move to the US when Jozwiak told them.

“They’ve sold a player but they haven’t paid for him,” Lech Poznan president Piotr Rutkowski tells The Athletic.

“How is that fair? How is that ethical?

“And what’s really frustrating is we have no protection from the authorities — FIFA’s enforcement proceedings are frozen while Derby are in an insolvency process and the English Football League is not supporting us. If we were an English club, it would be different.”

Rutkowski’s point about the EFL is correct, as the league’s football creditor rule allows it to withhold central payments from a club in administration and redirect them to any club or player owed money. The Premier League has an identical rule and the rationale is it preserves the competitive integrity of the game and protects other clubs from being dragged into financial problems.

These rules, however, only go so far. Overseas clubs owed money by English clubs must pursue their claims via FIFA’s Football Tribunal. Lech Poznan have started that process but the action is frozen while Derby are in administration. It is understood that the club will continue to pursue the full amount they are owed.

“While the situation at Derby County remains challenging with several issues still to be to resolved, the complaint of Lech Poznan related to the sale of Kamil Jozwiak remains a matter for FIFA with whom the rules for all clubs trading internationally are set,” an EFL spokesperson explains.

“The EFL's 'Football Creditor' rules focus on the protection of the domestic football pyramid by seeking to ensure that the financial default of one club does not unfairly penalise other clubs in our domestic competitions.

“Ultimately all professional clubs are bound by FIFA regulations and it will be for the game’s international governing body to advise on the required action for those involved.”

FIFA has not responded to a request for comment and Quantuma declined to comment on the matter.

[exAtyeoMax]

6 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

From Matt Slater / Athletic:

Derby County still owe Lech Poznan about £2.5 million for Kamil Jozwiak despite selling the Polish winger to Major League Soccer side Charlotte FC last week, The Athletic understands.

The Championship side bought Jozwiak for a fee in the region of €4 million (£3.4 million) in September 2020 but had only paid 25 per cent of that amount when they went into administration last September.

Derby’s administrators Quantuma contacted Lech Poznan in January to ask them if they would agree to defer the next instalment of Jozwiak’s fee, which was due on February 15. 

The Polish side rejected the request but received no further communication from Derby or their administrators.

In fact, that is the only time Lech Poznan have heard from Quantuma despite numerous attempts to ask the administrators about the money still owed for Jozwiak and the Ekstraklasa side only learned of the player’s move to the US when Jozwiak told them.

“They’ve sold a player but they haven’t paid for him,” Lech Poznan president Piotr Rutkowski tells The Athletic.

“How is that fair? How is that ethical?

“And what’s really frustrating is we have no protection from the authorities — FIFA’s enforcement proceedings are frozen while Derby are in an insolvency process and the English Football League is not supporting us. If we were an English club, it would be different.”

Rutkowski’s point about the EFL is correct, as the league’s football creditor rule allows it to withhold central payments from a club in administration and redirect them to any club or player owed money. The Premier League has an identical rule and the rationale is it preserves the competitive integrity of the game and protects other clubs from being dragged into financial problems.

These rules, however, only go so far. Overseas clubs owed money by English clubs must pursue their claims via FIFA’s Football Tribunal. Lech Poznan have started that process but the action is frozen while Derby are in administration. It is understood that the club will continue to pursue the full amount they are owed.

“While the situation at Derby County remains challenging with several issues still to be to resolved, the complaint of Lech Poznan related to the sale of Kamil Jozwiak remains a matter for FIFA with whom the rules for all clubs trading internationally are set,” an EFL spokesperson explains.

“The EFL's 'Football Creditor' rules focus on the protection of the domestic football pyramid by seeking to ensure that the financial default of one club does not unfairly penalise other clubs in our domestic competitions.

“Ultimately all professional clubs are bound by FIFA regulations and it will be for the game’s international governing body to advise on the required action for those involved.”

FIFA has not responded to a request for comment and Quantuma declined to comment on the matter.

kin ell

 

DCFC are really in the 

[GrahamC]

1 hour ago, exAtyeoMax said:

kin ell

 

DCFC are really in the 

Rumour going around yesterday that they could be liquidated at the end of the season but allowed to start the new one in L2.

Definitely sailing closer to the brink than any big club (with no disrespect intended to Bury) since Boro back in ‘86.

[Davefevs]

6 minutes ago, GrahamC said:

Rumour going around yesterday that they could be liquidated at the end of the season but allowed to start the new one in L2.

Definitely sailing closer to the brink than any big club (with no disrespect intended to Bury) since Boro back in ‘86.

I’d be shocked (and disappointed) if they liquidate and were allowed to stay in the EFL.

[exAtyeoMax]

16 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I’d be shocked (and disappointed) if they liquidate and were allowed to stay in the EFL.

yes, what would happen to the existing clubs in L2?

[Sleepy1968]

18 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

I’d be shocked (and disappointed) if they liquidate and were allowed to stay in the EFL.

They surely would need an EGM of member clubs and put something like this to the vote? A phoenix club would probably walk any league below league 1 it was entered into provided it could play at Pride Park because New Derby would sell 20k+ season tickets and be able raise sufficient income streams to attract decent players. Not sure I'd vote for this knowing that my club was destined to finisih a place lower in the league. It would p1ss off all teams at the level and below wouldn't it?

