should we stop attending away games to save OUR planet?

[Never to the dark side]

Of course not.

Bristol City are one of the four teams in the championship that have the furthest to travel this season.

I am a supporter of short distances for the planned FIVE away mid week games,

and long distance match's to be played on Saturdays, WHEN the fixtures are FIRST published.

PLEDGEBALL want Football followers to try and reduce their football carbon footprint.

Nearly 3,000 City fans went to coventry fans attended the game against Coventry on Saturday

I think approx ten coaches took fans to the game,correct me if I am wrong,and approx one hundred fans were on the first available Birmingham to Bristol train

That equates to approx 2,500 City went by car, and if each car took two persons that 1,250 cars were used to attend the game.

Maybe  football train specials could be started again(FREE OF CHARGE) subject to all passengers buying their match day tickets in advance.

See all you hoardes at Sheffield and Hull etc.

[The Batman]

Was watching the champions league game the other night and bt had an advert with Joe Cole about the impact of climate change and what "we" (as in us) can do. One of them being not flying. 

Course, the irony being it was champions league week where I believe that every club playing away would have flown to and from their match. 

These ideals are for us plebs. Not for the wealthy elite who can carry on as normal. We're the problem, not them. 

If they really care about the effect of flying on the climate, do away with the champions league...... Let's see some tangible effort made by the preachers for once. 

[Sir Geoff]

13 minutes ago, Never to the dark side said:

Of course not.

Bristol City are one of the four teams in the championship that have the furthest to travel this season.

I am a supporter of short distances for the planned FIVE away mid week games,

and long distance match's to be played on Saturdays, WHEN the fixtures are FIRST published.

PLEDGEBALL want Football followers to try and reduce their football carbon footprint.

Nearly 3,000 City fans went to coventry fans attended the game against Coventry on Saturday

I think approx ten coaches took fans to the game,correct me if I am wrong,and approx one hundred fans were on the first available Birmingham to Bristol train

That equates to approx 2,500 City went by car, and if each car took two persons that 1,250 cars were used to attend the game.

Maybe  football train specials could be started again(FREE OF CHARGE) subject to all passengers buying their match day tickets in advance.

See all you hoardes at Sheffield and Hull etc.

This exactly, even a tenner would induce people to use public transport. The extortionate price of public transport is my big bugbear with successive Governments trying to force people out of cars. I travel a round trip of 4 hours to every home game and would prefer to travel by train (to Parson St of course) but it is double the price and adds at least an hour to my journey.

[Oh Louie louie]

I would not like to put a figure on the amount who fly in for liverpool games.

Wouldnt suprise me if it was 5000, probaly more.

 

[East Londoner]

18 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

This exactly, even a tenner would induce people to use public transport. The extortionate price of public transport is my big bugbear with successive Governments trying to force people out of cars. I travel a round trip of 4 hours to every home game and would prefer to travel by train (to Parson St of course) but it is double the price and adds at least an hour to my journey.

Problem Bristol has is it’s public transport is woeful compared to virtually every other major British city with the exception of perhaps Leeds. I took my flatmate to Bristol for the balloon fiesta a couple of years back and their main assessment of Bristol was it badly needs a transport system.

The metrobus thing looks farcical and is like putting a Tesco value plaster over the problem. There have been opportunities like the tram a few years back when BCC didn’t want it going to Cribbs and so another city got the funding instead 

I know it’s a cultural thing in Bristol peoples attachment to their cars but thats probably as much due to the lack of realistic alternative.

[Puckle_red]

I was looking up trains to Blackpool for the game in Feb. £100pp, or I can drive there and back on a full tank, roughly £70 total so £35 each, decision made. I've always wondered why train fare is so expensive, a shame as it makes more of a day of it. 

[Galley is our king]

Don't Want this to become too political but we should probably stop doing lots of things but what is the point of us doing anything when China, Russia and India just carry on regardless?

Perhaps Greta should demonstrate in Beijing or Moscow, see how that goes.....

[Sir Geoff]

2 hours ago, Galley is our king said:

Don't Want this to become too political but we should probably stop doing lots of things but what is the point of us doing anything when China, Russia and India just carry on regardless?

