Harry

Sorry, I missed this question earlier. Of course it’s not to do with Bozo’s credibility- does he even have any? Of course it’s not to distract from the party scandal. The reason that’s come up is simply to get rid of him. Note that the Stratton video has been widely reported as having occurred days after the alleged party in Dec 20, yet the briefing room it was in wasn’t refurbed until March 21. Its because they are shit-scared of the thing. They are shit-scared to admit that people will die and there’s not a lot they can really do about it. They know that this was a man-made virus and are shit-scared to admit it. It’s because they know that they ****** up and have done absolutely nothing to improve the health services since this began. It’s because they don’t give a **** about your health and haven’t given vulnerable people any support whatsoever in 20 months to help them improve their chances of survival. It’s because they know that this crisis has managed to line their pockets and the pockets of their friends and they are more than happy for that to continue so that they get richer whilst everyone else suffers. It’s nothing to do with a global conspiracy. It started with incompetence and has ended up a breeding ground for greed. They’re shit-scared to admit it. And they don’t want it to end because they are getting rich off the back of it. You would be deluding yourself if you thought that anyone in power and anyone who is involved in any decision making on any of this actually gives a single flying **** about you or your health. Why do wars occur? Resources, greed, money. No global conspiracy. Just to line the pockets of the rich and powerful. This is no different. Who is benefitting from the pandemic? The rich. Why would they want it to end? Why would they want to put in proper health measures and services which would actually help, when they can just do **** all and impose new regulations every now and again and keep raking the money in. Covid, like war, is a huge juicy big-balled cash cow. And they’ll milk that sweet little hairy ****** for as long as they can get away with it.

Ha ha. So, you can flash your app. You are free. But what did you have to do to get your app. Yes, you had to take an injection that you probably didn’t really want. And then another one. And now another one. And you probably only got it so you could go on holiday. Don’t pretend you did it “to protect others”. Pretty much everyone under the age of 70 I know did it so they could fly to Spain, Portugal or wherever. Or because they HAD to for work! Pretty much everyone I know. And that’s from their own mouths. They just wanted to be able to go abroad or not lose their job. None of them were scared of the virus and didn’t mention anything about ‘the greater good’, it was just to be able to have their holiday this year. Freedom. Ha ha. Yeah, ok.

Funny how no one has mentioned New World Order or Great Reset except for you and Robbo.

Let’s run some pretty generous stats. Current ONS says 1 in 60 people infected. That’s as a whole. If we assume that the vaccine reduces your chance of infection by 50% (seems to be the average of most articles I’ve read), then for vaxxed that ought to be 1 in 120. Let’s take a 15,000 crowd. If it’s ‘open’ population, the stats would suggest that maybe 160 people in the crowd are positive. If all 15k are vaxxed, let’s say that this suggests maybe around 125 people in the crowd are positive. So that’s a difference of around 35 people in a vaxxed crowd vs an ‘open’ crowd. With 22,500 home seats available, the chances of one of those 35 people being sat next to you is 0.15%. So a vax passport might reduce your chances of sitting next to someone with covid by around 0.15%. This doesn’t even factor in that outdoor transmission is 90% less likely. Nor does it factor in that your own vax protection should reduce your chances of catching it by 65%. Nor does it factor in that, even if you are over 80 years old, you still have a 90% chance of survival. So, for an 80 year old, a 0.15% more chance of catching it, less the 90% outdoor factor, less your own vax protection, with the survival factor, means that there is 0.008% more chance of you catching and dying of covid at an ‘open’ AG than there is at a ‘fully vaxxed’ AG. And these are very generous figures using the same modelling as Neil Ferguson. *note. Fully expecting to be completely ridiculed for these ‘fag packet’ figures and that’s the reason I posted it ?

