That Prem big team bias again ? Or VAR just NFFP

[1960maaan]

So last week it was Wolves denied a Pen at Man U that would have given them a draw .
This week little Bournemouth at Liverpool. How is reaching for the ball and knocking it into another players path not deliberate ? Plus I know they don't want to be re-Reffing the game by VAR but that dive for the Pen is ridiculous. There was contact with one shin, not sure how that makes your other leg fly up in the air. I've lost count of the times the excuse/explanation for denying a Pen was exaggeration .
TBH there were others not involving bigger teams, the worst one last week was Everton's disallowed goal for the keeper landing on an Everton player. 
I know it would add time to games, but surely they should get the Ref to look at some of these decisions. At the very least I would like to know how they come to their choices. It gets tedious for some I know, and VAR in itself isn't the problem, but surely something has to be done. If Bournemouth go 2-0 up ? Who knows. Everton and Wolves get draws and their mindset could be different for the next games. `it does feel at times the bigger teams get a better rub of the green, but I think those in charge of VAR really need looking at.

[TDarwall]

I'm totally anti VAR & would love to see it binned. The only possible justification for keeping it is to spot terrible errors. Things like the Maradona hand ball. For me, if VAR needs to spend 5 mins looking at it from 47 different angles, & different speeds then it's not a foul/offside etc.

It ruins the flow of the game. Football is a sport that's needs to flow, VAR ruins this.

Even allowing for the fact we'd surely get more penalties with VAR I hope it never comes to the Championship.

[Roe]

The offside goal is a difficult one because people will argue either way and the rules are a mess as to what counts as Intentional or not.

The penalty was a clear dive and I think VAR should be used in cases like that to make a statement that cheating isn't tolerated. I thought that was supposed to be the case now anyway

Probably the worst decision in that game was the red card which was just nonsense. Missing 3 and a half games for that is ridiculous 

[luke_bristol]

Liverpool player should be banned for successful deception of the referee. Absolute joke.

[luke_bristol]

Just seen the dive described as “getting Liverpool in front with his bravery” by Mark Lawrenson on Match of the Day. They also interviewed the player after the game and didn’t mention the dive, but did ask the Bournemouth manager about it.

the media are a massive part of the problem

[Super]

1 hour ago, 1960maaan said:

So last week it was Wolves denied a Pen at Man U that would have given them a draw .
This week little Bournemouth at Liverpool. How is reaching for the ball and knocking it into another players path not deliberate ? Plus I know they don't want to be re-Reffing the game by VAR but that dive for the Pen is ridiculous. There was contact with one shin, not sure how that makes your other leg fly up in the air. I've lost count of the times the excuse/explanation for denying a Pen was exaggeration .
TBH there were others not involving bigger teams, the worst one last week was Everton's disallowed goal for the keeper landing on an Everton player. 
I know it would add time to games, but surely they should get the Ref to look at some of these decisions. At the very least I would like to know how they come to their choices. It gets tedious for some I know, and VAR in itself isn't the problem, but surely something has to be done. If Bournemouth go 2-0 up ? Who knows. Everton and Wolves get draws and their mindset could be different for the next games. `it does feel at times the bigger teams get a better rub of the green, but I think those in charge of VAR really need looking at.

The pen was soft but the sending off was worse. Get people with some football intelligence using VAR ffs.

[Silvio Dante]

1 hour ago, luke_bristol said:

Just seen the dive described as “getting Liverpool in front with his bravery” by Mark Lawrenson on Match of the Day. They also interviewed the player after the game and didn’t mention the dive, but did ask the Bournemouth manager about it.

the media are a massive part of the problem

I didn’t watch MOTD but I thought that Lawro had (thankfully) long been put out to pasture

Edited August 20, 2023 by Silvio Dante

[luke_bristol]

13 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

I didn’t watch MOTD but I thought that Lawro had (thankfully) long been put out to pasture

Should have been sacked after that England tournament where he did nothing but sulk for three weeks 

[22A]

I'd keep VAR, but, it should be used as in cricket with teams having to request a decision review and have just two unsuccessful reviews permitted.

[Malago]

5 hours ago, 22A said:

I'd keep VAR, but, it should be used as in cricket with teams having to request a decision review and have just two unsuccessful reviews permitted.

Agree.  And long term use AI to adjudicate.

[Fuber]

VAR should be an appeal system where the captain of each side, if they feel aggrieved, they can appeal said decision and it go for review - similar to the rugby.

2 appeals per team, so have to be used wisely.

[Laner]

1 hour ago, Fuber said:

VAR should be an appeal system where the captain of each side, if they feel aggrieved, they can appeal said decision and it go for review - similar to the rugby.

2 appeals per team, so have to be used wisely.

But what happens if the captain is no where near the incident? A player would need to be given the time to go his captain to explain why they feel a review would be worthwhile. Another stoppage in play. VAR for clear and obvious errors, not replay and replay. Things can look far worse in slow-mo too which doesn't help the decisions.

[johnbytheriver]

That Prem big team bias again 

This phrase  sums the situation up perfectly, it has always been the case long before var arrived on the scene.

[MarcusX]

21 hours ago, 22A said:

I'd keep VAR, but, it should be used as in cricket with teams having to request a decision review and have just two unsuccessful reviews permitted.

That doesn’t improve it though, it’s the decision making by VAR that’s the issue.

