steviestevieneville

12 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

And that is a major deviation from the plan Nige, RG put in place, that was based on steady progress without needing the outlay / risky outlay.

Even if Twine is that good, he alone isn’t enough.

Exactly . That’s why I’m so pissed off still. It’s not about nige being sacked as such, the way he was  yes. It’s treating us like ******* idiots . Just feed them some bullshit . Without that long sustainable plan , that we’ve never achieved under the lansdowns through their (bored of saying it) lack of football knowledge means we have  to rip it up again . That reason is because of the pressure they’ve put themselves & manning under with the ridiculous press conferences & they’ve left themselves nowhere to go . It’s 100% on them . They can’t sack manning in a years time , blame him after not backing him & it’s obvious from their statements that we expect to be competing top end. The only way short term to do that is spending . If not this month then it’s going to be a hell of a lot of turmoil in the summer. 

The bottom line is. If the morons running the club are actually serious about promotion then the level of player needed has to rise dramatically . A bit like hull are doing . Because we haven’t had a sustainable way of playing & bought into it for years like a Brighton/brentford or a Swansea of the past ten years . The only way we can do it is by spending again . Is twine that next level ? I’ve not watched him enough to have an opinion  . He’s not tearing the league up or being a driving force for hull from what I can see . It wouldn’t surprise me in the slightest if we panic & sign him though . Not with history the lansdowns have got . 

1 minute ago, bearded_red said:

Best midfielder in Premier League history.

He’s one of yes . To disregard Gerrard , lampard, scholes , viera, toure, etc is a bit harsh . I’ve watched him three times in the flesh all be it against us & he’s right up there no doubt . 

1 hour ago, NcnsBcfc said:

Was absolutely fantastic against us at AG last season in the cup.

That goal he scored, on the run, without stopping, to curl into the goal from 25 yards. Absolutely fantastic technique.

You can only admire the talent, after you've been able to see them live. Watching on TV cuts out so much of their off the ball work.

 

More impressive was the equaliser away in the league cup semi final. He got the ball off their keeper & thought **** this I’ll do I myself . 

1 hour ago, Bar BS3 said:

You just have to look at the way our views compare to theirs.

We are 4 points off the play off places & the general feeling on here (although very jekyll & Hyde, based on the last result) is that our chairman is a clown for believing we could be a top 6 contender & the general outlook from threads is frustrated & negative.

Rovers are 12 points off the top 6, closer to the drop zone than the play offs - yet they always seem to refer to their play-off push & how they are better than everyone that beats them..!

That’s because they’re desperate to be in the same league as us . Although only from fans 30 or above that can actually remember those days 

1 minute ago, Mr Popodopolous said:

Is it the fee or is it the wages he may wish for.

Wonder what he us in at Burnley, what % Hull are paying.

On paper £5m fee on say a 2.5 year deal for simplicity is £1m in amortisation this year and £2m each subsequent year. £5m/3.5 is £0.714m and £1.428m respectively.

How high will and should we go though..we know TV money set to rise by £2-3m next year. £20k per week, more?

I would have thought he would have had a clause in his contract that he would have got a pay rise when they got promoted . 

4 minutes ago, Natchfever said:

Because hes a treacherous *** who has brown nosed his way into a position no other club anywhere near our level would even consider him for.

Plus I did suggest that if he is professional he shouldn’t be in social media at all . Plus he can’t spell technical correctly

Just now, redsquirrel said:

fair play for trying , i like your style, if you dont ask,you wont get. might not get anyway but at least you tried.

I doubt Lansdown even reads twitter . Tinnion did though. I actually think , when I wrote . “ why are you , as a technical director of a professional football club private messaging people about transfer activity , he had enough  . 

After a good nights sleep , I decided to tweet JL & tinnion this morning . I never swear & it’s as constructive as I can be . It was 4-5 tweets getting things off my chest . When I mentioned the squad not suiting manning & Brian being economical with the truth regarding NP he blocked me . I wonder why

1 minute ago, Davefevs said:

You’ll laugh…

King and James - the problem is their legs.  I watched a ball get knocked out to Pring and saw James know he had to create an angle for a pass or Pring would be cornered.  He did that, got the pass, then just turned and opened a pass out to Tanner in acres.  Nothing flashy, but he had that pass in his mind before he made the run to receive a pass from Pring.

