I Support Johnson But

[Guest ashtonyate]

As I said I support johnson but he has nearly gone back to the team he took over, was he right to have so much up heavel or did he get it wrong.Should we have had all the loan players did this unsettle the squad and put us where we are today.

[havanatopia]

As I said I support johnson but he has nearly gone back to the team he took over, was he right to have so much up heavel or did he get it wrong.Should we have had all the loan players did this unsettle the squad and put us where we are today.

thats a very good question. all kinds of reasons why he did it but the primary one was that when GJ took over we had just lost 7-1. Equally by bringing those loanies in might have shaken the contract players into working harder. Whichever way we look at it we will never know; forwards not back now mate.

[Guest ashtonyate]

thats a very good question. all kinds of reasons why he did it but the primary one was that when GJ took over we had just lost 7-1. Equally by bringing those loanies in might have shaken the contract players into working harder. Whichever way we look at it we will never know; forwards not back now mate.

To be fair to Tin man The side we played at Swansea we were alway going to have a problem with the two centre halfs and Trundle

[havanatopia]

To be fair to Tin man The side we played at Swansea we were alway going to have a problem with the two centre halfs and Trundle

a problem is one thing but i doubt you or anybody else considered we would get pummelled quite so emphatically. if there is one thing we have to do this season it is to exorcise that result by thrashing those boys at the gate - that will be one hell of a match and atmosphere not least because the swans fans will for sure goad us to our limits.

[bh red]

He came in.........shock up a few of the senior pro's put them in the place, they didn't like it, so they got dropped, others have been injured or just unfit.

Now we have key players like Heywood and Russell back to full fitness as well, we are reaping the benefit.

Johnson's shake up was needed, but has done the trick.........the last 2 games have proved that

[havanatopia]

He came in.........shock up a few of the senior pro's put them in the place, they didn't like it, so they got dropped, others have been injured or just unfit.

Now we have key players like Heywood and Russell back to full fitness as well, we are reaping the benefit.

Johnson's shake up was needed, but has done the trick.........the last 2 games have proved that

absolutely and looks like you have answered your original question.

[Robbored]

Johnsons "shake up" cost City a record number of back to back defeats.Thats the fact of the matter.His loan signings,almost constant team changes and dropping of key players have lead City to be one from bottom in a dire league and out of all the potentially lucrative cup competitions.

From here on in City are facing a relegation battle and all because Johnson wanted to show a few militant players who is boss.Thats a very heavy price to pay for what is nothing more than dressing room politics.

Mid table mediocraty is best City can hope for this season - and thats if we are lucky.

[RedTauntonian]

I think bringing the loan players has made the players look at them selfs, and try even harder in training and games, to make sure that they aren't going to be heading for the exit door, i think johnson has got the players going now, they have showed that in the last two performances, and if they keep performing like that, we won't have any trouble surviving the drop.

[Nogbad the Bad]

absolutely and looks like you have answered your original question.

Not necessarily, he's a different poster.

From here on in City are facing a relegation battle and all because Johnson wanted to show a few militant players who is boss.Thats a very heavy price to pay for what is nothing more than dressing room politics.

We already had a poor and underperforming team in a relegation position when GJ took over.

Something had to give - would you really rather " a few militant players" had won the day?

[Robbored]

Something had to give - would you really rather " a few militant players" had won the day?

My point is that there are other ways of dealing with militantancy other than using "hand grenades" and waving the big stick.

Tact and man management skills for example.

[Guest Harry Dolman]

My point is that there are other ways of dealing with militantancy other than using "hand grenades" and waving the big stick.

Tact and man management skills for example.

He brought in Sankofa as Heywood was injured, Younga came in following the arrests. Quinn was a short term repl'ment for the injured Brooker. Few of us have seen enough of Joesph to comment & Basso has done ok.

If the loan players are to blame for the poor run, who was to blame for the poor form at the start of the season ??

[rednotblue]

Johnsons "shake up" cost City a record number of back to back defeats.Thats the fact of the matter.His loan signings,almost constant team changes and dropping of key players have lead City to be one from bottom in a dire league and out of all the potentially lucrative cup competitions.

From here on in City are facing a relegation battle and all because Johnson wanted to show a few militant players who is boss.Thats a very heavy price to pay for what is nothing more than dressing room politics.

Mid table mediocraty is best City can hope for this season - and thats if we are lucky.