Perhaps Greta should demonstrate in Beijing or Moscow, see how that goes.....

Exactly, as if our tiny island will make a big difference in the larger scheme of things.

[054123]

54 minutes ago, Sir Geoff said:

Exactly, as if our tiny island will make a big difference in the larger scheme of things.

All you can control is what you can control.

Seems a weak response to excuse your own accountability.

Thats by the by though. I was hoping this was more in protest at where we are as a club.

I quite like the idea.

People get in their high horse if you boo or show negativity at the ground, so let’s just not turn up?

[Shaun Taylor]

Man Utd first team squad flying to East Midlands airport to play Leicester a few weeks ago

[1960maaan]

3 hours ago, Puckle_red said:

I was looking up trains to Blackpool for the game in Feb. £100pp, or I can drive there and back on a full tank, roughly £70 total so £35 each, decision made. I've always wondered why train fare is so expensive, a shame as it makes more of a day of it. 

When I first looked at train for Coventry, it was coming up around £67. A mate organised it , split ticket etc, ended up going via Gloucester, cost £35. Northern games are a rip off. I've pretty much given up on trains further North. We are trying to plan a trip to Rangers, cheaper to fly than go by train, absolute nonsense.

[cidered abroad]

You should stop going to away games to save your sanity!

[Sir Geoff]

3 hours ago, 054123 said:

All you can control is what you can control.

Seems a weak response to excuse your own accountability.

Thats by the by though. I was hoping this was more in protest at where we are as a club.

I quite like the idea.

People get in their high horse if you boo or show negativity at the ground, so let’s just not turn up?

If you read the post properly you would see that I was responding to the last line of Galley is our king's post not stating something that I believe in.  Totally agree that everyone on the planet should make an effort (and I seem to be the only local dog walker that leaves the beach having collected several plastic / glass bottles to take home and recycle) but if the huge nations don't bother then what we do, as a small nation, is a total waste of time imo.

[The Original OTIB]

7 hours ago, Never to the dark side said:

Of course not.

Bristol City are one of the four teams in the championship that have the furthest to travel this season.

I am a supporter of short distances for the planned FIVE away mid week games,

and long distance match's to be played on Saturdays, WHEN the fixtures are FIRST published.

PLEDGEBALL want Football followers to try and reduce their football carbon footprint.

Nearly 3,000 City fans went to coventry fans attended the game against Coventry on Saturday

I think approx ten coaches took fans to the game,correct me if I am wrong,and approx one hundred fans were on the first available Birmingham to Bristol train

That equates to approx 2,500 City went by car, and if each car took two persons that 1,250 cars were used to attend the game.

Maybe  football train specials could be started again(FREE OF CHARGE) subject to all passengers buying their match day tickets in advance.

See all you hoardes at Sheffield and Hull etc.

Train companies removing the cheap day returns on the weekend killed the train option.

[2015]

7 hours ago, The Batman said:

Was watching the champions league game the other night and bt had an advert with Joe Cole about the impact of climate change and what "we" (as in us) can do. One of them being not flying. 

Course, the irony being it was champions league week where I believe that every club playing away would have flown to and from their match. 

These ideals are for us plebs. Not for the wealthy elite who can carry on as normal. We're the problem, not them. 

If they really care about the effect of flying on the climate, do away with the champions league...... Let's see some tangible effort made by the preachers for once. 

Blimey never seen a truer word spoken about this subject. 

[swanker]

Back in the day my mate used to thumb a lift to away games. He even managed to watch city at Sunderland that way. 

[The Batman]

15 minutes ago, 2015 said:

Blimey never seen a truer word spoken about this subject. 

I speak the truth all the time. It's rather inconvenient to many people

[LondonBristolian]

7 hours ago, Galley is our king said:

Don't Want this to become too political but we should probably stop doing lots of things but what is the point of us doing anything when China, Russia and India just carry on regardless?

Perhaps Greta should demonstrate in Beijing or Moscow, see how that goes.....

I always think it's a bit cheap and irrelevant argument to criticise someone actually trying to do something for doing the wrong things rather than the people not taking action.

