Punching Above Our Weight

[spudski]

I've been reading this forum for over a year now and felt compelled to sign up and vent my frustrations.

I've been following City for over 30 years,and even through the bad times of the 4th Division, I have never known such animosity, and lack of support for the Club, as we have at the present time. It amazes me.

The worst thing that has happened to this Club in recent times, was reaching the Play off Final two seasons ago.

That one achievement, has made fans of this Club delusional. If we had finished above the relegation zone in that first season, people would have been happy. In our second season, to finish mid table was also an achievement. To be mid table now, is also an achievement.

Bristol City fans, need to realise...WE ARE NOT A BIG CLUB. It's easy to fall into the 'Bubble' of thinking we are. Living in Bristol and reading and listening to the local media, can make you think we are the Man Utd of the South West.

After living in Bristol all my life, i have recently had to move away. It's been a Godsend in many ways, because i have realised what a small fish Bristol City are, in the big ocean of the Football League.

When i look at all the 'Big' clubs in our league struggling, and the likes of Leeds, Charlton, Norwich and Southampton below us, then i realise how lucky we are. Please enjoy it for what it is.

Yes, we may not be playing attractive football at the moment. And yes, we may all question GJ's motives, actions and tactics.

But, imo, all this negative energy around the Club, is only going to destroy everything that has been achieved in the last 5 years.

We all have a right to moan and have our own opinions. But sometimes i do wonder whether all the footballing brain cells in Bristol have been destroyed by Natch.

Have you ever wondered, apart from 76-81, why Bristol City have always been a mediocre football team? We've had different, Directors,Managers,Trainers and playing staff all through all our years of existence. Yet for a Club that comes from a City the size of Bristol, we have definately under achieved. Perhaps, we should all take a long hard look at ourselves. And realise we are Supporters who moan a bloody lot and have no right to, considering our poor history. If fans attitudes changed, to being more positive, then i'm sure this Club will keep progressing.

See us for what we are, and get behind the lads, management and Directors.

Flack jacket on...

[Mr Mosquito]

When i look at all the 'Big' clubs in our league struggling, and the likes of Leeds, Charlton, Norwich and Southampton below us, then i realise how lucky we are. Please enjoy it for what it is.

We were once a big club and now we're punching below our weight not above our weight. 1906-11 was our best period not 1976-81, have you really supported this club for 30 years ???

[BCFC_Dan]

We were once a big club and now we're punching below our weight not above our weight. 1906-11 was our best period not 1976-81, have you really supported this club for 30 years ???

I don't think you can really look that far back and say it has much of a bearing on the state of affairs now.

City has never really never a big club, and that first period of success was achieved in a league with many fewer teams in it, and virtually none of them from the South.

I'm a positive person and I like to think it's not impossible for City to one day compete for silverware at the top of the league but even the most ardent optimist has to say that it's unlikely and that City are probably about where they "belong" at the moment.

[Nogbad the Bad]

I've been reading this forum for over a year now and felt compelled to sign up and vent my frustrations.

I've been following City for over 30 years,and even through the bad times of the 4th Division, I have never known such animosity, and lack of support for the Club, as we have at the present time. It amazes me.

The worst thing that has happened to this Club in recent times, was reaching the Play off Final two seasons ago.

That one achievement, has made fans of this Club delusional. If we had finished above the relegation zone in that first season, people would have been happy. In our second season, to finish mid table was also an achievement. To be mid table now, is also an achievement.

Bristol City fans, need to realise...WE ARE NOT A BIG CLUB. It's easy to fall into the 'Bubble' of thinking we are. Living in Bristol and reading and listening to the local media, can make you think we are the Man Utd of the South West.

After living in Bristol all my life, i have recently had to move away. It's been a Godsend in many ways, because i have realised what a small fish Bristol City are, in the big ocean of the Football League.

When i look at all the 'Big' clubs in our league struggling, and the likes of Leeds, Charlton, Norwich and Southampton below us, then i realise how lucky we are. Please enjoy it for what it is.

Yes, we may not be playing attractive football at the moment. And yes, we may all question GJ's motives, actions and tactics.

But, imo, all this negative energy around the Club, is only going to destroy everything that has been achieved in the last 5 years.

We all have a right to moan and have our own opinions. But sometimes i do wonder whether all the footballing brain cells in Bristol have been destroyed by Natch.