Robbored,

fair points, but did Johnson do the right thing?? Obviously if he now loses his next 5 then we really are in the chicken soup, however I think if the dressing room politics have been sorted out then this is the BEST thing GJ could have done. For years we have had players going out and getting rat arsed whenever they want, recently we've had 4 players in trouble with the police and supposedly players like Hill and Tommy left because of disagreements with management (however that's just speculation)

Hopefully Johnson has now got eeryone pulling in the right direction, otherwise we could end up in a similar state to a few years a go (I wish I had my 100 years or City with me now) can't remember when but I think it was the ex Northern Ireland manager and we had two factions one for and one against (obviously!). To the extent when we scored only certain players would congratulsate you.

As I said if Johnson has got us all pulling in the right direction then 5th from bottom beckons!!

[Robbored]

The 10 day gap leading upto the Bradford game came at just the right time.Injured players like Heywood and Russell recovered,Brooker got back to full fitness and Johnson brought Woodman back from Torquay.

It was obvious that Johnson had finally managed to pick the right team on Tuesday night.Despite the defeat the performance was the best for ages and that form carried into Saturday with City eventually halting the run of defeats.

I don't know who deserves the credit for the upturn in form.I'm just happy things are looking more promising.

[RedUn]

From here on in City are facing a relegation battle and all because Johnson wanted to show a few militant players who is boss.Thats a very heavy price to pay for what is nothing more than dressing room politics.

... for which senior players are wholly to blame - they cost Tinnion his job, they stuck two fingers up to Johnson and it has taken two months for them to start working as hard as he knew they needed to.

Fair play to Johnson for standing his ground and getting so many of them to refocus on what is best for their careers. Why on earth would any fan have wanted him to let the cosy club rule the roost?

[Guest Harry Dolman]

... for which senior players are wholly to blame - they cost Tinnion his job, they stuck two fingers up to Johnson and it has taken two months for them to start working as hard as he knew they needed to.

Fair play to Johnson for standing his ground and getting so many of them to refocus on what is best for their careers. Why on earth would any fan have wanted him to let the cosy club rule the roost?

I find it amazing (maybe its down to personal friendships) how certain posters align themselves to a manager/player (or former) etc. The same people that supported Tinnion for acting tough last, season, now slate Johnson for doing the same.

[Guest Harry Dolman]

Done the trick !!!

One win in 10 after losing 9 on the bounce - yep, that did the trick ok, landed us bottom of the league.

We are almost back to square one in terms of selections and it's already looking a lot brighter.

He screwed it up big time and has now resorted to players who want to be here and see their future here, rather than mercenaries and lads wanting to get some league experience.

He's accepted his mistake by the selections he is now making, and as someone said - lets look forward now..

of course its ridiculous to claim we have turned the corner after 1 victory. Lets see where we are in Feb.

But i still maintain a lot of the loans were due to injuries. Other than the loans of Woody, Gilly & Younga I don't think he made any massive mistakes or screwed up big time.

[PhatWill]

He screwed it up big time and has now resorted to players who want to be here and see their future here, rather than mercenaries and lads wanting to get some league experience.

That's a contradiction. How can you say Johnson 'screwed it up' now that he has managed to separate the men from the boys as it were in the City squad?

I think what he did was spot on, and that in the long-term we will reap the rewards.

[RedUn]

That's a contradiction. How can you say Johnson 'screwed it up' now that he has managed to separate the men from the boys as it were in the City squad?

I think what he did was spot on, and that in the long-term we will reap the rewards.

I quite agree. The short-sighted view of some of our supporters never ceases to amaze me - they might find today's Daily Telegraph enlightening!

[samo]

I think what he did was spot on, and that in the long-term we will reap the rewards.

exactly. i hurt like everyone else when we lose, but GJ has set out his plans for bristol city as soon as he walked in the door. there are deeper issues than simply team selection at bristol city and GJ has vowed to deal with them and build for the future. simply getting results is a very different thing than changing an entire clubs mentality. and i for one say roll on the Johnson era.

[GrahamC]

I quite agree. The short-sighted view of some of our supporters never ceases to amaze me - they might find today's Daily Telegraph enlightening!

What an unusually well researched and perceptive piece on lower division football in a National newspaper, which is 100% correct, too.

[red panda]

What an unusually well researched and perceptive piece on lower division football in a National newspaper, which is 100% correct, too.

