Luke_Ciderhead Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 http://mirkobolesan.wordpress.com/2010/01/...nd-of-a-decade/ Some very interesting statistics here, it takes into account all league matches played in the noughties. Over the last decade, only the big four and Reading have won more games than we have!! And in terms of points average, we are 6th in the entire football league! The gas are waaaay down there in 80th position with 51 less wins than us, and 50 more defeats. Without trying to play devils advocate it really raises the question as to whether we have become accustomed to winning games, and thus raised expectations dramatically.... U REDS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 I think that just tells us we're one of the biggest underachievers having spent so long around the top of league one winning games without promotion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke_Ciderhead Posted January 6, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 I think that just tells us we're one of the biggest underachievers having spent so long around the top of league one winning games without promotion. Thats a very negative spin on that data. Remember that a quarter of those statistics are from our time in the Championship, and we've had some pretty rotton seasons in League 1 too (the Pulis season and the two in between the playoff final and our promotion year) What it shows is that we've won more games than anybody else in the football league bar the big four and Reading, and thus our supporters have become more accustomed to the feeling of victory (at whatever level) than virtually every other club... So in context, we've been spoilt over the last decade really...perhaps these expectation levels are having an impact on our current dissatisfaction.? Just raising the question like, as imho it makes interesting reading... AND its something to be proud of!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chaplain Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 http://mirkobolesan.wordpress.com/2010/01/...nd-of-a-decade/ Some very interesting statistics here, it takes into account all league matches played in the noughties. Over the last decade, only the big four and Reading have won more games than we have!! And in terms of points average, we are 6th in the entire football league! Without trying to play devils advocate it really raises the question as to whether we have become accustomed to winning games, and thus raised expectations dramatically.... Statistics based on historical data mean very little in football. The stats show that Forest won the European Cup twice and Leeds reached the semi-final just a few seasons ago. Its this season that matters. Try updating the stats to this season only. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fka dagest Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Statistics based on historical data mean very little in football. The stats show that Forest won the European Cup twice and Leeds reached the semi-final just a few seasons ago. Its this season that matters. Try updating the stats to this season only. Forest winning the European Cup doesn't matter? A club exisiting today is also a product of many decades' existence. I'd have said a club's history and its attached identity and customs counts for a lot. At least it does for me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Ian M Posted January 6, 2010 Admin Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Statistics based on historical data mean very little in football. The stats show that Forest won the European Cup twice and Leeds reached the semi-final just a few seasons ago. Its this season that matters. Try updating the stats to this season only. It depends what you'd like the historical data to explain. The stats you mention go some way to explaining the expectation levels of the fans at the 2 clubs you brought up. SCR's stats go some way to showing that over the last 10 years we have become accustomed to winning games and that our current spell where we draw a lot is disappointing in that context whilst at the same time gives way to a "reasonable" record if you take this season in isolation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Thats a very negative spin on that data. Remember that a quarter of those statistics are from our time in the Championship, and we've had some pretty rotton seasons in League 1 too (the Pulis season and the two in between the playoff final and our promotion year) What it shows is that we've won more games than anybody else in the football league bar the big four and Reading, and thus our supporters have become more accustomed to the feeling of victory (at whatever level) than virtually every other club... So in context, we've been spoilt over the last decade really...perhaps these expectation levels are having an impact on our current dissatisfaction.? Just raising the question like, as imho it makes interesting reading... AND its something to be proud of!!!!! It's not negative and it's not a spin, it's a fact. Your conclusion that we have become spoiled by watching us win in league one is bollards in my opinion. We are an average championship side and that is fine result wise, nobody is complaining about our league position. The concern is the obvious flaws in the squad remaining unaddressed and the boring long ball football resultant from having no width. Whether or not we spent four years under Danny Wilson winning games without success has absolutely no bearing on that view. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke_Ciderhead Posted January 6, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 . SCR's stats go some way to showing that over the last 10 years we have become accustomed to winning games and that our current spell where we draw a lot is disappointing in that context whilst at the same time gives way to a "reasonable" record if you take this season in isolation. Yep thats exactly the point I was trying to make. Im glad some people can see this without instantly trying to dismiss any scrap of positivity! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Im glad some people can see this without instantly trying to dismiss any scrap of positivity! How can anyone be positive when we've been subjected to the most dull and unexciting 'football' for the last one and half seasons? Its been crap to watch and led us to mid table last season and looks like doing the same this season. I don't have higher win expectations because of our history of wins in the last decade. All I and many other fans want is decent football from the team we support this season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Yep thats exactly the point I was trying to make. Im glad some people can see this without instantly trying to dismiss any scrap of positivity! What's positive about suggesting the fans are spoilt? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admin Ian M Posted January 6, 2010 Admin Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 How can anyone be positive when we've been subjected to the most dull and unexciting 'football' for the last one and half seasons? Its been crap to watch and led us to mid table last season and looks like doing the same this season. I don't have higher win expectations because of our history of wins in the last decade. All I and many other fans want is decent football from the team we support this season. So it only matters what went on before this season if it's painting a negative picture? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Chaplain Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Statistics based on historical data mean very little in football. The stats show that Forest won the European Cup twice and Leeds reached the semi-final just a few seasons ago. Its this season that matters. Try updating the stats to this season only. Taking this season alone I thnk you'll find we are 32nd of the 92 league clubs, considerably higher than our historic average I'd guess. As for history meaning little, I beg to differ, the reason why Forest and Derby, and Leeds for that matter, play in front of bigger crowds than us are capable of attracting higher revenue than us and therefore, according to most, are more likely than us to get to the Premier League over the next few years, despite being smaller cities, is precisely because they have a legacy of footballing success. When comments are made on here to the effect that ...we should be easily beating the likes of Reading, Ipswich and Watford... I often wonder on what basis. We're an under-supported club from a big city who have achieved very little. Thankfully the current regime is seeking to build something for the future here which may provide that sort of heritage for coming generations Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 So it only matters what went on before this season if it's painting a negative picture? I don't quite get that. Care to re-phrase? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke_Ciderhead Posted January 6, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 I don't quite get that. Care to re-phrase? I guess he means that in your earlier post, you said that anything that happened before this season is irrelevant... yet when mentioning the dull negative football, you mentioned our mid table finish of last year. That would be my guess anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC_Dan Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 How can anyone be positive when we've been subjected to the most dull and unexciting 'football' for the last one and half seasons? Its been crap to watch and led us to mid table last season and looks like doing the same this season. I don't have higher win expectations because of our history of wins in the last decade. All I and many other fans want is decent football from the team we support this season. I thought the team played very well against Watford. Not so well against Reading I admit, but I was more than satisfied with the Watford performance and I would hope that was indicative of an upturn in form from the low water mark of Reading. Watching the forward players, particularly Maynard and Haynes was excellent. Maynard's close control is quite brilliant and it's a world apart from some of the rubbish we've seen over the years. I think there's the nucleus of a successful and exciting side being put together at Bristol City. I'm pleased with the club's performance over the past few seasons and I'm very hopeful of more to come. There you go: positivity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 I guess he means that in your earlier post, you said that anything that happened before this season is irrelevant... yet when mentioning the dull negative football, you mentioned our mid table finish of last year. That would be my guess anyway. Ok. So I'll just concentrate on this season's dull and unexciting football. The fact that we'we were exposed to exactly the same dire stuff last season as well is irrelevent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 I thought the team played very well against Watford. Not so well against Reading I admit, but I was more than satisfied with the Watford performance and I would hope that was indicative of an upturn in form from the low water mark of Reading. Watching the forward players, particularly Maynard and Haynes was excellent. Maynard's close control is quite brilliant and it's a world apart from some of the rubbish we've seen over the years. I think there's the nucleus of a successful and exciting side being put together at Bristol City. I'm pleased with the club's performance over the past few seasons and I'm very hopeful of more to come. There you go: positivity. I thought the performance against Watford was better despite the result and said so at the time but I can't get carried away over one game. City were excellent against QPR early in the season for 45 mins but that didn't carry on into subsequent games. I'm not holding my breath that City will put in further attacking desplays in upcoming fixtures. Its not possible to change the habit of 70 odd games overnight. I agree that there is a nucleus of an attacking side at AG. All we need is a change of mindset from Johnson to see what this squad is capable of of. I'm not sure is this post is positive or not...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Do people on here not do away games? Played very well at Leicester and at QPR. I also can't remember a season this decade where we've scored such an array of spectaculor goals, with only half the season gone. I admit we've produced some dirge in recent weeks, like Ipswich and Reading at home but even the Sheff U game despite the rare home loss was a highly entertaining game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robbored Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 I also can't remember a season this decade where we've scored such an array of spectaculor goals, with only half the season gone. Scoring spectacular goals highlights how few chances City create, If it wasn't for Maynards superb goals City would definately be struggling. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cheese Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Scoring spectacular goals highlights how few chances City create, If it wasn't for Maynards superb goals City would definately be struggling. If it wasn't for last minute goals we'd be second. He's part of the team - scoring goals is part of his job. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tom Fleuriot Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 To return to the original post, I think it's a really interesting statistic and the conclusion has a lot of merit. The idea from Robbored and Nibor that their expectations and interpretations are not in any way coloured by history and is a truly objective interpretation is a little silly. This doesn't mean that we're amazing at the moment, it just means that when we're not winning fans will find it more frustrating and unacceptable than a team that is used to losing and grinding out draws / wins etc. A perfectly sensible post in danger of being hijacked by people who just want to whinge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rudolf Hucker Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 If it wasn't for Maynards superb goals City would definately be struggling. ... and if my Aunt had a dick she'd be my Uncle. Yes, City may be struggling in the league had it not been for Maynard's spectacular goals but I fail to see the point you are trying to make. Maynard was signed by GJ to score goals and he does exactly that and as a result, we aren't struggling. Whether scored from 30 yards or 3 yards they all count the same. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kid in the Riot Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Scoring spectacular goals highlights how few chances City create, If it wasn't for Maynards superb goals City would definately be struggling. Agree to an extent but Maynard needs to add 'tap ins' to his game. Some may say he doesn't get enough quality chances, I've still seen him miss an awful lot of 'easy' chances in a City shirt particularly last season. As of a couple of weeks ago I believe he was the player with most amounts of shots in the C'ship. Not all from outside the area are they? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laner Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Ok. So I'll just concentrate on this season's dull and unexciting football. The fact that we'we were exposed to exactly the same dire stuff last season as well is irrelevent. This does raise some interesting questions then - albeit slightly off topic from the original post. If City were playing a nice, 'attractive' passing game but still getting beaten, would we all be happy? Aren't results the bottom-line for any club - however unattractively they are gained? If we'd experienced exactly the same start to the season as we have BUT played really nice-looking football what would people's thoughts be? IMO they'd be the same as they are now and I'll go one further by suggesting that we'd all be discussing how performances aren't winning us games. And that maybe during this transfer window we should be bringing in players to 'mix-things up a bit' and add a 'bit of bite' to the pitch - all attributes that don't tend to lend themselves to 'attractive' football. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCFC_Dan Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 I'm not sure it's an attractive passing game people want so much as an attacking one with plenty of goalmouth action. I don't think there would be so many complaints about long ball football if City were endlessly hoofing balls into the box and it was working. The objection as I see it is to aimless passing, the inability to keep possession of the ball for longer than a few seconds at a time and a lack of closing down and pushing out of the box when the ball has been cleared. That's not down to tactics, it's down to players not performing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nibor Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 To return to the original post, I think it's a really interesting statistic and the conclusion has a lot of merit. The idea from Robbored and Nibor that their expectations and interpretations are not in any way coloured by history and is a truly objective interpretation is a little silly. Absolute rubbish. I haven't suggested my expectations or interpretations are objective, by definition they cannot be. My concerns on our lack of width, poor entertainment value, and unbalanced squad (NOT results) have nothing whatsoever to do with the results we have had on average over the last 10 years. They just aren't related, and the suggestion that people are complaining because they're spoilt is utter twaddle and undermines some valid points about the current state of our football club. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grifty Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 So hang on, Theres a bit of data which shows we are the 6th 'best' team in england over the last 10 years and people still manage to moan about our current formation and footballing negativity... Only on OTIB! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke_Ciderhead Posted January 6, 2010 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 My concerns on our lack of width, poor entertainment value, and unbalanced squad (NOT results) have nothing whatsoever to do with the results we have had on average over the last 10 years. So if it has nothing whatsoever to do with it, then why post it in a thread dedicated to it?? I posted this thread to highlight the great job we've done over the last ten years to have won more games than just about every other football league club.., and to suggest whether it has perhaps raised expectation levels... but instead its turned into a thread about the style of football we're playing, with most people whining and whinging. This is why I hardly ever post on OTIB to honest...and if I wasnt snowed in, I doubt I would have today! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Martyn Hocking Posted January 6, 2010 Report Share Posted January 6, 2010 Shame on you for exposing the fact that we have won more games than any other team in the English game outside the Big Four plus Reading! Don't you realise that this forum is for people who claim to support BCFC but spend their lives rubbishing the club at every opportunity??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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