Do not sign anyone in January - 3 year Plan.

[Robbored]

1 minute ago, Phileas Fogg said:

Very often? We’ve historically made several significant signings in that window.

You’ll like this, but the biggest example I can think of in recent-ish history is signing Dele Adebola in 07/08. A good player in his own right, but not quite what we needed. Hull got Frazier Campbell and went up.  

A contradiction there PF. I remember Adebola well but as you say he wasn’t what we needed at the time which supports my comment that January is not a good time to do business.

Its very rare for a season changing signing is made during the winter window. Campbell was an exception.

[Phileas Fogg]

1 minute ago, Robbored said:

A contradiction there PF. I remember Adebola well but as you say he wasn’t what we needed at the time which supports my comment that January is not a good time to do business.

Its very rare for a season changing signing is made during the winter window. Campbell was an exception.

Not a contradiction because you were questioning 'when a player is available at the right time for the right price' in January. Adebola was clearly available for an acceptable price, the debate as to whether he was what we needed is a side issue. 

[The Bard]

Seems to me that Nige has accepted that 3 5 2 / 3 4 3 best suits the players we have at the moment. Any signing now will need to plug a gap in the squad till the summer and be a long term option too.

Assuming Cundy is fit eventually it would give us 5 options at CB with the option of recalling Moore in January. 

Pring and COD cover LWB assuming JD has been thrown off the bus. Tanner RWB...

We've got 7 CMs including Benarous and Scott and 4 strikers plus Conway.

Seems to me we need an option who can play RWB or right side of a midfield 4 should Nige want to go back to 4 4 2 long term.

I expect us to sign someone unheralded from League 1 or League 2 

[Hampshire reds]

 There is a 3 year plan. By god i have heard this so many times over the years. can someone explain what is it.

[Nugget]

Talk while Nige was away from ceo that they were potentially accelerating plans to bring in their Summer targets in January. Perhaps with results improving they may hold back if priced out. 

[1960maaan]

A normally difficult and expensive window to deal in successfully , add in the financial hit due to the Plague and it makes it worse.

I think if a player we want was to come up fine, all the stars align then go for it. Otherwise lets get through and reassess in the summer. 

[The Bard]

19 minutes ago, Hampshire reds said:

 There is a 3 year plan. By god i have heard this so many times over the years. can someone explain what is it.

To gradually move out players that are under contract and move in ones that the manager wants. This will take 2 to 3 years due to contract length.

Develop homegrown players so they are regularly playing 1st team football. I'd hope we have 4 or 5 younger players involved in 2 years time.  Unfortunately can't see Scott staying as he looks a very good player and we could use a large fee.

By doing the 2 things above we should have a team that can challenge for top 6.

Sort infrastructure out fully including DOF and recruitment. 

It's all blindingly obvious to me can't understand why you can't work it out for yourself. 

[Waconda]

1 hour ago, Davefevs said:

The interesting thing is that in recent games, Scott, O’Dowda, James and Bakinson have scored…are we finally gonna see a better contribution from midfield.  I think some of this is linked to us playing a bit better and able to get players into shooting positions.

I think we do need a forward, but I’m not convinced the right one will be available in January…and like Weimann filled the void early season, Semenyo might take on some of that going forward.

Think there will be lots of rumours starting in the next week or so.

The change in formation and tactics has allowed our midfielders to get into scoring positions.

Previous "long ball" was not.

[Hampshire reds]

Bard good explanation thank u. Then u let yourself down by having a pop. sad really

[Davefevs]

1 hour ago, GrahamC said:

Yes.

His summer update said that he wanted 5 players, 2 centre halves, 2 midfield players & “someone to stick the ball in the back of the net”.

Those were his exact words & it was on the official site, too.. 

yep, and at the end of the window he said the right player wasn’t available, and it was no point bringing in someone not better than he had.  He also said he didn’t even know some of the players rumoured to be interested in.  I suspect he does, but that they weren’t targets.

