England

[Silvio Dante]

1 hour ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Don't like Real and everything they stand for, but watching Bellingham at the Bernabeu is now on the bucket-list. 

Already seen him at a far greater arena.

 

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

4 minutes ago, WolfOfWestStreet said:

Who do you think the thickest English Footballer of all time is? 

I don't necessarily think Rooney is thick, he's had the wherewithall to carve out a good career, but he's generally perceived as not being the sharpest knife in the drawer having on several occasions not engaged his brain before opening his mouth or taking an action. He's not the only one with Ashley Cole, John Terry, Paul Gascoigne and Jack Grealish instantly coming to mind. There are plenty of others but whether they are thick or just stupid is open to debate. 

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

7 minutes ago, Northern Red said:

Before anyone replies to this, it should be noted that Lee Hendrie and Gabby Agbonlahor have England caps.

That just means that the selectors were thick, not them. After all, Steve Stone has caps too. 

[Kid in the Riot]

1 minute ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said:

I don't necessarily think Rooney is thick, he's had the wherewithall to carve out a good career, but he's generally perceived as not being the sharpest knife in the drawer having on several occasions not engaged his brain before opening his mouth or taking an action. He's not the only one with Ashley Cole, John Terry, Paul Gascoigne and Jack Grealish instantly coming to mind. There are plenty of others but whether they are thick or just stupid is open to debate. 

I can assure you Wayne Rooney is not "thick", or stupid. Far from it.

[Northern Red]

 

[stephenkibby.]

26 minutes ago, RoystonFoote'snephew said:

Presumably in reverse order. Between 1962-1970 Bobby Charlton was widely regarded across the globe as the greatest midfielder in the world and a gentleman. Rooney was a wunderkind and great scorer but generally regarded as low on IQ. Gascoigne had moments of brilliance, bordering on genius, but was otherwise a bigoted ****. 

Lot of assumptions there.

Charlton best midfielder in the world? Never heard that before Rooney low IQ.? Never heard that before either.

Have you seen the result of Rooneys test? No chances are he's never taken one.

Probably the most shit i'v read on here for a while, and thats saying something.

[North London Red]

View from the away end tonight. Enjoyed that!

[RoystonFoote'snephew]

13 minutes ago, stephenkibby. said:

Lot of assumptions there.

Charlton best midfielder in the world? Never heard that before Rooney low IQ.? Never heard that before either.

Have you seen the result of Rooneys test? No chances are he's never taken one.

Probably the most shit i'v read on here for a while, and thats saying something.

You obviously haven't heard a lot. Most football commentators and analysts of the 1960s had Bobby Charlton as the best midfielder of the age. As for Rooney I never said he had a low IQ, I said it was the perception as he was constantly lampooned in the media regarding his (lack of) intelligence and was the butt of many a comedians jokes. He does have a languid method of speech which may have given rise to the perception. Personally, given his career I actually think he's quite astute. 

[Lrrr]

The issue with Maguire is Southgate’s made a rod for his own back originally saying he’d pick people in form, well Maguire clearly isn’t in form, he then dropped Stones from the England set up a few years ago for not playing enough, Maguire doesn’t play enough but still makes squads. We know Southgate just has his favourites who just won’t be left out. As with Ramsdale getting a full game, Eze getting minutes this was a good chance to test another CB in a pressure situation but instead he just reverts to Maguire.

[The Nest Egg]

1 hour ago, WolfOfWestStreet said:

Who do you think the thickest English Footballer of all time is? 

watch this from 11:20 to 12:00 and you have your answer!

In fairness to Jack he does seem reasonably harmless and non-malicious despite his appalling geography 

 

 

[Kid in the Riot]

11 minutes ago, Lrrr said:

The issue with Maguire is Southgate’s made a rod for his own back originally saying he’d pick people in form, well Maguire clearly isn’t in form, he then dropped Stones from the England set up a few years ago for not playing enough, Maguire doesn’t play enough but still makes squads. We know Southgate just has his favourites who just won’t be left out. As with Ramsdale getting a full game, Eze getting minutes this was a good chance to test another CB in a pressure situation but instead he just reverts to Maguire.

