italian dave Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 37 minutes ago, exAtyeoMax said: yes but he has to work under BT and JL, that is the remit. But, even accepting that's the case, and even if that involves "kow-towing" if he works under them, kow-tows, and does well and gets results the I agree with @B-Rizzle - people will forget. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 Just now, italian dave said: But, even accepting that's the case, and even if that involves "kow-towing" if he works under them, kow-tows, and does well and gets results the I agree with @B-Rizzle - people will forget. hmm possibly but People didn't forget Cotts getting shafted. 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shauntaylor85 Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 9 hours ago, GrahamC said: Nope. Voted sell up. Hope any new owners would move Tinnion on too. They certainly would. Only at the club because of the Lansdowns. Same as Murray. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
One Team Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 4 minutes ago, exAtyeoMax said: hmm possibly but People didn't forget Cotts getting shafted. Indeed, no way people will forget this it’s been monumental, certainly the biggest reaction from our fan base in my time. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BS3 Ark at Ee Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 No offence guys, but who genuinely thinks anyone’s coming in to get us promoted? They’ll end up falling way short and the hierarchy will just remain quiet whilst we all continue to be frustrated at their lack of communication, answers etc etc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
italian dave Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 Just now, exAtyeoMax said: hmm possibly but People didn't forget Cotts getting shafted. I know. And that was one of the burdens that LJ had to bear throughout his tenure - even though it was nothing to do with him. And there's already plenty of evidence on here already that people are going to hold it against any new manager that his popular predecessor got the push. It's almost like a cycle: the manager that I like gets the push so I hate his successor. He gets the push so I like his successor. he gets the push so I hate the next one..... @Davefevs alluded to it in one of his posts yesterday - and it's sad and a bit pathetic in my view. We all want what's best for the club, we probably all have different views on what that is, but not getting behind the club or its manager just because they happen to have come out of something you didn't like is really no way to support the club. I'm not suggesting no-one should be able to criticise - of course we should - and there's loads I'd criticise about recent events. But you then have to move on and support. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Rizzle Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 18 minutes ago, exAtyeoMax said: hmm possibly but People didn't forget Cotts getting shafted. They absolutely did when things were at their peak under LJ with the Man Utd win, competing with Man City and doing well in the league. It didn’t last but when things are going well the fan base are in the moment and loving the success. It’s only when things aren’t going so well that everyone pines for a previous coach. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 8 minutes ago, italian dave said: I know. And that was one of the burdens that LJ had to bear throughout his tenure - even though it was nothing to do with him. And there's already plenty of evidence on here already that people are going to hold it against any new manager that his popular predecessor got the push. It's almost like a cycle: the manager that I like gets the push so I hate his successor. He gets the push so I like his successor. he gets the push so I hate the next one..... @Davefevs alluded to it in one of his posts yesterday - and it's sad and a bit pathetic in my view. We all want what's best for the club, we probably all have different views on what that is, but not getting behind the club or its manager just because they happen to have come out of something you didn't like is really no way to support the club. I'm not suggesting no-one should be able to criticise - of course we should - and there's loads I'd criticise about recent events. But you then have to move on and support. All I've said in this thread that my concern is a new coach having to kowtow to BT and JL. The criticism is aimed directly at them, I don't think they have the experience, know-how whatever to take the club forward and make decisions about the team, tactics, playing style etc. People will get behind the team, its what we do but we won't forget. 2 minutes ago, B-Rizzle said: They absolutely did when things were at their peak under LJ with the Man Utd win, competing with Man City and doing well in the league. It didn’t last but when things are going well the fan base are in the moment and loving the success. It’s only when things aren’t going so well that everyone pines for a previous coach. No they didn't. They got behind the team. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B-Rizzle Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 5 minutes ago, exAtyeoMax said: All I've said in this thread that my concern is a new coach having to kowtow to BT and JL. The criticism is aimed directly at them, I don't think they have the experience, know-how whatever to take the club forward and make decisions about the team, tactics, playing style etc. People will get behind the team, its what we do but we won't forget. No they didn't. They got behind the team. And they got behind LJ and believed in what he was doing as we had a team we could be really proud of. No one was thinking of Cotts at that point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 5 minutes ago, B-Rizzle said: And they got behind LJ and believed in what he was doing as we had a team we could be really proud of. No one was thinking of Cotts at that point. did they? Some might have. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
italian dave Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 9 minutes ago, exAtyeoMax said: All I've said in this thread that my concern is a new coach having to kowtow to BT and JL. The criticism is aimed directly at them, I don't think they have the experience, know-how whatever to take the club forward and make decisions about the team, tactics, playing style etc. People will get behind the team, its what we do but we won't forget. No they didn't. They got behind the team. Yes; and just to be clear, my comments weren’t directed at you at all. I don’t know whether the new coach will have to kowtow, and if they do then I agree with your concerns about the credentials of JL and BT. But even if they do, there are ways of doing that and still getting your point across and of getting your way. It’s all about relationships. As for the support: I think the truth probably is that you can’t generalise about the fan base as a whole. But I do despair when I read some of the anger on here translating into personal abuse, and into blame already attaching to a new manager who’s not even been appointed! What’s happened has happened. None of us can change it. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