1 hour ago, robin_unreliant said:

Didn't Nige say back in August that he didn't expect to do much, if any, business in January? I remember him saying he was happy with the squad he had for the season. Obviously managers often trot this out without really meaning it but I don't think Nige does. 

There was talk from Gould about the need to bring plans forward but that was when we looked in danger of slipping into a relegation fight. Things have steadied so it would seem sensible to go back to Plan A. 

Yes, Nige did….and yes Gould talked about bringing forward some plans too.

[archie andrews]

2 hours ago, Countryfile said:

Agree about the journeyman players (with the possible exception of a striker).

However eight(?) points off a play off place with more than half the season to go, get Williams, Baker and King back in the fold, add a couple or three decent players and who knows?
 

The Championship, despite parachute payments, is so tight that with a large slice of luck it’s possible a long shot could go up this season.

I can at least dream.

We're more aldershot than long shot.... 

[archie andrews]

58 minutes ago, Hampshire reds said:

 There is a 3 year plan. By god i have heard this so many times over the years. can someone explain what is it.

A plan that takes 3 years HR.... 

[LondonBristolian]

1 hour ago, GrahamC said:

Yes.

His summer update said that he wanted 5 players, 2 centre halves, 2 midfield players & “someone to stick the ball in the back of the net”.

Those were his exact words & it was on the official site, too.. 

As @Davefevshas said, he then quite early in the window said we weren't likely to be getting a striker in. 

I'm reading between the lines a bit but early in the summer the Post was reporting that the fee for Atkinson was a stumbling block and that we were after Smith from Rotherham but being quoted a million. Shortly after that, we paid the money for Atkinson and Pearson stopped talking about getting a striker in. If the rumour mill was to be believed, we also dropped interest in Tom Lees and shortly after re-signed Baker.

My guess is that we originally planned to sign two cheap defenders and spend the budget on a striker but - once we realised there were no strikers at the right price - we spent the money we would have spent on a striker on Atkinson.

I don't think Pearson was "rebuffed" in signing a striker. I think he made a decision not to make a signing because he didn't feel he could get a player he wanted. I'm sceptical that January will be different. 

[The Bard]

20 minutes ago, LondonBristolian said:

As @Davefevshas said, he then quite early in the window said we weren't likely to be getting a striker in. 

I'm reading between the lines a bit but early in the summer the Post was reporting that the fee for Atkinson was a stumbling block and that we were after Smith from Rotherham but being quoted a million. Shortly after that, we paid the money for Atkinson and Pearson stopped talking about getting a striker in. If the rumour mill was to be believed, we also dropped interest in Tom Lees and shortly after re-signed Baker.

My guess is that we originally planned to sign two cheap defenders and spend the budget on a striker but - once we realised there were no strikers at the right price - we spent the money we would have spent on a striker on Atkinson.

I don't think Pearson was "rebuffed" in signing a striker. I think he made a decision not to make a signing because he didn't feel he could get a player he wanted. I'm sceptical that January will be different. 

That's plausible. As I said above I can see a RM coming in January on low wages from League 1 or 2. 

[Oh Louie louie]

So he wanted to sign five players, one to quote put the ball in the net as graham c says.

Hmm, sounds like he did want a forward.

[exAtyeoMax]

2 hours ago, Phileas Fogg said:

Not a contradiction because you were questioning 'when a player is available at the right time for the right price' in January. Adebola was clearly available for an acceptable price, the debate as to whether he was what we needed is a side issue. 

I assumed he meant the right player for the team as well?

[Oh Louie louie]

Fgs he talking about somebody putting the ball in the net.

As for the interview about adding more goals.

Is that not spelling it out?

Do you think hes talking about signing a goalie?

 

[brad blit]

The only ‘major’ signing (probably a young prem striker on loan) would only happen if Wells is moved on, perhaps someone like QPR come along and pay around 1mil to take him off our books? 

Other than that we might see the odd opportunist signing from lower leagues like Tanner. 