Have you ever wondered, apart from 76-81, why Bristol City have always been a mediocre football team? We've had different, Directors,Managers,Trainers and playing staff all through all our years of existence. Yet for a Club that comes from a City the size of Bristol, we have definately under achieved. Perhaps, we should all take a long hard look at ourselves. And realise we are Supporters who moan a bloody lot and have no right to, considering our poor history. If fans attitudes changed, to being more positive, then i'm sure this Club will keep progressing.

See us for what we are, and get behind the lads, management and Directors.

Flack jacket on...

Bristol City fans are certainly no worse than others, in fact more patient than many considering so many years of disappointment.

The fans' attitude only changed from being positive when watching City became hard work.

[Mr Mosquito]

I don't think you can really look that far back and say it has much of a bearing on the state of affairs now.

City has never really never a big club, and that first period of success was achieved in a league with many fewer teams in it, and virtually none of them from the South.

I'm a positive person and I like to think it's not impossible for City to one day compete for silverware at the top of the league but even the most ardent optimist has to say that it's unlikely and that City are probably about where they "belong" at the moment.

I reckon we've been living under a jinx since the first world war. We were once the only Southern Club that could properly compete with the mighty Midlands and Northern clubs prior to that war. Our record was better than that of Arsenal at that time.

[Redcliffe 78]

We were once a big club and now we're punching below our weight not above our weight. 1906-11 was our best period not 1976-81, have you really supported this club for 30 years ???

We have never been a big club we've been in one Fa Cup final and in the top flight once so how you can say were punching below our weight is a total joke, before you criticise other people you should get your own facts right.

[Mr Mosquito]

We have never been a big club we've been in one Fa Cup final and in the top flight once so how you can say were punching below our weight is a total joke, before you criticise other people you should get your own facts right.

Writing of facts - we've been in the top flight twice and that's a fact.

1906-11

1976-80

.....two periods - fact.

[Nibor]

We have never been a big club we've been in one Fa Cup final and in the top flight once so how you can say were punching below our weight is a total joke, before you criticise other people you should get your own facts right.

Twice.

[redcityman]

We have never been a big club we've been in one Fa Cup final and in the top flight once so how you can say were punching below our weight is a total joke, before you criticise other people you should get your own facts right.

You sure about that!

Might have been a bit before my time but i'm sure we were league runners up 1907, also i'm sure we were competing at top level when we beat Arsenal in 1976 at Highbury.

Dont see us as a big club, but I certainly dont see us as punching above our weight.

[Mr Mosquito]

You sure about that!

Might have been a bit before my time but i'm sure we were league runners up 1907, also i'm sure we were competing at top level when we beat Arsenal in 1976 at Highbury.

Dont see us as a big club, but I certainly dont see us as punching above our weight.

At one point during our first period in the top flight 1906-11 we had 3 of our players in the England national side - we were a top club. One of those players was Billy Wedlock.

[spudski]

Nogbag Quoted 'Bristol City fans are certainly no worse than others, in fact more patient than many considering so many years of disappointment.

The fans' attitude only changed from being positive when watching City became hard work.'

Imo i feel Bristol City fans moan a great deal more than others, considering our History.

We have a typical 'sing when you're winning' attitude at this club. When the times are good, we are well supported, but when things go slightly off kilter we moan like there's no tomorrow.

There seems to be no perspective.

This Club as it stands, under Steve Lansdown, is the healthiest it has been, ever.

The point i was trying to make, was that, negativity at this time of the season can only destroy the Club.

We can all disagree with managers and their methods, but by doing it so openly, it is only having a negative effect on all of the Club.

The pressure gets hold, and players can't play with freedom. Regardless of who the manager is and their tactics.

Do fans really believe that bringing in a New manager now,at this stage of the season, and the upheaval that comes with that, will benefit the Club this season?

A positive energy can only help us forward in this difficult period.

And yes, I have been a Supporter of this Club since 1971. You cannot compare 1908 and the league structure back then with 1976.

I was also at the defeat to Cardiff. And from what i saw, made me think, all this Club needs is some positive support to lift our poor lads.

There was a time, when we went behind, that Ashton Gate in Unison, would sing 'C'mon u reds' in loud encouragement.

We have a talented bunch of lads in our squad. If we get behind them 100% i'm sure they will turn things around.

