Silvio Dante Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 Anyone fancy it? Although I thought the first one was Krause’s job! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 In a normal world I’m sure @Davefevs would be an ideal candidate. But I’d imagine it pays minimum wage so would rule out anyone who’s not just left school. 6 5 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 3 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said: Anyone fancy it? Although I thought the first one was Krause’s job! Job for DaveFev?………. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim Monaghan Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 Although I don't see eye to eye with David, that would be the perfect role for him and someone who would benefit the club in such a role. We always talk about the extra percent, so why wouldn't you pay for someone with the aptitude that David has for this sort of thing to join the club? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted May 9 Author Report Share Posted May 9 5 minutes ago, Harry said: In a normal world I’m sure @Davefevs would be an ideal candidate. But I’d imagine it pays minimum wage so would rule out anyone who’s not just left school. True - I noted salary was “competitive” which in recruiter speak normally means “not very much”. It’ll be probably in the 20ks tops which is madness - if you could get someone in the building on £50-£60k who was experienced and good, it’s a drop in the football finances ocean and has massive potential upside benefit for us. 12 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRoss Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 4 minutes ago, Harry said: In a normal world I’m sure @Davefevs would be an ideal candidate. But I’d imagine it pays minimum wage so would rule out anyone who’s not just left school. It is strange that the money is so low in a role that could have considerable impact on results. Yet the contrast to players/managers wages is huge. I guess because it's a fashionable job so they can pay less. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 5 minutes ago, Harry said: In a normal world I’m sure @Davefevs would be an ideal candidate. But I’d imagine it pays minimum wage so would rule out anyone who’s not just left school. If only these jobs were available when I’d just finished studying Maths and Stats….30+years ago. Then again, computers weren’t even that big a thing back then! The salary will probably be in line with 30+ years ago too! Great opportunities though for the right person(s). 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 1 minute ago, RedRoss said: It is strange that the money is so low in a role that could have considerable impact on results. Yet the contrast to players/managers wages is huge. I guess because it's a fashionable job so they can pay less. The club/organisation seem penny wise pound foolish in some ways. The commercial side I imagine they could push a lot more e.g. this could be another example. Build up the data and analysis albeit if it makes Cash Losses as most Championship clubs persistently do, that us up to SL really. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 (edited) 12 minutes ago, Harry said: In a normal world I’m sure @Davefevs would be an ideal candidate. But I’d imagine it pays minimum wage so would rule out anyone who’s not just left school. I'd not worry. I suspect whoever gets it will just read Dave's analysis online and then present it as their own work... Edited May 9 by LondonBristolian 2 10 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Popodopolous Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 They ask for quite a lot but then doesn't everyone these days! This isn't the Lead Analyst but the one below. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pongo88 Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 These sort of jobs always refer to data. Without wishing to be rude to people who like this sort of thing, data analysis is easy. What is difficult is converting it into information. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted May 9 Author Report Share Posted May 9 5 minutes ago, RedRoss said: It is strange that the money is so low in a role that could have considerable impact on results. Yet the contrast to players/managers wages is huge. I guess because it's a fashionable job so they can pay less. As a theoretical case here, if you had a top notch analyst it pays for itself. Say you pay them the £60k and they’re top of their game. How much more likely is it that they will not recommend Mebude? If you dodge just one of those bullets, on likely loan and wage costs, you’ve paid for yourself for 2-3 years! We’re all surmising (probably correctly) it’s low salary but totally with you here. And, as lots of clubs take the penny pinching approach it would be somewhere where a bit more money spent could get a really strong team in. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 19 minutes ago, Harry said: In a normal world I’m sure @Davefevs would be an ideal candidate. But I’d imagine it pays minimum wage so would rule out anyone who’s not just left school. I'm in !! But what exactly do I have to do ? 