Three Lions Posted March 31, 2023 Report Share Posted March 31, 2023 On 30/03/2023 at 00:13, Portland Bill said: No rule change needed, a team can take the free kick as quick as they like. It’s the opposition players standing on the ball, a yellow card to be handed out, or an injured player that stops 90% of free kicks being taken quickly. That’s not in the laws of the game though!. Your a ref? Would you let this one go in one of your games? Looks to me the defending team have to be thinking the refs going to a ceremonial free kick as hes fannying around and not in control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted March 31, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2023 15 minutes ago, Three Lions said: Your a ref? Would you let this one go in one of your games? Looks to me the defending team have to be thinking the refs going to a ceremonial free kick as hes fannying around and not in control. According to the Accrington players, the ref had verbally said to play to the whistle. They were expecting to set up a wall and go through the ' ceremonial free kick' procedure. The ref didn't comply to his own instructions. This thread and others on such subjects, just goes to show how so many of us find the free kick laws and rules applied by refs, baffling and ambiguous. Free kick laws are written by the FA, say that you are entitled to take a free kick or corner without having to wait for the referees whistle. However this law is rarely allowed ( so what's the point of having the law ), as referees decide to manage the game themselves. Instructing both sides how they will interpret and manage a free kick situation. If a referee has told both teams to play to the whistle, but then allows a quick free kick without his whistle, then this is where controversy happens. Then you have the ' ceremonial free kick'... which goes along the lines of... Place the ball Show players your whistle Tell them not to take the free kick until you signal to do so Move sideways/backwards to the players lining up in the wall – keep eye on the ball Stop at the nearest defender Establish 10 yards whilst still keeping an eye on the ball Use voice and presence to take player back with you into the wall When wall established to your satisfaction move to one side, level with or slightly in front of the wall still keeping an eye on the ball Blow whistle The laws go out of the window...as the ref chooses to manage the game how he chooses...which can change from game to game. They can decide to give an advantage, pull a game back, slow a game down, offer a quick or slow free kick routine etc etc etc. Controversy occurs when communication is either mis understood or poorly directed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MarcusX Posted March 31, 2023 Report Share Posted March 31, 2023 On 29/03/2023 at 15:54, HappyClapper said: I’m all for it. In my view a free kick should infer an advantage. Too often an offence is committed that allows the defending team to reset, making it more difficult for the team that was fouled. I would like to see a rule change that encourages/ allows it in most circumstances. I tend to agree, what’s frustrating is a lack of consistency though. Some refs insist on the whistle, some allow them to be taken quick. I guess as defenders we need to be switched on and someone stood over the ball. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Leveller Posted March 31, 2023 Report Share Posted March 31, 2023 21 minutes ago, MarcusX said: I tend to agree, what’s frustrating is a lack of consistency though. Some refs insist on the whistle, some allow them to be taken quick. I guess as defenders we need to be switched on and someone stood over the ball. Yet the rules suggest that standing over the ball to stop a quick kick is cautionable? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted March 31, 2023 Author Report Share Posted March 31, 2023 3 minutes ago, Leveller said: Yet the rules suggest that standing over the ball to stop a quick kick is cautionable? The laws state that defenders have to be 10 yards back from the ball. If a free kick is given, and allowed to be played quickly, and a defender is within 10 yards, the laws state it it should be retaken. So to allow a quick free kick with that scenario, goes against the laws. Hence my posts on referees overruling laws of the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted April 1, 2023 Report Share Posted April 1, 2023 On 31/03/2023 at 12:18, spudski said: According to the Accrington players, the ref had verbally said to play to the whistle. They were expecting to set up a wall and go through the ' ceremonial free kick' procedure. The ref didn't comply to his own instructions. This thread and others on such subjects, just goes to show how so many of us find the free kick laws and rules applied by refs, baffling and ambiguous. Free kick laws are written by the FA, say that you are entitled to take a free kick or corner without having to wait for the referees whistle. However this law is rarely allowed ( so what's the point of having the law ), as referees decide to manage the game themselves. Instructing both sides how they will interpret and manage a free kick situation. If a referee has told both teams to play to the whistle, but then allows a quick free kick without his whistle, then this is where controversy happens. Then you have the ' ceremonial free kick'... which goes along the lines of... Place the ball