Lj Shirking Responsibility

[dezgimed]

Kind of a mixed thread here.

Firstly, Boro outplayed us in every way and we would be embarrased weekly if we go up this season. But, we didnt play to our potential at all.

Anyhoo, I had a new fella sat by me who was constantly saying things like ''Earn your money for once Johnson'' and ''Short ######'' etc. I'm not a fan of LJ but I don't ever say things like that. As the game progressed LJ was less and less involved.

It got to the stage where he would recieve the ball in the middle of the park, look for a pass, then just pass it back to one of the defenders to hoof forward.

It looked like he didnt want to be responsible for a poor pass. I'm sorry but what is the point in being on the pitch to take the ball off defenders then just pass it back to them to distribute.

Not a role for a playmaker.

I suspect he doesnt want to be the person yelled at for misplacing a pass.

No real point here I just thought I'd say how I saw things. With Noble off in the 2nd half and LJ not getting involved, no wonder we didnt threaten to any degree.

[Portishead Red]

LJ has been doing this all season but i didnt think he was to bad today. Always open to recieve balls from throw ins and generally sprayed the ball around quite well. In the 2nd half he faded as Boro just streamed forward and midfield was non-existant. LJ was no worse than Elliot today. Lets hope this was an off day and we can now focus on the league.

[Drew Peacock]

Kind of a mixed thread here.

Firstly, Boro outplayed us in every way and we would be embarrased weekly if we go up this season. But, we didnt play to our potential at all.

Anyhoo, I had a new fella sat by me who was constantly saying things like ''Earn your money for once Johnson'' and ''Short ######'' etc. I'm not a fan of LJ but I don't ever say things like that. As the game progressed LJ was less and less involved.

It got to the stage where he would recieve the ball in the middle of the park, look for a pass, then just pass it back to one of the defenders to hoof forward.

It looked like he didnt want to be responsible for a poor pass. I'm sorry but what is the point in being on the pitch to take the ball off defenders then just pass it back to them to distribute.

Not a role for a playmaker.

I suspect he doesnt want to be the person yelled at for misplacing a pass.

No real point here I just thought I'd say how I saw things. With Noble off in the 2nd half and LJ not getting involved, no wonder we didnt threaten to any degree.

Not another LJ knocking post! :grr:

It's all about opinions and I thought he was fine.

Can we have a thread about Noble and how all his passes went astray and how Carle has come in to take his place?

[dezgimed]

Not another LJ knocking post! :grr:

It's all about opinions and I thought he was fine.

Can we have a thread about Noble and how all his passes went astray and how Carle has come in to take his place?

Not really, just suggesting why we werent threatening and why he wasnt involved.

[Rocky]

We'll lose LJ at the end of the season, who needs this shit? I hope he doesn't read this forum!

[Longacre_red]

We'll lose LJ at the end of the season, who needs this shit? I hope he doesn't read this forum!

my thoughts exactly. He will not be a Bristol City player next year.

I feel for the lad, he does seem worried about failing to find a city shirt because he knows most of the crowd will be on his back. And consequently its costing the team.

[Gaffer]

Jesus christ. Lee Johnson gets stick for trying to play the difficult ball. He gets stick for playing the easy ball. He gets stick for giving it away. He gets stick for keeping it.

Lets face it, he's a good footballer with an eye for a pass. He links up play well and keeps the ball moving which is very important. He much far better than Elliott today, who went into his shell against better players. For all Elliott's heart and defensive qualities, he is poor on the ball and that's why he wont be moving to the prem.

I genuinely believe that people 'pre judge' players before they have the chance to perform. The pillock i sat next to at west brom slated LJ after 7 seconds! I know because i told him to F Off!

Elliott, Noble, Wilson and evey striker had worse games then LJ and nothing gets said about them! If your front players aren't performing, what chance does a playmaker have??

[tropicalsurfer]

I genuinely believe that people 'pre judge' players before they have the chance to perform. The pillock i sat next to at west brom slated LJ after 7 seconds! I know because i told him to F Off!

Bloke behind me Boo'd Lee Johnsons name on the team sheet before he had even stepped onto the pitch. Can't be good for someones morale if they are getting boo'd before he even steps onto the pitch

People need to get off his back, daddys boy or not none of them played the usual standard of football they play but Johnson always gets the stick.

[Gaffer]

Bloke behind me Boo'd Lee Johnsons name on the team sheet before he had even stepped onto the pitch. Can't be good for someones morale if they are getting boo'd before he even steps onto the pitch

People need to get off his back, daddys boy or not none of them played the usual standard of football they play but Johnson always gets the stick.