Or did the journalist just spend a few minutes browsing around posts on this forum, attend a post-match press conference and write it up

[cider army on tour]

Johnson won 3 out of 4 games when he came in. An incredible turn around in the clubs fortunes. After that run 3 players got themselves arrested. This showed Johnson a lot about the club and he had to deal with this very strongly. We are only just recovering from this now and will be all the better for it.

[Guest]

What an unusually well researched and perceptive piece on lower division football in a National newspaper, which is 100% correct, too.

Intresting to note that GJ comments on the bit about the grenade meaning all the players could tell their agents to look for new clubs in January.

The only place I saw that was on here.. so he's obviously still reading

[Alex_BCFC]

Or did the journalist just spend a few minutes browsing around posts on this forum, attend a post-match press conference and write it up

A Telegraph writer would be mad to use any of the crap that is written on this forum. Looks like a good, insightful, unbiased article.

[Rich-TWSC-]

I still don't think the Tinnion team was THAT bad. Other than the back 4.

[Guest Harry Dolman]

I still don't think the Tinnion team was THAT bad. Other than the back 4.

But Rich, you didn't see other teams routinely boss our midfield for the prev 18 months.....

[Rich-TWSC-]

But Rich, you didn't see other teams routinely boss our midfield for the prev 18 months.....

Very true. I am only going for the "on paper" theory. Which in this division tends to be enough.

[Alex_BCFC]

But Rich, you didn't see other teams routinely boss our midfield for the prev 18 months.....

Midfield has been the main problem for a long time. The fact that we have no one to win the midfield battel meant the defence was constantly under pressure. Wilkshire is good at home but away is usually quite poor. Murray is past it for me- good squad player but not quite up to it week in week out. On the left we have no-one. Tinnion had to play some games last season and he struggled to do this whilst managing. Dinning was good for a few games, quite poor thereafter. This season I can't remember a game where we have won the midfield battle. If we had a better midfield then the defence wouldn't have to work overtime. But it does help to have someone in goal who can come out and catch the ball to relieve the pressure.

[REDOXO]

He came in.........shock up a few of the senior pro's put them in the place, they didn't like it, so they got dropped, others have been injured or just unfit.

Now we have key players like Heywood and Russell back to full fitness as well, we are reaping the benefit.

Johnson's shake up was needed, but has done the trick.........the last 2 games have proved that

And that actually about sums it up...We needed a shake up and that doesn't necessarily mean get rid of players but make them earn their wages.

We are now tackling and winning 50-50's and don't look like a soft touch...The two guys in the middle of the park wont allow themselves to be over run and we have two pacey in form wingers...

Whether there was ever any question of City players spending to much time in the bar I don't know... but there certainly is not now.

Marcus and Steve Brooker looked like a combo on Saturday and we looked "relatively" solid the back....

Lets just hope we can maintain the momentum and not pick up the injuries you tend to when players are asked to up their tempo

[Guest ashtonyate]

By The way the poster have said on this subjected it seems they mostly think he was right to disrupt the team to bring in more disapline to the squad.

But there are 2 ways to do that the hand grenade or the stick and carrot approach I am not sure he pick the right one, we may have won saturday but we are a long way from being out of the wood yet

[Brianred]

A Telegraph writer would be mad to use any of the crap that is written on this forum. Looks like a good, insightful, unbiased article.

Take it you are refering to your post? But yes, it was agood read and correct. the thing to do now is to forget want went on so far. The season starts from now! only kidding Alex.

[Chappers]

So, GJ takes over, wins 3 and loses one very unluckily. He then mucks around with mediocre loan signings, drops 'hand-grenades' and we lose NINE, including early exits in the LDv and FA Cup, and we go bottom. Through injuries and recalls, is forced back to the original team, and unsurprisingly, we have 2 decent performances, and a win. Suddenly, the GJ spin goes into overdrive, claiming he meant it all along, and it was part of some master plan.

Personally, I think he mucked up, knows it, and is now trying to convince us otherwise. If we take an average around 2 points per game forthe rest of the season, I will accept that he might have got it right, but lets get real - One win in Ten - Loss of Cup revenues. Some master plan.

I will admit that I am warming to the new, less beligerant GJ, and if he builds on this success rather than dismantling the team in January, I will feel much more positive towards him. Lets see what happens in the next four games before getting too carried away.

