'fickle Or Starved Of Success'?

[richieb]

Much has been said about which fan is more loyal & whether we moan or not makes us a better individual fan.

Point is that every club has it's hard core & when things go t1t$ up then they are all back to what is the bare bones as supporters.

Those like robbored, who whatever the performance, have their bums on the Ashton Gate seats.May moan & be pee'd off with what they see, but suffer the highs & are joyus at the highs.

Then we have the floating fan who, vote with their feet when things aren't good & decide that while they support the club, cannot be bothered to be bored watching such drival.

Problem is with todays lifestyles,people have so much more alternatives to spend good money on.The working mans game is no longer the 'must' for entertainment for every male each week.

Football, has got to attract the family & give value for money that people feel at ease to adopt when things are not good at the Gate.

Reading this forum over many months, it is quite clear that the product on the pitch is not attracting the floating fan. But also the 'off field' contributions are failing.

Whats happened to the promised pre & half time entertainment?

Why hasn't the grub situation improved?

So is it any wonder that gates are dwindling for on field & off field reasons.

Saturday was a classic - poor fodder on the pitch, matched at half time by the continuing pathetic half time draw

SL, has promised to waken this sleeping giant, but unfortunately I feel as if we are in a deeper sleep than he realise's.

The longer the on & off field performances remain as they are, then the giant will remain sleeping & the numbers watching won't be enough to stir the snoring beast.

But we are ALL supporters of BCFC & whether we are part of the hard core fickle fans or whether we are a fair weather fan who wants to be entertained,the fact is we need to be entertained in what we are seeing.

We aint got the product & unfortunatly this will distract the fans outside the hardcore 8/9000.

The club has to realise this & can't see it being left too long before actions are taken to rectify.

My real issue with the Commercial side, is that while they have come on leaps & bounds in bringing in new revenue (concerts/fireworks etc), very little has been done to satisfy the attending fans. Little half time entertainment, cr@p food.

So while we maybe attracting people to the Gate for non footy activities, we are at risk in losing the 'life-blood' thats the FOOTBALL FANS.

:Costumed19: :Party27: :sport5:

[grebes]

I personally don't give a flying jibby jobby about the food and half-time entertainment.

:Sleep12:

[Bow_Legged_Chicken]

To start good post well thought out.

However. I feel that i am a hardcore fan haven't missed a home game for god knows how long and for the last three years have been to most away games. This year (the worst year) i haven't missed one game.

Latetly i have been having to decide whether to go enjoy myself and watch Weston Super Mare or stay at City and watch them. I have chose city every time so far, and it seems i have made the wrong choice. Every week i sit down in my seat and think were going to do it this week. Do we? Like hell.

The main reason why i have been thinking about staying away is for the sake of the club. I keep thinking to myself if i stop going and they start losing supporters, loyal supporters then they have to relise they are not doing what they should be. Those players may start to relise how much we feel for them when they wear that shirt when they have a contract for us. We have a rather bad reputation for treating our players a bit poorly if they aren't doing so well. Thats passion showing through in my eyes.

I think the players and Mr. Wilson should be sent to a few of our houses. if they were sent to mine they would see all my city merchandise, my clothes are made up of many city shirts, my room littered with old and new, home and away city programmes. Even my computer is plagued with various City products and yet have a look at the rest of my room. Old wallpaper most of it off, cheap curtains, poor quality very old windows, old stained carpet. What I'm saying is I'm not rich, if i go to city i have to sacrifice other things, big sacrifices, ihave to organise my money around city, i have to go without things, big things. MY LIFE EVOLVES AROUND THEM. I go to college the only thing keeping me going is the thought of me being able to afford to go to thier matches. Call me mad but I'm sure I'm not the only one everything i think about (almost) i have to think of ways to fit it in with city. Can i buy that Burger King instead of going home and making myself summat or will it put me short for the next away game.

Basically what I'm saying some of us feel more for this club than anyone belives and when they start showing a lack of committment and appreciation back it makes you feel as if theres any point in committing yourself so much to them when they repay you with such poor and unpassionate displays. They need to relise they're job is more than a job. They are working to entertain us, their entertainment brings us happiness or sadness. They are not just working for the overly large pay packet at the end of the week, but a playing to repay the ones that are giving them that pay packet, they need to relise this, the minute they do would be the minute The "sleeping giant" will arise from its sleep and all of us fans who genually feel for city will be repayed for our sacrifices.

[richieb]

I personally don't give a flying jibby jobby about the food and half-time entertainment.

:Sleep12:

Very well Grebes & each fan has a right to want or not to want.

But when trying to attract the missing fans with entertaining options, many families attend the game now adays & for many the 'pick-me' up after a drab 1st half is a good quality pie & something to view while enjoying the fayre.