[Sleepy1968]

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

From Matt Slater / Athletic:

Derby County still owe Lech Poznan about £2.5 million for Kamil Jozwiak despite selling the Polish winger to Major League Soccer side Charlotte FC last week, The Athletic understands.

The Championship side bought Jozwiak for a fee in the region of €4 million (£3.4 million) in September 2020 but had only paid 25 per cent of that amount when they went into administration last September.

Derby’s administrators Quantuma contacted Lech Poznan in January to ask them if they would agree to defer the next instalment of Jozwiak’s fee, which was due on February 15. 

The Polish side rejected the request but received no further communication from Derby or their administrators.

In fact, that is the only time Lech Poznan have heard from Quantuma despite numerous attempts to ask the administrators about the money still owed for Jozwiak and the Ekstraklasa side only learned of the player’s move to the US when Jozwiak told them.

“They’ve sold a player but they haven’t paid for him,” Lech Poznan president Piotr Rutkowski tells The Athletic.

“How is that fair? How is that ethical?

“And what’s really frustrating is we have no protection from the authorities — FIFA’s enforcement proceedings are frozen while Derby are in an insolvency process and the English Football League is not supporting us. If we were an English club, it would be different.”

Rutkowski’s point about the EFL is correct, as the league’s football creditor rule allows it to withhold central payments from a club in administration and redirect them to any club or player owed money. The Premier League has an identical rule and the rationale is it preserves the competitive integrity of the game and protects other clubs from being dragged into financial problems.

These rules, however, only go so far. Overseas clubs owed money by English clubs must pursue their claims via FIFA’s Football Tribunal. Lech Poznan have started that process but the action is frozen while Derby are in administration. It is understood that the club will continue to pursue the full amount they are owed.

“While the situation at Derby County remains challenging with several issues still to be to resolved, the complaint of Lech Poznan related to the sale of Kamil Jozwiak remains a matter for FIFA with whom the rules for all clubs trading internationally are set,” an EFL spokesperson explains.

“The EFL's 'Football Creditor' rules focus on the protection of the domestic football pyramid by seeking to ensure that the financial default of one club does not unfairly penalise other clubs in our domestic competitions.

“Ultimately all professional clubs are bound by FIFA regulations and it will be for the game’s international governing body to advise on the required action for those involved.”

FIFA has not responded to a request for comment and Quantuma declined to comment on the matter.

This seems wrong, but then so does the EFL football creditors having a priority over Joe Public (e.g. local companies getting shafted) . Maybe transfers should be paid 100% upfront and not staged, or at least underwritten to avoid these kind of issues.

[Mr Popodopolous]

2 hours ago, GrahamC said:

Rumour going around yesterday that they could be liquidated at the end of the season but allowed to start the new one in L2.

Definitely sailing closer to the brink than any big club (with no disrespect intended to Bury) since Boro back in ‘86.

 

2 hours ago, Davefevs said:

I’d be shocked (and disappointed) if they liquidate and were allowed to stay in the EFL.

Nixon said a few days ago that if this scenario was to play out, it would require a vote basically. Can't remember the thresholds.

If it was League Two but a clean slate, that would be shocking. Hopefully some issues would carry over to the new club as part of consent to transfer the Golden Share to the new entity.

This includes, but perhaps not limited to, a Business Plan, a 15 point deduction if appropriate, everything else on the Embargo Reporting Service, a resolution to the Wycombe saga , Football Creditors paid in full.

If the new owner doesn't like it, then you don't transfer the Golden Share.

Edited March 17, 2022 by Mr Popodopolous

[ExiledAjax]

I would urge Richard Gould to vote against any proposal that saw a phoenix club be permitted to begin in the Football League. 

[ExiledAjax]

16 hours ago, REDOXO said:

They are selling the players registration not the contract. I’m not sure how this would be viewed under DCFC circumstances, but players are sold almost everyday that the club still owe money on. 

But not by insolvent clubs who use a moratorium over claims to protect themselves from being sued by the club that is owed money. That is what Derby/Quantuma seem to have done here, if I understand it correctly. They owe LP, but have sold Jozwiak's contract/registration, and banked cash for it. They should send that onto LP, but know that LP cannot actually sue them right now, and as a non-English club are not protected b the EFL's rules. Derby/Quantuma are exploiting their insolvent position to avoid having to pay LP now. They may have to pay in the future, but they're gambling that by then they will either have a buyer - and so can afford the payment, or will have liquidated, and so the contract between them and LP will have been voided.

[REDOXO]

5 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

But not by insolvent clubs who use a moratorium over claims to protect themselves from being sued by the club that is owed money. That is what Derby/Quantuma seem to have done here, if I understand it correctly. They owe LP, but have sold Jozwiak's contract/registration, and banked cash for it. They should send that onto LP, but know that LP cannot actually sue them right now, and as a non-English club are not protected b the EFL's rules. Derby/Quantuma are exploiting their insolvent position to avoid having to pay LP now. They may have to pay in the future, but they're gambling that by then they will either have a buyer - and so can afford the payment, or will have liquidated, and so the contract between them and LP will have been voided.

I agree. However the transfer got approval on legal/ contractual/international registration grounds and it would appear the EFL/FA did not see any grounds to withhold his registration being moved to the USA or US Soccer saw no reason to not accept that registration. 
 

 

[ExiledAjax]

2 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

I agree. However the transfer got approval on legal/ contractual/international registration grounds and it would appear the EFL/FA did not see any grounds to withhold his registration being moved to the USA or US Soccer saw no reason to not accept that registration. 

