Mr Popodopolous

On FFP again, accounts still not out for Birmingham, Millwall and Stoke. All are due by the end of the year but in the case of Stoke this would merely be Bet365 which would contain March 31st 2021 to March 30th 2022 so would take a bit of extrapolation! Blackburn extrapolation from VLL to club is easier. Extrapolation for these maybe merely with Operating costs, amortisation, profit etc. Birmingham based on HK accounts lost maybe £26m last season. UK ones show the finer detail. Stoke linked with Ross Stewart?? Or at least Alex Neil reportedly has an interest, is FFP not a factor. Meanwhile I still wonder how Reading can sign Hendrick on loan under FFP, he was reportedly on £50k per week at Newcastle, albeit the parent club are covering a good chunk. What's your take @Davefevs if Stoke are genuinely interested in Ross Stewart despite aggregated pre tax losses of £97m in the two Covid years and we are walking this tightrope are we receiving equitable treatment? I have long had scepticism on this point. I struggle to see how they are in an FFP position to do so, post Parachutes.

Point is that if (thinking at home mainly) performances are not so bad, results should turn in due course. Something similar happened in his PL season at Leicester- the performances were often good, at home especially but they were often losing narrowly but then something clicked. Just clicked. 9 games, 22 pts and probably 2 goals a game and maybe more , can't remember without checking. If @Ostrich is still on here they may be able to add bit of detail.

I think performances have actually improved, at home especially. The question is have results necessarily reflected this? Jury is out. Away from home yeah it's been harder. Wigan away for example though we drew we could easily have lost, Middlesbrough even more so chances and lack of the ball, even West Brom away we were great 1at half but had to absorb some pressure in the 2nd, they also hit woodwork twice. However did we merit only one point from Sheffield United and Watford? Absolutely not- these were positive displays and luck was not on our side, between 4 and 6 would have been fair IMO. The Stoke game was disappointing but even then, woodwork at 1-0. Score that and we may well win- draw at worst probably. Even that said about Wigan away, Bennett should have been off, penalties denied at home in the 2 aforementioned November games, red card that should have been given to Norwood that never was. Could go on. We deserved to lose Monday but let's say in one of our intermittent 1st half spells of pressure that WBA instead of hitting their own woodwork, score an own goal in that period, think they headed against their own bar. How does that change things? It might!

You need a manager who buys in however. Someone like Parker wouldn't even look twice "I want this, and this and that- oh and that shiny one there". Only Parachute Payment clubs or PL clubs need apply for my services... Granted that is two ends of the spectrum but you do need a manager who will buy in and not kick off etc. Who understands and accepts the situation for what it is. Someone like Parker would ask for a big wage and a £10m transfer budget or expensive loans I imagine. Just one example- certainly wouldn't agree with reducing the amortisation and wage bills. Hence someone like Parker wouldn't join us- a lot of managers would chafe against the FFP restrictions we are under.

Still don't see us as top 6 even with that but I see your point, momentum and confidence etc. More likely we would feel secure at the level. Its not like we at home haven't been competing. West Brom the first full game, and obviously 1st half v QPR and probably most of game v Millwall tbh. Fine margins certainly.

Player loans aside, wouldn't have minded if he had mentioned some of the officiating calls this season but I guess that's not really the done thing for an agent. 1) Dodgy penalty at Hull against us- arguably we should habe had 2 of our own but I'm not so sure. 2) Failure to penalise Bennett correctly at Wigan when we were a goal up and playing alright. 3) No issue with the Sykes red but the failure to penalise Freeman or failing that call a foul committed on Sykes in build-up. 4) One if not two penalties denied v Sheffield United at home. Unless I'm getting my games mixed up. Bare minimum one iirc. 5) Failure to call a red card on Norwood in same game. 6) Failure to call one and maybe two penalties vs Watford at home. These calls can and do cost teams. Not as if we have received many major big calls or letoffs in our favour?

Still though that is some benefit from a player who wasn't in the plans! £10-15m profit, luck too. Could you imagine us getting that fortunate with a player we loaned out?? There was a strong element of luck to how his value increased as well as his obvious ability.

Although not always. Spence at Middlesbrough got loaned out and they have benefited to the tune of 8 figures for a player who wasn't in their plans! That's not the kind of luck that I would expect to fall our way though and certainly cannot be taken as a general rule or theme. He got loaned out to a side, Spence who finished bottom half in 2020-21 and first 7 or 8 games of last season sacked manager and one point. Then somehow that side beat a number of PL sides in the Cup AND got promoted and he was integral to it. Technically he was not getting any game time at Middlesbrough, £10-15m in the bank for them!

Both. Tinnion and the academy have done great work, but you still need that manager to give them a chance, to take thst risk. Talented or not with a lot of clubs wanting progress and results instantly if not sooner, it is easier to chase midtable with experienced pros, to buy time.

I agree with him on the games vs Sheffield United, Watford and Stoke in particular. Swansea seemed to take some control 2nd half but I think had we got 5 pts from the Sheffield United, Watford and Stoke games nobody really could have argued. Maybe More than 5 but we sure as hell deserved more than one. Perhaps 7 in fact. I suppose playing youth and giving them their head has enhanced their value. Some of the FFP stuff I agree with but as I've always said, the whole "oh Covid cost a club, any club millions in the transfer market therefore it should be added to our allowances" seems dubious to me FFP wise.

