Sending off correct?

[formerly known as ivan]

Thought it was a red card and a pen at the time. Still not sure if it was in the box having seen it a few times, but every time I see the incident I am more convinced it should have been a yellow. Goalkeeper and defender both seemed to be back covering. I feel like had the same thing happened following a decent build up it would have been a yellow. The way it played out with the keeper giving the ball away had already made the reds mind up, although to be fair he didn’t rush the decision.

Apologies if this has been discussed elsewhere.

[BCFCGav]

Because we’d nicked the ball off them and they were in disarray, it was a really excellent chance to score, and the foul prevented that so I think red. If it’s in the box, it’s a pen and a yellow correct? Double jeopardy rule?

[And Its Smith]

1 minute ago, formerly known as ivan said:

Thought it was a red card and a pen at the time. Still not sure if it was in the box having seen it a few times, but every time I see the incident I am more convinced it should have been a yellow. Goalkeeper and defender both seemed to be back covering. I feel like had the same thing happened following a decent build up it would have been a yellow. The way it played out with the keeper giving the ball away had already made the reds mind up, although to be fair he didn’t rush the decision.

Apologies if this has been discussed elsewhere.

Definitely outside the box. Red card for me. No attempt to play the ball and we are clean through 

[And Its Smith]

2 minutes ago, BCFCGav said:

Because we’d nicked the ball off them and they were in disarray, it was a really excellent chance to score, and the foul prevented that so I think red. If it’s in the box, it’s a pen and a yellow correct? Double jeopardy rule?

Would still have been a red as no attempt to play the ball 

[Cristored]

4 minutes ago, formerly known as ivan said:

Thought it was a red card and a pen at the time. Still not sure if it was in the box having seen it a few times, but every time I see the incident I am more convinced it should have been a yellow. Goalkeeper and defender both seemed to be back covering. I feel like had the same thing happened following a decent build up it would have been a yellow. The way it played out with the keeper giving the ball away had already made the reds mind up, although to be fair he didn’t rush the decision.

Apologies if this has been discussed elsewhere.

Prevented a clear goal scoring opportunity - red card.

[elhombrecito]

You certainly can't argue that there was a defender and goalkeeper covering, but you also can't deny it was a 'clear goalscoring opportunity' therefore, a sending off is correct.

[BCFCGav]

6 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Would still have been a red as no attempt to play the ball 

Ah I forgot that caveat. Cheers.

[ProfitInMyPocket]

Might have been a little aggrieved if it was the other way and if you look at the picture from behind the goal I can understand the frustration from their fans. 

But in real time it's pretty much a 1 on 1 with the goalie, it's not like the defender is rushing out to block Knight.

I guess that's what playing out from your 6 yard line to your defenders can do, invites serious pressure if you don't play the right pass. 

Inside it's not a red but outside it is.

[And Its Smith]

10 minutes ago, ProfitInMyPocket said:

Might have been a little aggrieved if it was the other way and if you look at the picture from behind the goal I can understand the frustration from their fans. 

But in real time it's pretty much a 1 on 1 with the goalie, it's not like the defender is rushing out to block Knight.

I guess that's what playing out from your 6 yard line to your defenders can do, invites serious pressure if you don't play the right pass. 

Inside it's not a red but outside it is.

Inside it would be a red as well in my opinion as he’s not gone for the ball 

[Harry]

Sorry. I’m not having this. 
If that was given against us I’d be livid. 
Surely the rule has always been ‘is he the last man’. He’s not. There is another defender who is pretty much bang in between Knight and the goal. If that’s not a ‘covering man’ I don’t know what is. 
I’d be mad if that was against us. 

[And Its Smith]

6 minutes ago, Harry said:

Sorry. I’m not having this. 
If that was given against us I’d be livid. 
Surely the rule has always been ‘is he the last man’. He’s not. There is another defender who is pretty much bang in between Knight and the goal. If that’s not a ‘covering man’ I don’t know what is. 
I’d be mad if that was against us. 

Rule is clear goal scoring opportunity. Nothing in there about the last man 

[Harry]

Just now, And Its Smith said:

Rule is clear goal scoring opportunity. Nothing in there about the last man 

But how can anyone say it’s a clear goal scoring opportunity when there is a defender stood directly between you and the goal? 
 

If that was a sending off today, then why wasn’t this one for Boro. Last man, player running directly in on the keeper, with the ball at his feet. 
 

 

[And Its Smith]

2 minutes ago, Harry said:

But how can anyone say it’s a clear goal scoring opportunity when there is a defender stood directly between you and the goal? 
 

If that was a sending off today, then why wasn’t this one for Boro. Last man, player running directly in on the keeper, with the ball at his feet. 
 

 

If you are looking for consistency I wouldn’t advise looking at championship referees! 

[And Its Smith]

3 minutes ago, Harry said:

But how can anyone say it’s a clear goal scoring opportunity when there is a defender stood directly between you and the goal? 
 

If that was a sending off today, then why wasn’t this one for Boro. Last man, player running directly in on the keeper, with the ball at his feet. 
 

 

I haven’t seen that. Did they give a penalty? Was a genuine attempt made at the ball? 

[Mr Popodopolous]

Keith Hackett has his doubts! Fwiw.

Thought the ref got it right, red card but not quite in the box.

Edited November 5, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, elhombrecito said:

You certainly can't argue that there was a defender and goalkeeper covering, but you also can't deny it was a 'clear goalscoring opportunity' therefore, a sending off is correct.