[cidered abroad]

I believe that it is essential for us in January to move a couple on and bring in two or three. I say this because I consider that we are not as safe as some on here would have us believe. 

Yes we are picking up points at present at a rate to stay out the dogfight but we are still suffering from long term injuries to some squad members. Joe Williams is still out and we then only have two experienced midfielders who have just had six weeks out of action. And only one central striker who should probably only be playing 3 out of five games.

I'm trying to be positive but one or two long injuries after January could be disastrous. So a couple more reliable bodies will help.

[Waconda]

51 minutes ago, brad blit said:

The only ‘major’ signing (probably a young prem striker on loan) would only happen if Wells is moved on, perhaps someone like QPR come along and pay around 1mil to take him off our books? 

Other than that we might see the odd opportunist signing from lower leagues like Tanner. 

Wells would have to agree to a massive wage cut for that to happen, that's why QPR couldn't keep him initially.

[Sniper]

The issue for me with getting in a new striker is do we have the players that will be able to compliment their needs on service. If we get in say a tall striker good in the air, or a fox in the box, will they get the required service?

If not then I wouldn't bother I'd say, unless we can find one that can pick up the ball, dodge past 2 defenders and slam it into the top corner. Unfortunately they don't come cheap. Oh to find another Super Bobby Taylor.

 

[LondonBristolian]

1 hour ago, brad blit said:

The only ‘major’ signing (probably a young prem striker on loan) would only happen if Wells is moved on, perhaps someone like QPR come along and pay around 1mil to take him off our books? 

Other than that we might see the odd opportunist signing from lower leagues like Tanner. 

QPR are well stocked for strikers now. I can’t see why they would go for him on top of Charlie Austin, Andre Gray and Lyndon Dykes…

 

 

 

[BCFCGav]

Thinking about depth of positions in our now preferred 5-3-2:

GK: Bentley, O'Leary, Wiles-Richards 

CB: 3 from Atkinson, Kalas, Baker, Vyner, Cundy. Given injury records of Bakes and Cundy I think we need one more 

RWB: Simpson, Tanner. Maybe one light 

LWB: O'Dowda, Pring, Dasilva 

CM: 3 from James, King, Williams, Bakinson, HNM, Scott, Benarous, Palmer 

Striker: 2 from Weimann, Martin, Wells, Semenyo, Conway 

Obviously I've put players in their 'natural' positions but many cover multiple roles. I think what this shows is we are manned well enough in all positions, barring the two I've marked orange where we could possibly do with one more. So no 'emergency' positions, which means we can think about areas we just want to improve. I see the need for a consistent goal scorer but generally we're scoring at an ok rate this season, but defensively leaky. I'd like to see us sign another consistent CB who could form a reliable back 3 with Atkinson and Kalas, with Baker, Cundy and Vyner covering. Then if Cundy is up to doing that covering, let Vyner go.

[mozo]

4 hours ago, GrahamC said:

Posted something similar in the ridiculously titled “Pearson & Fleming out” thread.

We are on course for 54/55 points, Derby & Barnsley (2 wins in 22) look down already, so unless we can see a player we want at a price we can afford, there is very little sense in us making signings, certainly no more than one.

Loans that cannot be made permanent also make no sense, far better to persevere with the likes of Semenyo, Scott, Conway & Benarous than give some Prem kid games just to benefit someone else.

Mind you I said in the summer that we wouldn’t be replacing the same number as left (13 out, 5 in) & got told I was wrong.

Beat Huddersfield and we're halfway to 60 which is pretty much par per our expectations. 

Worth acknowledging though that while the picture is very clear now, it wasn't so obvious back on 6th November when Coventry inflicted the 4th humiliation - not just defeat, humiliation! - in 5 games against us and as stated above, even the club were talking about January transfers.

[Supersonic Robin]

43 minutes ago, brad blit said:

The only ‘major’ signing (probably a young prem striker on loan) would only happen if Wells is moved on, perhaps someone like QPR come along and pay around 1mil to take him off our books? 