Contradiction on team selection and the accusation of favourites, happens to every single manager that has been at a club or country for more than a couple of years. From Fergie to Wenger to Pep to Klopp. All have had exactly the same accusations thrown at them due to their longevity in the job.

Ultimately, all that matters is results and performances. England got both this evening. 

[Ziderarmy]

1 hour ago, Kid in the Riot said:

I can assure you Wayne Rooney is not "thick", or stupid. Far from it.

@Kid in the Riot Based on personal experience? 

[Lrrr]

20 minutes ago, The Nest Egg said:

watch this from 11:20 to 12:00 and you have your answer!

In fairness to Jack he does seem reasonably harmless and non-malicious despite his appalling geography 

 

 

I mean everyone apart from Ward-Prowse’s seemed pretty horrendous, Jordan putting London in Birmingham, the presenter then putting north London level with Norwich saying it was correct for placement 

 

15 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Contradiction on team selection and the accusation of favourites, happens to every single manager that has been at a club or country for more than a couple of years. From Fergie to Wenger to Pep to Klopp. All have had exactly the same accusations thrown at them due to their longevity in the job.

Ultimately, all that matters is results and performances. England got both this evening. 

It’s not due to longevity, it’s due to him directly contradicting his own words and his own previous actions. Next international break if Maguire has barely had a minute at United he simply shouldn’t justify a place as one of the most likely CB’s to be on the pitch. 

[Harry]

1 hour ago, Lew-T said:

Not a fan of Phillips?

Au contraire, mon petit frere. 
 

I think he’s a very good player. I think the move to Man City was completely wrong. It’s stalled him as a footballer and he really should be playing games. 
I like him generally. What I don’t like is playing someone who is not playing, but not only that, had an absolute stinker and still did 90 minutes! That first half, 80% of his passes were wrong - either wrong choice, under/over hit, or played 2 yards wide of target meaning the recipient had to delay or go backwards. He should’ve been hooked at half time. Then 2nd half he lost confidence and just looked to be getting in the way. 
He needs to play for his club more regularly in order to justify a start. He’s not being played and he was terribly rusty. 
 

But, in addition to all that, it’s not Phillips I blame. I simply don’t think we should be playing 2 DM’s. We’re playing two 4’s and a 10, when we could easily play a 4 an 8 and a 10. 
That’s not Phillips’ fault. But he did have a bloody stinker tonight. 

Edited September 12, 2023 by Harry

[Kid in the Riot]

25 minutes ago, Lrrr said:

It’s not due to longevity, it’s due to him directly contradicting his own words and his own previous actions.

Yes it is. That is exactly my point. When you are in the same football managerial job for years, it is entirely inevitable that you will contradict yourself. It is near enough 100% guaranteed. I cannot think of a single football manager I don't consider to be a hypocrite or who has contradicted themselves.

Are you seriously of the view that either Pep or Fergie, let's say, didn't have their favourites who played even if they were on crap form? 

Of course you're not, because that would be silly. 

It just cracks me up, year after year, seeing the same accusations levelled at every football manager in the football league. 

[Kid in the Riot]

16 minutes ago, Harry said:

Au contraire, mon petit frere. 
 

I think he’s a very good player. I think the move to Man City was completely wrong. It’s stalled him as a footballer and he really should be playing games. 
I like him generally. What I don’t like is playing someone who is not playing, but not only that, had an absolute stinker and still did 90 minutes! That first half, 80% of his passes were wrong - either wrong choice, under/over hit, or played 2 yards wide of target meaning the recipient had to delay or go backwards. He should’ve been hooked at half time. Then 2nd half he lost confidence and just looked to be getting in the way. 
He needs to play for his club more regularly in order to justify a start. He’s not being played and he was terribly rusty. 
 