[Alex_BCFC]

So, GJ takes over, wins 3 and loses one very unluckily. He then mucks around with mediocre loan signings, drops 'hand-grenades' and we lose NINE, including early exits in the LDv and FA Cup, and we go bottom. Through injuries and recalls, is forced back to the original team, and unsurprisingly, we have 2 decent performances, and a win. Suddenly, the GJ spin goes into overdrive, claiming he meant it all along, and it was part of some master plan.

Personally, I think he mucked up, knows it, and is now trying to convince us otherwise. If we take an average around 2 points per game forthe rest of the season, I will accept that he might have got it right, but lets get real - One win in Ten - Loss of Cup revenues. Some master plan.

I will admit that I am warming to the new, less beligerant GJ, and if he builds on this success rather than dismantling the team in January, I will feel much more positive towards him. Lets see what happens in the next four games before getting too carried away.

I don't think he mucked up badly. I think one event that caused us a big problem was the night club thing and that set up a chain of events. Even though we beat Tranmere, we were poor, and were very poor against Barnet without any loan players. After that I think Johnson was entilted to throw 'hand grenades' with the poor performances at Oldham, Chesterfield etc. He brought in loan players to cover injuries and then to try and get better players which unfortunately didn't work out. I'm not saying he made mistakes but I have faith in what he is doing and I will still have faith even if we lose next week because I like a lot of the things he is doing. He is moving out those with stupid wages- although he can't rid of Stewart it would seem. also he is trying to get rid of the crap like Fortune.

GJ needs time to sort it out. The problems that Tinnion left us are still here and will be for some time. I'm not going to get on his back until he has had a while to sort it out. I'm not going to keep saying it's Tinnion's fault forever but I don;t think you can understand the situation we are in without considering what he did to the club.

[RedUn]

Suddenly, the GJ spin goes into overdrive, claiming he meant it all along, and it was part of some master plan.

But Johnson is saying nothing different now than the day he arrived. The only difference is that it has dawned on the majority of the squad that their interests are best served by listening to him. Simple game.

[RedUn]

Or it has dawned on Johnson that he got it wrong and is now amending his approach - if not publicly.

Errm, I don't think you bothered to read what I wrote.

[Guest twaters]

I don't believe for one minute he brought in the loan signings to shake up the old pros and bring them back in the side all shook up. He brought them in because he thought they were better than he already had and is now after 9 defeats in a row kicking himself.

Remember when he started for us he won the first 3 out of four games. Then he starts playing with the side (different formations and constant different 11s) and we lose 9 on the trot. A piece of mastermind management as now he will bring back in our original players "all shook up" or just stupidity he is now regretting.

I obviously think its the latter and to be honest i think he thought well i have got one good signing in (sankofa) and then got carried away.

I'm all behind Johnson but he has to take some blame for the 9 in a row. To say the loan signings were a clever ploy is rediculous.

[RedUn]

I just offered a different view.

So you did - it is only the evidence for it that you missed out ...

... the evidence for mine is in the words of Johnson's interview on Day One and in yesterday's press, particularly the Daily Telegraph; to summarise: "We will have professional athletes not social players."

Why anyone would prefer the idea that he has caved-in to the cosy club is beyond me but I await your evidence for this belief with interest.

[Robbored]

I commented several times during the run of defeats that Johnson had turned a winning squad of players into a bunch of losers. To be fair it could be argued that injuries and suspensions were partly to blame but Johnson brought in loan signings that were no better than the players already at the club and he chopped and changed the team seemingly with the purpose of showing the militant "social" players that if they didn't shape up they woudn't play.

The net result was 9 consequetive defeats leaving City deep in the relegation mire.

Johnson has now (with the exception of Noble and Basso) gone back to the players that have been available all along and immediately the team starts playing better.Co-incidence? Not in imo.

[Guest Harry Dolman]

I commented several times during the run of defeats that Johnson had turned a winning squad of players into a bunch of losers. To be fair it could be argued that injuries and suspensions were partly to blame but Johnson brought in loan signings that were no better than the players already at the club and he chopped and changed the team seemingly with the purpose of showing the militant "social" players that if they didn't shape up they woudn't play.

The net result was 9 consequetive defeats leaving City deep in the relegation mire.

Johnson has now (with the exception of Noble and Basso) gone back to the players that have been available all along and immediately the team starts playing better.Co-incidence? Not in imo.

A winning squad, that before he arrived were 2nd bottom & just got a manager the sack.

Even if we stay up, if our ambition is greater than mere survival, the current squad is not good enough & lacks cover in key areas. It is also lacking in pace.