They have it!

Yes I agree but intelligent enough not to get too expansive & also just help players into position by talking to them . I was kind of talking Hoddle chatting to the England lads & them all staring back at him In attacking flare I’d say jacki & he was another who’d play a ball that would run through to a keeper & he’d have his arms in the air . Like ? How didn’t you read that pass 

1 minute ago, ColneRed said:

Think he deserved better from the club. Apparently approaching the appearances clause that would have triggered a 12 month extension. Goal against Watford a reminder of what he is capable of. Club needs experienced heads with a rookie manager. 

No sentiment in football . Genuinely enjoyed watching him . Great pro , but he wasn’t going to get another contract . 
when you say he deserved better , you have to take into account he wasn’t here on minimum wage . He earned a lot of money playing for us and fair play to him it’s a short career I’ll never begrudge a player that . Apart from o’dowda’s second contract . Should be done for fraud that *****

50 minutes ago, PHILINFRANCE said:

Perhaps I just have a warped sense of humour, but I couldn’t help noticing the name of Bolton’s stadium.

How awful when a spectator collapsed and themself in a possibly life threatening situation.

Toughsheet Stadium.

How unfortunate.

My sense of humour is also warped but im not sympathetic . I’ve suffered the loss of my parents as have a lot of us . I was especially close to my dad who introduced me to the city in the mid 70’s . It’s a very numbing time & 13 years on I still feel his loss. However , I do try to see the funny side in anything . The reason is , well we’re all going to die so have a laugh while you’re here. Unless your a bloody city fan 

5 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Yeah, yeah, mental is just another “attribute” that we are generally mid-table ability-wise across the group.

Who would you say had it mentally as a city player ? Recent times I’d say David noble but lacked the fitness . Trundle . Cormack  my dad loved him . He used to say when we got home (me about 7 or 8 ) all those idiots moaning about Pete but we ain’t intelligent to see his passing mate . 

8 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

That was another moment , and I don't want to come across as some sort of Anis basher but he did annoy me today. When TC got the ball , made it to the touchline to cross, it wasn't a great cross but even the commentator mentioned Mehmeti was just jogging into the box. I think he's miles off ATM, but Manning likes him, technically fine but needs to add a lot to his game. If Manning can work magic , brilliant , we all benefit , but it will be a long road IMO.

Sorry to quote you again. I don’t believe a football brain can be taught . You either got it or you haven’t. 
 

2 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

That was another moment , and I don't want to come across as some sort of Anis basher but he did annoy me today. When TC got the ball , made it to the touchline to cross, it wasn't a great cross but even the commentator mentioned Mehmeti was just jogging into the box. I think he's miles off ATM, but Manning likes him, technically fine but needs to add a lot to his game. If Manning can work magic , brilliant , we all benefit , but it will be a long road IMO.

You can have technically prem players but they’re mentally park players 

2 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

You know what Mike, I’m with you.  I think too much is made of “these players don’t suit…”, “it’s not his players” type comments.  Most if not all have come through academy systems where they’d have been taught what I’ll just simply call “pass and move” and technical ability.

We saw first half (on a shit pitch) that we can play fine.

In the past we’ve been a bit soft, perhaps lacking in hard work.  That’s not the case anymore.

The main problem is ability.

They are mid-table ability wise, on average.

Until you improve the players ability, it doesn’t matter how you play (within reason), we will get similar results.

Can LM improve the current players ability by on the grass coaching?  If he can, fair play.

More likely is that he’ll coach them to play his system to a similar level to how Curtis / Jase coached them to play Nige’s system.

Will there be a point where some players look at it and think - why isn’t this method getting us better results, it’s what we were sold.

Maybe I’m just a bit cynical?  Maybe that’s based on my view that there’s no one way to play this game.  I dunno.