If we give 100% support, then the Club, if they fail, can never turn around and blame us. At the momment i put a lot of our performances down to negativity brought about by the 'feel' of our support. It can only be destructive.

I'm trying to be positive and only want the best for our club.

I hope that's how people read my post and don't see me as some happy clapper, which i'm not.

[CotswoldRed]

Given the settled nature of the club, insofar as having a long-term manager and chairman, coupled with the large amount spent on wages I think an 'objective' expectation would be for a top 8 finish (look at the clubs outgoings on salaries).

So you might argue we are almost punching where we should be.

[Yate Red]

I've been reading this forum for over a year now and felt compelled to sign up and vent my frustrations.

I've been following City for over 30 years,and even through the bad times of the 4th Division, I have never known such animosity, and lack of support for the Club, as we have at the present time. It amazes me.

The worst thing that has happened to this Club in recent times, was reaching the Play off Final two seasons ago.

That one achievement, has made fans of this Club delusional. If we had finished above the relegation zone in that first season, people would have been happy. In our second season, to finish mid table was also an achievement. To be mid table now, is also an achievement.

Bristol City fans, need to realise...WE ARE NOT A BIG CLUB. It's easy to fall into the 'Bubble' of thinking we are. Living in Bristol and reading and listening to the local media, can make you think we are the Man Utd of the South West.

After living in Bristol all my life, i have recently had to move away. It's been a Godsend in many ways, because i have realised what a small fish Bristol City are, in the big ocean of the Football League.

When i look at all the 'Big' clubs in our league struggling, and the likes of Leeds, Charlton, Norwich and Southampton below us, then i realise how lucky we are. Please enjoy it for what it is.

Yes, we may not be playing attractive football at the moment. And yes, we may all question GJ's motives, actions and tactics.

But, imo, all this negative energy around the Club, is only going to destroy everything that has been achieved in the last 5 years.

We all have a right to moan and have our own opinions. But sometimes i do wonder whether all the footballing brain cells in Bristol have been destroyed by Natch.

Have you ever wondered, apart from 76-81, why Bristol City have always been a mediocre football team? We've had different, Directors,Managers,Trainers and playing staff all through all our years of existence. Yet for a Club that comes from a City the size of Bristol, we have definately under achieved. Perhaps, we should all take a long hard look at ourselves. And realise we are Supporters who moan a bloody lot and have no right to, considering our poor history. If fans attitudes changed, to being more positive, then i'm sure this Club will keep progressing.

See us for what we are, and get behind the lads, management and Directors.

Flack jacket on...

SPOT ON POST!!!

And to go back in time to 1906 seems a little strange to try and prove a point!! I think if you look at that league table a couple of the clubs fail to exist anymore? I may be wrong!

We also missed out on the title during this poeriod to Newcastle due a terrible run in and losing three games on the trot one of which was to Newcastle who won the tile!!

Things never change!!!

[Nogbad the Bad]

Nogbag Quoted 'Bristol City fans are certainly no worse than others, in fact more patient than many considering so many years of disappointment.

The fans' attitude only changed from being positive when watching City became hard work.'

Imo i feel Bristol City fans moan a great deal more than others, considering our History.

We have a typical 'sing when you're winning' attitude at this club. When the times are good, we are well supported, but when things go slightly off kilter we moan like there's no tomorrow.

There seems to be no perspective.

This Club as it stands, under Steve Lansdown, is the healthiest it has been, ever.

The point i was trying to make, was that, negativity at this time of the season can only destroy the Club.

We can all disagree with managers and their methods, but by doing it so openly, it is only having a negative effect on all of the Club.

The pressure gets hold, and players can't play with freedom. Regardless of who the manager is and their tactics.

Do fans really believe that bringing in a New manager now,at this stage of the season, and the upheaval that comes with that, will benefit the Club this season?

A positive energy can only help us forward in this difficult period.

And yes, I have been a Supporter of this Club since 1971. You cannot compare 1908 and the league structure back then with 1976.

I was also at the defeat to Cardiff. And from what i saw, made me think, all this Club needs is some positive support to lift our poor lads.

There was a time, when we went behind, that Ashton Gate in Unison, would sing 'C'mon u reds' in loud encouragement.

We have a talented bunch of lads in our squad. If we get behind them 100% i'm sure they will turn things around.