I think we are agreeing!

Yes, my view is there are two dodgy things happening. The one I point out, and the one you point out. Poznan should be absolutely fuming with everyone involved.

[1960maaan]

3 hours ago, GrahamC said:

Rumour going around yesterday that they could be liquidated at the end of the season but allowed to start the new one in L2.

Definitely sailing closer to the brink than any big club (with no disrespect intended to Bury) since Boro back in ‘86.

Even the thought of that really pisses me off. 
The supposed/apparent size of the Club makes no difference as to what division they play in. Wimbledon won the FA Cup, played at the top, Man City were in Div 3 & Wolve Div4. Wimbledon & Bury weren't allowed to start in L2, why Derby?  Specially as they have played fast and loose with any rules they thought they could get around. 

[REDOXO]

7 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

I think we are agreeing!

Yes, my view is there are two dodgy things happening. The one I point out, and the one you point out. Poznan should be absolutely fuming with everyone involved.

They should be fuming. It would appear The Football Authorities (and there are a few differing organizations involved) Have allowed this to happen. I would suggest they would argue that they had no standing to stop it. IE Derby are not breaking any rules from a football administration stand point. Some new rules or rule tightening is required to stop this happening in future. I think someone mentioned the Harford scenario up the thread, it seems foreign clubs like LP don’t get the player back, or what happened then is no longer applicable. 
 

By the way Maguire has a new poddy out today. Nothing on Derby so far. 

[Ska Junkie]

17 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

Even the thought of that really pisses me off. 
The supposed/apparent size of the Club makes no difference as to what division they play in. Wimbledon won the FA Cup, played at the top, Man City were in Div 3 & Wolve Div4. Wimbledon & Bury weren't allowed to start in L2, why Derby?  Specially as they have played fast and loose with any rules they thought they could get around. 

There is some serious litigation heading the EFL's way, I would assume, if that happens.

[PHILINFRANCE]

I suspect most observers, Derby fans or further afield, share a common view that Quantuma’s handling of the administration has been totally incompetent and unprofessional; even scandalous if this latest story is correct.

Whilst, in normal circumstances, none of us would wish liquidation on a fellow football club, with all the heartache for innocent fans and financial distress to creditors, especially small local businesses, I am now sort of hoping that it does happen, even more so as I have heard it mentioned that Mel Morris was instrumental in Quantuma’s appointment.

The icing on the cake would be for any phoenix club to be prevented from staying in the EFL and for MM to be left with his stadium as an empty white elephant and still in hock to Dell.

[1960maaan]

9 minutes ago, PHILINFRANCE said:

I suspect most observers, Derby fans or further afield, share a common view that Quantuma’s handling of the administration has been totally incompetent and unprofessional; even scandalous if this latest story is correct.

Whilst, in normal circumstances, none of us would wish liquidation on a fellow football club, with all the heartache for innocent fans and financial distress to creditors, especially small local businesses, I am now sort of hoping that it does happen, even more so as I have heard it mentioned that Mel Morris was instrumental in Quantuma’s appointment.

The icing on the cake would be for any phoenix club to be prevented from staying in the EFL and for MM to be left with his stadium as an empty white elephant and still in hock to Dell.

Didn't I read that the Club were advised against appointing them ?

Not sure whether they are corrupt or incompetent , if Morris had a hand in the appointment, I know where my money is.

[PHILINFRANCE]

1 minute ago, 1960maaan said:

Didn't I read that the Club were advised against appointing them ?

Not sure whether they are corrupt or incompetent , if Morris had a hand in the appointment, I know where my money is.

Probably both.

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, ExiledAjax said:

I think we are agreeing!

Yes, my view is there are two dodgy things happening. The one I point out, and the one you point out. Poznan should be absolutely fuming with everyone involved.

At the point the transfer was being concluded, Derby / Quantuma had already missed the payment.  Transfer should not have been allowed to progress.  I believe funds go through FIFA escrow accounts for international transfers.  If Charlotte paid Derby direct, that is wrong.  Erik Alonso, one time potential buyer at Derby, is allegedly at Charlotte, although Charlotte deny it.

[Sleepy1968]

22 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

Didn't I read that the Club were advised against appointing them ?

Not sure whether they are corrupt or incompetent , if Morris had a hand in the appointment, I know where my money is.

As owner MM put the club into administration, and got to choose the insolvency practitioner. See here for further info. I think you'd probably be safer calling them incompetent than corrupt. If they sue for libel, you might find that's one thing that they're good at. They'd probably have long list of people to go after - perhaps that's part of their ultimate business plan. Genius.

[chinapig]

50 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

Didn't I read that the Club were advised against appointing them ?

Not sure whether they are corrupt or incompetent , if Morris had a hand in the appointment, I know where my money is.

Maguire suggested that they ended up with Quantuma because no reputable insolvency practitioner would take it on.

Their particular concern was that Morris had not put the company owning the stadium into administration.

[Davefevs]

Out of interest, when Quantuma were appointed, they were announced as “joint administrator”….is that because they are working jointly with Derby.  If so, then is Morris still in effect, involved?

[Marvin]

14 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Out of interest, when Quantuma were appointed, they were announced as “joint administrator”….is that because they are working jointly with Derby.  If so, then is Morris still in effect, involved?