It contains the results of the studies which are the same ones which I posted about, to which I initially stated the findings that the same viral loads occur but they might reduce quicker in a vaxxed person. It then goes on to interpret those studies differently. You literally posted a link which agreed with what I said, which contained links to the studies to which I referred, and are attempting to use it to call me a mad eejit. Oh dear Robbo. For someone who comes across as so intelligent, you do often lack any real sense.

The link you provided is an opinion piece by a couple of researchers who specifically quote and link some of the studies which I referred to in my post, where those studies found that viral loads are similar but there might be some evidence that vaccinated might reduce a bit faster. So your link actually agrees with what I stated, and specifically links the studies I referred to, and yet you state the old favourite of “you’re no expert”. The fact these 2 researchers, who, yes are very qualified persons, then put their own opinion to the studies is just that - their opinion. The facts of the studies remain. And thats what I said.

I’m sorry for your situation. I also have family and friends who’ve also suffered the same including death and suicide. So I am not using it as an argument against an app. I’m using it as an argument against the bundle of nonsense that led to you having to use an app.

Your opening sentience is not true. Most studies I’ve come across suggest a similar level of viral load but that a vaccinated person might see their levels fall slightly quicker. Please don’t spread misinformation now Robbo ? End of the day, let’s face the reality that everyone will get this in the end. If you are in a vulnerable group due to certain conditions then all you can do to protect yourself is to have the vaccine, which gives you a better chance of not dying with it. If you are in a vulnerable group through your own choice (ie obese), then you can take the vaccine or you can improve your own personal health, in order to give you a better chance of surviving (even though the chance of survival is already very high anyway). Nothing that anyone else does (short of coughing and phlegming directly over you), will stop you getting it.

Proven to be false. The governments own publication show the latest stats for weeks 44-47 show 65% vaxxed, 35% unvaxxed. No one, certainly not me, is denying that vaccines do work, for a specific section of the population. For everyone else, it’s negligible. And the sole focus, concentration, money and resource that’s been put into it at the behest of everything else is what is currently to blame for the nhs being busy. The government don’t give a single flying **** about your health.

It’s this kind of “but it’s only” mentality that the government rely upon. It’s only a pass. It’s only 3 weeks. It’s only til summer. It’s only to save Christmas. It’s only Plan B. It’s only another winter. It’s only a hand sanitizer before you come in. It’s only a ‘stand here’ marking on the floor. It’s only a Perspex screen. It’s only a mask. It’s only a play park. It’s only a zoom lesson. It’s only a business. It’s only a gym. It’s only a nightclub. It’s only working from home. It’s only a jab. It’s only 2. It’s only a booster. It’s only a 4th, 5th etc. It’s only 15 million jabs til freedom. It’s only 120 million jabs. It’s only 1 jab for children. It’s only your mental health. It’s only cancer. It’s only one abused and murdered child. It’s only a heart attack. It’s only a stroke. It’s only it’s only it’s only. It’s only a pass.

Unrelated. But I’ll answer. I told you in that thread last year that I disagreed with many elements of the policing bill, but I disagreed with people attacking the police and causing mass damage to property. I’ll still stand by the fact that anyone who took part in that ‘riot’ last summer is a buffoon. To your wider point - I said earlier in this thread that I was very much on the side of the restrictions last year, so yes, I did think that protests during a pandemic were foolish. But as I said earlier, after a lot of thought, attention, reading, evidence, logic and reason, specifically with what I could see as the mission creep of jabbing healthy children, I did indeed change my mind. So yes, the penny did drop. But not in the way you think.