If we give 100% support, then the Club, if they fail, can never turn around and blame us. At the momment i put a lot of our performances down to negativity brought about by the 'feel' of our support. It can only be destructive.

I'm trying to be positive and only want the best for our club.

I hope that's how people read my post and don't see me as some happy clapper, which i'm not.

spudski, the fans were positive enough at the start on Saturday, unfortunately nothing of note happened in the first half. It was tedious in the extreme.

We then managed to go behind immediately the second half started and, although there were shouts of encouragement, an air of depression settled on Ashton Gate. Not moaning, the fans en masse were fed up.

I really object to this theory that BCFC supporters are somehow bigger moaners than fans of other clubs.

I've followed City at well over 60 opposition grounds and I can absolutely assure you that it is not the case.

We've got plenty of damn good supporters at AG but they do need something to get behind.

The fact is there has been far too little on offer on the pitch for far too long and it has gradually ground down the enthusiasm of the fans.

[SimplyRed]

Yes, we may not be playing attractive football at the moment. And yes, we may all question GJ's motives, actions and tactics.

But, imo, all this negative energy around the Club, is only going to destroy everything that has been achieved in the last 5 years.

We all have a right to moan and have our own opinions. But sometimes i do wonder whether all the footballing brain cells in Bristol have been destroyed by Natch.

Have you ever wondered, apart from 76-81, why Bristol City have always been a mediocre football team? We've had different, Directors,Managers,Trainers and playing staff all through all our years of existence. Yet for a Club that comes from a City the size of Bristol, we have definately under achieved. Perhaps, we should all take a long hard look at ourselves. And realise we are Supporters who moan a bloody lot and have no right to, considering our poor history. If fans attitudes changed, to being more positive, then i'm sure this Club will keep progressing.

See us for what we are, and get behind the lads, management and Directors.

Flack jacket on...

Another one of those fans who thinks we should be grateful for what we get. Patronising claptrap.

Well I'm sorry, but I think ALL supporters, the club and the club's employees and playing staff should be aspiring to be the best we can be, not simply accepting it as "our lot and be grateful for it".

Supporters and fans "moan" (I prefer "criticise") because they desperately want the club to be successful and get frustrated by what they see as things not being done correctly within the club.

For all the diatribe that is constantly wheeled out about the knowledge and experience of the incumbent club management, in general most supporters and fans ARE NOT STUPID, and can see when something is wrong and not working.

Here's another cliche for you - when the incumbent club management are long gone, the fans will still be here.

It is the fans, and the fans alone, that drive the club forward by demanding of the management, a standard of play that brings success.

[Redcliffe 78]

Writing of facts - we've been in the top flight twice and that's a fact.

1906-11

1976-80

.....two periods - fact.

Maybe i should get my facts right before i criticise other people - fact. Of course City were in the top flight twice the first being in the period when they lost 1-0 to Man U at Crystal Palace in the FA Cup final.

[Chappers]

I've also been around a long time. I think the biggest problem has just been the dire football at AG, it really has been bad and totally devoid of entertainment. I think expectations were too high pre-season. We spent a lot of money, but the spending was badly-targetted. SIX central midfielders, all much of a muchness, but only one wide player. The transfer window activity was totally baffling, and for me, might well be Johnsons 'Shark Moment'.

Looking at the fixtures, it is going to be hard to scrape the 50 or so points for safety, and if this means a few games where we grind out tedious draws away, that will do. We might have to do the same at home to WBA, Newcastle and Forest. For me, the biggest risk of all is that we all carry on believing that we can still make the play-offs, the League remains very tight, and we get sucked into a relegation fight almost un-noticed. Bit negative, but we have some horrible fixtures coming up and could easily get 5 or less points from the next 5 games.

[Yate Red]

I've also been around a long time. I think the biggest problem has just been the dire football at AG, it really has been bad and totally devoid of entertainment. I think expectations were too high pre-season. We spent a lot of money, but the spending was badly-targetted. SIX central midfielders, all much of a muchness, but only one wide player. The transfer window activity was totally baffling, and for me, might well be Johnsons 'Shark Moment'.

