Cowshed Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, Esmond Million's Bung said: I'm sorry I am not LJ's biggest fan but kicking a dead ball or a rolling ball whilst under no pressure is almost certainly the easiest part of a keepers game, he actually put at least one goal kick directly into touch. No. Its not the easiest part of a Keepers game. Balls flying out of play are more acceptable than the opposition intercepting them. He is being asked to hit a small area which will almost certainly be a aerially contested ball leading to success and inevitable failure due to the opposition. The margin between success and failure is narrow. Many Keepers struggle with distribution because they have not done the thousands and thousands (years) of hours it requires to be adept at this aspect of their game. Frankie will practice but improvement will only be marginal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 Just now, h hills left shoe said: But is this down to the coaching? If they are both similar then surely the problem is elsewhere! Not sure of all positions you can change keepers much You can work on their core skills of course but it would be impossible to make FF. a dominant type keeper merely due to his stature although dominance can be achieved by an inbred mentality (Pickford) and aggression FF can be most of the time an exceptional shot stopper and better than keepers who have a stature that makes them more able to dominate the area Things like starting positions etc can be improved but I don’t think you’re going to change a keepers weaknesses or assets dramatically - you can improve them but change them - very difficult IMHO Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h hills left shoe Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Not sure of all positions you can change keepers much You can work on their core skills of course but it would be impossible to make FF. a dominant type keeper merely due to his stature although dominance can be achieved by an inbred mentality (Pickford) and aggression FF can be most of the time an exceptional shot stopper and better than keepers who have a stature that makes them more able to dominate the area Things like starting positions etc can be improved but I don’t think you’re going to change a keepers weaknesses or assets dramatically - you can improve them but change them - very difficult IMHO True Bob but surely their assets should come naturally and as you say improve them where needed! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 10 minutes ago, h hills left shoe said: True Bob but surely their assets should come naturally and as you say improve them where needed! Someone like Angus Gunn or Ruddy , Maybe Bentley probably come the closest to the complete package at Champ Level - Expensive They are as unrealistic signings for us as Cairney would be (IMHO) (Should Maybe have bust a gut £££ for Bentley when he was at Southend) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h hills left shoe Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 Just now, BobBobSuperBob said: Someone like Angus Gunn or Ruddy , Maybe Bentley probably come the closest to the complete package at Champ Level They are as unrealistic signings for us as Cairney would be (IMHO) (Should Maybe have bust a gut £££ for Bentley when he was at Southend) Totally agree with you there but can you see city under Lansdown spending decent money for any player? Because I can't! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 1 minute ago, h hills left shoe said: Totally agree with you there but can you see city under Lansdown spending decent money for any player? Because I can't! We’d pay a decent fee What we won’t pay is some audacious agent fees or wages Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h hills left shoe Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: We’d pay a decent fee What we won’t pay is some audacious agent fees or wages I normally agree with alot of your comments but I don't think that will happen! I hope I'm wrong but you never know! Expect the unexpected! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
taxidog Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 If Lee had any balls he'd drop FF for last two games, otherwise Frank will know he'll be picked however badly he plays. Therefore no incentive to improve. But guaranteed that won't happen - Lee makes excuses for all his favourites. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 4 minutes ago, h hills left shoe said: I normally agree with alot of your comments but I don't think that will happen! I hope I'm wrong but you never know! Expect the unexpected! Lost me HHLS Don’t think we will pay a sizeable fee ? Think we will pay a decent fee in some positions If you mean For a keeper - no I don’t think we would Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three Lions Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 1 hour ago, Esmond Million's Bung said: I agree, to be fair he has generally had a good season between the sticks but today his kicking really pissed me off, the worst part being he was kicking dead balls straight into touch and none of the balls he kicked straight out was he under any pressure and on top of the free kick, he had a shocker, I just cannot understand the kicking it looks to me as though he never practices because he has never improved. isn't the dead ball goal kick routine rubbish anyway? whats it gaining when it goes right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h hills left shoe Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 1 minute ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Lost me HHLS Don’t think we will pay a sizeable fee ? Think we will pay a decent fee in some positions If you mean For a keeper - no I don’t think we would I 'll believe it when I see it! I hope we do spend money to get quality players in otherwise we'll just be also rans! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