The wording on the press release is ambiguous: https://www.quantuma.com/insights/quantuma-appointed-joint-administrators-derby-county-football-club

"Andrew Hosking, Quantuma managing director and joint administrator, said: “I can confirm that Andrew Andronikou, Carl Jackson and I were appointed joint administrators of Derby County FC today."

All three work for Quantuma.

[ExiledAjax]

20 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Out of interest, when Quantuma were appointed, they were announced as “joint administrator”….is that because they are working jointly with Derby.  If so, then is Morris still in effect, involved?

No Dave. An administrator is an individual person. Those people work for Q, and so people refer to them as "Quantuma". But legally the administrators are Hosking, Andronikou, and Jackson. It is they who are 'joint'. They act as individuals, and have personal liability. You appoint multiple so that there is always someone who can sign stuff and deal for the Company.

2 minutes ago, Marvin said:

The wording on the press release is ambiguous: https://www.quantuma.com/insights/quantuma-appointed-joint-administrators-derby-county-football-club

"Andrew Hosking, Quantuma managing director and joint administrator, said: “I can confirm that Andrew Andronikou, Carl Jackson and I were appointed joint administrators of Derby County FC today."

All three work for Quantuma.

It is not ambiguous on the companies house filing form 30 Sep 2021.

 

Edited March 17, 2022 by ExiledAjax

[Davefevs]

2 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

No Dave. An administrator is an individual person. Those people work for Q, and so people refer to them as "Quantuma". But legally the administrators are Hosking, Andronikou, and Jackson. It is they who are 'joint'.

It is not ambiguous on the companies house filing form 30 Sep 2021.

 

Ah, yes….it’s all coming back to me now.  Ta.

[Marvin]

5 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said:

No Dave. An administrator is an individual person. Those people work for Q, and so people refer to them as "Quantuma". But legally the administrators are Hosking, Andronikou, and Jackson. It is they who are 'joint'. They act as individuals, and have personal liability. You appoint multiple so that there is always someone who can sign stuff and deal for the Company.

It is not ambiguous on the companies house filing form 30 Sep 2021.

 

Thanks EA, I had read it as 'Quantuma' had been appointed as joint administrators i.e. Quantuma as an entity and A N Other. All makes sense now.

[ExiledAjax]

1 minute ago, Marvin said:

Thanks EA, I had read it as 'Quantuma' had been appointed as joint administrators i.e. Quantuma as an entity and A N Other. All makes sense now.

Lazy writing doesn't help either. We all do it as it's quicker to write "Quantuma" etc, but technically those individuals are acting in their own capacity. Same with most professions. People act individually, but form partnerships or practices with others in order to share overheads, costs, and insurance etc. Insolvency professionals are just like that.

[CyderInACan]

6 hours ago, GrahamC said:

Rumour going around yesterday that they could be liquidated at the end of the season but allowed to start the new one in L2.

Definitely sailing closer to the brink than any big club (with no disrespect intended to Bury) since Boro back in ‘86.

This would be an utter disgrace. I don’t care how “big” Derby are, they should feel the full force of the EFL (and HMRC etc) start again in the Dog and Duck league and be grateful. League Two is no punishment at all. 
 

 

Edited March 17, 2022 by CyderInACan

[Bristol Rob]

9 minutes ago, CyderInACan said:

This would be an utter disgrace. I don’t care how “big” Derby are, they should feel the full force of the EFL (and HMRC etc) start again in the Dog and Duck league and be grateful. League Two is no punishment at all. 
 

 

The Dog and Duck have never been promoted or relegated.

They have somehow been less successful than Rochdale.

[downendcity]

1 hour ago, Bristol Rob said:

The Dog and Duck have never been promoted or relegated.

They have somehow been less successful than Rochdale.

That's because they've never been Wayne Rooney's Dog and Duck.

[exAtyeoMax]

15 minutes ago, downendcity said:

That's because they've never been Wayne Rooney's Dog and Duck.

is that Cockney rhyming slang?

[downendcity]

1 minute ago, exAtyeoMax said:

is that Cockney rhyming slang?

WRDC do appear to be Dog and Duck'd don't they? ,

[Yellow&Blue&Red]

15 hours ago, CyderInACan said:

This would be an utter disgrace. I don’t care how “big” Derby are, they should feel the full force of the EFL (and HMRC etc) start again in the Dog and Duck league and be grateful. League Two is no punishment at all. 
 

 

That feels harsh to me. And it's punishing the wrong people. Morris and the administrators are the culprits here but this wouldn't hurt them much. This would just hit employees and fans. And would mean NONE of the debts being repaid.

I don't think they should get gifted a place in L2 if they go bust, that's not fair either. But I'm not HOPING they go bust.

I hope that they get relegated, they find a buyer at a price that makes sense for L1, that as much of their debt as possible is repaid and they start next season with a hefty points deduction. That feels proportionate to the crime of fiddling FFP. 

[Davefevs]

4 minutes ago, Yellow&Blue&Red said:

That feels harsh to me. And it's punishing the wrong people. Morris and the administrators are the culprits here but this wouldn't hurt them much. This would just hit employees and fans. And would mean NONE of the debts being repaid.

I don't think they should get gifted a place in L2 if they go bust, that's not fair either. But I'm not HOPING they go bust.

I hope that they get relegated, they find a buyer at a price that makes sense for L1, that as much of their debt as possible is repaid and they start next season with a hefty points deduction. That feels proportionate to the crime of fiddling FFP. 