Sorry if I keep going on about this . But like I’ve said previously we don’t have football intelligent players . As you know . The further up you go is about technic yes but speed of thought and making the right decisions . I’ve seen it in the last third especially with our players , not Tommy so much . They’ll get the ball & dwell on it . That could be , a lack of intelligence with the run off them , or they’ve got the ball where they’ve closed themselves off . I know it’s part of the championship to have players of that level. Is it also coaching when you look how Ipswich play with largely league one players . I’m rambling , into my second bottle of wine & ****** off I’ve wasted another Saturday moaning about city

6 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

The most frustrating thing about today for me was Mehmeti . I've mentioned it before but, with 2 passes on fronting up a player he took the man on and lost the ball . About a minute later identical situation he did exactly the same thing. After a few good moments recently I thought he was learning, it appears not.
I want to see Bell infront of McCrorie, someone more willing or finds attacking more natural . Most of Bell's good work seems to come defending , I would give him a run off of TC or try him on the left. I share your fears he may not make it long term though. 

And imo with mehmeti keeping the ball is a lack of vision , he doesn’t read the game . I used to play full back . You love to play against players like him . As you & others know. Players like him need to make runs off the ball to create space for others & to take defenders away . He doesn’t do any of that 

31 minutes ago, Harry said:

Ha ha. I was planning on having a quiet night Dave. This question, as I know you very well know, is gonna get my hackles right up

As said, there are 3 ways that this goes :

1) Coach the current players to play LM’s way. 
Answer - I can’t see it. I’ve always said I just can’t see the players being able to regularly sustain the style LM wants. Patches, yes. But not consistently or quick/slick enough. 
 

2) LM adapts to this squad. 
This is a comment I see a lot. Yes. Maybe he should. But my argument would be; why should he?? We’ve recruited him as manager based on what we’ve seen him produce in previous roles. He has a very clear CV.  Why would you hire a cocktail-shaker to work in the cloakroom? Why would you hire a sparky to sort out your plumbing (and other such crap analogies). 
 

3) Buy players to suit the managers style. 
This is all we can be left with. I just don’t see options 1 or 2 as credible. 
 

So, to answer your questions. Can we afford to buy the style of players required? The answer to that is Yes. It can definitely be done. 
But of course that leads into question 2) can we recruit expertly. 
My answer to that is a resounding and very sorry No. 

As you know, I have very little faith in our recruitment structure and team. I’m sure Brian is very keen to complete his TGH deal that he’s oh so very proud of. And yes, TGH is a good player, I’m not doubting that. But does he suit LM’s style. I personally don’t think he does, no. 
We will of course sign him. But I’m not actually convinced LM would target him if he wasn’t already here. 
And as you’ve noted elsewhere re Knight. The recruitment team and Brian are oh so proud of him too. And I again say that yes he’s a very good player. But hand on heart, if he wasn’t already here, would Manning have him on a list of targets? I’d say the answer to that is also no. 
 

Anyway. A quiet night for me.

So my short answer to your questions are :

1) Yes. It’s very do-able. 
2) No. I have no trust in our recruitment. 

Answer no2 it’s what eve done for decades. Get manager in thinking he’ll adapt the squad. Squad doesn’t /can’t play his way. Buy new squad . Sack manager etc etc etc . Let’s try the Brentford way or Brighton way .

Heres an idea , have one of your own . Ah well , the problem with that is , football to the lansdowns is like me reading mandarin 

15 minutes ago, 1960maaan said:

I said I will make a judgment in February, I might as well stick to that .
He has one way of playing, he likes possession , but that doesn't mean he can't adjust formation or shape . 
I will give him the benefit and say, maybe he has been trying to get them to retain the ball, ingrain the movement needed to be able to play and may gradually bring in other shapes or set ups down the line, I don't know but we can only hope. We have improved in possession, but there are times we look lost . Games like Birmingham, Millwall and 2nd half today, nowhere near looking as though we can pass let alone retain the ball, this is where Manning must earn his corn.

