Bar BS3 Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 54 minutes ago, Colemanballs said: You are. 15 seasons does not constitute 'almost all' of 25 seasons which is the reasonable meaning of 'most' given the context in which KITR used it. Looking forward to all the apologies to WSM from all those who got it wrong... "Almost all" & "most" can be 2 very different proportions of whatever total you are discussing. Most - would be anything over 50% ie: can't be more of the alternative. Almost all - is more subjective, but you'd probably be expecting 90%+ No idea what the initial comment was specifically - but nobody owes WSM an apology for his stating that "15 out of 25 is not most" - because it is. Fact! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colemanballs Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 23 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said: "Almost all" & "most" can be 2 very different proportions of whatever total you are discussing. Most - would be anything over 50% ie: can't be more of the alternative. Almost all - is more subjective, but you'd probably be expecting 90%+ No idea what the initial comment was specifically - but nobody owes WSM an apology for his stating that "15 out of 25 is not most" - because it is. Fact! You are simply wrong. "The main difference, which will be the focus of this paper, is that ‘most’ tends to be used to convey proportions higher than ‘more than half’. More specifically, while ‘more than half’ is usually used for proportions right above 50%, ‘most’ is used for proportions that are significantly higher than 50%." Carcassi, F. & Szymanik, J., (2021) “An alternatives account of 'most’ and 'more than half’”, Glossa: a journal of general linguistics 6(1): 146. doi: https://doi.org/10.16995/glossa.5764 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bar BS3 Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 7 minutes ago, Colemanballs said: You are simply wrong. "The main difference, which will be the focus of this paper, is that ‘most’ tends to be used to convey proportions higher than ‘more than half’. More specifically, while ‘more than half’ is usually used for proportions right above 50%, ‘most’ is used for proportions that are significantly higher than 50%." Carcassi, F. & Szymanik, J., (2021) “An alternatives account of 'most’ and 'more than half’”, Glossa: a journal of general linguistics 6(1): 146. doi: https://doi.org/10.16995/glossa.5764 You have just used someone's opinion to back up your belief, rather than the factual. Mathematically, 15 IS most of 25. Definition wise - I think quoting the Oxford definition holds more weight than whoever you have quoted. MOST - greatest in amount, quantity, or degree. 15 is 60% of 25. That leaves 40% remaining- so no other alternative can exceed that of 15. Therefore 15 is most of 25. That's not an opinion, it's a fact. Someone else's interpretation of how many they would regard as most of 25 is irrelevant, because, like it or not - 15 is & always will be most of 25..! 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC Rich Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 15 minutes ago, Colemanballs said: You are simply wrong. "The main difference, which will be the focus of this paper, is that ‘most’ tends to be used to convey proportions higher than ‘more than half’. More specifically, while ‘more than half’ is usually used for proportions right above 50%, ‘most’ is used for proportions that are significantly higher than 50%." Carcassi, F. & Szymanik, J., (2021) “An alternatives account of 'most’ and 'more than half’”, Glossa: a journal of general linguistics 6(1): 146. doi: https://doi.org/10.16995/glossa.5764 I would call you ridiculous for going to the lengths of finding this paper, but I then read it - So I'm clearly going to the same lengths! The paper isn't actually saying what you think, it's arguing that when both 'more than half' and 'most' are used in the same piece of writing, maths, or paper then a clear difference is needed - it then attempts to show what the difference might be/at what point 'more than half' becomes 'most' if both are used. To try and put that more clearly - it looks at the two expressions from an academic point of view and how they could/can be used in Maths and research papers. It is similar to the use of 'theory' in science - in general the use of the word 'theory' means a hunch or best guess about something, however in science/ research papers it means pretty much the opposite. It means that every piece of evidence has been taken into account and any future evidence should comply with that theory- it means something has been completed tested, thought out, and is backed up - gravity in science is a theory. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RollsRoyce Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 Maning had. a part to play in that promotion, LJ in Sunderland getting promoted too, and Pearson for Leicester winning the Prem. Equally Manning a good part to play in MK Dons being relegated, LJ in Fleetwood getting relegated and Pearson in Watford being relegated. Not sure what anyone is trying to make out here. The record books show, Manning and LJ have never got a club promoted. Neil Warnock is so far ahead of them all. McKenna has 2 promotions. Manning and LJ will struggle to get any team promoted in the next decade for a multitude of reasons, some related to their ability, some well out of their control. Neither are stand out talents like McKenna. All IMHO. Many will disagree. 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colemanballs Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 7 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said: You have just used someone's opinion to back up your belief, rather than the factual. Mathematically, 15 IS most of 25. Definition wise - I think quoting the Oxford definition holds more weight than whoever you have quoted. MOST - greatest in amount, quantity, or degree. 15 is 60% of 25. That leaves 40% remaining- so no other alternative can exceed that of 15. Therefore 15 is most of 25. That's not an opinion, it's a fact. Someone else's interpretation of how many they would regard as most of 25 is irrelevant, because, like it or not - 15 is & always will be most of 25..! This is becoming tedious and will be my last post on the subject. According to the Oxford Dictionary, 'most' can mean 'almost all'. In the context which KITR used it, that is the only reasonable meaning. From NTTDS's post re: MOTD: I would prefer if it was shown as two separate matches. Most of us do know the outcome of the games. Would changing 'most' to 'more than half' change the meaning? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 3 hours ago, Colemanballs said: You are. 15 seasons does not constitute 'almost all' of 25 seasons which is the reasonable meaning of 'most' given the context in which KITR used it. Looking forward to all the apologies to WSM from all those who got it wrong... I agree with you. In the context used I too read 'most' as meaning 'almost all'. 15 out of 25 seasons is 60%. That's not most, far from it. WSM certainly isn't wrong afaic. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 2 hours ago, Colemanballs said: You are simply wrong. "The main difference, which will be the focus of this paper, is that ‘most’ tends to be used to convey proportions higher than ‘more than half’. More specifically, while ‘more than half’ is usually used for proportions right above 50%, ‘most’ is used for proportions that are significantly higher than 50%." Carcassi, F. & Szymanik, J., (2021) “An alternatives account of 'most’ and 'more than half’”, Glossa: a journal of general linguistics 6(1): 146. doi: https://doi.org/10.16995/glossa.5764 OTIB can be so erudite at times! You wouldn't get a discussion of linguistics on Gaschat. Except perhaps arguing about the precise meaning of prowd. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Davefevs Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 2 hours ago, Colemanballs said: You are simply wrong. "The main difference, which will be the focus of this paper, is that ‘most’ tends to be used to convey proportions higher than ‘more than half’. More specifically, while ‘more than half’ is usually used for proportions right above 50%, ‘most’ is used for proportions that are significantly higher than 50%." Carcassi, F. & Szymanik, J., (2021) “An alternatives account of 'most’ and 'more than half’”, Glossa: a journal of general linguistics 6(1): 146. doi: https://doi.org/10.16995/glossa.5764 This term is the new “top-end” 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bar BS3 Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 1 hour ago, Colemanballs said: This is becoming tedious and will be my last post on the subject. According to the Oxford Dictionary, 'most' can mean 'almost all'. In the context which KITR used it, that is the only reasonable meaning. From NTTDS's post re: MOTD: I would prefer if it was shown as two separate matches. Most of us do know the outcome of the games. Would changing 'most' to 'more than half' change the meaning? No. Its the same thing. The majority - most.! Please don't bother replying - you are right - it is tedious. Enjoy the sunshine Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledAjax Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 4 hours ago, Colemanballs said: You are. 15 seasons does not constitute 'almost all' of 25 seasons which is the reasonable meaning of 'most' given the context in which KITR used it. Looking forward to all the apologies to WSM from all those who got it wrong... At the risk of speaking for him, I think the fact that @Kid in the Riot clarified his intended context, that in his initial post he was using the word to mean "significant majority", is important. He may have been abrupt in that clarification, but it was made quite clearly. That may not be the primary common meaning, but it is an acceptable meaning of the word "most", and once clarified, can be taken to be what the author intended. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lenred Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 Slightly off the incredibly educational mathematical theme, but I wonder how many ‘caps’ we are going to need to get to the away game. Probably will be the most popular away game next season? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledAjax Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 5 minutes ago, lenred said: Slightly off the incredibly educational mathematical theme, but I wonder how many ‘caps’ we are going to need to get to the away game. Probably will be the most popular away game next season? Easy from London, small stadium, new ground for many, close to Bristol. Yeh it'll sell out 4 or 5 times over I reckon. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pillred Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 (edited) 12 hours ago, W-S-M Seagull said: Nope cos I dont agree that 15 out of 25 is most. 20+ would be most. You going to apologise to the numerous posters that you constantly call thick? Even 13 out of 25 could conceivably be considered the most as it's more than half. Edited May 19 by pillred Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nogbad the Bad Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 46 minutes ago, Bar BS3 said: No. Its the same thing. The majority - most.! Please don't bother replying - you are right - it is tedious. Enjoy the sunshine You're wrong. The majority - a word that wasn't used btw - is not the same as most. Majority means the greater number, quite different from most which means nearly all. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JBFC II Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 1 hour ago, Nogbad the Bad said: You're wrong. The majority - a word that wasn't used btw - is not the same as most. Majority means the greater number, quite different from most which means nearly all. Just to be clear then, which division have we spent most of this century in if it isn't the championship? 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
italian dave Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 Roll on August…… 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PHILINFRANCE Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 20 hours ago, Sleepy1968 said: Bolton for me as they were our opposition for my first game Home to Bolton was my first game as well, although it was a little bit before the days of Tom Ritchie. Not many on here will remember him, most have probably never heard of him, but a former England goalkeeper played for Bolton that day, the late Eddie Hopkinson. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Red Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 Up The City! 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 5 hours ago, Colemanballs said: This is becoming tedious and will be my last post on the subject. According to the Oxford Dictionary, 'most' can mean 'almost all'. In the context which KITR used it, that is the only reasonable meaning. From NTTDS's post re: MOTD: I would prefer if it was shown as two separate matches. Most of us do know the outcome of the games. Would changing 'most' to 'more than half' change the meaning? The context is that this century we have been in either the Championship or L1 - agreed? So me saying that we have spent "most" of that time in the Championship is a statement of fact, and an entirely appropriate use of the word "most" in the circumstance. It's really not too deep, or difficult, to understand... 7 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Red Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bristol Oil Services Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 1 hour ago, italian dave said: Roll on August…… I hope we win Sat......I hope we arrange a pre pre-season game, for this .... soon Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eardun Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 12 minutes ago, Northern Red said: Must admit that I don’t remember Darren Dunning playing for City (on loan). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Northern Red Posted May 19 Report Share Posted May 19 26 minutes ago, eardun said: Must admit that I don’t remember Darren Dunning playing for City (on loan). Came from Blackburn, I think he was only here for a couple of months. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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