What is for sale….?

[ExiledAjax]

11 minutes ago, James54De said:

Which is legally owned by Bristol City Holding ltd. That is the company that both the FA and EFL consider our football club. 

I might contest that a little. 

You're correct from a financial reporting standpoint, but it's Bristol City Football Club Limited that owns the share in the EFL, and it's Bristol City Football Club Limited that registers players with the FA and FIFA and presumably pays/receives transfer fees. I think it's arguable that it's Bristol City Football Club Limited that is recognised by the EFL and FA for footballing rather than financial purposes.

Edited November 1, 2023 by ExiledAjax

[Frenchay Red]

We, BCFC, pay rent to use it just like the Bears do. As was explained on a recent stadium tour.

Could be paying rent to ourselves I suppose

[bcfc01]

11 minutes ago, James54De said:

Which is legally owned by Bristol City Holding ltd. That is the company that both the FA and EFL consider our football club. 

Final time, the asset is owned by Ashton Gate Ltd, not the football club. 

 

 

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, bcfc01 said:

Final time, the asset is owned by Ashton Gate Ltd, not the football club limited. 

 

 

Tinsy winsy tweak

[SecretSam]

My house is for sale, anyone want it?

[The Bard]

2 hours ago, Frenchay Red said:

We, BCFC, pay rent to use it just like the Bears do. As was explained on a recent stadium tour.

Could be paying rent to ourselves I suppose

Money is being paid from the club to its holding company. I imagine the holding company also benefits from the profits of Ashton Gate Stadium.  After the £8 million "other operating costs" have covered whatever they cover.

 

[Davefevs]

3 hours ago, The Bard said:

Money is being paid from the club to its holding company. I imagine the holding company also benefits from the profits of Ashton Gate Stadium.  After the £8 million "other operating costs" have covered whatever they cover.

 

Try unpicking this!

[The Bard]

1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

Try unpicking this!

Okay, so the staff costs on matchdays are all recharged to the clubs, the takings aren't unless they specifically relate to each 'franchise'?  Hence each club has a cost from the bars etc on matchday.  

Basically, Steve takes the surplus income from the stadium doesn't he?  Hospitality, conferencing whether it be from Football, rugby or just in the middle of the week.  It's why he's so desperate for the arena as this will take the whole thing onto a different level. Yes the arena is lovely for the basketball team, but its real value to its owner is immeasurable.  Think his plan was that it would've been built by now and the sale would be nailed on.

[Mr Popodopolous]

Draw your own conclusions, possibly a simplistic analysis by me or looking at the wrong areas but.

The revenue streams for Bristol City Holdings- which is the consolidator if non trading- of Bristol City FC and Ashton Gate Limited.

Some of it must go go the rugby or is it the ground rent that that computes out at the Holdings level? However the Holdings is the key for FFP tests if nothing ekse.

Edited November 1, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[fgrsimon]

19 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

The fact that wages are about 1/3 of turnover for AGL and it still runs at a loss- granted depreciation and amortisation plus no separate cash..Well the obvious question of tax offsetting even a small amount but really from a cost control perspective that kind of company shouldn't be making a loss surely. IMO.

Could the loss be because these are 2021-2022 accounts and so were partly affected by Covid?

[Numero Uno]

On 31/10/2023 at 16:39, italian dave said:

What slightly concerns me is the potential for that to be broken up.

My understanding is that SL’s current intention is that the terms of any sale include whatever is necessary (contracts, covenants, corporate structures) to ensure that it can’t be broken up.

I assume that affects the price.

If he reaches Sheffield Wednesday owner levels of being pissed off with the whole thing, and with moaning fans etc etc, is there a risk that he decides he just wants rid whatever. And doesn’t worry if that means removing any provisions to ensure that it can’t be broken up?

Because, appealing though his departure clearly is to many, if it was on that basis then we could very much regret that in years to come.

(And no, I’m not Steve L!!)

Totally understand this post..............all it does for me though is reinforce what a totally misguided **** up Steve's Bristol Sport dream was and is.

[italian dave]

13 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

Totally understand this post..............all it does for me though is reinforce what a totally misguided **** up Steve's Bristol Sport dream was and is.

I think we just have to accept (and perhaps have not fully appreciated) that Steve’s dream is all about sport generally in Bristol, not just football and Bristol City. Thats what he got his CBE for. And to be fair that what he’s always been open about.

So I don’t know that ‘misguided’ is the right term, it’s what he’s aimed for - perhaps just not what we have always acknowledged we’re part of.

But it's certainly risky for the football club. Maybe less so in Steve’s original vision of the whole of Bristol Sport remaining one entity - or one ‘group’ at least. And I’m prepared to believe he was, and maybe still is, genuine about that. But if he starts to lose interest, or is he can’t find anyone appropriate to take on the legacy then that risk starts to materialise. 

[Mr Popodopolous]

22 minutes ago, fgrsimon said:

Could the loss be because these are 2021-2022 accounts and so were partly affected by Covid?

Think it often makes a loss but happy to look back.

[The Bard]

14 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Draw your own conclusions, possibly a simplistic analysis by me or looking at the wrong areas but.

The revenue streams for Bristol City Holdings- which is the consolidator if non trading- of Bristol City FC and Ashton Gate Limited.

Some of it must go go the rugby or is it the ground rent that that computes out at the Holdings level? However the Holdings is the key for FFP tests if nothing ekse.

It would make no sense for money to go to the rugby. There's no FFP in rugby, just a salary cap. When we were sailing close to the wind FFP wise the opposite would've made sense. Just as Man City's 'sponsorship' was bloated to increase 'revenue' to allow extra spending.

Rugby pay rent to Ashton gate stadium Ltd.

 

Or sm I missing your point?

[Davefevs]

20 minutes ago, The Bard said:

It would make no sense for money to go to the rugby. There's no FFP in rugby, just a salary cap. When we were sailing close to the wind FFP wise the opposite would've made sense. Just as Man City's 'sponsorship' was bloated to increase 'revenue' to allow extra spending.

Rugby pay rent to Ashton gate stadium Ltd.

 

Or sm I missing your point?

@Mr Popodopolous you need to be looking at the inter group pages of the annual accounts…the revenues are the revenues.  Although the granularity isn’t there to do much analysis on it.  See my post and screenshots above and @The Bard’s reply.

[The Bard]

13 hours ago, Numero Uno said:

Totally understand this post..............all it does for me though is reinforce what a totally misguided **** up Steve's Bristol Sport dream was and is.

The dream wasn't.

The very cynical, financial set up done to suit only his needs clearly was. The more tuned in Rugby fans are deeply concerned about this sale and would come after.