But, in addition to all that, it’s not Phillips I blame. I simply don’t think we should be playing 2 DM’s. We’re playing two 4’s and a 10, when we could easily play a 4 an 8 and a 10. 
That’s not Phillips’ fault. But he did have a bloody stinker tonight. 

Agree with your points on Phillips. Only thing I'd say is that although it seemed to be a 4-2-3-1, Rice is pretty progressive, isn't he? It certainly didn't feel like we were playing with a back 6 and only 4 attacking players.

Rice will always look to push forward, he very much has that in his locker. Plus we had Walker and Trippier pushed right up against their wing backs. So in reality, despite the system, we were pushing them very high up the pitch and had everyone bar Dunk, Guehi and Phillips joining in with attacks. 

This looked and felt like a fairly "handbrake is off" England performance to me. 

[Lrrr]

26 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Yes it is. That is exactly my point. When you are in the same football managerial job for years, it is entirely inevitable that you will contradict yourself. It is near enough 100% guaranteed. I cannot think of a single football manager I don't consider to be a hypocrite or who has contradicted themselves.

Are you seriously of the view that either Pep or Fergie, let's say, didn't have their favourites who played even if they were on crap form? 

Of course you're not, because that would be silly. 

It just cracks me up, year after year, seeing the same accusations levelled at every football manager in the football league. 

You can’t compare club and international managers the same, the clubs are playing week in week out and a method for regaining form is by playing and they play because club managers outside the window can’t just say I’ll go and pick that centre back from a different club whose playing well, international managers can. The simple question really is should Maguire at the moment be near this England team as one of the 2 or 3 CB’s most likely to play and the answer is no. 

[bcfctim]

45 minutes ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Yes it is. That is exactly my point. When you are in the same football managerial job for years, it is entirely inevitable that you will contradict yourself. It is near enough 100% guaranteed. I cannot think of a single football manager I don't consider to be a hypocrite or who has contradicted themselves.

Are you seriously of the view that either Pep or Fergie, let's say, didn't have their favourites who played even if they were on crap form? 

Of course you're not, because that would be silly. 

It just cracks me up, year after year, seeing the same accusations levelled at every football manager in the football league. 

Don't like the manager?

He [has his favourites]/[doesn't know his best team]

*delete as appropriate 

[Alex_BCFC]

7 hours ago, North London Red said:

View from the away end tonight. Enjoyed that!

You were stood very close to where I was! 

[southside]

9 hours ago, WolfOfWestStreet said:

All of which I agree with but a bit early for goat talk.

He was only kidding

[Kid in the Riot]

6 hours ago, Lrrr said:

You can’t compare club and international managers the same, the clubs are playing week in week out and a method for regaining form is by playing and they play because club managers outside the window can’t just say I’ll go and pick that centre back from a different club whose playing well, international managers can. The simple question really is should Maguire at the moment be near this England team as one of the 2 or 3 CB’s most likely to play and the answer is no. 

A level of consistency is still required in team selection at international level. In fact you could argue it is more important given the players spend less time together. 

I don't agree that Maguire should be nowhere near this current England team. He's a first ball winner who is excellent in the air and has performed pretty consistently for England. That said, Dunk performed well last night so of course we should always be looking at other options to improve the team further. 

[maxjak]

9 hours ago, WolfOfWestStreet said:

Greatest ever player? Probably not. 

No........... that'll be Scotty  

[maxjak]

9 hours ago, Open End Numb Legs said:

The greatest players need to come back from serious injuries. I hope that never happens to Bellingham obviously but that is what a long career tends to bring at some point.

A joy to watch at the moment, he has everything.

Mmmmm....Interesting theory.........But Neither Messi or Portuguese Ronaldo have ever suffered a serious injury

[Never to the dark side]

Matthew 10:36?