Other than that we might see the odd opportunist signing from lower leagues like Tanner. 

Don't think I'd like to see us loaning a prem striker personally.

Seems like a waste of money on a short term project to help us finish 14th instead of 17th. It would also be a shame to invest those Championship minutes in developing another team's young striker instead of our own (e.g. Conway).

Perhaps a different story if it's a loan with option to buy, but that's very unlikely if you're looking at most notable youngsters from prem teams. 

[Numero Uno]

5 hours ago, Simon bristol said:

Perhaps a better idea would be to move out palmer dasilva and wells, that would free up a fortune to bring a loan striker in.

the alternative is to sell on the family silver,, alex scott in this case,,, if we could get 8 million or so should we take it? The answer is that the club would definitely take it I suppose 

The problem is that if buying clubs offer the likes of Wells and Palmer say £12K per week we will be expected by the players themselves to pay the shortfall for the remainder of their contract with us before they will agree to a move otherwise they may as well sit on their arses here and shop around in the summer. So you aren't freeing up a fortune in reality because NOT ONE SINGLE CLUB will be mental enough to match the wages that Swiss and Steve signed off on players who just aren't doing it for us...............or anything like it in the current financial climate that exists in football.

[Numero Uno]

1 hour ago, BCFCGav said:

Thinking about depth of positions in our now preferred 5-3-2:

GK: Bentley, O'Leary, Wiles-Richards 

CB: 3 from Atkinson, Kalas, Baker, Vyner, Cundy. Given injury records of Bakes and Cundy I think we need one more 

RWB: Simpson, Tanner. Maybe one light 

LWB: O'Dowda, Pring, Dasilva 

CM: 3 from James, King, Williams, Bakinson, HNM, Scott, Benarous, Palmer 

Striker: 2 from Weimann, Martin, Wells, Semenyo, Conway 

Obviously I've put players in their 'natural' positions but many cover multiple roles. I think what this shows is we are manned well enough in all positions, barring the two I've marked orange where we could possibly do with one more. So no 'emergency' positions, which means we can think about areas we just want to improve. I see the need for a consistent goal scorer but generally we're scoring at an ok rate this season, but defensively leaky. I'd like to see us sign another consistent CB who could form a reliable back 3 with Atkinson and Kalas, with Baker, Cundy and Vyner covering. Then if Cundy is up to doing that covering, let Vyner go.

Can't agree with you at all on the Goalkeepers. Two of the three will never ever be given a league start for any other reason than Bentley being injured. That's not covering a position in my book.

[Davefevs]

2 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

The problem is that if buying clubs offer the likes of Wells and Palmer say £12K per week we will be expected by the players themselves to pay the shortfall for the remainder of their contract with us before they will agree to a move otherwise they may as well sit on their arses here and shop around in the summer. So you aren't freeing up a fortune in reality because NOT ONE SINGLE CLUB will be mental enough to match the wages that Swiss and Steve signed off on players who just aren't doing it for us...............or anything like it in the current financial climate that exists in football.

In Palmer’s case you could sweeten by offering him a long term, but even that seems unlikely in current climate.

[Numero Uno]

Just now, Davefevs said:

In Palmer’s case you could sweeten by offering him a long term, but even that seems unlikely in current climate.

Yep, we are paying big time for the previous recruitment strategy. Some people just won't see it. and we'll continue to see "Nige and Curtis Out" threads EVERY time we lose a game.

[BCFCGav]

4 minutes ago, Numero Uno said:

Can't agree with you at all on the Goalkeepers. Two of the three will never ever be given a league start for any other reason than Bentley being injured. That's not covering a position in my book.

Isn't that the definition of cover 

I think we've seen enough of Max to know he's a solid enough back up should Bents get a knock, and we don't know much about Wiles-Richards because we haven't needed to. But if he didn't have it he'd have been released by now. Not a problem area at all for me.