I too, couldn't be ###### to queue up for the cr@p fayre at the kiosks, but would if it didn't take 1o minutes to have a pee & the food was decent.

As for the entertainment, kids footy or a decent musicial interlude, would be welcome by many.

[Guest frogred]

Or do you think that perhaps some of us have had the #### kicked out of us by years of a #### on field product, Signing of #### players and being led by #### managers. Players looking for their last big pay cheque and very little commitment.

Since the John Ward debacle, The first time I actually saw a marked improvement was when Rosenior, Burnside & Fawthrop were in charge.

I'm sure i'm right in saying that we spent more than any other club in our division in bringing in players, But, Those players are very ordinary and have not enhanced the squad in short the money has been wasted.

I don't feel fickle after over 40 years of support, I definately feel starved of success, But, Worst of all I can't remember a lot of passion from players over the past 3 years and that is why many on this forum complain of lack of passion from the crowd. Passion breeds passion.

[richieb]

Now theres passion.

Yep, many fans go through such alot in supporting this great club.

While I am sure the Board & club realise this, it sometimes gets lost. I still feel that the priority is to turn the 'off-field' activities into a money generating scheme first, then take heed as to what the fans really are all about.

Ok yep, weve had questionaires etc, but I can't feel the real warmth to the day to day punter. Perhaps the guys & gals who sign up to the new forum will get this over.

Great post.

[Bow_Legged_Chicken]

Exactly it mate what i was trying to say.

[Guest frogred]

I have a simple answer, I feel the talent is at the club, Sell Coles and sack Wilson (pay him off) and bring in a manager with a bit of passion and who understands what it's like to be fan, Who is big enough to be wrong from time to time and also who teams play football. And oh yes a wheeler dealer cos Del Boy Wilson aint.

[Bow_Legged_Chicken]

Yep the trouble is finding that man.

Joe royle?!

Tinman would be ideal if it were for his extreme inexperience, on the other hand they all have to start from somewhere!

Tinman in with Leroy?

Anyway straying from the subject, expecially as Wilson ain't going no-where cause there is no point paying him excessive amount of compen just to rid of him.

at the moment i think we are all in agreement that passion from players and manager is what were lacking right?

[Robbored]

Not so long ago City under Lumbsden were playing infront of around hardcore 6000 at AG.I was one of them.It was dreadfull to watch - long balls.mostly #### players and no prospect at the time of it getting better.

Now - City in 9th place - 7 points from top spot and some are talking about staying away because the team is playing so poorly.Thats fickle.I simply couldn`t miss a City game at AG without good reason.If City are at home - then thats where I'm going - to support my team.

If you support your club then it should be for better and for worse.I've got no time at all for those who chose not watch the City simply because they aren`t playing all that well. And those very same people moan at locals who support Man Utd! and who never see them play live.

Fickle is to kind a word.

[fRed]

The first time I actually saw a marked improvement was when Rosenior, Burnside & Fawthrop were in charge.

Too right! They turned the season around by using a mostly different team to Pulis.

Young hungry players given their chance, refreshing and enjoyable.

It's time for youth to be given a chance again else our season is in ruins

[squirrel]

Ok, many of you say about your support over the past forty+ years, or however many it is.

When you can't get to a game, what do you do?.

I'll tell you shall I, You reach for the dial on the radio, there is always that elemant that this week we could win, and lets say on this particular week, you reached for that dial, and we won, it was a brilliant game, and the team played like a div 1 side? . You'd kick yourself.

Fans go for the passion, win or lose, the atmosphere that a good game can produce, or even when things arn't going our way there is always the ref to blame and take the frustration out on.

It's a weekly fix, the excitement as a player looks like scoring, as they close in on the net, hit or miss, the excitement still mounts before that ball is kicked either into the net, or over the bar.

To me the manager IS NOT to blame for the lackluster proformance of the team, they have to want the win. they know how to play the game, we can and do sit and say he shouldn't of played so and so, or played that player in that position, and sometimes I think he must hear you, as the following game certain changes have been made to what the person sat behind me was saying, and still it didn't work.

The short of it being, we go for the not knowing what will happen this game. the sheer passion and excitement.

[openEnd]

Not so long ago City under Lumbsden were playing infront of around hardcore 6000 at AG.I was one of them.It was dreadfull to watch - long balls.mostly ###### players and no prospect at the time of it getting better.

Now - City in 9th place - 7 points from top spot

Ok, but try not to forget Lumsden was in charge when city finished a respectable 9th place just missing out on the playoffs but 2 places and 3 points (I think) in Div One!