[Robbored]

A winning squad, that before he arrived were 2nd bottom & just got a manager the sack.

.

Didn't Johnson win his first two games as City manager? and with largely the players he has now.

[Guest Harry Dolman]

Didn't Johnson win his first two games as City manager? and with largely the players he has now.

What about the same squad in the 7 or so games before that ? Maybe Johnson is just a good manager, & not a miracle worker ??

He won the 1st game with the same set of players.

Sankofa came in for the next game due to Heywoods injury.

Younga came in following the arrests.

Quinn came in as Brooker was injured.

There seems to be a myth that the team was doing great & Johnson relentlessly changed it. Had the team continued to do well & the arrests not happen then I doubt we'd have seen so much change.

Of the players that came in, I thought that initally Sankofa, Younga & Quinn did well & then they all faded - maybe we dragged them down a bit (can't be easy being an outsider in a team doing abysmally). Quinn got promoted with Wednesday last season so he can't be that useless.

I think a lot of the loans etc were forced on Johnson - yep you can argue that he could have used the likes of Fortune, Keogh, Gilly & Bridges instead, but in truth none of those have set the world alight, although there is clearly still time for Gilly & Keogh.

[BCFC_Dan]

I am not in any way saying he has caved in to anything, merely that he has changed his approach. The obvious evidence for that is in his team selections and his pre and post match interviews.

Is it impossible to believe that the players who were dropped and then reinstated have changed their attitudes over the past couple of months?

What kind of a manager would Johnson be if he didn't give the players a chance to make amends?

As for all this "turned a winning team into a losing one", maybe he has, but it was a team that won when it felt like it, rather than every week. For years our squad has been capable of beating anyone and they've usually done just enough to prove that without ever doing enough to win promotion. This is pointless. If they're not out to win every game then they might as well lose every game because we will never progress with that attitude. Something had to change and if a period of very poor performances is necessary to achieve that then so be it.

Some of you may prefer to take the short term view, but I would like to see my team promoted one day soon, so I'm backing Johnson.

[Guest Simon Lambley]

Hurrahhh , Yes one day it will happen , Oh yes one day....

[BCFC_Dan]

No that's not impossible, in fact it's likely. Just as likely as Johnson changing his attitude - and that needed to change as much as the players.

I disagree. I think his attitude has been spot-on and that if performances continue to improve it'll be because Johnson won. If it is because Johnson has given in to the players then I'll be very disappointed and look forward to another few years of league one mediocrity.

He gave them no chance at all when he first came - told them to look for new clubs after 5 minutes, big stick approach. He has now seen sense, seen that it doesn't work like that, and changed his approach.

Rubbish. He gave them all a chance when he arrived, even praised many of them. Then they repaid his faith by going out on the lash and getting arrested, and then by sulking when he criticised them.

Any player who responds to criticism by sulking is not a winner, and a football club should be no place for losers.

A number of things have to change to get the squad playing as they can, including the managers attitude. A period of poor performances is acceptable - but not 9 straight defeats, the worst sequence in over 100 years of history. That was rank bad management as much as bad attitude from the players.

Not in this case. This squad of players has been responsible for getting rid of several managers. They have too much power and not enough responsibility. This has to change or there is simply no point in continuing.

I wouldn't care if we didn't win another game all season as long as Johnson builds a team of responsible, self-motivated players with the will to win. It will be better in the long run.

If he fails to do that then I will agree with you, but he needs to have a chance to do it.

I think you will find that every City supporter wants his team promoted, to suggest otherwise is senseless. As for short term views, as far as I'm concerned if Johnson fails to keep us up I'd like to see him sacked. In fact, if we go on another losing streak, he should be sacked before the end of the season. It's an opinion which is as valid as anyone else's on here. If that's a short term view then fine. .

Of course it's valid, but it is a short term view. To my mind the worst thing we could do now is sack Johnson because it will mean that the players have won - again. We'll then have to spend more money on getting another manager, who will either achieve mediocrity a la Wilson, or fail because the players don't like him a la Pulis, Tinnion and Johnson.

I totally appreciate the ramifications of relegation, but I do not want to see any more years of players wasting their talent, messing about in the lower leagues because they can't be bothered to give 100% every game. I don't want to support players who aren't giving 100%, and I shan't. But I will support a manager who is prepared to shake them up.