Please forgive me, but the Nhs being overwhelmed is a line you’re being fed to get people to comply. Here’s the truth. The people who work in frontline nhs are superb and do the best job they can. But they are backed up by a hulking dinosaur of a system that swallows money and a ruinous government who don’t give a **** about your health. The actions this government have taken have done everything possible to ruin your health and collapse the nhs. Fear, panic, lockdowns and restrictions have seen businesses go bust, people lose their homes, people lose their minds, people kill themselves, people become destitute, people struggle mentally, children be abused and murdered, people not be able to see their GP, people not get cancer screens, people not get regular blood tests, people die in their homes, alone, without any family to comfort them, blimey, I could go on. Yet, if you want a vaccine you can get it anywhere anytime. Want to see your GP? No chance. Want a vaccine? Come on up, we’ll do it right now. Yes, the people who work in the nhs are superb. But the nhs itself isn’t fit for purpose. The reason it can become overwhelmed is nothing to do with a minority of unvaxxed people. The reason hospitals are busy this winter is because millions of people haven’t been cared for in the last 20 months and are now becoming severely ill, through undiagnosed cancer, unmonitored heart conditions, etc. Vaccine status for attending a football match will have absolutely 0% impact on this situation. Football, for many people, involves enjoying a bit of alcohol. Given that 35% of all hospital admissions are alcohol related, perhaps they should stop people having a drink at the match as well, just in case they might become one of the 1.3 million people per year who burden the nhs with their choice to get pissed. Perhaps they should also ban smoking from anywhere in the ground, and lock everyone inside at half-time and not allow them to go out for a fag. Just in case they become one of the half a million people per year who burden the nhs through their choice to smoke. Perhaps they should stop serving you pies and pasties in the ground just in case you become one of the million people per year who are a burden on the nhs because of their dietary choices. Spare me the “nhs overwhelmed” line, when nothing, absolutely nothing, has been done in the last 20 months to help the service, and absolutely nothing has been done to tell people to get healthy - the likelihood of death or Icu intake is tremendously higher in those with a high BMI than those of a healthy range. Tell me one thing the government have done to promote healthy lifestyle, healthy eating, education and courses to support those with high bmi to help them reduce their risk. Nothing. In fact they did the opposite - closed gyms, locked people in their homes, ****** up their mental health, closed GP surgeries, cancelled blood tests for sick people in order to get more jabs into healthy people, which only has the benefit of lining the pockets of people who don’t give a flying **** about you or your health. So please forgive me for not bowing to the ‘vax passports will help to not overwhelm the nhs’ line.

There’s not really much ‘packing in’ going on at AG nowadays. Loads of space if you wanna sit away from people. And besides, you’ll spend the majority of your time ‘outside’. You are more likely to be breathed on by a dirty carrier when you are squashed up in the pub together, or standing for 20 minutes in a disorganised throng of people waiting to be searched, like the recent games, or indeed standing in a queue for 10 minutes in the concourse waiting for your latest round of high-fat content food or alcohol, both of which are more likely to make you unfit and unhealthy and more susceptible to a bad case of Covid. Vaccine passports have been in place in many countries for many months, and they haven’t made a blind bit of difference. So the real world data says that they simply do not make a jot of difference. The funniest news I saw this week : France made vaccine passports mandatory in nightclubs in July. Earlier this week they closed nightclubs again. So, who was spreading this virus in nightclubs?? Ultimately, vax passes don’t work. There is no evidence in any of the places that have implemented them that they stop spread. Having 1, 2 or 3 vaccines does not stop you catching covid and does not stop you passing it on. The only benefit which is clear is that it may prevent someone who previously would have had a high risk of death that they may now get through it. So yes, vaccines are good for anyone who is vulnerable to this virus. But they are pretty much negligible for everyone else. It seems to be forgotten that millions and millions of people caught covid before vaccinations and survived. In fact, most of them didn’t even know they had it. There has recently been a narrative that says the opposite to that known fact - now it’s said that if you haven’t had a vaccine you are probably going to be hospitalised. Which of course, is absolute nonsense. It really amazes me that most people are absolutely apoplectic at this governments actions in pretty much everything they do, that everyone knows that governments and media tell lies on a regular basis, and yet people simply fall in line with anything they say in regard to covid. One minute it’s “I hate this government, they don’t represent me”, the next it’s “must show my pass to go to football, because the government said so”. It’s laughable. Actually, it’s not laughable. It’s actually very very sad. I’m not willing to play this nonsense game that the government are playing. I’m not anti vax or a sceptic or anything. Covid exists. Yes. Covid can be dangerous for a very very small number of people. Yes. Covid is not any danger for the vast vast vast majority of people. Yes. Vaccines can help the most vulnerable to fight it off. Yes. Vaccines are necessary for everyone else who are not vulnerable to death from the virus. No! Coercion has been used to get vaccines into healthy children. Yes. Is that ******* disgusting and forever unforgivable. Yes. Do vaccine passports stop spread. No. Can a vaxxed person catch it. Yes. Can a vaxxed person pass it on. Yes. What will vaccine passports do? Nothing.