Looking at the fixtures, it is going to be hard to scrape the 50 or so points for safety, and if this means a few games where we grind out tedious draws away, that will do. We might have to do the same at home to WBA, Newcastle and Forest. For me, the biggest risk of all is that we all carry on believing that we can still make the play-offs, the League remains very tight, and we get sucked into a relegation fight almost un-noticed. Bit negative, but we have some horrible fixtures coming up and could easily get 5 or less points from the next 5 games.

But if you look at the transfer window as a whole not much moement went on relly. Alot of loan singing etc. But what none of us know is who we TRIED to get and which targets didn't want to come to us or the finances were not in place?

I don't think we have spent big as you put it? Maynard was a big buy, but I think he was and will be worth the money. The other came in the form of frees and undisclosed fees. So was it big?

[spudski]

Another one of those fans who thinks we should be grateful for what we get. Patronising claptrap.

Well I'm sorry, but I think ALL supporters, the club and the club's employees and playing staff should be aspiring to be the best we can be, not simply accepting it as "our lot and be grateful for it".

Supporters and fans "moan" (I prefer "criticise") because they desperately want the club to be successful and get frustrated by what they see as things not being done correctly within the club.

For all the diatribe that is constantly wheeled out about the knowledge and experience of the incumbent club management, in general most supporters and fans ARE NOT STUPID, and can see when something is wrong and not working.

Here's another cliche for you - when the incumbent club management are long gone, the fans will still be here.

It is the fans, and the fans alone, that drive the club forward by demanding of the management, a standard of play that brings success.

So you think moaning and critising the Club, players and management at this stage of the season will help matters?

Obviously things are not going to plan down at the Gate. But, when did throwing toys out of the pram, and venting frustrations in such negative manners win any football matches.

Steve Lansdown, knows what's going on. Making a knee jerk reaction can only hinder proceedings.

However much supporters dislike what is happening at our Club right now, booing, abusing the players and management isn't going to help win games.

Yes it's hard to be positive when the going gets tough, and we all want to vent our frustrations. But what good can it do 'AT THIS STAGE OF THE SEASON'?

You are right...most Supporters are not stupid. But they are stupid if they think Steve Lansdown and his management team aren't working behind the scenes to correct matters.They have everything to lose and not a lot to gain, at this momment in time. Whether GJ is the right man to take us forward is another matter.

The point being...Bringing in another manager now, at this present momment will not help matters.

So whether your for or against GJ...it doesn't matter. The lads need a lift.

Get behind the Club. If they Screw it up, then they can't blame us.

[Guest david wka]

I've been reading this forum for over a year now and felt compelled to sign up and vent my frustrations.

I've been following City for over 30 years,and even through the bad times of the 4th Division, I have never known such animosity, and lack of support for the Club, as we have at the present time. It amazes me.

The worst thing that has happened to this Club in recent times, was reaching the Play off Final two seasons ago.

That one achievement, has made fans of this Club delusional. If we had finished above the relegation zone in that first season, people would have been happy. In our second season, to finish mid table was also an achievement. To be mid table now, is also an achievement.

Bristol City fans, need to realise...WE ARE NOT A BIG CLUB. It's easy to fall into the 'Bubble' of thinking we are. Living in Bristol and reading and listening to the local media, can make you think we are the Man Utd of the South West.

After living in Bristol all my life, i have recently had to move away. It's been a Godsend in many ways, because i have realised what a small fish Bristol City are, in the big ocean of the Football League.

When i look at all the 'Big' clubs in our league struggling, and the likes of Leeds, Charlton, Norwich and Southampton below us, then i realise how lucky we are. Please enjoy it for what it is.

Yes, we may not be playing attractive football at the moment. And yes, we may all question GJ's motives, actions and tactics.

But, imo, all this negative energy around the Club, is only going to destroy everything that has been achieved in the last 5 years.

We all have a right to moan and have our own opinions. But sometimes i do wonder whether all the footballing brain cells in Bristol have been destroyed by Natch.

Have you ever wondered, apart from 76-81, why Bristol City have always been a mediocre football team? We've had different, Directors,Managers,Trainers and playing staff all through all our years of existence. Yet for a Club that comes from a City the size of Bristol, we have definately under achieved. Perhaps, we should all take a long hard look at ourselves. And realise we are Supporters who moan a bloody lot and have no right to, considering our poor history. If fans attitudes changed, to being more positive, then i'm sure this Club will keep progressing.

See us for what we are, and get behind the lads, management and Directors.

Flack jacket on...

Are you on crack cocaine.............