Derby fans on twitter starting to see Quantuma as the devil now they can’t blame Gibson, the EFL, Mr Pops (), etc.

[East Londoner]

16 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Derby fans on twitter starting to see Quantuma as the devil now they can’t blame Gibson, the EFL, Mr Pops (), etc.

Forests forum has an amusing list of people Derby fans are blaming, currently at 145 so too long to screenshot and no Mr Pops in sight 

https://www.forestforum.co.uk/threads/44511-The-demise-of-Wayne-Rooney-s-D***y-County-(in-Administration)-(and-denial)/page944

[exAtyeoMax]

13 minutes ago, East Londoner said:

Forests forum has an amusing list of people Derby fans are blaming, currently at 145 so too long to screenshot and no Mr Pops in sight 

https://www.forestforum.co.uk/threads/44511-The-demise-of-Wayne-Rooney-s-D***y-County-(in-Administration)-(and-denial)/page944

No Lee Johnson? 

 

46. Ugg (the caveman that created football, leading to the creation of the EFL)  

61. Holland & Barrett.  

Edited March 18, 2022 by exAtyeoMax

[Marvin]

15 minutes ago, East Londoner said:

Forests forum has an amusing list of people Derby fans are blaming, currently at 145 so too long to screenshot and no Mr Pops in sight 

https://www.forestforum.co.uk/threads/44511-The-demise-of-Wayne-Rooney-s-D***y-County-(in-Administration)-(and-denial)/page944

The new and improved official Derby County blame list:
1. The EFL
2. Steve Gibson
3. Neil Bausor
4. Middlesbrough
5. Rob Couhig
6. Wycombe
7. Covid
8. The ticket office
9. The HMRC
10. Nicholas Randall
11. Trevor Birch
12. Darren Bent
13. Steve McClaren
14. Danny Higginbotham
15. Richard Keogh
16. The European Super League
17. Sky Sports
18. The Football League paper
19. Burton Albion
20. Derby City Council
21. Mind (the mental health charity)
22. Opposition fans
23. The taxpayer
24. Derby's creditors
25. Forest fans that sit in the Upper Bridgford
26. Rick Parry
27. Brice Samba
28. Jack Colback
29. Simon Jordan
30. ITV Digital
31. Setanta
32. Brian Clough
33. Juventus
34. Tim Robinson
35. Lewis Grabban
36. Brennan Johnson
37. Kenny Burns
38. Nigel Clough
39. Billy Davies
40. LTLF
41. Rockabilly and his curse
42. Derby fans (whilst also being blameless at the same time)
43. Stan Collymore
44. Leeds United
45. Ed Dawes
46. Ugg (the caveman that created football, leading to the creation of the EFL)
47. Scott McKenna (for heading aeroplanes away that may contain investors, thus preventing Derby's takeover)
48. OK SpidermAndy! (for upsetting Derby fans by querying how long it will be before Derby fans nick Liverpool's "You'll Never Walk Alone" chant)
49. John Percy
50. Rob Dorsett
51. FFSForest (a Twitter user who pointed out how the absence of Derby's "unreal" supporters this season has cost them around £5m, which would help them complete the season. Clearly an EFL stooge!)
52. 166,000 empty seats (probably the fault of the seat manufacturer, rather than their "unreal" fans though)
53. Forest selling players to Olympiacos
54. Liverpool fans, Sheffield police and the Hillsboro/Govt report (making stadiums all seater prevented them from selling 60k every game)
55. Lyle Taylor
56. Adrian Durham
57. Luke Plange and Crystal Palace
58. Matt Donohue
59. Duane Holmes
60. Beardo7 and his £10 bet
61. Holland & Barrett
62. Bobby Zamora
63. Goalposts
64. Kim Leck
65. Aston Villa
66. Myself
67. The Mysterons
68. Captain Black
69. Shaggy
70. The Queen
71. RealRed85
72. Billingham Synthonia FC
73. Text messages
74. Congo_red (for daring to use facts)
75. Chevin Homes (the "preferred" partner in property)
76. Gianluca Di Marzio
77. Pozzo family (Udinese/Watford)
78. Brexit
79. Derby's Category 1 academy
80. Adam Hart-Davis
81. Birmingham City fans
82. Derby forum users Gritstone Tup and Mucker1884 (for breaking away from the hive mind and going against the narrative)
83. Chris Kirchner
84. Chris Doidge (blasphemous BBC Radio Derby presenter)
85. Daniel Taylor
86. Hasbro
87. From Software
88. Atari
89. 32 Red
90. Sheffield Wednesday fans
91. Bouncer the dog
92. Sam Longson
93. Alcohol
94. Leicester City
95. MaxiRobriguez
96. The MLS
97. The Joiners Arms in Quarndon
98. Highways England
99. Middlesbrough fans bringing facts onto Derby's forum
100. Ze list
101. Darren Huckerby
102. Del Boy and Rodney
103. Harry Enfield
104. Jeremy Simpson
105. Mason Bennett
106. Tom Lawrence
107. Ball boys
108. Scott Malone
109. Tubby pitch invaders
110. Kenny Loggins
111. Nathan Thompson
112. Vladimir Putin
113. MPs
114. "Fake" deadlines
115. The Derby Telegraph
116. The Twitter user @derbyram76 (aka Leitrim Ram) (for creating his own version of ze list)
117. Boris Johnson
118. Daleks
119. Derbyshire Mortgage Services (blasphemous mortgage firm)
120. Pancake day
121. Doctor Who and their companions
122. I'm Red Till Dead
123. BBC Radio Derby
124. Colin Fray
125. Uche Ikpeazu
126. Sky Bet
127. Mitchell and Webb
128. Cardiff City fans
129. Bungle from Rainbow (his coke addiction is causing confusion in the Quantuma offices, thus preventing Derby's takeover)
130. Notcher
131. Whoever at Nottingham Forest is asking the EFL to lobby FIFA to let players at Russian clubs walk away from their contracts
132. Chelsea
133. DC Comics
134. Preston North End
135. Billy Joel
136. Igor Novikov
137. Ben Smyth (treacherous "Derby fan" on Twitter slandering Derby's "amazing" supporters)
138. Joel Moore (another Derby traitor on Twitter who is going against the "Fight 'till the end" narrative)
139. Lech Poznan (for having the audacity to ask for money owed to them)
140. Kieran Maguire
141. Truth
142. HBB
143. Evangelos Marinakis
144. David (moderator on the DCFC Fans forum)
145. "Interested parties"

