Rich Posted November 11, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2008 Definitely. I love to mass debate. You could be one of the biggest mass debater's this forum has ever Known. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WhistleHappy Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 erm, anyone care for a Blackjack? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingswood red Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 It would be a really carp forum if we all agreed with each other! Theres something fishy about your post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 I have never know anyone yet to stand there and say 'I know everything about football and I am always right'. Except Robinson obviously but while this rules applies the debate rages on. And a good job too. I don't remember ever posting such a comment but I'd be glad to eat some humble pie if you could prove that I did. There are several different types of posters on here. Some like to enagage in reasoned debate, others like to insult other posters for whatever purpose and others like to come over as witty and amusing and fail most of the time. I would see myself in the first catagory whereas I would see Malone in the second two catgories, but hey! thats just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingswood red Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 I don't remember ever posting such a comment but I'd be glad to eat some humble pie if you could prove that I did. There are several different types of posters on here. Some like to enagage in reasoned debate, others like to insult other posters for whatever purpose and others like to come over as witty and amusing and fail most of the time. I would see myself in the first catagory whereas I would see Malone in the second two catgories, but hey! thats just my opinion. Haven't you just, by your own words, put yourself in the second two categories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 Haven't you just, by your own words, put yourself in the second two categories. Don't think so. I wasn't being insulting nor trying to be witty. Just stating my opinion as succinctly as possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edson Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 I don't remember ever posting such a comment but I'd be glad to eat some humble pie if you could prove that I did. You do know what a sage is, right? Or do you mean you have a woody stem and greyish leaves? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Godzilla Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 But that isnt many other fans saying it. Its one fan saying that many other fans are saying it. One fan, who speaks only for himself, has said that "a huge proportion of the fans simply don't trust the manager". That is patently incorrect and makes the huger error of presuming what other fans think when nobody has actually said it. It's fairly obvious you don't trust Gary when you say: To date, all we get is Noble is "injured" (he isnt) So if, as you say, he isn't injured, there could be a million and one reasons why he hasn't been playing. I have absolutely no reason to believe he's not injured, but say you're right. Say, for example, a member of his family is critically ill and he is having trouble focussing on football. Do you expect/want Gary to come out and say that publicly? Sometimes we'd like an explanation and sometimes it's required, but according to the club Noble is injured. Why does there need to be further explanation? And even if he isn't injured, why can't you accept there may be other circumstances that have led to his absence that really shouldn't be made public? Footballers are real people, and they have to be managed. It's not always a case of 'he's good, pick him'. Like we pay the players to play, we pay the manager to manage. It's a results based business. If he makes decisions when it boils down to it, it doesn't actually matter why he makes those decisions. The only thing that matters is whether we win or lose. Most of the time, we win. So I trust him. If Noble isn't injured, then like you I'm none the wiser as to why he hasn't been playing. I agree with you that he's one of our most gifted footballers and I'd like to see him start every week. I'd like to see him, Lee Johnson and Lee Trundle start in the same team. I think they're all terrific footballers and I believe in playing your best ball players when possible. But he hasn't been playing and personally I trust Gary that there's a good reason for that. So if I am being presumptions, then I've obviously misinterpreted what trust actually is. Else our fans have a very weird way of showing it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Riaz Posted November 12, 2008 Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 But he has plenty of time to talk about us-The fans! I'd far rather he used that tinme to talk about selection,tactics etc the way GJ got the club so united and together last season was brilliant - it was the first time since I've supported the club that it had such a togetherness. I suppose GJ just wants that type of support again - and why not? its not like were near the bottom and struggling is it? He's done alot for this club and he probabaly thinks he deserves that type of support - and I'd agree with him But it really depends if your behind him and trust him 100%? do you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich Posted November 12, 2008 Author Report Share Posted November 12, 2008 the way GJ got the club so united and together last season was brilliant - it was the first time since I've supported the club that it had such a togetherness. I suppose GJ just wants that type of support again - and why not? its not like were near the bottom and struggling is it? He's done alot for this club and he probabaly thinks he deserves that type of support - and I'd agree with him But it really depends if your behind him and trust him 100%? do you? Does anyone trust someone that much? Garry is not the Messiah, like all people he makes mistakes, maybe less than others in football but to expect people to trust in his judgement blindly is expecting too much. Some people do learn a little from watching for forty years and need to be enlightened a little also. Perhaps he would get more support from his detractors if he gave the odd insight into his thinking, without giving too much away. Surely the opposition are well enough informed anyway. I'm sure the recent debating subjects have focussed some peoples attention and resulted in a more determined approach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickJ Posted November 13, 2008 Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 It's fairly obvious you don't trust Gary when you say: So if, as you say, he isn't injured, there could be a million and one reasons why he hasn't been playing. I have absolutely no reason to believe he's not injured, but say you're right. Say, for example, a member of his family is critically ill and he is having trouble focussing on football. Do you expect/want Gary to come out and say that publicly? Sometimes we'd like an explanation and sometimes it's required, but according to the club Noble is injured. Why does there need to be further explanation? And even if he isn't injured, why can't you accept there may be other circumstances that have led to his absence that really shouldn't be made public? Footballers are real people, and they have to be managed. It's not always a case of 'he's good, pick him'. Like we pay the players to play, we pay the manager to manage. It's a results based business. If he makes decisions when it boils down to it, it doesn't actually matter why he makes those decisions. The only thing that matters is whether we win or lose. Most of the time, we win. So I trust him. If Noble isn't injured, then like you I'm none the wiser as to why he hasn't been playing. I agree with you that he's one of our most gifted footballers and I'd like to see him start every week. I'd like to see him, Lee Johnson and Lee Trundle start in the same team. I think they're all terrific footballers and I believe in playing your best ball players when possible. But he hasn't been playing and personally I trust Gary that there's a good reason for that. So if I am being presumptions, then I've obviously misinterpreted what trust actually is. Else our fans have a very weird way of showing it. You've picked up on one relatively insignificant comment that I've made and used that to justify making quite a strong accusation - even though you could find plenty of other comments that I have made, on here, where I have said, quite literally, that with Johnson's track record we have to trust that he will get it right. So you have been presumptious not through misinterpretation, but by isolating one thing to make the point you want to make. I trust that the reason Noble isnt playing is a good one. If Johnson is in his right mind - which for the record, before you say otherwise, I do believe that he is - he isnt going to leave a gifted player out for no reason. But as I have said before, since we pay his wages, I think it is reasonable to request some sort of explanation. In the same way that I question why Webster is here but seemingly injury prone and/or surplus to requirements. And, for the record, do you seriously believe, for example, that McIndoe was injured the one game he didnt play this season? I don't, and if you want to interpret that as justifying a sweeping statement that I don't trust Johnson, well thats up to you. Perhaps every thread on this forum, instead of constructive criticism and healthy questioning of decisions, should simply say, we all love Gary Johnson, he is god and the messiah and everything he does is right. Would that make you feel better? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chinapig Posted November 13, 2008 Report Share Posted November 13, 2008 Very relevant column in today's Guardian. Paragraph 5 especially. http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/blog/2008/...-manchestercity Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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