EnderMB Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 I remember there was a poll, either from the Premier League or the BBC, that highlighted a shocking statistic of how many people would stop supporting their team if one of their players came out as gay. In many ways, I'm not surprised. The average fan in the ground is different to those we'll see on a forum. There's also the widely held belief that the fans intimidate the opposition. If their team needs a win, and their fans know what buttons to push on their opposing players, they're going to push them. Some people will claim to love equality, but they'll happily chant racist/homophobic slurs, and bring up painful moments of that persons past. With that being said, I don't believe that it's an impossible problem to solve. It's just down to the club to ensure that these people are no longer able to attend games. Atmosphere or "banter" be damned. Watching football is not a right, and if the club thinks you're being a hateful bellend, then they should be within their rights to ensure you never attend that ground again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
And Its Smith Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 55 minutes ago, Tuggin over Tomlin said: It's banter at the end of the day, you'll never ever stop it. When we sing "does your boyfriend know you're here" to Brighton fans we know that the majority of them aren't gay, in fact probably none of them are but it's just a football chant. We live in a day and age where someone finds something offensive. We've gone to away games and been called Welsh sheep shaggers, inbreds, yokels etc, doesn't bother me one bit as it's just football banter. We'll soon not be allowed to chant anything but "CITY" incase it offends somebody, and even then someone would pick fault with that. No doubt someone will find offence with this post. It's not banter. You don't get it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 2 hours ago, Maesknoll Red said: In the end you won't be able to the the piss out of anyone/anything, as it is belittling or disrespectful. Taking the piss out of gingers, those with poor dress sense, full kit wanchors, fat people, teams playing poorly....... where does it stop? A bit of a trite question, but with some validity. I think it's easy to make a slippery slope argument but it is not that hard to define. Ultimately it comes down to not taking the piss out of things that people are not able to control. There is a world of difference between mocking someone's sexuality, race or disability and mocking their dress sense or a poor football team. It's not the same thing at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LondonBristolian Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 3 minutes ago, EnderMB said: I remember there was a poll, either from the Premier League or the BBC, that highlighted a shocking statistic of how many people would stop supporting their team if one of their players came out as gay. In many ways, I'm not surprised. The average fan in the ground is different to those we'll see on a forum. There's also the widely held belief that the fans intimidate the opposition. If their team needs a win, and their fans know what buttons to push on their opposing players, they're going to push them. Some people will claim to love equality, but they'll happily chant racist/homophobic slurs, and bring up painful moments of that persons past. With that being said, I don't believe that it's an impossible problem to solve. It's just down to the club to ensure that these people are no longer able to attend games. Atmosphere or "banter" be damned. Watching football is not a right, and if the club thinks you're being a hateful bellend, then they should be within their rights to ensure you never attend that ground again. I think the other thing to note as well is a I suspect the number of people who say they would stop supporting their team is a lot higher than the number who would actually stop supporting their team if it actually came down to it. Back in the dark days of the 70s and 80s there were supporters who claimed they would stop supporting their team, or the national team, if there were black players. I suspect few people actually did when it came down to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eddie Hitler Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 1 hour ago, Tuggin over Tomlin said: It's banter at the end of the day, you'll never ever stop it. When we sing "does your boyfriend know you're here" to Brighton fans we know that the majority of them aren't gay, in fact probably none of them are but it's just a football chant. We live in a day and age where someone finds something offensive. We've gone to away games and been called Welsh sheep shaggers, inbreds, yokels etc, doesn't bother me one bit as it's just football banter. We'll soon not be allowed to chant anything but "CITY" incase it offends somebody, and even then someone would pick fault with that. No doubt someone will find offence with this post. I was going to cite that one as I think that qualifies as banter; it's good natured and done for a laugh and plays on a characteristic of the whole town. It crosses the line where a single player or manager gets specific abuse (the worst in my memory was somebody shouting "I hope your wife dies" at a manager whose wife was seriously ill) for something that they are rather than for something they have done: being a cheat, criminal, dirty player, bad mouthing your club, whatever. The first openly gay player may get hardly any nasty abuse, that would be restricted to a very small number of individuals, but they would get lots of "amusing witticisms" shouted such as, in the words of Ricky Gervaise, "nice tackle" which would get very wearing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Maesknoll Red Posted July 31, 2017 Admin Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 I'm not so sure it's not hard to define. What was acceptable yesterday, becomes unacceptable today, what's acceptable today will offend someone and then become unacceptable tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 18 minutes ago, RedDave said: It's not banter. You don't get it I guess it's seen as banter as it is aimed at the opposition crowd as a whole. Not at a individual gay person. If