[REDOXO]

5 hours ago, East Londoner said:

Forests forum has an amusing list of people Derby fans are blaming, currently at 145 so too long to screenshot and no Mr Pops in sight 

https://www.forestforum.co.uk/threads/44511-The-demise-of-Wayne-Rooney-s-D***y-County-(in-Administration)-(and-denial)/page944

Looking at that, makes me thankful for what the admins and developers do here. The site is almost unreadable. 

[exAtyeoMax]

5 hours ago, Marvin said:

91. Bouncer the dog

and his mate, Wellard…

[PHILINFRANCE]

From that same thread ,which I thought was quite amusing.

[REDOXO]

9 hours ago, Marvin said:

The new and improved official Derby County blame list:
1. The EFL
2. Steve Gibson
3. Neil Bausor
4. Middlesbrough
5. Rob Couhig
6. Wycombe
7. Covid
8. The ticket office
9. The HMRC
10. Nicholas Randall
11. Trevor Birch
12. Darren Bent
13. Steve McClaren
14. Danny Higginbotham
15. Richard Keogh
16. The European Super League
17. Sky Sports
18. The Football League paper
19. Burton Albion
20. Derby City Council
21. Mind (the mental health charity)
22. Opposition fans
23. The taxpayer
24. Derby's creditors
25. Forest fans that sit in the Upper Bridgford
26. Rick Parry
27. Brice Samba
28. Jack Colback
29. Simon Jordan
30. ITV Digital
31. Setanta
32. Brian Clough
33. Juventus
34. Tim Robinson
35. Lewis Grabban
36. Brennan Johnson
37. Kenny Burns
38. Nigel Clough
39. Billy Davies
40. LTLF
41. Rockabilly and his curse
42. Derby fans (whilst also being blameless at the same time)
43. Stan Collymore
44. Leeds United
45. Ed Dawes
46. Ugg (the caveman that created football, leading to the creation of the EFL)
47. Scott McKenna (for heading aeroplanes away that may contain investors, thus preventing Derby's takeover)
48. OK SpidermAndy! (for upsetting Derby fans by querying how long it will be before Derby fans nick Liverpool's "You'll Never Walk Alone" chant)
49. John Percy
50. Rob Dorsett
51. FFSForest (a Twitter user who pointed out how the absence of Derby's "unreal" supporters this season has cost them around £5m, which would help them complete the season. Clearly an EFL stooge!)
52. 166,000 empty seats (probably the fault of the seat manufacturer, rather than their "unreal" fans though)
53. Forest selling players to Olympiacos
54. Liverpool fans, Sheffield police and the Hillsboro/Govt report (making stadiums all seater prevented them from selling 60k every game)
55. Lyle Taylor
56. Adrian Durham
57. Luke Plange and Crystal Palace
58. Matt Donohue
59. Duane Holmes
60. Beardo7 and his £10 bet
61. Holland & Barrett
62. Bobby Zamora
63. Goalposts
64. Kim Leck
65. Aston Villa
66. Myself
67. The Mysterons
68. Captain Black
69. Shaggy
70. The Queen
71. RealRed85
72. Billingham Synthonia FC
73. Text messages
74. Congo_red (for daring to use facts)
75. Chevin Homes (the "preferred" partner in property)
76. Gianluca Di Marzio
77. Pozzo family (Udinese/Watford)
78. Brexit
79. Derby's Category 1 academy
80. Adam Hart-Davis
81. Birmingham City fans
82. Derby forum users Gritstone Tup and Mucker1884 (for breaking away from the hive mind and going against the narrative)
83. Chris Kirchner
84. Chris Doidge (blasphemous BBC Radio Derby presenter)
85. Daniel Taylor
86. Hasbro
87. From Software
88. Atari
89. 32 Red
90. Sheffield Wednesday fans
91. Bouncer the dog
92. Sam Longson
93. Alcohol
94. Leicester City
95. MaxiRobriguez
96. The MLS
97. The Joiners Arms in Quarndon
98. Highways England
99. Middlesbrough fans bringing facts onto Derby's forum
100. Ze list
101. Darren Huckerby
102. Del Boy and Rodney
103. Harry Enfield
104. Jeremy Simpson
105. Mason Bennett
106. Tom Lawrence
107. Ball boys
108. Scott Malone
109. Tubby pitch invaders
110. Kenny Loggins
111. Nathan Thompson
112. Vladimir Putin
113. MPs
114. "Fake" deadlines
115. The Derby Telegraph
116. The Twitter user @derbyram76 (aka Leitrim Ram) (for creating his own version of ze list)
117. Boris Johnson
118. Daleks
119. Derbyshire Mortgage Services (blasphemous mortgage firm)
120. Pancake day
121. Doctor Who and their companions
122. I'm Red Till Dead
123. BBC Radio Derby
124. Colin Fray
125. Uche Ikpeazu
126. Sky Bet
127. Mitchell and Webb
128. Cardiff City fans
129. Bungle from Rainbow (his coke addiction is causing confusion in the Quantuma offices, thus preventing Derby's takeover)
130. Notcher
131. Whoever at Nottingham Forest is asking the EFL to lobby FIFA to let players at Russian clubs walk away from their contracts
132. Chelsea
133. DC Comics
134. Preston North End
135. Billy Joel
136. Igor Novikov
137. Ben Smyth (treacherous "Derby fan" on Twitter slandering Derby's "amazing" supporters)
138. Joel Moore (another Derby traitor on Twitter who is going against the "Fight 'till the end" narrative)
139. Lech Poznan (for having the audacity to ask for money owed to them)
140. Kieran Maguire
141. Truth
142. HBB
143. Evangelos Marinakis
144. David (moderator on the DCFC Fans forum)
145. "Interested parties"