Show players your whistle Tell them not to take the free kick until you signal to do so Move sideways/backwards to the players lining up in the wall – keep eye on the ball Stop at the nearest defender Establish 10 yards whilst still keeping an eye on the ball Use voice and presence to take player back with you into the wall When wall established to your satisfaction move to one side, level with or slightly in front of the wall still keeping an eye on the ball Blow whistle The laws go out of the window...as the ref chooses to manage the game how he chooses...which can change from game to game. They can decide to give an advantage, pull a game back, slow a game down, offer a quick or slow free kick routine etc etc etc. Controversy occurs when communication is either mis understood or poorly directed. Oh dear!. Have a chat with an assessor, then come back to me if you are still convinced the “ref decides to manage the game how he chooses”. You really haven’t got a clue!. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted April 1, 2023 Report Share Posted April 1, 2023 On 31/03/2023 at 11:40, Three Lions said: Your a ref? Would you let this one go in one of your games? Looks to me the defending team have to be thinking the refs going to a ceremonial free kick as hes fannying around and not in control. Two of the defending team are more interested in arguing with the referee than defending the free kick, so they got what they deserved. The whistle does not ‘have’ to be blown for a free kick to be taken, and it’s common all around the pitch for a player to take a free kick quickly, I personally don’t see any issues at all with the clip. This scenario has happened numerous times. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted April 1, 2023 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2023 2 hours ago, Portland Bill said: Oh dear!. Have a chat with an assessor, then come back to me if you are still convinced the “ref decides to manage the game how he chooses”. You really haven’t got a clue!. I'll take that as a compliment, as most refs haven't got a clue. Hence the daily complaints. Who gives a shit about an assessor....our own manager constantly complains about the standard of refereeing and the association. You have a typical referees view point...everyone else hasn't got a clue apart from you. **** off...****. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colemanballs Posted April 1, 2023 Report Share Posted April 1, 2023 On 31/03/2023 at 03:17, Cowshed said: In that position, and with that delay etc a free kick to the whistle (ceremonial free kick) would not be ignoring the laws. It would be normal. Its surprising that the ref in this instance does not show the whistle, state on my whistle, place the ball, then move to allowing the opponents opportunity to form the wall, ensure the wall is in the correct position and move on to blowing the whistle to restart the match. This is a rule at free kicks. Where in the LAWS of the game does it state this? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted April 1, 2023 Report Share Posted April 1, 2023 4 hours ago, spudski said: I'll take that as a compliment, as most refs haven't got a clue. Hence the daily complaints. Who gives a shit about an assessor....our own manager constantly complains about the standard of refereeing and the association. You have a typical referees view point...everyone else hasn't got a clue apart from you. **** off...****. Every referee ‘does’ give a huge shit about an assessor, but you know best big boy. You have just proved my point. You clearly don’t know any referees. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Portland Bill Posted April 1, 2023 Report Share Posted April 1, 2023 (edited) On 31/03/2023 at 18:21, spudski said: The laws state that defenders have to be 10 yards back from the ball. If a free kick is given, and allowed to be played quickly, and a defender is within 10 yards, the laws state it it should be retaken. So to allow a quick free kick with that scenario, goes against the laws. Hence my posts on referees overruling laws of the game. Wrong, the referee can play the advantage rule. It’s little things like these that a referee would know, and a fan wouldn’t. If, when a free kick is taken, an opponent is closer to the ball than the required distance, the kick is retaken unless the advantage can be applied; but if a player takes a free kick quickly and an opponent who is less than 9.15 m (10 yds) from the ball intercepts it, the referee allows play to continue. However, an opponent who deliberately prevents a free kick being taken quickly must be cautioned for delaying the restart of play. Edited April 1, 2023 by Portland Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spudski Posted April 1, 2023 Author Report Share Posted April 1, 2023 32 minutes ago, Portland Bill said: Every referee ‘does’ give a huge shit about an assessor, but you know best big boy. You have just proved my point. You clearly don’t know any referees. Erm..I do know a couple refs...and they agree with me. They would prefer the rules to be tighter and less open to referees ' interpretation'. As it often causes confrontation in games. What's very obvious with your posts is you have an authoritive tone with no substance to back it up. Saying you are a ref means jack shit. Most fans would feel pity on you. It takes a certain ' type' to become a ref. We all know one. 10 minutes ago, Portland Bill said: Wrong, the referee can play the advantage rule. If, when a free kick is taken, an opponent is closer to the ball than the required distance, the kick is retaken unless the advantage can be applied; but if a player takes a free kick quickly and an opponent who is less than 9.15 m (10 yds) from the ball intercepts it, the referee allows play to continue. However, an opponent who deliberately prevents a free kick being taken quickly must be cautioned for delaying the restart of play. Again...as most refs do...you miss the point Kinnel...no wonder we struggle. Football failures in charge...glorified traffic wardens 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