Believe a chunk of it will be on instalments, they certainly still owe on players such as Diangana, Grant etc. Transfer instalments still owing and year 2 of Parachute Payments running out after this season makes for a bit of a crunch situation or could do. All clubs owe instalments of course but their owner either won't or can't bung the cash flow in each year to keep the ship steady from that angle.

Perhaps, although a prospective new owner would have to agree that they won't breach FFP in the next two years say- they also have to agree that the League can set such conditions that they require in order to maintain compliance with all applicable regs. In layman's terms they could drop an embargo if a new owner deviaged vastly from plans say. Regulation 16.20 or any other conditions to ensure compliance that they deem appropriate. They do indeed. The stadium is a factor that will add to the complexity but the League won't approve it without being satisfied. See also Charlton- different case but their ESI takeover went through unapproved and there was a full embargo- rules have only tightened since then.

That and whether any bid complies with all applicable EFL regs too. If a new owner was over ambitious in his two year figure info- not just FFP but revenue, cash flow, solvency etc predictions that would create a problem.

That's fair Lenred. Certainly more regulation surrounding it now than a decade ago by a long way. Yes these transactions are complex and will likely take time but it's just worth stressing and reiterating that varied criteria exist, hoops to jump through, it's no bad thing but just the act of buying and selling doesn't translate to approval, a new era to spend etc. I appreciate that a lot of people likely already know this tbh.

He would a) Have to sell to someone with the money and b) Just selling or desire to sell isn't enough, any buyer would have to satisfy varied EFL criteria pertaining to rules etc. Not like it was 10 years ago, say the new owner had items that were risky to the future of the club in the business plan or wanted to spend to get up fast and ignore FFP in the process. The League would not approve such a transaction, without revision to said plan. Not only does a new owner have to show proof and sufficiency of funding for the next two seasons but they have to show and demonstrate how their Business Plan for a club will abide by all applicable regulations. I find it interesting how easily @Kid in the Riot seems to talk about a potential takeover when there are hoops to jump through and criteria to satisfy. Hull's took 2.5-3 months to complete for example.

I dunno, £30m in wages using the Holdings, amortisation, depreciation- cost of staging events doesn't come that cheap.. obviously Interest will contribute to the losses but would they be included in the Running costs? Academy, Community and Women's Football will all be included even if not itemised separately. For context, Derby in 2018 had a £29m income- talking the consolidator- but total running costs of £75m maybe. That is wages, amortisation, academy- the lot. That cost of staging events was reduced during the 2020-21 season especially but is back towards normal levels now. Unsure it is that far outside.

Other thing, inevitably some WBA fans think that if the club defaulted they could/would take ownership, MSD that is, simply by dint of defaulting and ownership or control transferring. Of course that is theoretically possible subject to the Loan Agreement but given their Loan arrangements wirh other clubs that is a major issue surely. That can't be permitted?

Did it say he works for the Met in the preview. Millwall, London club.

Mixture of that and generally outperforming our baseline quality in the first place IMO.

West Brom have taken out a £20m loan from MSD. Secured I believe, says it's over 4 years.. Their Parachute Payments end this season- if they stay down its down to £8-9m tops in EFL and related distributions, will be interesting to see how it plays out.

Small update on this. Looks like it won't be approved by the end of 2022, things maybe delayed by Christmas but 6 weeks and counting. https://www.coventrytelegraph.net/sport/football/football-news/coventry-city-takeover-king-efl-25849182 Takeovers can drag these days- various hoops to jump through.

Worth noting of course that it is one thing selling a club but there are certain criteria that a prospective new owner must comply with for approval. Do they have the money that they claim they do, will their Business Plan find favour with the EFL etc. SL could sell it tomorrow on paper but until such time as the Governing body are satisfied with all aspects. It can take months. Months. Cannot transfer the Golden Share or whatever it is until such time as EFL satisfied- different now.

Well Swindon were at that time a 2nd tier club/side and Crystal Palace were a bit yoyo between the two divisions.

Had a quick look stats wise. First 10 games, our strikers scored 16 goals between them- Weimann, Wells, Masfin, Semenyo and Conway. 16 goals from 70 shots and none were penalty goals. That's not far off 1 in every 4 shots results in a goal, it's hard to sustain. This is inclusive of sub appearances etc. 22.856% conversion rate and none of them penalties is elite but unless you are elite you won't be sustaining such numbers. People can scoff at stats if they like but. If you get a high ratio of penalties to games that moves the dial of course. We though seem to be one of the lowest in Europe over a given period!!

I guess that Tanner is the best option we currently have fit and available at RWB, doesn't mean I'm thrilled about it or think it will prove transformative but he is closer probably than anyone else unless we give Sykes another go. Would also free up Weimann either to play behind the strike pair or as part of a more obvious front 3. Tanner-Naismith-Atkinson-Pring Any merit to that? I worry about Naismith in a pair of CBs however. If Atkinson being dropped and getting a bit of a calling out in public works or helps then maybe but I'd rather have as many good players on the pitch as possible, in their best position where possible.