 

21 minutes ago, And Its Smith said:

Rule is clear goal scoring opportunity. Nothing in there about the last man 

Agree - Think I read / heard that if the next action would’ve been a shot, that’s DOGSO.

The other thing I wanted to add generally is that first point of contact isn’t necessarily the point where the foul is committed.

I haven’t seen it back but recall him going another stride or two before being brought down.

Just seen Mr P’s post, that still screenshot is not the position of the foul at all.

[Mr Popodopolous]

3 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

 

Agree - Think I read / heard that if the next action would’ve been a shot, that’s DOGSO.

The other thing I wanted to add generally is that first point of contact isn’t necessarily the point where the foul is committed.

I haven’t seen it back but recall him going another stride or two before being brought down.

Just seen Mr P’s post, that still screenshot is not the position of the foul at all.

It wasn't Dave no, have to wonder what Hackett is on about. A former senior ref isn't he.

[Mr Popodopolous]

To also add, will be interesting to see if it gets overturned on appeal, that'll tell us either way as I'm sure Sheffield Wednesday will appeal it.

Hackett again fwiw. I still think the correct call was made anyway.

Edited November 5, 2023 by Mr Popodopolous

[Garland-sweden]

Dont think its a red.

[East Londoner]

3 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Keith Hackett has his doubts! Fwiw.

Thought the ref got it right, red card but not quite in the box.

Should also be noted he’s a Sheffield Wednesday supporter 

[firstdivision]

When you see Sam Bell’s miss, you wonder what a clear goal-scoring opportunity is for us. But surely this is a clear goal-scoring opportunity. Sheffield-born Hackett’s angle doesn’t take into account our players free left and right either. 
If that had happened against us, I couldn’t make out a really strong case for a yellow. It was an unusual situation, though. 
 

[cidercity1987]

Looks like a free kick and a red to me although I can concede there is a small element of debate as to whether it is a clear goalscoring opportunity. Not to the extent of Hacketts comments though.

The deciding factor for me, not that it's in law somewhere but, was it equitable for us to have a free kick and only a yellow from that denied opportunity or was it more equitable them getting a red. Its clearly the latter.

[kit]

He's 1 on 1 with the keeper, Bannan has clearly made zero attempt for the ball and only has eyes to bring him down not to give away a penalty.

If Bannan is making a sliding last ditch attempt to take the ball and mistimes it then I think it would be an obvious yellow.

I think examples of other players only getting yellows are more examples of refs not correctly applying the letter of the law.

When Wednesday undoubtedly appeal it the old trope of Bailey Wright getting a 3 match ban on appeal will come out. I think its probably got a decent chance of being overturned on appeal but I don't think that should.

[O'Garlandinho]

7 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

To also add, will be interesting to see if it gets overturned on appeal, that'll tell us either way as I'm sure Sheffield Wednesday will appeal it.

Hackett again fwiw. I still think the correct call was made anyway.

I agree the correct decision was made, for me Knight would’ve scored had he not been hacked down, right behind him from the south stand the goal was gaping!

Hackett referring to position of defenders just wrongly interprets why lots of people assume it’s the last man.

[1960maaan]

9 hours ago, elhombrecito said:

You certainly can't argue that there was a defender and goalkeeper covering, but you also can't deny it was a 'clear goalscoring opportunity' therefore, a sending off is correct.

Setting himself for a shot, which looks like a clear goal scoring opportunity . From behind & no chance to get the ball.
Against us and I'm questioning the Red. But deliberate foul play in that act of shooting ? From that position, even with the defender coming across it looks like Knighty gets a shot with the keeper to beat.
TBH I was more interested in watching the Ref, didn't even reach for a card straight away. Finger to the ear , looked like he was talking to Lino/4th official. Whoever he was discussing it with, he took his time and gave the Red, whether it was really his decision or not.

[Bristol Oil Services]

7 hours ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Keith Hackett has his doubts! Fwiw.

Thought the ref got it right, red card but not quite in the box.

Keith Hackett? That's Keith Hackett, born in Sheffield, just to add some detail

[Davefevs]

4 hours ago, East Londoner said:

Should also be noted he’s a Sheffield Wednesday supporter 

6 minutes ago, Bristol Oil Services said:

Keith Hackett? That's Keith Hackett, born in Sheffield, just to add some detail

You two must be old enough to remember this then?

My first thought when I saw Hackett’s response was “todays ref is Keith Hackett from Sheffield”.

[nickolas]

How is this even being discussed? Read a very long twitter thread today with a lot of dumbass salty northerners complaining about their bad luck and even some of our own fans saying they’d be upset if given against us. Does noone actually follow the rules of the game we all go to watch?!
Bannan deliberately kicked Knight’s legs out ( im sat dead in line in the Dolmoan). Last man clear on goal, its irrelevant whether there’s a defender there. 
Was soooo close to also being a penalty. 

Edited November 5, 2023 by nickolas

[ralphindevon]

Might be just me but I’m never as happy as I should be when a player is sent off against us.

I know it was Bannan who’s got a good record against us but I’d rather let the game play out as it was supposed to. I don’t know the stats but it feels like we can struggle against 10.

Very happy to get over the line yesterday but some scary second half moments.

[Midred]

And with our record, If he'd gone over in the box would the ref just have said "play on?"