trundle wheel Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 He's turned down significant step ups in the past for the same reason. Coventry and Derby whilst at Yeovil for example. Fair point, but then those clubs are limited too... We're not talking about just doubling your wages here, we're talking about maybe 5-6 times. Its a massive jump between the likes of us and Newcastle. This is why i think that there are only a handful of clubs he would leave us for... And I expect those wouldnt look in his direction due to experience, so i would say he's safe with us and probably at a club about his level... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Eamer Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Oh for godsake be quiet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Newcastle and the Prem is a different world though isn't it and I can't think of any manager in the Championship who would turn that job down- academic however because it will never happen. Fair point, but then those clubs are limited too... We're not talking about just doubling your wages here, we're talking about maybe 5-6 times. Its a massive jump between the likes of us and Newcastle. This is why i think that there are only a handful of clubs he would leave us for... And I expect those wouldnt look in his direction due to experience, so i would say he's safe with us and probably at a club about his level... Yes it is a much bigger step up but it is also likely to be a career ender through reasons beyond his control. GJ is too smart to take a short cut like that, he will get us or another club promoted and make an unexpected success out of them for a few seasons and then when he feels he has done all he can move to a big and stable club where there is the potential to exceed the fans expectations - that is not Newcastle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CiderHider Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Wow is all i can say. Go read how Mike Ashley made his money then come back and try to justify that comment. I don't have to justify my opinion, but to reiterate my point, I'm just baffled that such a 'successful businessman' can run a club into the ground like he has done and is doing, it makes no sense unless he's a simpleton. But if you have shed loads of money you can't be stupid right? Wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bully Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Oh for godsake be quiet! Quiet day so why not let things pass keyboard warrior Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trundle wheel Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Yes it is a much bigger step up but it is also likely to be a career ender through reasons beyond his control. GJ is too smart to take a short cut like that, he will get us or another club promoted and make an unexpected success out of them for a few seasons and then when he feels he has done all he can move to a big and stable club where there is the potential to exceed the fans expectations - that is not Newcastle. I guess there are precedents set for both... look at Martin O'Neill... stepped up at Leicester from Wycombe and has continually improved to move up the ladder, successful example. John Gregory did the same and now he's hardly attractive manager material. sam Allardyce to a lesser extent, now whenever he's linked to a club the fans are in uproar, but he was a popular choice for the england job recently. Then we got that other bloke whose name escapes me who managed at palce, england u21s went on to be caretaker for full england team, then back to non-league. Managers do need to be quite strategic i agree, it can go badly wrong and they will then fall off the managerial merry-go-round Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bully Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 I guess there are precedents set for both... look at Martin O'Neill... stepped up at Leicester from Wycombe and has continually improved to move up the ladder, successful example. John Gregory did the same and now he's hardly attractive manager material. sam Allardyce to a lesser extent, now whenever he's linked to a club the fans are in uproar, but he was a popular choice for the england job recently. Then we got that other bloke whose name escapes me who managed at palce, england u21s went on to be caretaker for full england team, then back to non-league. Managers do need to be quite strategic i agree, it can go badly wrong and they will then fall off the managerial merry-go-round Without wishing to upset Eamer but it is a quiet afternoon , and accepting this is an academic discussion because it won't happen, GJ is what 52?, has been in management for donkeys years, and having managed a national team (yeah I know Latvia but..) and had success in every other division, the last targets are surely managing a Premier League side and a BIG Premier League side. If either happened and he fell out of favour after 12 months, he'd be financially set up for life with a career as a pundit for as long as he wanted it - remember, he's not in his late 30's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red23 Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Newcastle are a joke...i feel sorry for the fans oop there Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC Grim Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Why would they want Gary Johnson. We are only fourth in the league. Have a midfield that hasn't enough quality to challenge(obviously just look at last season) and wasted 2.25 Million on a player that after 4 league games, we can plainly see that isn't good enough for this level. Lets not forget that he only picks Lee because he is his son. Its laughable to even think about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozo Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 I'm sure Weale, Lee Johnson, McIndoe and Williams are all desperately hoping Gary gets the job!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Why would they want Gary Johnson. Its laughable to even think about it. Agree with this part of your reply. There are plenty of bigger names and higher profile managers out there than Johnson. There woud be a Toon rebellion if someone with no PL experience or experience of handling millionaire players got the job. It is indeed laughable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yessir Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 I'm sure Weale, Lee Johnson, McIndoe and Williams are all desperately hoping Gary gets the job!! and trundle and brooker!