[Alex_BCFC]

I disagree. I think his attitude has been spot-on and that if performances continue to improve it'll be because Johnson won. If it is because Johnson has given in to the players then I'll be very disappointed and look forward to another few years of league one mediocrity.

Rubbish. He gave them all a chance when he arrived, even praised many of them. Then they repaid his faith by going out on the lash and getting arrested, and then by sulking when he criticised them.

Any player who responds to criticism by sulking is not a winner, and a football club should be no place for losers.

Not in this case. This squad of players has been responsible for getting rid of several managers. They have too much power and not enough responsibility. This has to change or there is simply no point in continuing.

I wouldn't care if we didn't win another game all season as long as Johnson builds a team of responsible, self-motivated players with the will to win. It will be better in the long run.

If he fails to do that then I will agree with you, but he needs to have a chance to do it.

Of course it's valid, but it is a short term view. To my mind the worst thing we could do now is sack Johnson because it will mean that the players have won - again. We'll then have to spend more money on getting another manager, who will either achieve mediocrity a la Wilson, or fail because the players don't like him a la Pulis, Tinnion and Johnson.

I totally appreciate the ramifications of relegation, but I do not want to see any more years of players wasting their talent, messing about in the lower leagues because they can't be bothered to give 100% every game. I don't want to support players who aren't giving 100%, and I shan't. But I will support a manager who is prepared to shake them up.

Suprisingly I agree 100% with BCFC Dan. Depsite the obvious poor run, it is clear to me that Johnson will do a good job here given the right backing by board. The board would be mad to even consider his position. Even when we won Saturday with mostly the players Tinnion left we weren't convincing. Don't get me wrong, I'm not moaning about the performance or the result, but everyone had to give 100% for us to be in with a shout and even then Huddersfield dominated the first half. We certainly wouldn't be able to win a game like that very often. The side isn't good enough yet and the fact that we were left without key players, and other poor ones highlights that Johnson has a big job on his hands. One in which I think he will do well at.

[Chappers]

I go with Cynic on this one. I think GJ came in with his massive ego, thought he could change things overnight, couldn't and is now a wiser and better Manager. Similarly, the players probably learnt a lot as well about commitment and professionalism. Mind you, it might still be an isolated win, and it is not inconceivable to suggest that we might not win any of our next 4 games (Equally, we could easily win all four), as our away record has hardly inspired this season.

Lets hope for stability, sanity from GJ, dedication and passion from the team, and an improved League position.

[Robbored]

Sorry but most of that is based on anecdotal here say sprinkled with hope that Johnson gets it right. You may not mind not winning another game this season on the off chance that he gets it right in the long run, but you'll be on your own, because that'll mean we will be in division 4 with attendances which mean we have players wages we cannot meet and debts we cannot service. To take that sort of chance is stupid.

He deserves enough time to turn around his initial mistakes, no more than that.

The same old points get dragged up every time and we just aint going to agree, so no more from me on this thread.

Not my debate, I know, but the obvious answer to this is that time will tell.City may kick on from the win on Saturday and embark upon a decent run of form that will lift us out of the relegation mire but they also may come away from Vale Park this Saturday with no points.

But imo City should ever have allowed to get into the current situation and I point the finger at Johnson,who has failed( untill recently) to get the best out of what is a decent squad.His aim was to show the players who is boss and his heavy handed approach led to a club record of back to back defeats.I can't forgive the bloke for that even if City manage to finish in mid-table obscurity come April/May.

That said, I do believe after the last two performances that City have turned the corner but City should not be fighting to escaping relegation at this point in the season.They should be on the fringes of the play-offs and looking to kick on come the second half of the season,sadly thats not going to happen.

If Johnson had adopted a different,less bullish approach then maybe City would have been better placed than they are now.

But its all retrospective...we just have to accept the things we cannot change.

[RedUn]

But imo City should ever have allowed to get into the current situation and I point the finger at Johnson,who has failed( untill recently) to get the best out of what is a decent squad.

As did his predecessor, the architect of said squad.

What Johnson (with some help from the Constabulary) has done is pinpoint the underlying cause - not that it was anything new at this club over the past eight years - accordingly, the players I saw on Saturday looked fitter than at any time since Mark Hammond was employed and there is still improvement to come. Johnson deserves great credit for sticking to his guns in the face of the squad's social leaders and their cronies within the fanbase.