That, quite frankly, is disgusting. Hopefully he will get fed up and not come anymore!

[dezgimed]

Jesus christ. Lee Johnson gets stick for trying to play the difficult ball. He gets stick for playing the easy ball. He gets stick for giving it away. He gets stick for keeping it.

Lets face it, he's a good footballer with an eye for a pass. He links up play well and keeps the ball moving which is very important. He much far better than Elliott today, who went into his shell against better players. For all Elliott's heart and defensive qualities, he is poor on the ball and that's why he wont be moving to the prem.

I genuinely believe that people 'pre judge' players before they have the chance to perform. The pillock i sat next to at west brom slated LJ after 7 seconds! I know because i told him to F Off!

Elliott, Noble, Wilson and evey striker had worse games then LJ and nothing gets said about them! If your front players aren't performing, what chance does a playmaker have??

You couldnt see the point of this thread if it poked you in the eye.

What does anything I've said have to do with pre-judging him??

We all know he has an eye for a pass, whats that have to do with anything??!

My point was that he as our soul playmaker with Noble off cannot afford to decide he doesnt want to take responsibility and get us playing, as witnessed earlier.

Noble was good, Elliott did ok considering he was the only Midfielder tackling anyone and Wilson was proper shite. Nothing gets said about them because they don't play every game guarenteed so arent required to play consistently well.

[yessir]

We'll lose LJ at the end of the season, who needs this shit? I hope he doesn't read this forum!

Rocky I think you'll find lee has got a bit more about him than throwing the towel in. he'll be hell bent trying to ram the doubters words down their throats. he knows it might take him a while but DADDYS boy will keep trying.

Personally, some of the sh-te written by friends of some of the wasters that have left the club is pathetic.

We are more likely to lose GJ than LJ because of it.

[samo]

Rocky I think you'll find lee has got a bit more about him than throwing the towel in. he'll be hell bent trying to ram the doubters words down their throats. he knows it might take him a while but DADDYS boy will keep trying.

Personally, some of the sh-te written by friends of some of the wasters that have left the club is pathetic.

We are more likely to lose GJ than LJ because of it.

BANG!

(That's the sound of the nail being hit firmly on the head BTW)

[Rocky]

Rocky I think you'll find lee has got a bit more about him than throwing the towel in. he'll be hell bent trying to ram the doubters words down their throats. he knows it might take him a while but DADDYS boy will keep trying.

Personally, some of the sh-te written by friends of some of the wasters that have left the club is pathetic.

We are more likely to lose GJ than LJ because of it.

Thanks yessir, respect to you - whoever you are!!!

[Dollymarie]

Got it in one yessir. I hope as you say Lee is ignoring all this rollocks!

[Guest Tafkar]

What exactly was Lee supposed to do that was going to provide the "killer ball" today? Both our wingers were marked out of the game and had poor showings, while Byfield was pulled out wide to accommodate for them, and Noble had an extra man on him, as Nibor showed in a previous thread. Lee Johnson didn't create much today... Great. Neither did 9 other outfield players, 5-6 (8 if you include the subs) of whom are supposed to be getting out there and attacking. Where are their threads. Lee kept the possession going today and got himself about well. It was a very stop-start performance from us, we weren't in full flow, Middlesbrough were well organised and as a team we didn't do enough to break them down. We are not Lee Johnson FC, we are Bristol City, we succeed as a team and we fail as a team.

Today we failed, as a team.

[Alex_BCFC]

I thought he was very poor today but he is nowhere near Prem class so not too worried about him having a bad game. It's just when he does it for most of the league ones...

[Guest ashtonyate]

I think Lee Johnson is a good player and if was picking the team he would be 5 player I would have down on the sheet. The way we play with one up front and one in the hole makes it hard to string passes together you don't have the time that you have when playing 442. If he was out injured we would miss him badly.

What I don't understand is how Trundle gets away with under performing and most of the crowd thinks he is wonderfull yet Johnson does not hide and play well most of the time and gets lots of stick.

[Gaffer]

Rocky I think you'll find lee has got a bit more about him than throwing the towel in. he'll be hell bent trying to ram the doubters words down their throats. he knows it might take him a while but DADDYS boy will keep trying.

Personally, some of the sh-te written by friends of some of the wasters that have left the club is pathetic.

We are more likely to lose GJ than LJ because of it.

Spot on.

The Johnson's, all three of them, are the best thing to happen to this club in many years.