Ok you'll argue Jordan helped, but he left after the WBA game in Septemberish (if I remember correctly). So Lumsden had 30+ games in charge that season

Correct me I'm wrong no manager since has matched those lofty heights. At the moment I'd be satisfied to just be competing at that level

For the record that season was a very strong Div 1 too

West Ham

Oldham

Sheff Wed

Notts County went up via the play offs

[Guest Spike]

Again I'll say not every fan can afford the large sums of money it costs to go see City week in week out and when City are playing awful thier not going to waste alot of money and free time just to be disapointed by the team they love!

[bucksred]

Good Post, and very true.

for those of us who have seen City over the years from Top flight to broke, and just about every point since, all the highs and lows, good and bad, this current drift is demoralising- things saeem to improve and then sink back into mediocrity.

I want to come to the Gate more, and every season start that way, but you get ground down, and as I said earlier £100 blown per game to watch the current ######*, sorry I cant justify it. don't give a toss bout half time entertainment, what I want is passion from the team, like it actually cares, some noise from the fans, difficult in the post Taylor days I know, and the thought we might actually improve every game, play good football, get out of this poxy division and not play the likes of Colchester, Chesterfraud, Hartlepool etc, with their huge travelling support, and even better grounds.

My missus despairs with the City Shirts, programmes fanzines round the place, and just cos I don't go every game doesnt make me any less of a fan. I listen to every game I can, where ever I can.

Gates WILL go up when City start playing passing football, the team shows it cares and the long suffering fans think its going places. More than most clubs City has suffered numerous false dawns, and its fans are more than aware of this. Saturdays gate proved this, and if that don't worry the Board than Plymuff's gate damn well should, Oldham are in even worse ###### than Luton, and they are further away, than Luton from the west.

Steve, and board should now think about what is happeneing, and listen to the fans, cos we aint going to happen AGAIN this season, are we, as things stand.

We as fans have to pull together as well, concentrates on focusing minds in the club, to sort this aimless drift out again, cos every time it happens youngsters stop supporting city, and turn to Manurre, Gooners etc, and some of us will stop coming, and City and their fans deserve a lot better. for those at the Wycombe game, who saw that diabolical excuse for a team, we cant let this go on. :Rage: :Rage: :Rage:

[Guest frogred]

Not so long ago City under Lumbsden were playing infront of around hardcore 6000 at AG.I was one of them.It was dreadfull to watch - long balls.mostly ###### players and no prospect at the time of it getting better.

Now - City in 9th place - 7 points from top spot and some are talking about staying away because the team is playing so poorly.Thats fickle.I simply couldn`t miss a City game at AG without good reason.If City are at home - then thats where I'm going  - to support my team.

If you support your club then it should be for better and for worse.I've got no time at all for those who chose not watch the City simply because they aren`t playing all that well. And those very same people moan at locals who support Man Utd! and who never see them play live.

Fickle is to kind a word.

I'm sorry to point this out again, I had to give ABUSE an english lesson re-fickle.

The main thrust of my arguement is I don't and not since the original honeymoon period was over (when I realised that Wilson was an intelligent and eloquent man, But poor at team selection, tactics, substitutions and signings) coupled with his total arrogance, I don't think that he is the man to lead us to the promise land, That is not fickle that is consistant.

It is a deeply held belief and the under acheivement, money wasting (on poor or injury prone players) woeful performances and worst of all trying to spin a ###### performance into a good performance under his management is my evidence.

So far this season the excuse book has read:- They came for a point (or 10 man defence), We need luck, (after 0-0 draws) 2 points should be awarded to the away side, We played some great stuff and saturday 'they were lucky'.

I fully support this current board, Especially in releasing funds at a time when money is tight, But invest it wisely Danny, In the case of Miller probably there is more to come, But, A signing on fee and probably guaranteed goals from Robins would have been wiser, Wilkshire big reputation and little else.

I will always admit to anger, bewilderment and not just being starved of success, But, At times embarrassment that a big club such ours cannot get out of this ###### division, I don't think it's a lot to ask.

And going back to passion, I don't think it's too much to ask that the 11 players display that passion whilst waering the shirt, Unfortunately some of them could'nt give a toss and that comes back to the same thing the manager, I don't think they are playing for him.

:PC_Plod: Edited for abusive language :PC_Plod:

[PhatWill]

I will always admit to anger, bewilderment and not just being starved of success, But, At times embarrassment that a big club such ours cannot get out of this ###### division, I don't think it's a lot to ask.

No wonder our fans get the reputation they do.

Any gashead reading those comments must be lapping it up.

Just how arrogant do you want to be?

Sorry but 5 years in the top flight does not make us a big club! The sad truth is that we've been in the lower leagues for most of time.

We have no divine right to be anywhere.

PS - Weener

[Riaz]

I agree with Phatwill.........for once!!!!!!!

[openEnd]

Divine right no

But PhatWill in your heart of hearts can you honestly say we are competing at the correct level?