His aim was to show the players who is boss {heaven forfend! ... obviously the players know best?} and his heavy handed approach led to a club record of back to back defeats. I can't forgive the bloke for that even if City manage to finish in mid-table obscurity come April/May. {whereas you implicitly can forgive "professional athletes" for wanting to be out on the razz? - bizarre}

Yes, the medicine has been a bitter pill but the effect is infinitely preferable to letting the cosy club float along like it has been doing ... what fascinates me is that the Daily Telegraph seems to have a clearer idea of City's problems than some of its most prominent supporters!

[Robbored]

Yes, the medicine has been a bitter pill but the effect is infinitely preferable to letting the cosy club float along like it has been doing ... what fascinates me is that the Daily Telegraph seems to have a clearer idea of City's problems than some of its most prominent supporters!

RedUn, My point which maybe I didn't make clear enough is that there are more ways than one to "skin a cat".

Johnson chose to wave the big stick which according to some has worked despite 9 defeats on the trot.Its not beyond consideration that he could have changed the ethos of the club by adpoting a more reasoned and dare I say it, a more subtle approach to the problem.That way the club may not have tumbled into a record number of loses and City may not be second from bottom.

[Guest Harry Dolman]

If Johnson had adopted a different,less bullish approach then maybe City would have been better placed than they are now.

The truth is you have absolutely no idea if this is true or not. Tinnion had a softly softly approach this season after playing the "hard man" last season. Funnily enough when he played the hard man we finished 7th, the softly approach got us 2nd bottom & him a dream gig at Aldershot.

The truth is none of us know what has really gone on. Even those who claim to have "connections" at the club, will have only got either the jaundiced view of someone out of favour or the "happy clappy" view of someone in favour.

You could argue the facts either way - either Johnson did a tremendous job to get 9 points out of 12 when he arrived (boy don't we need them) or the fact that this proves that the squad were good enough & he was wrong to bring in loans.

We often seem to want to sensationalise things - many people have said that Johnsons recent selections show he is admitting the "massive mistakes" he made early on, or are evidence that someone has had a word with him. We don't know the truth, so we speculate to extremes.

When Johnson took over most people said survival was the aim. If he achieves that, I think he should be applauded. If we go down he derserves criticism.

So far this season our only decent performances have come under Johnson. Unlike under Tinnion I can see that there is a pattern to our play, I can see what Johnson wants to achieve (achieving it is another thing, but under Tinns I genuinely couldn't see what it was, cos what he said we were going to do & what we did were poles apart).

WIth the flurry of games over Xmas I think the table will start thinning out by mid Jan & we will know better where we stand.

RedUn, My point which maybe I didn't make clear enough is that there are more ways than one to "skin a cat".

Johnson chose to wave the big stick which according to some has worked despite 9 defeats on the trot.Its not beyond consideration that he could have changed the ethos of the club by adpoting a more reasoned and dare I say it, a more subtle approach to the problem.That way the club may not have tumbled into a record number of loses and City may not be second from bottom.

Ok, I will speculate, what if a major problem at the club was the "social" nature of a hardcore of players. To begin with Johnson takes the subtle approach "you are all grown ups, I trust you etc, etc" - he then sees that that doesn't work, so he uses the big stick......... pure speculation, but seems reasonable to me.

The way I see it, he has praised the players heartily when they have done well (even following defeats to H'pool & Donny) & slated them when they were dreadful. Again, seems reasonable to me.

[BCFC_Dan]

RedUn, My point which maybe I didn't make clear enough is that there are more ways than one to "skin a cat".

Johnson chose to wave the big stick which according to some has worked despite 9 defeats on the trot.Its not beyond consideration that he could have changed the ethos of the club by adpoting a more reasoned and dare I say it, a more subtle approach to the problem.That way the club may not have tumbled into a record number of loses and City may not be second from bottom.

This would be a reasonable argument if the problem we were dealing with was a recent one, but it isn't. It's been around for years.

Wilson advocated the softly-softly approach and built a squad that nearly made it but failed (in my opinion) due to a lack of ambition from a squad that was content to prove that it was capable of winning things without ever actually doing it. All our other managers in recent history - Lennartsen, Pulis, Tinnion, Johnson - have identified a lack of professionalism and fitness in the squad as the major limiting factor - and all up to Johnson have paid with their jobs whilst the squad gets no better.

I cannot be sure that Johnson will be successful but I think it's about time we put some faith in a manager who is trying to do what 4 out of our past 5 managers have tried to do - shake the squad up and get them fitter and more professional.