[Guest ashtonyate]

I think Lee Johnson is a good player and if was picking the team he would be 5 player I would have down on the sheet. The way we play with one up front and one in the hole makes it hard to string passes together you don't have the time that you have when playing 442. If he was out injured we would miss him badly.

What I don't understand is how Trundle gets away with under performing and most of the crowd thinks he is wonderfull yet Johnson does not hide and play well most of the time and gets lots of stick.

[Bristol Boy]

Rocky I think you'll find lee has got a bit more about him than throwing the towel in. he'll be hell bent trying to ram the doubters words down their throats. he knows it might take him a while but DADDYS boy will keep trying.

Personally, some of the sh-te written by friends of some of the wasters that have left the club is pathetic.

We are more likely to lose GJ than LJ because of it.

As someone whos position has been 100% consistent on this, I've always felt that LJ, like anyone else should be praised & criticised on his playing ability-As per every other player at the club.He is in an invidious position however, that's not his doing, although, I suppose he could have turned down the move, the West Country must have seemed appealing after his "exile" at Hearts with all that was going on up there.

I can't think this kind of thing didn't happen at Yeovil, in fact, I know it did and I reckon that (I'm not saying I know), whilst annoyed, LJ will brush it off.

If GJ's going to sign his son, he must have been aware of the potential for accusations of neoptism.I don't think GJ would find it any different anywhere else-In fact, if GJ let's something like this affect him, then I can see issues if he did move on to a major club because people like Benitez, who have won massive competitions, get unbelievable focus & stick from all sections of the media & supporters virtually every time he picks a team!!

I've just done the R&R and I gave LJ & Marv 6's today with Noble a 5-I've seen two of them play far better-And before someone says, look at the opposition, I've seen them play far better against Middlesboro-twice when Boro had a better team, IMHO.

[Gaffer]

As someone whos position has been 100% consistent on this, I've always felt that LJ, like anyone else should be praised & criticised on his playing ability-As per every other player at the club.He is in an invidious position however, that's not his doing, although, I suppose he could have turned down the move, the West Country must have seemed appealing after his "exile" at Hearts with all that was going on up there.

I can't think this kind of thing didn't happen at Yeovil, in fact, I know it did and I reckon that (I'm not saying I know), whilst annoyed, LJ will brush it off.

If GJ's going to sign his son, he must have been aware of the potential for accusations of neoptism.I don't think GJ would find it any different anywhere else-In fact, if GJ let's something like this affect him, then I can see issues if he did move on to a major club because people like Benitez, who have won massive competitions, get unbelievable focus & stick from all sections of the media & supporters virtually every time he picks a team!!

I've just done the R&R and I gave LJ & Marv 6's today with Noble a 5-I've seen two of them play far better-And before someone says, look at the opposition, I've seen them play far better against Middlesboro-twice when Boro had a better team, IMHO.

Good post, especially the Benitez similarity.

6's each for LJ and Marv is probably about right, but i think LJ performed better, just not quite well enough for a 7. It was disappointing that we have improved so much since last year, and didn't give a good account of ourselves.

Cest le vie, if we beat Colchester then i wont give a damn!!

[screech]

Its the same old story for some, we might as well have a thread about him at the top of the forum that automatically appears after every game.

LJ is a decent player at this level, i know this because GJ picks him at every opportunity that he's fit, there are other players that I will list that will get picked for every game as long as they are fit or not banned. The reason is because they are good players and thats why they are in, not because they are related to the manager.

Basso

Orr

Carey

Fontaine

Mcallister

Sproule

Elliott

Johnson

Mcindoe

That is the nucleus of a team that has risen to joint top of the championship, every one of them has good and bad games, If Mcindoe was GJ's son it would be him getting the flack regardless of how well he plays.

Some supporters at this club need a scapegoat, its happened as far back as I can rememeber, I'm sure LJ and GJ knew this type of thing would happen and know how to handle it.

[Gaffer]

By the way, didn't we vote the 'Lee Johnson is no good' thread, the one topic we didn;t want to hear again?? :noexpression:

[Guest Tafkar]

Everyone knows New Years' Resolutions only last a week maximum, Gaffer.

[Nibor]

Here's a thought. The Bristol City crowd loves tough tacklers and players who get stuck in, far more than skillful passers. This has been the case as long as I remember. This is why someone like Tommy Doherty is worshipped as a hero after his first few games but a great passer like Tinnion took years to win the crowd over.