146. Mr Popodopolos

147. Anyone who blames Mel 

148. Derbyshire MPs

149. Bloke who interviewed Couhig on BBC Radio Derby

150. Derbyshire Live  

 

[Lanterne Rouge]

2 hours ago, PHILINFRANCE said:

From that same thread ,which I thought was quite amusing.

Is that from g*schat?

[downendcity]

4 hours ago, PHILINFRANCE said:

From that same thread ,which I thought was quite amusing.

Sounds like a fairly normal family up here in Fenland 

[Davefevs]

 

[ExiledAjax]

31 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

 

Interesting re Lech Poznan. Fingers crossed they'll make a statement  themselves to set out their side.

Other than that it's another vacuous Friday statement isn't it.

[chinapig]

9 hours ago, Davefevs said:

 

A statement empty of content as usual though I note the word imminent doesn't appear this time. 

Good faith my arse.

[Hxj]

Looking good for Derby County at 3pm today.  Another point picked up, and Barnsley lost.

At 5 pm things are looking rather desperate.  Reading won at home against Blackburn.

So Derby County started the season 15 points behind Reading and with 7 games remaining are 8 points adrift. Now Derby need 8 points more than Reading from 7 remaining games, oh and they also need to get 3 points more than Barnsley,

I've also learnt a new excuse for delay.  Apparently failing a self-imposed deadline 'in good faith' is fine.

[ExiledAjax]

1 hour ago, Hxj said:

Looking good for Derby County at 3pm today.  Another point picked up, and Barnsley lost.

At 5 pm things are looking rather desperate.  Reading won at home against Blackburn.

So Derby County started the season 15 points behind Reading and with 7 games remaining are 8 points adrift. Now Derby need 8 points more than Reading from 7 remaining games, oh and they also need to get 3 points more than Barnsley,

I've also learnt a new excuse for delay.  Apparently failing a self-imposed deadline 'in good faith' is fine.

Yeh, fivethirtyeight think it's all but done now. Only a 4% chance of survival by their reckoning. Jolly good.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Actual football post by me on Derby- novel I know!

Rooney said Derby should have had 3- yes three- penalties today. Obviously didn't see their game but that sounds a bit of a stretch.

[chinapig]

3 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Actual football post by me on Derby- novel I know!

Rooney said Derby should have had 3- yes three- penalties today. Obviously didn't see their game but that sounds a bit of a stretch.

Remember he has already said there is a conspiracy by referees against them to add to all the other conspirators.

I saw the second half and the penalty they were given was very soft. Otherwise I don't recall any other penalty claims.

[Charlie BCFC]

1 hour ago, chinapig said:

Remember he has already said there is a conspiracy by referees against them to add to all the other conspirators.

I saw the second half and the penalty they were given was very soft. Otherwise I don't recall any other penalty claims.

Very interesting he says that when we’ve had just the one after being denied so many stonewall penalties. Don’t even think Swansea have had a penalty this season 

[Jerseybean]

Derby County’s versatile prospect Festy Ebosele is set to join Italian club Udinese next week.

[cidered abroad]

1 hour ago, Jerseybean said:

Derby County’s versatile prospect Festy Ebosele is set to join Italian club Udinese next week.

And then on to Watford for a miserly fee?

[East Londoner]

13 hours ago, chinapig said:

Remember he has already said there is a conspiracy by referees against them to add to all the other conspirators.

I saw the second half and the penalty they were given was very soft. Otherwise I don't recall any other penalty claims.

There’s a whole thread on their forum on how they’re the victims of some conspiracy to ensure they get relegated by denying them penalties etc etc. They’re world class at playing the victim I’ll give them that 

Couldn’t be bothered to register to point out its actually the standard of refereeing and they’ve been given more than we have 

[Lanterne Rouge]

Rock bottom now after Posh unexpectedly beat QPR 3-1 away.