italian dave Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 For me, goalkeeper is the no 1 priority this summer. I think we've got two barely average Championship keepers and FF certainly does nothing for the confidence of an already wavering defence. I agree with @Red-Robboabove - there've been too many games this season when he's cost us. I don't think his positional play is very good: unlike (whisper it!) David James, he doesn't make howling blunders, but also unlike David James he doesn't have the positional sense to make long range saves and otherwise difficult saves look easy. He lets in far too many from long distances. And then there's the rushes of blood - going up for a challenge for a high ball and just not getting anywhere near it (first goal v Barnsley), racing out for a ball he's never going to get (Preston, Wolves). And then what was that nonsense today in the 95th minute - if you're going to go up for the corner then at least get into the box, don't get 20 yards short and then stop, look worried, and shuffle about some 80 yards out of position. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BobBobSuperBob Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 6 minutes ago, h hills left shoe said: I 'll believe it when I see it! I hope we do spend money to get quality players in otherwise we'll just be also rans! Depends what you think ‘decent fee’ there are still a few outperforming us who havnt ever spent anything like t£5.5m On a player , let alone the £30m spent in the last 3 yearson the squad However its ok being prepared to pay a decent fee , if you won’t pay the wages that normally come with that fee you won’t get the player normally Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h hills left shoe Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 2 minutes ago, BobBobSuperBob said: Depends what you think ‘decent fee’ there are still a few outperforming us who havnt ever spent anything like t£5.5m On a player , let alone the £30m spent in the last 3 yearson the squad However its ok being prepared to pay a decent fee , if you won’t pay the wages that normally come with that fee you won’t get the player normally Can't argue with that! I think that is the main problem city won't pay the wages! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFCGav Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 I do rage Frankie but today was a bad day at the office. I said before the free kick, that is not how we should be set up. I’d have scored that. Massive gap. Plus the OG and the awful kicking. Not good at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Esmond Million's Bung Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 16 minutes ago, Three Lions said: isn't the dead ball goal kick routine rubbish anyway? whats it gaining when it goes right? This won't be considered very Pepesque but I was listening to Ruud Gullit discussing the ball playing ability of Ederson and he said that the great team AC Milan team of which he was a member (one of my favourite sides to watch) the keeper pretty much launched every kick and the team then set up to either back the striker up if he controlled the ball or to win the ball back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lorenzos Only Goal Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 2 hours ago, Ivorguy said: Sorry he is div1 at best I'm glad you ain't the manager.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jacky Boy Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 Should have dropped him after he cost us the game at home to Wolves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cider Army Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 Sack bobby davro ..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
h hills left shoe Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 3 minutes ago, Jacky Boy said: Should have dropped him after he cost us the game at home to Wolves. True and our season has been downhill since that game! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Top Robin Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 Ultimately if a keeper has to make a save then the midfield and defence aren't doing their job properly. Having said that Frankie is a good shot stopper but is poor in the air and his distribution is appalling. Is that enough to be a good Championship keeper! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redstoke Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 1 hour ago, Top Robin said: Ultimately if a keeper has to make a save then the midfield and defence aren't doing their job properly. Having said that Frankie is a good shot stopper but is poor in the air and his distribution is appalling. Is that enough to be a good Championship keeper! Couldn't fire an arrow in a straight line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xiled Posted April 21, 2018 Report Share Posted April 21, 2018 Decent distribution - no Commands his area - no Regular clean sheets - no Gives confidence to defenders - no Claims crosses consistently - no Reliable decision maker - no Good shot stopper - yes, until today Nice guy - yes I'm afraid that doesn't add up to enough. Unfortunately FF has been one of several weak links this season. Thanks for being our no.1 but it's time to move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Constant Rabbit Posted April 22, 2018 Report Share Posted April 22, 2018 We need a keep who is effectively another ball-player. Someone who rolls out the ball via the defence to ensure possession. Who comes outside his box (not like Wolves) to clean up and rebound a short pass to ball-playing defenders. Maggs and Hegeler would thrive with this play. A sweeper, in effect. Sadly, Flint, Wright and Baker aren't the type of players who could cope with this. If we want a top