I differ from many on here, I think that players at Championship level can be turned into possession minded. It may have to be drummed into some and others may not cope, but most I believe can . The problem we have is consistency and being able to change things on the fly.
This is where my main worry is .
He is detail led and coaches players throughout the game , it was mentioned before how he walked Mehmeti through the first half a few weeks ago, then 2nd half when he wasn't close enough AM's performances dropped , extreme example but I wonder if that detail impacts when things go wrong. Everyone has been coached and cajoled into retaining the ball, to the extent it looks like some 2nd guess themselves and don't play the quick ball that is on. I may be wrong , but whatever , I think come Feb we will be able to see where we stand and with luck and some new recruits things may look a little better. We can only hope.

I put in another post how decision making & speed of it is fundamental . I agree , some championship can be coached to be possession based but not on the whole. Look at mehmeti . Ripped it up in league one because he’s instinctive . He’ll turn defenders inside & out . In this league he’s not quick enough mentally to see the pass & move into space . That part of his game is not instinctive. 
I really hate saying this but I’m worried about Sam bell as well . He doesn’t seem to have it upstairs to play in a possession side . He suits a big man small man partnership imo & isn’t as quick as I thought . 
 

19 minutes ago, Davefevs said:

Agree, absolutely no need to rush him.  Being back in the squad was a nice little boost to his recovery, no need to be a bit desperate to play him, unless say Tanner got injured or sent off.

Do you honestly think we can either:

1. afford the players required to play that style and succeed?
2. recruit expertly to avoid spending millions and millions?

If the only choice in Harry’s scenario is to rebuild . Which I agree with . Then we end up back where we were when nige came in . Rinse & repeat . Another wasted three years . 
If I could go back in history to when little Jon was scribbling on the walls at home and said . Daddy can you take me to Bristol city . A sopranos like hit would of been in order

2 hours ago, 1960maaan said:

IMO, and I stress it is just my opinion , that was all bluff and excuse used to cover up or make excuses for getting rid of Pearson.  I doubt they really thought we had a top 6 squad, we don't have a top 10 budget so as I say bluff.

They have what they wanted, Nige out and the new man in place, now they have to back him or look even more foolish, although backing him will also make them look foolish or at least liars as we had a budget to stick to. 

And they think we’re all idiots & wont see through it . I do think they’re so arrogant that they don’t give a ****. As Lansdown said . It’s my club . *** 

54 minutes ago, Silvio Dante said:

It’s for me an interesting angle and I’m keen to move away from the “Nige good Liam bad” angle (but for avoidance of doubt I have significant doubts over Liam)

Your point about “lineage” is vital here for me. If you take successful clubs - from Liverpool and the “boot room”, or even examples like Swansea, there is a consistency to the appointments. A nuclear option, or a volte farce, only happens when things go wrong. Every club has an identity and a plan - take Sheffield United. Through Warnock to Wilder it’s been about outworking the opposition - the overlapping fullbacks were a sideshow - they were and are always more physical and worked harder. 
 

So I ask myself what is our identity - to me it’s always going to be wedded to the Cooper/Jordan teams I grew up with, and I think City fans have an expectation of that expansive attacking football. But moving away from that isn’t an issue if it’s part of a sustained and continuous strategy. And the issue is it hasn’t been. In fact, as Liam Manning himself might note, the board (Tinnikn//Lansdown) have done the opposite of “trusting the process” and have right angled at every turn- which is why we are where we are now

Excellent post 

3 hours ago, firstdivision said:

I’m sorry, this sort of abuse disgusts me. It is unnecessary and uncivilised. 

Oh no

57 minutes ago, Frenchay Red said:

Home game v Nottingham Forest for the return leg of the 1988/89 League Cup. It was surreal. The band kept marching while the poor guy was lead on the pitch.

Ok thanks . You only got marching bands for big games . 

6 minutes ago, Natchfever said:

Ill get a membership next season.

Less and less inclined to actually go into the ground matchday.

Good idea. It’s the hope that kills you thinking it’ll be this year. But deep down we all know nothing will happen with this lot in charge