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yessir Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Agree with this part of your reply. There are plenty of bigger names and higher profile managers out there than Johnson. There woud be a Toon rebellion if someone with no PL experience or experience of handling millionaire players got the job. It is indeed laughable. Don't be to sure happy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheshire_red Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 and trundle and brooker!!! Now the irony of that remark is interesting. As you will have appreciated the poster you replied was intimating, no doubt tongue in cheek, that those four players would be signed up for the Toon if GJ was appointed. Your comment leads me to believe you are intimating that Brooker and Trundle are not GJs biggest fans? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangkok Red Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Eh? Keegan is anything but a chequebook coach. His one real "success" as a manager came when he took over a side struggling at the bottom of what is now the Championship and built a side out of players largely from unfashionable clubs (like Bristol City), and from abroad. At one point he even had to sell his top scorer to try and move the team forward. It was when he started spending big that things started to go wrong. Ehh?? Totally incorrect mate. Keegan is one of the ultimate cheque book coaches and has never been in a management job on a limited budget. He was bank rolled big time by Sir John Hall at Newcastle, Al Fayed at Fulham and John Wardle at Man City. Your argument falls flat if you're referring to his one "success" as being Fulham....he was only in charge there for one year and had a £3M deficit on transfers in that period. He bought his way out of the division and spent £2.3M on Barry Hayles and Geoff Horsfield alone!! He couldn't fail on that sort of budget. Apart from the massive debts he ran up at Newcastle and leaving Man C on the brink of financial meltdown, he left England on the verge of failing to qualify for the World Cup!! Keggy.......great player but vastly overrated as coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mozo Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 and trundle and brooker!!! Now the irony of that remark is interesting. As you will have appreciated the poster you replied was intimating, no doubt tongue in cheek, that those four players would be signed up for the Toon if GJ was appointed. Your comment leads me to believe you are intimating that Brooker and Trundle are not GJs biggest fans? I take it we were both joking. I'd confirm that Yessir or you'll be hounded about your comments!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Don't be to sure happy Happy? Alan Shearer must be favourite - if he'll take the job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC_Dan Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Ehh?? Totally incorrect mate. Keegan is one of the ultimate cheque book coaches and has never been in a management job on a limited budget. He was bank rolled big time by Sir John Hall at Newcastle, Al Fayed at Fulham and John Wardle at Man City. Your argument falls flat if you're referring to his one "success" as being Fulham....he was only in charge there for one year and had a £3M deficit on transfers in that period. He bought his way out of the division and spent £2.3M on Barry Hayles and Geoff Horsfield alone!! He couldn't fail on that sort of budget. Apart from the massive debts he ran up at Newcastle and leaving Man C on the brink of financial meltdown, he left England on the verge of failing to qualify for the World Cup!! Keggy.......great player but vastly overrated as coach. He may have been bankrolled at Fulham (and I have to confess I'd actually forgotten all about his time there), but in his early days at Newcastle money was extremely tight, despite Sir John Hall's involvement. In my opinion his greatest achievement was taking Newcastle from the bottom of the second division to the top of the Premier League in the matter of a couple of seasons. It was only after that that he started spending big - and that's when it all started to go wrong. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheshire_red Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Intelligent money is backing Moyes, I never bet, thats the intelligent bet...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Red Hat Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 He may have been bankrolled at Fulham (and I have to confess I'd actually forgotten all about his time there), but in his early days at Newcastle money was extremely tight, despite Sir John Hall's involvement. No it wasn't. He is most definetly a 'cheque book' manager and when he took on Fulham and Newcastle they were big fish in little ponds due to the financial clout of their respective chairmen. Great pro as a player, not a particularly good manager/coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
myol'man Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Now it's all being denied, Keegan stays... " i am the Mesiah!" glad our club is a bit more stable Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bangkok Red Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 He may have been bankrolled at Fulham (and I have to confess I'd actually forgotten all about his time there), but in his early days at Newcastle money was extremely tight, despite Sir John Hall's involvement. In my opinion his greatest achievement was taking Newcastle from the bottom of the second division to the top of the Premier League in the matter of a couple of seasons. It was only after that that he started spending big - and that's when it all started to go wrong. Sorry mate, you're suffering from a selective memory. Keegan ran up a £2M deficit in transfers within 12 months of becoming Newcastle manager. I don't consider that to be 'extremely tight'......and that's before spending another £1.75M on Andy Cole to help guarantee promotion. The simple facts are Keegan spent big to get Newcastle out of Div 2 and even bigger when they reached Div 1. . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SE23Red Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 There are plenty of bigger names True and higher profile managers out there than Johnson. Also true. And I'll be ecstatic if Premier League chairmen continue to recruit based on big name and high profile rather than proven ability and success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