You're seeing the same thing now with Marvin and Lee Johnson. It's not because he's the manager's son, it's because he's the least physical player on the field. Couple that with the fact that much of our play goes through him so his mistakes stand out and you have the situation we've got now.

Now, I think there are still things LJ can do to improve his game - mainly being far less casual with the ball - but he does get a disproportionate amount of stick and I think that's why. Then of course comes all the nepotism rubbish because it's easy for people who lack imagination - although again GJ doesn't help himself in that respect because we have all seen LJ have a very poor game but not get subbed.

I think, unfortunately for LJ, because of the type of player he is it would be harder for him to win the crowd over than most anyway and his old man being the boss just makes the criticism have a bit more of a personal edge than it should.

[chinapig]

Rocky I think you'll find lee has got a bit more about him than throwing the towel in. he'll be hell bent trying to ram the doubters words down their throats. he knows it might take him a while but DADDYS boy will keep trying.

Personally, some of the sh-te written by friends of some of the wasters that have left the club is pathetic.

We are more likely to lose GJ than LJ because of it.

Respect to you yessir, and to Lee. I'm with Scott Minto who said on Sky that Lee is one player who could cut it at a higher level. Like Ray Wilkins, who also used to get unjustified criticism, Lee's priority is to build moves from the back and to that extent he takes more responsibility and risks than any other player. How many players even at Championship level have the quality and time to get their head up and look at the passing options as Lee does? If a good forward option is not on he will indeed play it backwards if necessary and then make himself available to pick the ball up again to make a better angle. Watch our first goal against Coventry for an example of how Lee built it up from the back, joined in again and set up David Noble for an example of his quality. Notice as well how many of his team mates rushed to Lee to congratulate him afterwards. They obviously appreciate him even if a vocal minority of our own fans don't.

Sometimes Lee will lose posession. Shock horror probe, check out how often Steven Gerrard and Frank Lampard do that. I'm willing to bet that ProZone would show Lee's ball retention is up there with the best but because he plays in a high-risk position in front of the back four it gets noticed more. If David Noble does the same it is likely to be 70 yards from our goal so nobody makes a fuss (no reflection on David who is also a gifted player).

What you won't usually find Lee doing is bashing hopeful balls upfield.The problem is there is still a culture in English football that demands exactly that, hence the abject failure of our international team where over-rated, multi-millionaire players are incapable of retaining possession and we fall back on lumping it towards Peter Crouch. Perhaps our fans would prefer Boothroyd or Pulis as manager? Then we won't have to argue about skilfull midfield players because there won't be any.

I often wonder whether those who claim Lee keeps his place because he is Gary's son consider what they are saying about Gary. Are they really saying that one of the most forward thinking and respected English managers in the game (any arguments on that one?) would be so unprofessional? Did Danny Wilson keep picking Lee Peacock because he was his secret love child? No, that was his judgement. I disagreed with him but did not invent an ulterior motive for him doing it. Disagree with Gary if you must but why slander (or is libel if its online?) him in doing so?

Our style of football, which has brought a lot of deserved praise this season, is built around Lee. If we lose him we have a real problem. May I remind everybody again that Brian Tinnion also used to get abuse in his early days? To quote Joni Mitchell "Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you got till its gone?"

The pernicious influence of the wasters yessir refers to still seems to be in our bloodstream off the field. I confess I walked away from the club after the Brighton game because I couldn't stomach the culture of the club any more. It was Gary and consummate professionals like Lee that brought me back and I couldn't find anything to complain about about our players if I tried.

Apologies for rambling. Rant over.

[tpitman]

Not another LJ knocking post! :grr:

It's all about opinions and I thought he was fine.

I agree. What most people don't see is that most (if not all) our play goes through LJ, so any mistake is going to be noticed. However, some people think that there are 5 or 6 LJ's. When ANY missplaced pass goes astray, whoever it may be, its always LJ that gets the blame!

Quite extraordinary!

[Redtucks]

Respect to you yessir, and to Lee. I'm with Scott Minto who said on Sky that Lee is one player who could cut it at a higher level. Like Ray Wilkins, who also used to get unjustified criticism, Lee's priority is to build moves from the back and to that extent he takes more responsibility and risks than any other player. How many players even at Championship level have the quality and time to get their head up and look at the passing options as Lee does? If a good forward option is not on he will indeed play it backwards if necessary and then make himself available to pick the ball up again to make a better angle. Watch our first goal against Coventry for an example of how Lee built it up from the back, joined in again and set up David Noble for an example of his quality. Notice as well how many of his team mates rushed to Lee to congratulate him afterwards. They obviously appreciate him even if a vocal minority of our own fans don't.