What frustrates me is the way businesses and governments constantly try to make us feel guilty about our individual choices and try to present climate change as something that is fixed by individual choices to distract us from putting the pressure on them to face up to their responsibilities to be sustainable. 

Greta should carry on doing what she is doing. But world leaders and businesses need to face up to their responsibilities. Our government - and other governments - should look at making systemic changes but also putting pressure on China, Russia, India and all the businesses contributing to emissions.

I absolutely agree with @The Batman that the problem is the wealthy elite who carry on as normal. But footballers are barely even scratching the surface of that problem. The power to change lies with oligarachs and billionaires. If they don't change then any change we make is pretty much irrelevant. 

[cheese]

Dunno about the planet, but it might save my sanity.

[frenchred]

I'm stopping going cause we are shite

[TBW]

Travel contributes far less to annual CO2 issues than many other things.

If we stopped trying to make everybody live forever and encouraged people to stop after one child it'd help far more than a round trip to Bournemouth ever would.

 

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

4 hours ago, LondonBristolian said:

I always think it's a bit cheap and irrelevant argument to criticise someone actually trying to do something for doing the wrong things rather than the people not taking action.

What frustrates me is the way businesses and governments constantly try to make us feel guilty about our individual choices and try to present climate change as something that is fixed by individual choices to distract us from putting the pressure on them to face up to their responsibilities to be sustainable. 

Greta should carry on doing what she is doing. But world leaders and businesses need to face up to their responsibilities. Our government - and other governments - should look at making systemic changes but also putting pressure on China, Russia, India and all the businesses contributing to emissions.

I absolutely agree with @The Batman that the problem is the wealthy elite who carry on as normal. But footballers are barely even scratching the surface of that problem. The power to change lies with oligarachs and billionaires. If they don't change then any change we make is pretty much irrelevant. 

Absolutely correct. You can feel good about it if you like but English football fans reducing their travel doesn't amount to a hill of beans in efforts to save the planet. We may think that a 300 mile trip is a long way but its nothing compared to distances travelled across Europe. It's not as if we're not trying anyway with electrification of the railways and electric cars. Football specials are a nice idea but even if the rail companies wanted them (which they don't) where are the trains going to come from. They struggle to run services now without adding to them. 

[myol'man]

I glued my face to the road outside of the Ricoh, no-one noticed, I'm still here. 

[The turtle]

12 hours ago, East Londoner said:

Problem Bristol has is it’s public transport is woeful compared to virtually every other major British city with the exception of perhaps Leeds. I took my flatmate to Bristol for the balloon fiesta a couple of years back and their main assessment of Bristol was it badly needs a transport system.

The metrobus thing looks farcical and is like putting a Tesco value plaster over the problem. There have been opportunities like the tram a few years back when BCC didn’t want it going to Cribbs and so another city got the funding instead 

I know it’s a cultural thing in Bristol peoples attachment to their cars but thats probably as much due to the lack of realistic alternative.

When I moved to Madrid, the difference in public transport blew my mind. 

AND CHEAP (even if it has gone up over 10 years) 

 

55€ for the month: metro, bus, airport access. An absolute bargain. Never mind the fact the system in itself is fantastic. 

 

Every time I come back to Bristol, the serious b***hing begins alone. 

7.50 for a single from the airport 

Tickets which don't count on conpetitor services. 

And the timetable. I don't need to say more. 

 

Truly, you don't realise what's possible till you live elsewhere. 

[underover]

Public transport especially our trains are truly a shambles, only in NZ was it worse where you basically have to fly anywhere to get anywhere on time if you’re not driving (or even if you are driving tbh). Countries across Europe certainly differ in quality, functionality and price but I most recently went from Berlin to Wrocław for ~€30, the train from Copenhagen to Malmö iirc was about 70-80dkk I remember thinking ‘oh a touch pricey’ before I remembered the exchange rate, it’s about £8, and also Rotterdam to Groningen (other side of the country) is showing as €27.40 right now on the NS app, not forgetting the fact that you can use the chipkaart on buses trams and trains which is SO convenient I was almost tempted to live there just for that (not really of course but the novelty of being able to get public transport easily was huge).
Conversely I actually can’t get the train to Sheffield United because someone thought having it at 12:30 on a Sunday would be a good idea and of course with Sunday service, nothing would get me there on time. Solution? Drive I suppose, it would also be cheaper than the ~£100 the tickets appeared to be when I briefly checked. 
At least Manchester has some good trams though. 
Edit: I’m obviously not saying that NZ is the only country that’s worse simply of all the places I’ve tried to use public transport consistently & not just as a tourist getting airport buses/taxis

Edited November 8, 2021 by underover

[Wealwayseatcheese]

On 08/11/2021 at 08:30, Galley is our king said:

Don't Want this to become too political but we should probably stop doing lots of things but what is the point of us doing anything when China, Russia and India just carry on regardless?