luke_bristol Posted April 1, 2023 Report Share Posted April 1, 2023 8 hours ago, Portland Bill said: Oh dear!. Have a chat with an assessor, then come back to me if you are still convinced the “ref decides to manage the game how he chooses”. You really haven’t got a clue!. I’m sure there are multiple examples of referees suggesting in the media that they have managed a game how they chose. Clattenburg and Spurs springs to mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowshed Posted April 2, 2023 Report Share Posted April 2, 2023 17 hours ago, Colemanballs said: Where in the LAWS of the game does it state this? Restarts, free kicks. The whistle can be used when the appropriate distance is required. This is included in IFAB's advice on body language, communication and whistle. The advice of when to blow the whistle is as sound as it gets - IFAB are responsible for the laws of the game. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TonyTonyTony Posted April 2, 2023 Report Share Posted April 2, 2023 23 hours ago, spudski said: Erm..I do know a couple refs...and they agree with me. They would prefer the rules to be tighter and less open to referees ' interpretation'. As it often causes confrontation in games. What's very obvious with your posts is you have an authoritive tone with no substance to back it up. Saying you are a ref means jack shit. Most fans would feel pity on you. It takes a certain ' type' to become a ref. We all know one. Again...as most refs do...you miss the point Kinnel...no wonder we struggle. Football failures in charge...glorified traffic wardens Such a bitchy post. Christ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three Lions Posted April 13, 2023 Report Share Posted April 13, 2023 On 31/03/2023 at 12:18, spudski said: According to the Accrington players, the ref had verbally said to play to the whistle. They were expecting to set up a wall and go through the ' ceremonial free kick' procedure. The ref didn't comply to his own instructions. This thread and others on such subjects, just goes to show how so many of us find the free kick laws and rules applied by refs, baffling and ambiguous. Free kick laws are written by the FA, say that you are entitled to take a free kick or corner without having to wait for the referees whistle. However this law is rarely allowed ( so what's the point of having the law ), as referees decide to manage the game themselves. Instructing both sides how they will interpret and manage a free kick situation. If a referee has told both teams to play to the whistle, but then allows a quick free kick without his whistle, then this is where controversy happens. Then you have the ' ceremonial free kick'... which goes along the lines of... Place the ball Show players your whistle Tell them not to take the free kick until you signal to do so Move sideways/backwards to the players lining up in the wall – keep eye on the ball Stop at the nearest defender Establish 10 yards whilst still keeping an eye on the ball Use voice and presence to take player back with you into the wall When wall established to your satisfaction move to one side, level with or slightly in front of the wall still keeping an eye on the ball Blow whistle The laws go out of the window...as the ref chooses to manage the game how he chooses...which can change from game to game. They can decide to give an advantage, pull a game back, slow a game down, offer a quick or slow free kick routine etc etc etc. Controversy occurs when communication is either mis understood or poorly directed. If the ref did say play the whistle he ballsed it up. that is a deception. You can allow a quick free kick if the ref thinks its ok. Its on the ref and he might think its not on for a number of reasons. Laws generally dont go out the window. On 01/04/2023 at 14:05, Portland Bill said: Two of the defending team are more interested in arguing with the referee than defending the free kick, so they got what they deserved. The whistle does not ‘have’ to be blown for a free kick to be taken, and it’s common all around the pitch for a player to take a free kick quickly, I personally don’t see any issues at all with the clip. This scenario has happened numerous times. I asked if you ref as i do and so does my son, Neither of us would let that one go early and the ref didn't either. Hes over the ball fannying about with two teams having a stewards for ages then it goes. Its rubbish 100% i am on the whistle asking do they want a wall pacing it out to make sure the game is under control and on my whistle. I dont think this scenario happens that often because refs are normally better than that. Refs made mistake. Improve move on. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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