class keeper, we would need the appropriate defenders to support their distribution. So if we keep the defenders, then we just limit ourselves to a 'kick long or wide' keeper. To really upgrade would involve substantial defensive personnel changes - however if Baker,Bryan and Flint leave, then the option is there. Big decisions to be made before next season methinks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lew-T Posted April 22, 2018 Report Share Posted April 22, 2018 12 hours ago, Fordy62 said: Yes. That’s right. He’s been playing like a league one keeper all season. You’ve no idea have you? Sorry, I’ll have a go. I often compare with opposition keepers who come down here and I have to say, I’d probably pick 3/4 of the division’s keepers over Fielding. The guy is a fruit loop at times. Can you imagine playing yourself and having him command you? I don’t see it personally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowshed Posted April 22, 2018 Report Share Posted April 22, 2018 7 hours ago, SX227 said: We need a keep who is effectively another ball-player. Someone who rolls out the ball via the defence to ensure possession. Who comes outside his box (not like Wolves) to clean up and rebound a short pass to ball-playing defenders. Maggs and Hegeler would thrive with this play. A sweeper, in effect. Sadly, Flint, Wright and Baker aren't the type of players who could cope with this. If we want a top class keeper, we would need the appropriate defenders to support their distribution. So if we keep the defenders, then we just limit ourselves to a 'kick long or wide' keeper. To really upgrade would involve substantial defensive personnel changes - however if Baker,Bryan and Flint leave, then the option is there. Big decisions to be made before next season methinks. You are creating a picture of players all being comfortable in possession and taking balls under elements of pressure .That could be the future if Lee Johnson has the intent to work towards it. A Keeper who has more confidence in his skills and plays higher can add security to those players games. It does not need extensive change to add simple improvement e.g. Keeper shows for it outside of the box to play a simple pass to a player not under pressure, or clear lines. That is not total football there, its is marginal gain and improvement. Bryan as a footnote is vey comfortable under pressure in possession. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trueredsupporter Posted April 22, 2018 Report Share Posted April 22, 2018 13 hours ago, Xiled said: Decent distribution - no Commands his area - no Regular clean sheets - no Gives confidence to defenders - no Claims crosses consistently - no Reliable decision maker - no Good shot stopper - yes, until today Nice guy - yes I'm afraid that doesn't add up to enough. Unfortunately FF has been one of several weak links this season. Thanks for being our no.1 but it's time to move on. Leaving off his line and clearing danger outside of the box- no. What i find interesting is people think that amount of no's cant be improved upon. City spend millions on forwards but what are pennies on Keepers !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobfish Posted April 22, 2018 Report Share Posted April 22, 2018 12 hours ago, SX227 said: We need a keep who is effectively another ball-player. Someone who rolls out the ball via the defence to ensure possession. Who comes outside his box (not like Wolves) to clean up and rebound a short pass to ball-playing defenders. Maggs and Hegeler would thrive with this play. A sweeper, in effect. Sadly, Flint, Wright and Baker aren't the type of players who could cope with this. If we want a top class keeper, we would need the appropriate defenders to support their distribution. So if we keep the defenders, then we just limit ourselves to a 'kick long or wide' keeper. To really upgrade would involve substantial defensive personnel changes - however if Baker,Bryan and Flint leave, then the option is there. Big decisions to be made before next season methinks. Great post, I am sorry I didn't see it earlier. Me and @Davefevs were discussing this on his team 18/19 topic. To play the short passing system we saw at the start of the season, we need to build from the back, whilst Frankie's distribution disrupts our play as he gives it straight back to our opponents. I know some fans love his "for the cameras" saves, but he wouldn't need to make half of them if he didn't throw, well kick, away our possession. Vyner has been mentioned as a good outlet for bringing the ball forward. Personally, I believe mags and hegelar were signed in the hope of having a cb pair of one big-lump-old-style cb on the right (wright/flint) with a more technical player alongside at lcb (mags/hegelar.) Baker was obviously just a flint replacement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ZiderEyed Posted April 22, 2018 Report Share Posted April 22, 2018 Not read the whole thread but BCFC NEED a new goalkeeper if they are going to progress and be this high pressing, intricate passing team they aspire to be. I like Frankie but does he actually fit with the ethos LJ is supposedly trying to implement? The Goalkeeper is one of the most important positions for a passing side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Three Lions Posted April 22, 2018 Report Share Posted April 22, 2018 1 minute ago, ZiderEyed said: I like Frankie but does he actually fit with the ethos LJ is supposedly trying to implement? The Goalkeeper is one of the most important positions for a passing side. I like Frankie but does he actually fit with the ethos LJ is supposedly trying to implement? no way. The Goalkeeper is one of the most important positions for a passing side. Exactly if and its a big if LJ is going that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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