Perhaps Greta should demonstrate in Beijing or Moscow, see how that goes.....

How does the odious little bint travel the world ??
does she lease the Tardis from the Dr?

[Galley is our king]

9 minutes ago, Wealwayseatcheese said:

How does the odious little bint travel the world ??
does she lease the Tardis from the Dr?

No, just walks on water ......apparently 

[TheReds]

I will stop taking a flight, driving a car etc etc when the hypocrites preaching to us start doing the same. It was a nice touch of Joe Biden to only have 85 cars driving to the COP26, that was obviously a must.... How many planes flew in exactly? But as long as a celebrity tells me what not to do, with their staggering hypocrisy they can frankly do one imo.

[2015]

1 minute ago, TheReds said:

I will stop taking a flight, driving a car etc etc when the hypocrites preaching to us start doing the same. It was a nice touch of Joe Biden to only have 85 cars driving to the COP26, that was obviously a must.... How many planes flew in exactly? But as long as a celebrity tells me what not to do, with their staggering hypocrisy they can frankly do one imo.

Celebrities/Elites/Politicians have no idea how the 'normal' people live, I would say the majority of people are concerned about putting food on the table for them and their family. 

It's nauseating listening to them drone on and on about their endless rubbish, they're boring - no wonder TV and Film has gone way downhill over the last decade or so when majority are more interested in stroking their own false ego and their hypocrisy stinks

[stephenkibby.]

48 minutes ago, TheReds said:

I will stop taking a flight, driving a car etc etc when the hypocrites preaching to us start doing the same. It was a nice touch of Joe Biden to only have 85 cars driving to the COP26, that was obviously a must.... How many planes flew in exactly? But as long as a celebrity tells me what not to do, with their staggering hypocrisy they can frankly do one imo.

The Green Council leader for Brighton and Hove flew to Glasgow for the summit.

You couldn't make it up.

[Wealwayseatcheese]

They hired diesel generators to charge the fleet of Tesla cars they had laid on because not enough charging points at venues . It’s all hypocritical b ollox 

[IAmNick]

"Other people do bad things so why should I stop?"

Bringing out the secondary school level arguments I see

[cheese]

15 hours ago, myol'man said:

I glued my face to the road outside of the Ricoh, no-one noticed, I'm still here. 

Bit like the players who glued their boots to the turf.

[Bas's perfect hattrick]

4 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

"Other people do bad things so why should I stop?"

Bringing out the secondary school level arguments I see

Agree with this. Ultimately, everyone has to make their own decision on what steps they take to reduce their environmental impact. I personally think we are facing a very serious problem, so I have reduced the amount of meat I eat along with the things I was doing before (cycling, not owning a car etc.). 

I totally agree with the arguments made above about China's huge impact, and the hypocrisy from the rich + famous pisses me off too. However, I can only control my own consumption. I suspect that most people who use the China/elites argument to continue as normal don't really give a toss about climate change and are happy for the excuse

[TheReds]

2 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

"Other people do bad things so why should I stop?"

Bringing out the secondary school level arguments I see

Indeed, and I have no shame whatsoever using it. 

If this is the crisis that these people are telling us it is, then why are they literally doing nothing about it themselves, bar virtue signalling to the peasants of society? Why do they still go on holiday and get flights (mainly private jets)? Why do they still have gas guzzling motors? The climate spokesperson for the PM drives a diesel and not electric, whilst telling people to go electric. How are Gretas people getting everywhere, it wouldn't be flying would it?