Sometimes Lee will lose posession. Shock horror probe, check out how often Steven Gerrard and Frank Lampard do that. I'm willing to bet that ProZone would show Lee's ball retention is up there with the best but because he plays in a high-risk position in front of the back four it gets noticed more. If David Noble does the same it is likely to be 70 yards from our goal so nobody makes a fuss (no reflection on David who is also a gifted player).

What you won't usually find Lee doing is bashing hopeful balls upfield.The problem is there is still a culture in English football that demands exactly that, hence the abject failure of our international team where over-rated, multi-millionaire players are incapable of retaining possession and we fall back on lumping it towards Peter Crouch. Perhaps our fans would prefer Boothroyd or Pulis as manager? Then we won't have to argue about skilfull midfield players because there won't be any.

I often wonder whether those who claim Lee keeps his place because he is Gary's son consider what they are saying about Gary. Are they really saying that one of the most forward thinking and respected English managers in the game (any arguments on that one?) would be so unprofessional? Did Danny Wilson keep picking Lee Peacock because he was his secret love child? No, that was his judgement. I disagreed with him but did not invent an ulterior motive for him doing it. Disagree with Gary if you must but why slander (or is libel if its online?) him in doing so?

Our style of football, which has brought a lot of deserved praise this season, is built around Lee. If we lose him we have a real problem. May I remind everybody again that Brian Tinnion also used to get abuse in his early days? To quote Joni Mitchell "Don't it always seem to go that you don't know what you got till its gone?"

The pernicious influence of the wasters yessir refers to still seems to be in our bloodstream off the field. I confess I walked away from the club after the Brighton game because I couldn't stomach the culture of the club any more. It was Gary and consummate professionals like Lee that brought me back and I couldn't find anything to complain about about our players if I tried.

Apologies for rambling. Rant over.

No need to apologise.

A great post with many salient points.

Agree wholeheartedly.

[North Lincs Red]

Here's a thought. The Bristol City crowd loves tough tacklers and players who get stuck in, far more than skillful passers. This has been the case as long as I remember. This is why someone like Tommy Doherty is worshipped as a hero after his first few games but a great passer like Tinnion took years to win the crowd over.

You're seeing the same thing now with Marvin and Lee Johnson. It's not because he's the manager's son, it's because he's the least physical player on the field. Couple that with the fact that much of our play goes through him so his mistakes stand out and you have the situation we've got now.

Now, I think there are still things LJ can do to improve his game - mainly being far less casual with the ball - but he does get a disproportionate amount of stick and I think that's why. Then of course comes all the nepotism rubbish because it's easy for people who lack imagination - although again GJ doesn't help himself in that respect because we have all seen LJ have a very poor game but not get subbed.

I think, unfortunately for LJ, because of the type of player he is it would be harder for him to win the crowd over than most anyway and his old man being the boss just makes the criticism have a bit more of a personal edge than it should.

Great post Nibor

[Hicksy-BCFC]

Here's a thought. The Bristol City crowd loves tough tacklers and players who get stuck in, far more than skillful passers. This has been the case as long as I remember. This is why someone like Tommy Doherty is worshipped as a hero after his first few games but a great passer like Tinnion took years to win the crowd over.

You're seeing the same thing now with Marvin and Lee Johnson. It's not because he's the manager's son, it's because he's the least physical player on the field. Couple that with the fact that much of our play goes through him so his mistakes stand out and you have the situation we've got now.

Now, I think there are still things LJ can do to improve his game - mainly being far less casual with the ball - but he does get a disproportionate amount of stick and I think that's why. Then of course comes all the nepotism rubbish because it's easy for people who lack imagination - although again GJ doesn't help himself in that respect because we have all seen LJ have a very poor game but not get subbed.

I think, unfortunately for LJ, because of the type of player he is it would be harder for him to win the crowd over than most anyway and his old man being the boss just makes the criticism have a bit more of a personal edge than it should.

You are spot on there mate.

I am still baffled by someone yelling "take your ###### son off" behind me in the Williams.

I had a look at the clock - we'd been playing 12 minutes.

He'll never win the fans over like Elliott.

I'd argue Lee Trundle was more popular the day after he signed than Lee Johnson has ever been.

Agree 100% as well that sometimes (mainly last season) GJ has not pulled LJ off when maybe should have. I'd argue though it's because he believes that he can turn a game in a second with a pass than it being his son.