hate was aimed at a individual who was gay, rather than a whole crowd of whom zero may be gay, then it would be homophobia. A difficult one to decide on really. I personally do not it is homophobia when not specifically targeted. But I understand gay and lesbians don't like the fact that people are using their sexuality as a derogatory term to abuse others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Humble Realist Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Does your boyfriend know your here to Brighton fans Always the victim it's never your fault to liverpool fans Sheep sheep sheep shaggers to Cardiff Sheep sheep sheep shaggers to us Inbreds and roundabouts to swindon fans She's a whore...to Daryll Clarke Jimmy Saville he's one of your own to leeds Is there any world where you'd get agreement on which of the above are acceptable to sing and which ones aren't ? Some would say they are all fair game ...others would say they are all unacceptable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 8 minutes ago, The Humble Realist said: Does your boyfriend know your here to Brighton fans Always the victim it's never your fault to liverpool fans Sheep sheep sheep shaggers to Cardiff Sheep sheep sheep shaggers to us Inbreds and roundabouts to swindon fans She's a whore...to Daryll Clarke Jimmy Saville he's one of your own to leeds Is there any world where you'd get agreement on which of the above are acceptable to sing and which ones aren't ? All but the first one are acceptable imv. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Maesknoll Red Posted July 31, 2017 Admin Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 45 minutes ago, Robbored said: All but the first one are acceptable imv. Jimmy Saville taunts OK - classy.... I think that just reiterates my point, someone will always find offence, even if it's on behalf of someone not offended. Drawing the Line is impossible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 7 minutes ago, Maesknoll Red said: Jimmy Saville taunts OK - classy.... I think just reiterates my point, someone will always find offence, even if it's on behalf of someone not offended. Drawing the Line is impossible. Jimmy Saville was a peadophile using his celebrity to have sex with under age girls and reviled by the public after his death. Shame he never got caught during his lifetime. Not exactly the same being homosexual or having dark skin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 41 minutes ago, Robbored said: All but the first one are acceptable imv. Why are the rest acceptable? But the gay slur not? You are still upsetting someone. I wouldn't mind hearing your rational behind it. I think its agreed all chants that have the ability to upset someone are banned or none. I personally think none should be banned, unless it is directed directly at some one, not the opposition supporters as a whole. Very difficult to make a decision as you are opening up a complete ban on chanting a football matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Just now, Robbored said: Jimmy Saville was a peadophile using his celebrity to have sex with under age girls and reviled by the public after his death. Shame he never got caught during his lifetime. Not exactly the same being homosexual or having dark skin. but to call a whole section of society paedos is okay? because of where they come from.. isn't that exactly the same as calling all people from Brighton gay? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Maesknoll Red Posted July 31, 2017 Admin Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Just now, Robbored said: Jimmy Saville was a peadophile using his celebrity to have sex with under age girls and reviled by the public after his death. Shame he never got caught during his lifetime. Not exactly the same being homosexual or having dark skin. So you are happy to use this as banter to opposition fans - I would think inferring paedophillia is a trend of a group of fans, is somewhat worse than asking if their boyfriend knows they are at a football match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jj77 Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Whatever happened to keeping things to yourself? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Ian M Posted July 31, 2017 Admin Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Largely I think in football grounds there would be some initial friction but once a few are "out" the fans would be widely self policing. Where I think the real abuse would take place is over Social Media. Some people in this world already believe they have the right to say some of the most vile things imaginable just because a player had a bad game. This will become the bigot's playground and there was the stat in that programme that 40% of Britain's LGBT community have had some form of mental health disorder linked to their sexuality and the problems it has caused them in "fitting in" to modern Britain. Who knows what effect this abuse could do to some of them? I hope the authorities come up with a good support system because it won't be long before one of our tabloids outs the first one in the name of "public interest". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shelts Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 6 hours ago, Steve Watts said: Yes....swearing is still allowed at football in the 21st century when you get here... Not been to the Gate since we was in the 3rd Division South Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cockneydave Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 5 hours ago, Robbored said: Abuse of faith, colour and sexuality are sacrosanct in the eyes of the law and quite right to. Taling the piss out of fat people, gingers, people with poor dress sense is not quite the same thing. Those people could do something about it... But why do it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 Just now, cockneydave said: But why do it? Don't ask me! I very rarely take the piss out of anyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maltshoveller Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 5 hours ago, jj77 said: Whatever happened to keeping things to yourself? 