[Harry]

8 hours ago, Kid in the Riot said:

Agree with your points on Phillips. Only thing I'd say is that although it seemed to be a 4-2-3-1, Rice is pretty progressive, isn't he? It certainly didn't feel like we were playing with a back 6 and only 4 attacking players.

Rice will always look to push forward, he very much has that in his locker. Plus we had Walker and Trippier pushed right up against their wing backs. So in reality, despite the system, we were pushing them very high up the pitch and had everyone bar Dunk, Guehi and Phillips joining in with attacks. 

This looked and felt like a fairly "handbrake is off" England performance to me. 

As I mentioned earlier in thread :

”don’t come to me saying that Rice can also play forwards”. 
 

Yes, he can. But his best role is that as a DM. I want him doing that. 
There are other players who are better than him in the advanced roles. I’d want them to be doing that. 
 

Whilst Southgate has had a good run in tournaments, I feel that this 2 x DM philosophy will be his legacy.

Yes, the full backs get into advanced positions. But they can still do that even if you had 1 DM. But again, who would you rather have in an attacking position - a gifted attacking midfielder with vision and poise or a full back?

Scotland’s goal was a very good example of our set up. We’d just lost possession after a swift counter. We only had 4 players forward. The other 6 were behind the ball when Scotland broke quickly and advanced to our midfield. 
We had Dunk, Maguire, Walker, Trippier, Rice and Phillips all behind the ball. And we conceded. Having the extra DM made absolutely no difference to our defensive outcome. 
 

We have a wealth of attacking talent at the moment. We are not, in my opinion, making the most of them, because we are scared of being too open. That will be what Southgate will be remembered for, as much as the good tournament outcomes. 

Edited September 13, 2023 by Harry

[2015]

Must admit I quite liked Dunk and Guehi at the back together. 

We are very lucky to have Bellingham, Foden, Saka and Rice all under the age of 25. Bellingham will be the best player in the World one day.

[Son of Fred]

9 minutes ago, Harry said:

As I mentioned earlier in thread :

”don’t come to me saying that Rice can also play forwards”. 
 

Yes, he can. But his best role is that as a DM. I want him doing that. 
There are other players who are better than him in the advanced roles. I’d want them to be doing that. 
 

Whilst Southgate has had a good run in tournaments, I feel that this 2 x DM philosophy will be his legacy.

Yes, the full backs get into advanced positions. But they can still do that even if you had 1 DM. But again, who would you rather have in an attacking position - a gifted attacking midfielder with vision and poise or a full back?

Scotland’s goal was a very good example of our set up. We’d just lost possession after a swift counter. We only had 4 players forward. The other 6 were behind the ball when Scotland broke quickly and advanced to our midfield. 
We had Dunk, Maguire, Walker, Trippier, Rice and Phillips all behind the ball. And we conceded. Having the extra DM made absolutely no difference to our defensive outcome. 
 

We have a wealth of attacking talent at the moment. We are not, in my opinion, making the most of them, because we are scared of being too open. That will be what Southgate will be remembered for, as much as the good tournament outcomes. 

Bang on Harry

[2015]

Can anyone remember seeing Bellingham destroy us on the left wing in 2020 just before Covid lockdowns? I think Birmingham won 3-1 but I remember leaving the game thinking wow this lad is only 17. Literally has the world at his feet.

[Kid in the Riot]

25 minutes ago, Harry said:

As I mentioned earlier in thread :

”don’t come to me saying that Rice can also play forwards”. 

But it's very relevant Harry because Rice is not a DM who just sits in front of the back four. He DOES press higher up the pitch and break up play when England are pressing. That is an integral part of his game. 

Anyway, I enjoyed last night's performance from a defensive and attacking perspective so will leave it there !

[Kid in the Riot]

19 minutes ago, 2015 said:

Can anyone remember seeing Bellingham destroy us on the left wing in 2020 just before Covid lockdowns? I think Birmingham won 3-1 but I remember leaving the game thinking wow this lad is only 17. Literally has the world at his feet.

Was on Sky I think.