bearded_red Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 Fraud. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 17 minutes ago, bearded_red said: Fraud. Absolutely right. LJ was a shit player and became a shit manager. It’s a real shame that we had to put up with his pre and post match waffle for so long……………. The gulf in managerial quality between him, his father and Nige is truly vast. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledAjax Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Robbored said: Absolutely right. LJ was a shit player and became a shit manager. It’s a real shame that we had to put up with his pre and post match waffle for so long……………. The gulf in managerial quality between him, his father and Nige is truly vast. And yet...Pearson is yet to guide us to a higher finish than LJ's 8th place in 2018/19, nor to a higher finish than the 4th place achieved by Johnson Sr. in 2007/08, nor has he taken us to a cup semi-final. Miraculous really. Edited July 28, 2023 by ExiledAjax 5 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 6 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said: And yet...Pearson is yet to guide us to a higher finish than LJ's 8th place in 2018/19, nor to a higher finish than the 4th place achieved by Johnson Sr. That’s the crucial word. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledAjax Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 Just now, Robbored said: That’s the crucial word. We'll see. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted July 28, 2023 Admin Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 17 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said: And yet...Pearson is yet to guide us to a higher finish than LJ's 8th place in 2018/19, nor to a higher finish than the 4th place achieved by Johnson Sr. in 2007/08, nor has he taken us to a cup semi-final. Miraculous really. I would think that we would all agree if NP had taken over at the time LJ did with his financial backing etc he would have probably done as well I certainly would not have had the faith in LJ to sort the financial mess NP has been restricted by over the past two seasons 13 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Louie louie Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 Not being disrespectful to gj, but how many good seasons did he have at this level 1 ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledAjax Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 8 minutes ago, phantom said: I would think that we would all agree if NP had taken over at the time LJ did with his financial backing etc he would have probably done as well I certainly would not have had the faith in LJ to sort the financial mess NP has been restricted by over the past two seasons Your opinion, not sure I agree with your first line. No one knows what would have happened had we appointed Pearson when we did Johnson. If you assume all else would remain the same in your alt universe then Ashton is still there spending the cash and running up the wages/amortisation bill. Maybe we don't sign Abraham, maybe we sign someone else. I think Pearson is ok, I don't think the sun shines out of his arse like some seem to. I thought Johnson left when he should have done, maybe even a little later, but I don't think he's the worst manager we've ever had like some seem to. Far from it. I just find it funny that people run a line that because Pearson uses different language in his press conferences and has (with a lot of credit to Richard Gould) guided us through a period of austerity, there's a "gulf" in managerial quality between him and the two Johnsons. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Louie louie Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 What used to upset a lot of people where I sat in those days, was LJ getting a game, and David noble not. LJ wasn't fit to lace David's boots Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selred Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 44 minutes ago, Robbored said: Absolutely right. LJ was a shit player and became a shit manager. It’s a real shame that we had to put up with his pre and post match waffle for so long……………. The gulf in managerial quality between him, his father and Nige is truly vast. He was an average player, and an average manager. You don't get to a Championship play off final from being a shit player or a shit manager. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin phantom Posted July 28, 2023 Admin Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 7 minutes ago, ExiledAjax said: Your opinion, not sure I agree with your first line. No one knows what would have happened had we appointed Pearson when we did Johnson. If you assume all else would remain the same in your alt universe then Ashton is still there spending the cash and running up the wages/amortisation bill. Maybe we don't sign Abraham, maybe we sign someone else. I think Pearson is ok, I don't think the sun shines out of his arse like some seem to. I thought Johnson left when he should have done, maybe even a little later, but I don't think he's the worst manager we've ever had like some seem to. Far from it. I just find it funny that people run a line that because Pearson uses different language in his press conferences and has (with a lot of credit to Richard Gould) guided us through a period of austerity, there's a "gulf" in managerial quality between him and the two Johnsons. All fair points and well explained, but we could flip it that many think the sun shines out of LJ because of the cup run What many people (not specifically aimed at you) is that people don't seem to appreciate the restrictions NP has had to work with, we haven't really had a pot to piss in for the past two years, to me THIS is the season we should judge NP, even LJ didn't click straight away 4 minutes ago, Oh Louie louie said: What used to upset a lot of people where I sat in those days, was LJ getting a game, and David noble not. LJ wasn't fit to lace David's boots I don't blame LJ for the Hull defeat, but I am still bemused how he came on and Elliott was forced to right back, when we had a defensive player also on the bench 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Louie louie Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 3 minutes ago, Selred said: He was an average player, and an average manager. You don't get to a Championship play off final from being a shit player or a shit manager. Should I remind you Phil brown was manager of hull, he sums up that perfectly. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledAjax Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 1 minute ago, phantom said: the restrictions NP has had to work with, we haven't really had a pot to piss in for the past two years, to me THIS is the season we should judge NP Sure, happy to agree with that. So, if he gets us to second place this season then I will absolutely agree that there's some evidence a gulf in managerial quality between him and the two Johnsons, no doubt about it if that happens. I appreciate that's not the only criteria when judging "managerial quality", but there it is. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Selred Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 Just now, Oh Louie louie said: Should I remind you Phil brown was manager of hull, he sums up that perfectly. Phil Brown got Hull promoted to Premier League. Again not a shit manager, but could be classed at average. He also won manager of the month in the Premier League. If I ever won an award for being the best in the country at my job I'd be proud. Look at some of the other frauds whose managed in the league who never achieved anything Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Louie louie Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 Phil brown a good manager haha Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Watts Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 Just now, Oh Louie louie said: What used to upset a lot of people where I sat in those days, was LJ getting a game, and David noble not. LJ wasn't fit to lace David's boots It's been done to death, but if he hadn't gotten injured against Watford we likely wouldn't have needed the play-offs in my opinion. The breaking up of the LJ/Marv midfield partnership led to our worst run of results that season. Without LJ in the team, Marv wasn't the same player. We essentially lost two players with that injury. LJ did the simple, unappreciated stuff that masked a lot of Marvs shortfalls, a fact that is often conveniently overlooked. 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Louie louie Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 Just now, Steve Watts said: It's been done to death, but if he hadn't gotten injured against Watford we likely wouldn't have needed the play-offs in my opinion. The breaking up of the LJ/Marv midfield partnership led to our worst run of results that season. Without LJ in the team, Marv wasn't the same player. We essentially lost two players with that injury. LJ did the simple, unappreciated stuff that masked a lot of Marvs shortfalls, a fact that is often conveniently overlooked. Nah Marv masked lees downfalls, let's have it right Marv did the simple unappreciated stuff, 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 3 minutes ago, Steve Watts said: It's been done to death, but if he hadn't gotten injured against Watford we likely wouldn't have needed the play-offs in my opinion. The breaking up of the LJ/Marv midfield partnership led to our worst run of results that season. Without LJ in the team, Marv wasn't the same player. We essentially lost two players with that injury. LJ did the simple, unappreciated stuff that masked a lot of Marvs shortfalls, a fact that is often conveniently overlooked. I knew there was a reason I let you coach… About to make the same point. LJ got injured against Watford. We were top at that point. In the next 7 games (before a dead rubber last day win), we lost 5, drew 1 and won 1. I loved Marv. But to pretend that LJ wasn’t integral to a side that nearly went up (and we probably would have if he’d stayed fit) and therefore by definition couldn’t have been a shit championship player is one eyed, myopic bullshit. 9 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
italian dave Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 16 hours ago, italian dave said: There’s certainly no denying how obsessed with LJ some City fans are. No fewer than three of the top 7 threads on our football forum at the moment are talking about a manager who left us more than three years ago. I rest my case……. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve Watts Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 1 minute ago, Oh Louie louie said: Nah Marv masked lees downfalls, let's have it right Marv did the simple unappreciated stuff, So the reason we, and Marv. entered our worst run of form when LJ was injured was..........? Let's not romanticise things too much. Marv, as revered as he was and loved by all, couldn't pass a ball to save his life. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
italian dave Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 5 minutes ago, Oh Louie louie said: Nah Marv masked lees downfalls, let's have it right Marv did the simple unappreciated stuff, Nonsense. I’m not getting into ‘shortfalls’ - they were both good players. But it was LJ who did the simple unappreciated stuff in that pairing. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Louie louie Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 Steve he made the pfa team, that does indicate Marv could pass, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnheadbcfc Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 2 minutes ago, Oh Louie louie said: Steve he made the pfa team, that does indicate Marv could pass, Johnson made the squad that made a play off final and almost won the league itself. Not saying he's iniesta but you can't be "shit" and get into a promotion chasing team all season 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Louie louie Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 LJ tackling and tracking back? What planet are these two on 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CyderHead92 Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 I see Phil Brown as the shittest manager to gain promotion to the premier league. I raise you Ian Holloway. Enough said! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Louie louie Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 Marv won the ball back when lee lost it, lets be honest here, to suggest it was the other way around is insane 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 4 minutes ago, Oh Louie louie said: Marv won the ball back when lee lost it, lets be honest here, to suggest it was the other way around is insane And yet, when LJ wasn’t in the side, for that run at the end of the season, and by your definition Marv didn’t have to win the ball back from Lees mistakes, we lost 5 in 7. Begs the question what Nick Carle was doing to keep Marv so occupied on other matters that we lost so many games in that run. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Louie louie Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 3 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said: And yet, when LJ wasn’t in the side, for that run at the end of the season, and by your definition Marv didn’t have to win the ball back from Lees mistakes, we lost 5 in 7. Begs the question what Nick Carle was doing to keep Marv so occupied on other matters that we lost so many games in that run. My views on Marvin are based on two years, not five games in seven, what a weak argument,, I saw LJ play for the same amount of time, not even in the same leauge, was probably around then nick carle was being scouted? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oh Louie louie Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 I just realized what someone else said you got to be a mug to be taken in by LJ, little point in arguing I feel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted July 28, 2023 Report Share Posted July 28, 2023 (edited) 11 minutes ago, Oh Louie louie said: My views on Marvin are based on two years, not five games in seven, what a weak argument,, I saw LJ play for the same amount of time, not even in the same leauge, was probably around then nick carle was being scouted? It’s not a weak argument. I watched Marvin, I thought Marvin was great. What I can do, which you can’t, is understand that sometimes a player who isn’t popular can be integral to a team. Just to confirm in that season: First 38 games we got 67 points - 1.76ppg Last 8 games we got 7 points - 0.88ppg If for approximately 1/5 of a season you were without a certain player and you got 0.88 less ppg on average (essentially moving from promotion to relegation form), you’d suggest that player was pretty integral to the success of the team. That it isn’t viewed that way is simply because his name is Lee Johnson. The team that season was better - way better- than the sum of its parts (hence Byfield top scoring with 8). If you took any of them out, it may well have been the same drop off. But it was LJ, and the dropoff happened. That’s just basic facts. Edited July 28, 2023 by Silvio Dante The ppg on the first 38 was even better than initially calculated 6 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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