100% SPOT ON I couldnt give a monkey what any player does in their private life What they do on the pitch is the only thing that matters Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gl1 Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 9 hours ago, TRL said: A difficult one to decide on really. I personally do not it is homophobia when not specifically targeted. But I understand gay and lesbians don't like the fact that people are using their sexuality as a derogatory term to abuse others. As a gay man, I find the chants at Brighton fans pretty funny. Its innocuous - we can see you holding hands? Does your boyfriend know you're here? Not really in the same category as 'Kill the queers' (I heard this shouted by an invading group of bigots at a gay pride event in Cardiff maybe 10 years ago) The misconception that they gay community at large are en masse offended by bigotry is not actually that true. When some politician, I think it was UKIP, correct me if I'm wrong said the floods that were deluging the country at the time was due to gay marriage being legalised was not met with open mouthed indignation from the gay community. We launched a campaign to get 'Its raining men' to number one. I think you straights get more upset than us gay lads do. I have never had any anti gay comments on any of my sexuality related posts on here. I am also pretty certain that if i was verbally attacked on here, there would wholesale condemnation of his or her comments I've said it before, but I really do feel that all this homophobia in sport is blown out of all proportion. If one did come out I am pretty sure that he would be accepted pretty quickly. Sure he would get wolf whistles etc, but I dont think there would be too much of a problem with that - he may well like it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted July 31, 2017 Report Share Posted July 31, 2017 45 minutes ago, gl1 said: As a gay man, I find the chants at Brighton fans pretty funny. Its innocuous - we can see you holding hands? Does your boyfriend know you're here? Not really in the same category as 'Kill the queers' (I heard this shouted by an invading group of bigots at a gay pride event in Cardiff maybe 10 years ago) The misconception that they gay community at large are en masse offended by bigotry is not actually that true. When some politician, I think it was UKIP, correct me if I'm wrong said the floods that were deluging the country at the time was due to gay marriage being legalised was not met with open mouthed indignation from the gay community. We launched a campaign to get 'Its raining men' to number one. I think you straights get more upset than us gay lads do. I have never had any anti gay comments on any of my sexuality related posts on here. I am also pretty certain that if i was verbally attacked on here, there would wholesale condemnation of his or her comments I've said it before, but I really do feel that all this homophobia in sport is blown out of all proportion. If one did come out I am pretty sure that he would be accepted pretty quickly. Sure he would get wolf whistles etc, but I dont think there would be too much of a problem with that - he may well like it... Thank you for this reply. Good to hear from a gay giving their thoughts rather than outraged heterosexuals on their behalf. I agree certainly more playful chants than hateful chants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handsofclay Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 On 31/07/2017 at 09:27, Robbored said: Abuse of faith, colour and sexuality are sacrosanct in the eyes of the law and quite right to. Taling the piss out of fat people, gingers, people with poor dress sense is not quite the same thing. Those people could do something about it... As a ginger myself I have long since reached the conclusion that it isn't me who needs to do something about it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 12 minutes ago, handsofclay said: As a ginger myself I have long since reached the conclusion that it isn't me who needs to do something about it! I can lend you some clippers if you want, I guess that's me doing something about it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handsofclay Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 14 minutes ago, TRL said: I can lend you some clippers if you want, I guess that's me doing something about it! I can donate some of my brain cells to you if you want, I guess that's me doing something to address your problem. I've never met you so why the aggressive, bullying response? Made you feel good did it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 22 hours ago, LondonBristolian said: I think the other thing to note as well is a I suspect the number of people who say they would stop supporting their team is a lot higher than the number who would actually stop supporting their team if it actually came down to it. Back in the dark days of the 70s and 80s there were supporters who claimed they would stop supporting their team, or the national team, if there were black players. I suspect few people actually did when it came down to it. Who'd want those bigots supporting their club anyway ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 7 minutes ago, handsofclay said: I can donate some of my brain cells to you if you want, I guess that's me doing something to address your problem. I've never met you so why the aggressive, bullying response? Made you feel good did it?Insert other media or maybe i have ginger hair and have clippers? i'll let you decide Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
handsofclay Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 7 minutes ago, TRL said: or maybe i have ginger hair and have clippers? i'll let you decide Neanderthals don't have ginger hair or clippers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Major Isewater Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 It's a shame that gay and lesbian people feel the need to fight for the right to be themselves. We should live and let live . I have many gay and lesbian friends and neither their sexuality or their colour blocks our relationships. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TRL Posted August 1, 2017 Report Share Posted August 1, 2017 Just now, handsofclay said: Neanderthals don't have ginger hair or clippers. Good to hear phew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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