[Wrongagain]

21 hours ago, chinapig said:

Remember he has already said there is a conspiracy by referees against them to add to all the other conspirators.

I saw the second half and the penalty they were given was very soft. Otherwise I don't recall any other penalty claims.

Was pure acting, jumped up and dropped on his knees, ref bought it - doubt the EFL will review it though 

[ExiledAjax]

3 hours ago, Lanterne Rouge said:

Rock bottom now after Posh unexpectedly beat QPR 3-1 away.

Inject it.

[Davefevs]

Big assumption in this that HMRC will accept 25%.

If they don’t but accepted a payment plan of say 25% and the rest over 20 years plus interest, how does that affect the amount bid?

[cidered abroad]

57 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Big assumption in this that HMRC will accept 25%.

If they don’t but accepted a payment plan of say 25% and the rest over 20 years plus interest, how does that affect the amount bid?

Appalling if they get any reduction or extended payments when last owner could pay this, probably without noticing the reduction in his fortune.

[Hxj]

Interesting stuff, will BAWT be on the conspiracy list next 

It also has a flaw in the scenarios.  Assume that £20 million is available in the administration after fees, that legally is due to MSD.  If MSD decide not to collect in the administration and the funds go elsewhere they would have real difficulty in collecting elsewhere or on a personal guarantee as the loss arises purely from MSD's own actions, not those of the guarantors.

[Hxj]

And the latest - 'believe' 'end of week' sounds familiar!

A statement from Team Derby says Quantuma “believe” they’ll be in a position to name a preferred bidder by the end of the week. “Quantuma confirmed there are multiple bids and expressions of interest, and are now in the final stages of clarification”

[REDOXO]

It was a good article. The flaws pointed out above are clear. The way I see it is HMRC will not be brushed over with 25p on the pound. 
 

They could of course give time to pay over an extended period but would themselves want guarantees that the back debt is payable by the new group. 
 

As pointed out in the previous pages DCFC has tax debt around 15x higher (close to 30m a good deal more than the article suggests) than the nearest club QPR.  If anyone thinks this is passed anyone at the revenue by they are nuts. Any deal with HMRC is going to be from their side to stop any other club from not paying them and then pleading poor 

Can you imagine if Derby get away with stuffing the nation because HMRC are seen as soft what will happen at other clubs. 
 

I came to the conclusion unless they found a Saudi or Russian oligarchs (they are a bit thin ion the ground right now) months ago the only way out is for Mel to hand over the ground as a gift accept the club are worth nothing and allow the buyer to spend their money on the debt to the government and the poor little guys who get 25p for their pound note. 
 

oOtherwise Derby are done!

[ExiledAjax]

34 minutes ago, Hxj said:

And the latest - 'believe' 'end of week' sounds familiar!

A statement from Team Derby says Quantuma “believe” they’ll be in a position to name a preferred bidder by the end of the week. “Quantuma confirmed there are multiple bids and expressions of interest, and are now in the final stages of clarification”

Talk of both bids and expressions of interest. Does that mean there are new parties 'expressing interest' after the deadline for bids (a deadline that was self-imposed by Q and so can be ignored, restated, or moved at their whim). Mixed messages there IMO. On the one hand they are in the final stages of clarification, on the other they are still considering mere 'expressions of interest'.

Then again, there are typos and errors in the rest of the statement, so it is well within the realm of possibility that the use of that phrase is a meaningless weasel word.

[Davefevs]

35 minutes ago, REDOXO said:

It was a good article. The flaws pointed out above are clear. The way I see it is HMRC will not be brushed over with 25p on the pound. 
 

They could of course give time to pay over an extended period but would themselves want guarantees that the back debt is payable by the new group. 
 

As pointed out in the previous pages DCFC has tax debt around 15x higher (close to 30m a good deal more than the article suggests) than the nearest club QPR.  If anyone thinks this is passed anyone at the revenue by they are nuts. Any deal with HMRC is going to be from their side to stop any other club from not paying them and then pleading poor 

Can you imagine if Derby get away with stuffing the nation because HMRC are seen as soft what will happen at other clubs. 
 

I came to the conclusion unless they found a Saudi or Russian oligarchs (they are a bit thin ion the ground right now) months ago the only way out is for Mel to hand over the ground as a gift accept the club are worth nothing and allow the buyer to spend their money on the debt to the government and the poor little guys who get 25p for their pound note. 
 

oOtherwise Derby are done!

Been my view since I found out the HMRC amount.

[Davefevs]

1 minute ago, ExiledAjax said:

Talk of both bids and expressions of interest. Does that mean there are new parties 'expressing interest' after the deadline for bids (a deadline that was self-imposed by Q and so can be ignored, restated, or moved at their whim). Mixed messages there IMO. On the one hand they are in the final stages of clarification, on the other they are still considering mere 'expressions of interest'.

Then again, there are typos and errors in the rest of the statement, so it is well within the realm of possibility that the use of that phrase is a meaningless weasel word.

[chinapig]

46 minutes ago, Hxj said:

And the latest - 'believe' 'end of week' sounds familiar!

A statement from Team Derby says Quantuma “believe” they’ll be in a position to name a preferred bidder by the end of the week. “Quantuma confirmed there are multiple bids and expressions of interest, and are now in the final stages of clarification”

So, approximately the 42nd time a preferred bidder has been imminent. Is this a record?