[formerly known as ivan]

Bruno Fernandes came out saying referees should have to be interviewed after the game and held accountable for what they got wrong after Utd not getting a pen at Spurs. I’ve been trying to find where he said the same after the Wolves game last week but struggling to find it anywhere!

[Sir Geoff]

No way do Bournemouth get awarded a penalty if the 'dive' happens at the other end, in front of the Kop. Never a pen but don't blame Var as they have been told not to re referee the game. That one was down to the onfield referee getting conned.

[Markthehorn]

18 hours ago, Fuber said:

VAR should be an appeal system where the captain of each side, if they feel aggrieved, they can appeal said decision and it go for review - similar to the rugby.

2 appeals per team, so have to be used wisely.

They’d probably waste it after 2 goes !

Trouble is so many decisions are subjective so not clear cut but agree there have been some shockers .

TBF Liverpool got the worse decision against them but agree penalty wasn’t one .

It was Liverpool fan and ex player Danny Murphy who called the dive brave .

 

Edited August 21, 2023 by Markthehorn

[Fuber]

9 minutes ago, Markthehorn said:

They’d probably waste it after 2 goes !

Trouble is so many decisions are subjective so not clear cut but agree there have been some shockers .

TBF Liverpool got the worse decision against them but agree penalty wasn’t one .

It was Liverpool fan and ex player Danny Murphy who called the dive brave .

 

Bold is key - they need to be as certain as possible to use the appeal, thereby cutting wastage. As any review should be for a clear and obvious error.

No use, for example, wasting it on a subjective throw in.

[LondonBristolian]

I think VAR could work but the way it is applied is worse than having nothing.

I feel it should be simple. 3 qualified adjudicators watch a video of any contentious decisions. If, after reviewing the incident 3 times, the panel are unanimous that a clear and obvious error was made, the referee is alerted to reverse their decision.

If three qualified people do not agree after three viewings, it is not clear and obvious so the original decision stands.

As soon as you have the concept of a ref rewatching a decision because the panel are not sure - or a decision requiring several minutes from multiple angles - it cannot be a clear or obvious error.

[1960maaan]

10 hours ago, Sir Geoff said:

No way do Bournemouth get awarded a penalty if the 'dive' happens at the other end, in front of the Kop. Never a pen but don't blame Var as they have been told not to re referee the game. That one was down to the onfield referee getting conned.

That incident could have been quickly handed back to the Ref to have a second look. Just as the "Arm not in a natural position" seems to count a lot, it was clear the contact on his left leg wouldn't naturally send his right leg up in the air.

I would like more decisions handed back to the Ref to look at, but that would add too long to a game. What I would bring in is, any thing that needs more than 2/3 looks or more than 30/40 seconds study is not clear. Those Pens they look at slower and slower will always look worse, it's like they're trying to give Pens in the same way they microscopically review Offsides almost wanting to give it. 
There should be a rule, couple of looks and 30 seconds spent on a review then you can't give anything and you have to stick with the original Ref's call or give nothing. The re-Reffing the game seems to make it more difficult for the VAR mob, the whole thing could do with a total rethink , there didn't seem to be the same problems in either of the recent Women's Competitions , and the bits I've seen of foreign football doesn't seem to suffer in the same way. 
I don't have an easy answer, but something needs to be done , 2 games in and there have already had too many obvious mistakes.

[Super]

Another dreadful decision this time by the ref. Never a 2nd booking.

[Maltshoveller]

1 minute ago, Super said:

Another dreadful decision this time by the ref. Never a 2nd booking.

Fair play to the ref for not time wasting Couldnt get the card out any faster if he tried 

[Super]

26 minutes ago, Maltshoveller said:

Fair play to the ref for not time wasting Couldnt get the card out any faster if he tried 

Football has gone. Its nothing more than a joke nowadays.

[Markthehorn]

1 hour ago, Super said:

Another dreadful decision this time by the ref. Never a 2nd booking.

And VAR cannot look as it was a 2nd yellow .

[W-S-M Seagull]

1 hour ago, Super said:

Another dreadful decision this time by the ref. Never a 2nd booking.

Tell me you're an Arsenal fan without telling me you're an Arsenal fan.

[Roe]

Very similar red to the Dickie one. Equally ridiculous. Referees shouldn't be trying to send players off as quickly as possible. Just stupid

VAR should have stopped the penalty as well

[Super]

10 hours ago, W-S-M Seagull said:

Tell me you're an Arsenal fan without telling me you're an Arsenal fan.

Nope but anyone could see its never a booking.

[Mr Popodopolous]

1 hour ago, Roe said:

Very similar red to the Dickie one. Equally ridiculous.

On that note, that reminds me. Saw a Tweet on Saturday which seemed to imply some Birmingham fans saw one of the linesmen on the train back and he said the Dickie decision was an easy one for the ref to make.

Will try to find this.

Edited August 22, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[MarcusX]

35 minutes ago, Super said:

Nope but anyone could see its never a booking.

I only had half an eye on the game, but was it not a cynical pull/trip to stop a breakaway?

The first yellow seemed a little harsh as most of the timewasting was done by the first player, but they knew what they were doing.

 

[Super]

23 minutes ago, MarcusX said:

I only had half an eye on the game, but was it not a cynical pull/trip to stop a breakaway?

The first yellow seemed a little harsh as most of the timewasting was done by the first player, but they knew what they were doing.

 

Nothing cynical barely any contact. Nonsense decision.