I just don't understand how these people know so much about this crisis, and know how much damage we are all doing to the planet, yet they cannot be bothered to even practice what they preach and do absolutely nothing - they cannot be that worried can they.

It's hypocrisy of the highest order, and quite frankly all they are all doing is making people think "why bother".

[IAmNick]

7 minutes ago, TheReds said:

Indeed, and I have no shame whatsoever using it. 

If this is the crisis that these people are telling us it is, then why are they literally doing nothing about it themselves, bar virtue signalling to the peasants of society? Why do they still go on holiday and get flights (mainly private jets)? Why do they still have gas guzzling motors? The climate spokesperson for the PM drives a diesel and not electric, whilst telling people to go electric. How are Gretas people getting everywhere, it wouldn't be flying would it?

I just don't understand how these people know so much about this crisis, and know how much damage we are all doing to the planet, yet they cannot be bothered to even practice what they preach and do absolutely nothing - they cannot be that worried can they.

It's hypocrisy of the highest order, and quite frankly all they are all doing is making people think "why bother".

The truth is that individual changes (e.g. you changing from diesel to electric or me using a refillable washing liquid thingy) are a drop in the ocean on the grand scheme of things. I read recently that if you or I lived an entirely neutral life regarding emissions, it wouldn't even be the equivalent of 1 second of the global energy sector. That doesn't mean we shouldn't do them imo, but we need real systematic, society level changes.

I don't see how it's virtue signaling if they're clearly not doing it themselves at the same time? Surely that's the opposite?

Greta flies around, sure. Does that make her message wrong? It's a classic "You complain about society yet you live in society how curious" thing. Do you expect her to live in a mud hut and wear rags?

One reason they can't be bothered is that they're lobbied with amazing amount of money by the fossil fuel industry. The largest delegation to COP26 was the fossil fuel industry, more so than any single country.

It may be hypocrisy, but people use that as an excuse to ignore the argument and just attack the messengers so they don't have to bother changing. We're all going to be f*cked (or rather, my 1yr old son may well be) if that keeps happening.

Edited November 9, 2021 by IAmNick

[TheReds]

10 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

It may be hypocrisy, but people use that as an excuse to ignore the argument and just attack the messengers so they don't have to bother changing

Well on that note, from now on I will tell everyone to go electric, stop flying, stop eating meat etc etc, but not do it myself as I'm just a messenger. When the messengers are people like Lewis Hamilton who flies a dog on private plane, and Greta who is now reported to be a millionaire (wasn't she having a go at people profiting from this crisis over the weekend), then they won't be getting me on board for the full menu of change. 

I do enough myself imo, but certainly will carry on flying for a holiday, driving a diesel, as an electric car is a non starter for me, and eating meat. As I said it cannot be that much of a crisis when the messengers, actors, celebrities tell us all what to do, but they cannot be bothered to practice what they preach, they either do not care one bit, or there just isn't the crisis they are telling us about. 

[IAmNick]

11 minutes ago, TheReds said:

Well on that note, from now on I will tell everyone to go electric, stop flying, stop eating meat etc etc, but not do it myself as I'm just a messenger. When the messengers are people like Lewis Hamilton who flies a dog on private plane, and Greta who is now reported to be a millionaire (wasn't she having a go at people profiting from this crisis over the weekend), then they won't be getting me on board for the full menu of change. 

I do enough myself imo, but certainly will carry on flying for a holiday, driving a diesel, as an electric car is a non starter for me, and eating meat. As I said it cannot be that much of a crisis when the messengers, actors, celebrities tell us all what to do, but they cannot be bothered to practice what they preach, they either do not care one bit, or there just isn't the crisis they are telling us about. 

I think you're misunderstanding. I'm saying that just because they don't practice what they preach doesn't mean their message is wrong - it just means they're hypocrites.

It seems like you want to follow a person, rather than the look at the argument they're making. If there is a perfect squeaky clean climate activist you'd be on board, if Greta has made some money and sometimes gets on a jet that means the whole thing isn't worth it. That's a really odd stance to me.

I think it's OK to fly sometimes, and eat meat. I eat meat, drive a petrol car, and like the heating on a bit earlier than I should do probably. That doesn't mean I don't think it's an important problem though - it's a scale. I don't think you're a bad person if you have a diesel because you need it.