And if that was going to happen with this new variant, then there is no evidence that vaccine passports will prevent that.

Ha ha. Can’t argue with that Rob. But I’ve done a lot of penance (that’s of the repentance kind, not the small town on the Cornish coast) and I’m re-born. My soul is as pure as that Colombian stuff we used to see some of our friends bring out of an evening. ?

Probably didn’t make myself clear. I don’t want to engage in the facilitation of this bollox in any way. I’m amazed people think it’s ok.

I answered this earlier. Nothing against the club. They have to obey the rules. I’ve paid for my season ticket so they won’t be losing any money from me and I won’t be asking for a refund. I simply do not agree with the measure. Never have and never will. I’m shocked that so many people think it’s ok and will accept it as the ‘norm’. I know this is football chat, so I don’t want to stray too much into the ‘politics’ of it, but I’d like to make it clear that I am not against the vaccine, I am happy that many vulnerable people have been able to be afforded an element of protection (you’ll know from when I used to post on the politics forum that I was very ‘pro-Covid measures’ until the mission creep to start jabbing children came filtering through). But I am vehemently against a vaccine mandate. Yes, the vaccine does offer some protection for the person who has received it, but many people have been indoctrinated and fail to believe that having had a vaccine does not prevent you from getting covid nor prevent you from passing it on. You can still get it and you can still give it. There is no evidence that vaccines passports actually work. So anyone that has been staying away who will now attend again because they think they are now safe - well, they are very wrong. Their safety at AG with a vaccine passport is pretty much the same as their safety would be without one. It’s unnecessary, authoritarian, won’t make any difference, and quite frankly is just a coercive attempt to get more people ‘boosted’ as quickly as possible to line more pockets of people who don’t actually give a flying **** about the health of the population and never have. That’s not something I want to be a part of, and so, for as long as this applies, I won’t be there. Same goes for anywhere that requires such a ‘pass’. If that means I ‘miss out’ on stuff, so be it. My soul will remain pure, knowing that I didn’t take part in the facilitation of this utter bollox.

In a supposedly stand-up liberal democracy too!! I’m stunned that people think this sort of thing is ok.

Ah, apologies. I forgot about your LJ hatred.

Yes. It is football chat. It’s a decision taken by the government that determines your right to watch Bristol City play football without being subject to authoritarian control

I read it as being the numbers in attendance rather than the capacity. But if it’s capacity then I’ll watch some local non league instead. Not punishing City at all. It’s not their fault. I’ve paid for my season ticket and won’t be asking for any refund. But I always said from the very start of all this that I’m against this kind of thing and I won’t attend anywhere that requires people to show evidence of vaccine status. Just to be absolutely clear - I would be able to gain access if I wanted to. But it’s against everything in my moral fibre and I will choose not to attend. I’m not taking part in this governments bullcrap dictats.

I’m against vaccine passports. I won’t be attending. Will take my custom to Forest Green or Cheltenham instead whilst this idiocy reigns.

I know quite a few people with the same opinion. In about 10 years I think we’ll look back and you will be proven right.

7 of the last 12 Preston managers is Scottish. I wouldn’t be surprised if they went down the same route. Maybe Callum Davidson at St Johnstone, who won the cup double last season, and played for Preston too for quite a long time.

I’m enjoying watching the Ipswich fans slowly begin to unravel the story ?