parkender78 Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 Don't be to sure happy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted September 2, 2008 Report Share Posted September 2, 2008 I'll be ecstatic if Premier League chairmen continue to recruit based on big name and high profile rather than proven ability and success. And so would I, but thankfully the reality is that with 'big' clubs like Newcastle they almost always go for 'named' managers. People like George Graham, David Moyes or Souness would be in the frame. Taking a chance on a manager with no PL experience is not likely to happen. They don't have the nouse of how to deal with millioniare players who even if they never played another game would never have to work again. Motivating and getting the best from these players is a completely different ball game to managing CCC or Div 1 players who are largely motivated by money.In the PL money is no longer the be all and end all. Johnson simply doesn't have the skills (as yet) to attract that kind of job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest DanC Posted September 3, 2008 Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 Now it's all being denied, Keegan stays... " i am the Mesiah!" glad our club is a bit more stableMakes me realise how good it is that we have sensible people running our football club. I did question it during the Tinnion era but now I can happily say I was wrong. Our club is in safe hands and it's something we all take for granted really. Of course there is always going to be things fans are unhapppy about but I would rather be unhappy about a few minor things than having a clueless #### running our club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redhyde Posted September 3, 2008 Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 I don't have to justify my opinion, but to reiterate my point, I'm just baffled that such a 'successful businessman' can run a club into the ground like he has done and is doing, it makes no sense unless he's a simpleton. But if you have shed loads of money you can't be stupid right? Wrong. You said he "was too much of a tool to make his money by himself" You certainly need to justify that. I'm suggesting that a guy who by the means of private finance turned himself into a billionnaire in 25 years isn't an "incompetant retard". He didn't win the lottery, he didn't inherit his money. He built a commercial empire from scratch. Can you be stupid and rich? Absolutely, Both Richard Branson and Mike Ashley are "stupid". I suspect most people would choose their stupidity over yours. How has he run the club into the ground? How has he destroyed Newcastle? Please explain. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim S Posted September 3, 2008 Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 Happy? Alan Shearer must be favourite - if he'll take the job. And so would I, but thankfully the reality is that with 'big' clubs like Newcastle they almost always go for 'named' managers. People like George Graham, David Moyes or Souness would be in the frame. Taking a chance on a manager with no PL experience is not likely to happen. They don't have the nouse of how to deal with millioniare players who even if they never played another game would never have to work again. Motivating and getting the best from these players is a completely different ball game to managing CCC or Div 1 players who are largely motivated by money.In the PL money is no longer the be all and end all. Johnson simply doesn't have the skills (as yet) to attract that kind of job. It makes me laugh this football world thing!!! The Newcastle fans would be up in arms if Gary Johnson got the job becuase he has no Premier League experience but is probably one of the most experienced and gifted managers outside of the Premier League. However - they are happy to see a Newcastle legend in Alan Shearer with NO managerial experience at all get the job, but purely becuse he is a Newcastle Legend then he has to be the right man for the job - aparrantly!!! Well to all those Geordie fans out there I have two words for you - BRIAN TINNION !!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
I BELIEVE Posted September 3, 2008 Report Share Posted September 3, 2008 a) there is no chance in hell that Mike Ashley would offer him the job........as it wouldn't please the fans, who will want a big name b) even if offered the job, It is highly unlikely he would even consider it due the same reasons that Keegan left, which is mainly due to not being involved in Transfers, the James Milner situation was nothing short of a joke. silly thread, barely worth discussing Totally agree, why the hell would GJ want to go there? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
downendcity Posted September 4, 2008 Report Share Posted September 4, 2008 You said he "was too much of a tool to make his money by himself" You certainly need to justify that. I'm suggesting that a guy who by the means of private finance turned himself into a billionnaire in 25 years isn't an "incompetant retard". He didn't win the lottery, he didn't inherit his money. He built a commercial empire from scratch. Can you be stupid and rich? Absolutely, Both Richard Branson and Mike Ashley are "stupid". I suspect most people would choose their stupidity over yours. How has he run the club into the ground? How has he destroyed Newcastle? Please explain. Can you be stupid and rich? I think Ashley has proved he is both. I've previously read that the true extend of Newcastle's financial problems only became clear some time after Ashley had bought the club. It was only when reading some of the Newcastle fans' posts on 606 yesterday that I became aware that Ashley bought Newcastle without undertaking due diligence, i.e carrying out a full check on the clubs financial position. In the light of this, it is no surprise that the financial problems only became clear post purchase. Ashley has recently dug deep into his own pockets to clear substantial debts at the club and the knock on from this seems to have affected the clubs plans in the transfer market , i.e. Keegan hasn't been given the promised funds for new purchases, and the club have been looking to sell their player assets to help balance the books. While there is liittle doubt that Keegan's position has been undermined by the activities of Wise behind his back, I think the main cause of the current shananigans is the background financial issues. For as experienced and sucessful a business man as Ashley to buy any business, let alone a football club, without due diligence is not only amazing but has to be regarded as stupid. It's not so much what he has done, it's what he didn't do that is the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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