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted May 9 Author Report Share Posted May 9 2 minutes ago, pongo88 said: These sort of jobs always refer to data. Without wishing to be rude to people who like this sort of thing, data analysis is easy. What is difficult is converting it into information. Can of worms, but you’re right. The Achilles heel of some data analysts is that they can tell you what the data says but aren’t great at working out what it means in real life - and to bang the drum again, particularly when they’re starting out, which is why paying more and getting someone who has a DA/Real World blend of skills is a no brainer. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTone Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 7 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: They ask for quite a lot but then doesn't everyone these days! This isn't the Lead Analyst but the one below. Got none of that but it's never stopped me before 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 1 minute ago, Silvio Dante said: True - I noted salary was “competitive” which in recruiter speak normally means “not very much”. It’ll be probably in the 20ks tops which is madness - if you could get someone in the building on £50-£60k who was experienced and good, it’s a drop in the football finances ocean and has massive potential upside benefit for us. Yeah, often amazes me what they see as “competitive”. Someone on the inside said these are a £25-30k (ish) jobs. When I look at the role specs and ditto at other clubs, I think they are looking for a multi-skilled person, but most of the things the person would do are more “junior” type activities with a smaller percentage “specialist”. And that’s not to diss those junior activities either. And from chatting to a ex-City analyst, he said that most of the stuff he did is trainable on the job, so why ask for the skills and qualifications they do. I guess to filter out applicants. But I think most clubs run small “analysis” departments and they are trying to cover too broad a range in a single job. I was chatting to a Data Scientist who was working short-term at a local club back in March, and he was talking serious data stuff (way over my head)…that’s where the money is, basically bringing in consultant, modelling skills, etc. It is probably the bigger clubs who can have a department big enough to have jobs specific for the task in hand…and therefore pay appropriately. Its fascinating how the analysis focus has grown though. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozo Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 2 minutes ago, BigTone said: I'm in !! But what exactly do I have to do ? Just follow DaveFevs on Twitter and nick all his ideas 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted May 9 Author Report Share Posted May 9 1 minute ago, mozo said: Just follow DaveFevs on Twitter and nick all his ideas And if you’re head scout, just follow Roy DeAlien and that jobs sorted as well. 4 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 10 minutes ago, Mr Popodopolous said: They ask for quite a lot but then doesn't everyone these days! This isn't the Lead Analyst but the one below. Exactly the point I made above. They ask a helluva lot for what circa 90% of the role will be filming, coding, saving to a database (admin tasks) and presenting to seniors. Liam Manning does that whilst sat on an exercise bike!!! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 3 minutes ago, Davefevs said: Yeah, often amazes me what they see as “competitive”. Someone on the inside said these are a £25-30k (ish) jobs. When I look at the role specs and ditto at other clubs, I think they are looking for a multi-skilled person, but most of the things the person would do are more “junior” type activities with a smaller percentage “specialist”. And that’s not to diss those junior activities either. And from chatting to a ex-City analyst, he said that most of the stuff he did is trainable on the job, so why ask for the skills and qualifications they do. I guess to filter out applicants. But I think most clubs run small “analysis” departments and they are trying to cover too broad a range in a single job. I was chatting to a Data Scientist who was working short-term at a local club back in March, and he was talking serious data stuff (way over my head)…that’s where the money is, basically bringing in consultant, modelling skills, etc. It is probably the bigger clubs who can have a department big enough to have jobs specific for the task in hand…and therefore pay appropriately. Its fascinating how the analysis focus has grown though. “Competitive”, my arse. My team (of circa 100) pays around £27k as a starting salary to the most junior grade with this year’s pay award (due last month, but not settled with the unions yet) to come on top. This amount isn’t competitive at all, it just strikes me as another attempt to do something important on the cheap. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Hitler Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 21 minutes ago, RedRoss said: It is strange that the money is so low in a role that could have considerable impact on results. Yet the contrast to players/managers wages is huge. I guess because it's a fashionable job so they can pay less. Not just fashionable, maybe fifteen years ago I looked at the financial controller role for BCFC and it would have been a big pay cut. Football clubs, other than the huge ones, tend to woefully underpay their back office staff because the owners don't have much interest in the back office. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 Just now, GrahamC said: “Competitive”, my arse. My team (of circa 100) pays around £27k as a starting salary to the most junior grade with this year’s pay award (due last month, but not settled with the unions yet) to come on top. This amount isn’t competitive at all, it just strikes me as another attempt to do something important on the cheap. Not forgetting they’ll probably bring in a couple of interns too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamdon Mart Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 7 minutes ago, Davefevs said: Yeah, often amazes me what they see as “competitive”. Someone on the inside said these are a £25-30k (ish) jobs. When I look at the role specs and ditto at other clubs, I think they are looking for a multi-skilled person, but most of the things the person would do are more “junior” type activities with a smaller percentage “specialist”. And that’s not to diss those junior activities either. And from chatting to a ex-City analyst, he said that most of the stuff he did is trainable on the job, so why ask for the skills and qualifications they do. I guess to filter out applicants. But I think most clubs run small “analysis” departments and they are trying to cover too broad a range in a single job. I was chatting to a Data Scientist who was working short-term at a local club back in March, and he was talking serious data stuff (way over my head)…that’s where the money is, basically bringing in consultant, modelling skills, etc. It is probably the bigger clubs who can have a department big enough to have jobs specific for the task in hand…and therefore pay appropriately. Its fascinating how the analysis focus has grown though. Think you hit the nail on the head there. A little like scouting, you'd imagine every man and his dog fancies themselves as a scout but can they really do it at a professional club when stuff gets real? Asking for too much on your CV will put a lot of people off. 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unan Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 31 minutes ago, Harry said: In a normal world I’m sure @Davefevs would be an ideal candidate. But I’d imagine it pays minimum wage so would rule out anyone who’s not just left school. I’m back doing a Computer Science bachelors at the big age of 29, Data Science is the field I’m looking to work in, this would be a dream job, but for the wages football pays, I’d never work in it! 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TammyAB Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 30 minutes ago, Robbored said: Job for DaveFev?………. I don't think the technical director will be employing someone he's just blocked on twitter 14 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted May 9 Author Report Share Posted May 9 3 minutes ago, Hamdon Mart said: Think you hit the nail on the head there. A little like scouting, you'd imagine every man and his dog fancies themselves as a scout but can they really do it at a professional club when stuff gets real? Asking for too much on your CV will put a lot of people off. As I’m sure you’re aware, Yeovil have also recently been given a bit of grief on social media for wanting a full time unpaid medical intern. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 2 minutes ago, TammyAB said: I don't think the technical director will be employing someone he's just blocked on twitter From the sounds of it, that significantly narrows down his options. He's got to employ someone! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IAmNick Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 5 minutes ago, Eddie Hitler said: Not just fashionable, maybe fifteen years ago I looked at the financial controller role for BCFC and it would have been a big pay cut. Football clubs, other than the huge ones, tend to woefully underpay their back office staff because the owners don't have much interest in the back office. Totally agree. I have a team with around 15 data scientists on it I interact with daily. Our level 2 (so a few years of experience) salary starts at around 45k, and you can be easily approaching 6 figures for a lead position without too much sweat. And guess what? We have incredible people - salary isn't the only factor but it does make a difference. 5 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Dante Posted May 9 Author Report Share Posted May 9 1 minute ago, LondonBristolian said: From the sounds of it, that significantly narrows down his options. He's got to employ someone! He could do it himself! If that’s what he wants to do, in view of his career as a player he deserves the opportunity to have a go at the head analysts role without criticism (I think that’s how the logic goes!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GrahamC Posted May 9 Report Share Posted May 9 2 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said: From the sounds of it, that significantly narrows down his options. He's got to employ someone! So Matt Hewlett or Dean Gerken then? ”Know the club”.. 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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