The problem is that the people who are telling us (the messengers) are in general the ones it wont affect. Like with most of these things, it will affect the poorest here and especially abroad first.

That's why it's important to look at the argument, not the person telling you it.

As I said, what people really need to focus on are large scale changes far outside anything you or I could directly affect. I think it's an intentional tactic to try and push responsibility down onto us while the ones in charge basically pay lip service (if that) to it... or actively work against it. Same with covid - push the responsibility down to normal people so we all fight with each other, while everything goes to hell in the background.

Edited November 9, 2021 by IAmNick

[Crackers Corner]

7 minutes ago, IAmNick said:

I think you're misunderstanding. I'm saying that just because they don't practice what they preach doesn't mean their message is wrong - it just means they're hypocrites.

It seems like you want to follow a person, rather than the look at the argument they're making. If there is a perfect squeaky clean climate activist you'd be on board, if Greta has made some money and sometimes gets on a jet that means the whole thing isn't worth it. That's a really odd stance to me.

I think it's OK to fly sometimes, and eat meat. I eat meat, drive a petrol car, and like the heating on a bit earlier than I should do probably. That doesn't mean I don't think it's an important problem though - it's a scale. I don't think you're a bad person if you have a diesel because you need it.

The problem is that the people who are telling us (the messengers) are in general the ones it wont affect. Like with most of these things, it will affect the poorest here and especially abroad first.

That's why it's important to look at the argument, not the person telling you it.

As I said, what people really need to focus on are large scale changes far outside anything you or I could directly affect. I think it's an intentional tactic to try and push responsibility down onto us while the ones in charge basically pay lip service (if that) to it... or actively work against it. Same with covid - push the responsibility down to normal people so we all fight with each other, while everything goes to hell in the background.

 Complely agree, it all boils down to money, always has and always will, its the same reason why some can afford teslas (and 3 holidays a year) and most are stuck with petrol/diesels and one holiday if they are lucky. Its why everyone would love to go organic but cant. Make green affordable for the masses rather than bombarding them with doom in the news and it will be far more effective Than people superglueing thier hands to the m25. It really boils my piss when the bbc fly reporters to the Antarctic to tell us how bad it is damaging we are when they are creating loads of co2 to go there in the first place. 

[BS4 on Tour...]

Thread title will be used as the next excuse by the roverzzzz for their measly, non-massive away support ...

[oldstandrobin]

On 09/11/2021 at 13:16, Crackers Corner said:

 Complely agree, it all boils down to money, always has and always will, its the same reason why some can afford teslas (and 3 holidays a year) and most are stuck with petrol/diesels and one holiday if they are lucky. Its why everyone would love to go organic but cant. Make green affordable for the masses rather than bombarding them with doom in the news and it will be far more effective Than people superglueing thier hands to the m25. It really boils my piss when the bbc fly reporters to the Antarctic to tell us how bad it is damaging we are when they are creating loads of co2 to go there in the first place. 

Nail on head, all down to money. I have a hearing problem and have waited months to see a specialist, saw him and waited another two months for an MRI two weeks ago. Still awaiting results. If I went private, could have seen a specialist in Bath within a fortnight, MRI in a week and would have known months ago what problem was. The rich will always give a reason for their 'importance' over us plebs

[Jim Davey]

On 09/11/2021 at 12:20, TheReds said:

Indeed, and I have no shame whatsoever using it. 

If this is the crisis that these people are telling us it is, then why are they literally doing nothing about it themselves, bar virtue signalling to the peasants of society? Why do they still go on holiday and get flights (mainly private jets)? Why do they still have gas guzzling motors? The climate spokesperson for the PM drives a diesel and not electric, whilst telling people to go electric. How are Gretas people getting everywhere, it wouldn't be flying would it?

I just don't understand how these people know so much about this crisis, and know how much damage we are all doing to the planet, yet they cannot be bothered to even practice what they preach and do absolutely nothing - they cannot be that worried can they.

It's hypocrisy of the highest order, and quite frankly all they are all doing is making people think "why bother".

Emma Thompson being one off the biggest hypocrites of them all

Edited November 11, 2021 by Jim Davey