italian dave Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 9 minutes ago, exAtyeoMax said: did they? Some might have. Well, you’d certainly hope so, and more than some, at the point where we’re beating Man U, competing with Man C and doing well in the league. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
exAtyeoMax Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 1 minute ago, italian dave said: Yes; and just to be clear, my comments weren’t directed at you at all. I don’t know whether the new coach will have to kowtow, and if they do then I agree with your concerns about the credentials of JL and BT. But even if they do, there are ways of doing that and still getting your point across and of getting your way. It’s all about relationships. As for the support: I think the truth probably is that you can’t generalise about the fan base as a whole. But I do despair when I read some of the anger on here translating into personal abuse, and into blame already attaching to a new manager who’s not even been appointed! What’s happened has happened. None of us can change it. no, blaming the new guy is just stupid and narrow-minded 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Superjack Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 19 minutes ago, B-Rizzle said: And they got behind LJ and believed in what he was doing as we had a team we could be really proud of. No one was thinking of Cotts at that point. Nobody knew what he was doing. Least of all him. 2 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shauntaylor85 Posted October 31, 2023 Report Share Posted October 31, 2023 If you talk about the PL you need to back it up with a PL or promotion experienced appointment. But that’s going to cost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted November 1, 2023 Report Share Posted November 1, 2023 2 hours ago, italian dave said: I know. And that was one of the burdens that LJ had to bear throughout his tenure - even though it was nothing to do with him. And there's already plenty of evidence on here already that people are going to hold it against any new manager that his popular predecessor got the push. It's almost like a cycle: the manager that I like gets the push so I hate his successor. He gets the push so I like his successor. he gets the push so I hate the next one..... @Davefevs alluded to it in one of his posts yesterday - and it's sad and a bit pathetic in my view. We all want what's best for the club, we probably all have different views on what that is, but not getting behind the club or its manager just because they happen to have come out of something you didn't like is really no way to support the club. I'm not suggesting no-one should be able to criticise - of course we should - and there's loads I'd criticise about recent events. But you then have to move on and support. Crikey, I almost read that the wrong way to what was meant If for example the new manager is a complete outsider like Eustace or Rowett, there really should be no animosity towards either. I think LJ suffered from several things, 1) his playing days baggage re his playing style (up for debate) and being the managers son and 2) his lack of experience. I think those went against him more than following Cotts. Pearson carried baggage for signing Danny Simpson. Lets hope it’s as good an appointment as possible. I’m still gutted, but I’m trying to move on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Posted November 1, 2023 Report Share Posted November 1, 2023 It’s very simple for me. Win promotion. 32 games to go. Win 23. Draw 4. Lose 5. That will give us 91 points. Which pretty much guarantees top 2. Anything else is a failure. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted November 1, 2023 Report Share Posted November 1, 2023 (edited) 9 hours ago, Harry said: It’s very simple for me. Win promotion. 32 games to go. Win 23. Draw 4. Lose 5. That will give us 91 points. Which pretty much guarantees top 2. Anything else is a failure. We've heard from Tins and Jon L, so it was only a matter of time before we heard from you Steve! Edited November 1, 2023 by downendcity 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
italian dave Posted November 1, 2023 Report Share Posted November 1, 2023 9 hours ago, Davefevs said: Crikey, I almost read that the wrong way to what was meant If for example the new manager is a complete outsider like Eustace or Rowett, there really should be no animosity towards either. I think LJ suffered from several things, 1) his playing days baggage re his playing style (up for debate) and being the managers son and 2) his lack of experience. I think those went against him more than following Cotts. Pearson carried baggage for signing Danny Simpson. Lets hope it’s as good an appointment as possible. I’m still gutted, but I’m trying to move on. Ha ha, yes, I probably should have been more careful how I worded that! And yes, I’d agree that there was a lot more baggage that affected views on LJ. The experience/lack of is an interesting one. Part of me looks at the list of familiar names of ‘experienced’ managers, all not long ago sacked from elsewhere, all the same as other clubs’ lists (Millwall) in this instance - and I wouldn’t mind us trying someone a bit left field. Riskier, of course, and if the risk doesn’t come off then the inexperience is inevitably the stick used to beat everyone. As you say, you’d hope a complete outsider would arrive with no animosity related to current events at the club - but it’s already evident that isn’t going to be the case. As you say, move on, and hope this is the right appointment. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JP Hampton Posted November 1, 2023 Report Share Posted November 1, 2023 12 hours ago, B-Rizzle said: They absolutely did when things were at their peak under LJ with the Man Utd win, competing with Man City and doing well in the league. It didn’t last but when things are going well the fan base are in the moment and loving the success. It’s only when things aren’t going so well that everyone pines for a previous coach. On the subject of people forgetting all about NP as soon as we start hypothetically climbing the table with a new manager, or not. I think for most, the club as a whole is divided into the manager and the team in camp 1 and the board in camp 2. So if we did start climbing the table and started getting all happy clappy for the new manager, that’s fine, but for many it won’t change anything about how they feel about camp 2. Even if we got promoted, we’ve seen how the board have acted and the underhand way they’ve treated us and more importantly NP and no amount of success will (for many) let us forget it. So, personally, I see nothing wrong in getting behind the team and any new manager, but it by no means translates to, all is forgiven or forgotten. Just because as humans we have the ability to feel moments of happiness even in times of struggle, it doesn’t change our previous experiences or our original response to them. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Geoff Posted November 1, 2023 Report Share Posted November 1, 2023 12 hours ago, BS3 Ark at Ee said: No offence guys, but who genuinely thinks anyone’s coming in to get us promoted? They’ll end up falling way short and the hierarchy will just remain quiet whilst we all continue to be frustrated at their lack of communication, answers etc etc I can name you 3 people. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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