My opinion is our natural level is mid/lower Div 1, so I argue we are treading water with the likes of hartlepool and bournemouth and it's not acceptable

Our current league status is embarassing

[openEnd]

we are treading water with the likes of hartlepool and bournemouth and it's not acceptable

as a side point both these are currently above us in the division

I suppose thats acceptable?

[Gazred]

I go to about 1-2 games a month, always at AG. I personaly cannont really afford to have a season ticket or to go more than that. If city are playing in div 2 i will still go and watch those 2 games a month, if they were in the conference i would still go and watch 2 games a month.

I have been going to watch city since i was 10, back in 1986. I have probably only seen half the amount of games that most people on here have but i still love this club and am desperate to see it do better.

The down side to city fans and i include myself in this, is that we seem to expect better from the club. Ok compared to a smaller division club our expectations should be higher, but thats what they are, expectaions nothing more, teams that play in the Prem do so because they have earnt the right to be there, we havent, we think we should be higher, but we are not, we are where we should be because we are not playing well enough.

Its only because of the fans/supporters who cannot be realistic that there is so much discontent with where we are in the league or at what level we should be playing at.

Get behind the team always, never head hunt individuals and above all be patient, I'm sure in my life time i will get to see city play in the top flight.

[Guest frogred]

No wonder our fans get the reputation they do.

Any gashead reading those comments must be lapping it up.

Just how arrogant do you want to be?

Sorry but 5 years in the top flight does not make us a big club! The sad truth is that we've been in the lower leagues for most of time.

We have no divine right to be anywhere.

PS - Weener

Firstly a history lesson it was 4 seasons and not 5 in the top flight.

Big, I agree that 4 seasons in the top flight does not make us big. But, Not long ago the Boltons and Blackburns were getting 4,500 and 7,500 respectively (ok Blackburn had Jack Walker) City's support has remained fairly constant even in the 4th division and that suggests that the support we could expect in higher division, Gives us potential to be big.

And my point was there was a passion within the squad, Which has been lacking in past 3 years.

Devine right of course not, But, A City the size of Bristol should have at least a 1st div team holding it's own.

Arrogant maybe, But, At least I have no need to put positive spin in negative situation, That is arrogance.

I have always been able to admit my mistakes and if by some miracle, We do get promoted this season, I will be the first come onto this forum and admit I was wrong and good old Danny was right and take all the flak that comes with it, Why, Because I am a city fan and I want to see them doing well, That dos'nt mean I have agree with everything that is going on.

As for the gashead comment as I posted a few days ago that is the credo of the happy clappy rose tinted glasses brigade.

[PhatWill]

Firstly a history lesson it was 4 seasons and not 5 in the top flight.

Big, I agree that 4 seasons in the top flight does not make us big. But, Not long ago the Boltons and Blackburns were getting 4,500 and 7,500 respectively (ok Blackburn had Jack Walker) City's support has remained fairly constant even in the 4th division and that suggests that the support we could expect in higher division, Gives us potential to be big.

And my point was there was a passion within the squad, Which has been lacking in past 3 years.

Devine right of course not, But, A City the size of Bristol should have at least a 1st div team holding it's own.

Arrogant maybe, But, At least I have no need to put positive spin in negative situation, That is arrogance.

I have always been able to admit my mistakes and if by some miracle, We do get promoted this season, I will be the first come onto this forum and admit I was wrong and good old Danny was right and take all the flak that comes with it, Why, Because I am a city fan and I want to see them doing well, That dos'nt mean I have agree with everything that is going on.

As for the gashead comment as I posted a few days ago that is the credo of the happy clappy rose tinted glasses brigade.

1. I stand corrected, BCFC have been in the top flight for at least 8 seasons, the last stint being in the 70's for 4 years which I was well aware of thanks.

2. A point I was making to openend before my post was deleted was that our attendances were lower than they are now when we were in DIV 1 in the early-mid nineties. So all your ramblings about people voting with their feet isn't exactly at an extreme is it?

3. We may well have the potential to be big, but then so do the gas, so do Hull City and Plymouth. However I'm still confident that we are in a much better position to succeed than any of those teams.

4. Passion lacking in the squad for 3 years? Erm, sorry but up until this season we have played a passing game not seen at AG for a while and have staged some great comebacks scoring shed loads of goals. Attendances have been very high considering we're in div 2 due to the attractive game we've played and skillfull players we have at the club. There have been some poor performances under Wilson, but also some great ones. We've won a hell of a lot of games under DW.

5. "Devine right of course not, But, A City the size of Bristol should have at least a 1st div team holding it's own." Almost a contradiction there. Maybe you're right but again sadly it seems that Bristol has never really had anything to shout about in footballing terms.

6. Fair enough you are a doom and gloom merchant. Personally my glass is half full and remain optimistic of our chances this season, certainly not arrogance though. Also I don't work in the media department at AG so I'm not trying to put spin on anything.