Mr Mosquito Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 Paisley has obviously won more cups, having inherited a world class team from Shanks. Clough did the equivelant of taking control of Johnson's Bristol City, winning the CCC, then on to winning the prem and then the champions league consecutively....clearly a bigger achievement. You've got to remember that Liverpool FC was very much in the shadow of Everton when Shankley took Liverpool over - and they were a second division club. Liverpool could so easily have fallen apart after Shankley - as many clubs do when they lose a great manager. Something different and new happened at Liverpool when Paisley took over from Shankley....they got better, much better and became world class and world famous rather like Man U did under Matt Busby. No disrespect to Brian Clough but Bob Paisley was easily the better manager in my opinion and Bob Paisley was 100% loyal to Liverpool FC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garlicbread Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 You've got to remember that Liverpool FC was very much in the shadow of Everton when Shankley took Liverpool over - and they were a second division club. Liverpool could so easily have fallen apart after Shankley - as many clubs do when they lose a great manager. Something different and new happened at Liverpool when Paisley took over from Shankley....they got better, much better and became world class and world famous rather like Man U did under Matt Busby. No disrespect to Brian Clough but Bob Paisley was easily the better manager in my opinion and Bob Paisley was 100% loyal to Liverpool FC. Oh dear, it's clear that you are trying desperately to stick to your guns, which is commendable. But to take a crap team in a lower division to the league one championship then two european cups (back to back) is way more of an achievement than inheriting a world class team (that has won plenty already)....don't get me wrong, Paisley is probably the best Manager ever...but Clough has achieved more (because of the level he took ovr Forest AND Derby) I'm sure that if Clough had done it with BCFC and not Forest, you would agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Mosquito Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 Oh dear, it's clear that you are trying desperately to stick to your guns, which is commendable. But to take a crap team in a lower division to the league one championship then two european cups (back to back) is way more of an achievement than inheriting a world class team (that has won plenty already)....don't get me wrong, Paisley is probably the best Manager ever...but Clough has achieved more (because of the level he took ovr Forest AND Derby) I'm sure that if Clough had done it with BCFC and not Forest, you would agree. Liverpool hadn't actually won that much under Shankly and they definately were not world class but he certainly planted the seeds of future success. Shankly also won the FA Cup 2 times more than Clough or Paisley did ..... 1962 Second Division champions 1964 First Division champions 1965 FA Cup Winners, European Champions' Cup semi-finalists. 1966 First Division champions, European Cup Winners Cup beaten finalists. 1969 First Division runners-up. 1971 FA Cup beaten finalists, Inter-Cities Fairs Cup semi-finalists. 1973 First Division champions, UEFA Cup winners. 1974 FA Cup winners, First Division runners-up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Red Ferret Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 I think what Garlicbread is saying is its not down to how many trophys each manager won It's down to the size of the club and the limitations/circumstances each manager had to work with when they took over Basing it on that, I would agree that Clough is the better manager. Even though Forest didn't win as many trophys as Liverpool, the fact that they did is what makes the achievement so great Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Mosquito Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 I think what Garlicbread is saying is its not down to how many trophys each manager won It's down to the size of the club and the limitations/circumstances each manager had to work with when they took over Basing it on that, I would agree that Clough is the better manager. Even though Forest didn't win as many trophys as Liverpool, the fact that they did is what makes the achievement so great Garlicbread is right. However, the point I'm trying to make is that Bob Paisley was the Brian Clough and Peter Taylor Forest partnership's greatest rival. If you gave me the choice of a Brian Clough and Peter Taylor partnership or Bob Paisley to manage City, I'd choose the quiet and unassuming Bob Paisley. It's just such a great shame that all the greatest English managerial names are no longer with us. Don Revie, Clough and Taylor, Bob Paisley were all around in my lifetime and I saw all their teams play Bristol City FC. I'm pretty sure that Scotsman Shankly's Liverpool played us in the FA Cup in 1974 - after we beat Leeds - but I missed that game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garlicbread Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 Garlicbread is right. However, the point I'm trying to make is that Bob Paisley was the Brian Clough and Peter Taylor Forest partnership's greatest rival. If you gave me the choice of a Brian Clough and Peter Taylor partnership or Bob Paisley to manage City, I'd choose the quiet and unassuming Bob Paisley. It's just such a great shame that all the greatest English managerial names are no longer with us. Don Revie, Clough and Taylor, Bob Paisley were all around in my lifetime and I saw all their teams play Bristol City FC. I'm pretty sure that Scotsman Shankly's Liverpool played us in the FA Cup in 1974 - after we beat Leeds - but I missed that game. Mate, you would rather have Paisley drop down a league and manage at this level, rather than go for someone who has won the english title twice and 2 European cups with teams at his level? Are you sure? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Mosquito Posted March 27, 2009 Report Share Posted March 27, 2009 Mate, you would rather have Paisley drop down a league and manage at this level, rather than go for someone who has won the english title twice and 2 European cups with teams at his level? Are you sure? Don't forget that it was Bob Paisley that helped Shankly get Liverpool from the bottom of Div 2 in the early 1960's. You wont find many managers more loyal and more gifted than Bob Paisley was. The major flaw with Brian Clough - that would concern me most - was his ability to fall out with people - not just rivals/bosses - but the way he fell out with Peter Taylor over a football transfer and didn't speak to him ever again apparently. Brian Clough just seemed to be too explosive a character, so if I was the lucky BCFC Chairman with the choice I'd appoint Bob Paisley. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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