[spudski]

Care to elaborate and add something constructive?

[cidercity1987]

Being the premier team in England's sixth biggest city shows we have clearly been punching far below our weight for an awful long time.

[WellRedPhil]

I know we're not a big club, and I do not for one minute believe we are. However judging us on our past is not acceptable anymore. You have to judge on the squad we have, the expenditure that we have made compared to the 'old days' when we were in League 1 if you like. We have a good Championship squad, however it is also vastly inbalanced, we have made several signings, especially loan signings and strikers that have been poor and unnecessary. We have wasted money, and IMO are not getting anything like the best out of the squad we currently occupy. We are boring, predictable, negative both at home and away and even unable to press against the lesser teams in the league. I believe we are wasteful in possession, we create a minimal amount of chances, and do not play to players strengths. Therefore I'm not going to be happy, simply because we have been in the league below for most of my life, I do not believe that is an acceptable way of looking at things, and I therefore disagree with your post.

[Mr Mosquito]

Being the premier team in England's sixth biggest city shows we have clearly been punching far below our weight for an awful long time.

Too right.

We're punching well below our weight. Being Bristolian, this is the top club in the land - in MY opinion.

[rockin-robin]

I've been reading this forum for over a year now and felt compelled to sign up and vent my frustrations.

I've been following City for over 30 years,and even through the bad times of the 4th Division, I have never known such animosity, and lack of support for the Club, as we have at the present time. It amazes me.

The worst thing that has happened to this Club in recent times, was reaching the Play off Final two seasons ago.

That one achievement, has made fans of this Club delusional. If we had finished above the relegation zone in that first season, people would have been happy. In our second season, to finish mid table was also an achievement. To be mid table now, is also an achievement.

Bristol City fans, need to realise...WE ARE NOT A BIG CLUB. It's easy to fall into the 'Bubble' of thinking we are. Living in Bristol and reading and listening to the local media, can make you think we are the Man Utd of the South West.

After living in Bristol all my life, i have recently had to move away. It's been a Godsend in many ways, because i have realised what a small fish Bristol City are, in the big ocean of the Football League.

When i look at all the 'Big' clubs in our league struggling, and the likes of Leeds, Charlton, Norwich and Southampton below us, then i realise how lucky we are. Please enjoy it for what it is.

Yes, we may not be playing attractive football at the moment. And yes, we may all question GJ's motives, actions and tactics.

But, imo, all this negative energy around the Club, is only going to destroy everything that has been achieved in the last 5 years.

We all have a right to moan and have our own opinions. But sometimes i do wonder whether all the footballing brain cells in Bristol have been destroyed by Natch.

Have you ever wondered, apart from 76-81, why Bristol City have always been a mediocre football team? We've had different, Directors,Managers,Trainers and playing staff all through all our years of existence. Yet for a Club that comes from a City the size of Bristol, we have definately under achieved. Perhaps, we should all take a long hard look at ourselves. And realise we are Supporters who moan a bloody lot and have no right to, considering our poor history. If fans attitudes changed, to being more positive, then i'm sure this Club will keep progressing.

See us for what we are, and get behind the lads, management and Directors.

Flack jacket on...

How come so many posts these days are starting with "I've been supporting City for [iNSERT NO.OF YEARS]"?

Anyway, whilst a lot of what you say is true, I could also swing it around the other way and state that it is "opinions" like these that are the reason why we have under achieved for so many years and it is this fans mentality that is holding back the club from progressing.....too many fans merely accept that we are punching above our weight and don't demand that we do better.

As you rightly say, a city the size of Bristol should have a top flight team, however many many years and decades of under achievemnet has been engraved into the Bristolian mentality that this is acceptable.

[Mr Mosquito]

SPOT ON POST!!!

And to go back in time to 1906 seems a little strange to try and prove a point!! I think if you look at that league table a couple of the clubs fail to exist anymore? I may be wrong!

We also missed out on the title during this poeriod to Newcastle due a terrible run in and losing three games on the trot one of which was to Newcastle who won the tile!!

Things never change!!!

They all still exist......

DIVISION 1 1906/07

P W D L F A Pts

1

Newcastle United 38 22 7 9 74 46 51

2

Bristol City 38 20 8 10 66 47 48

3

Everton 38 20 5 13 70 46 45

4

Sheffield United 38 17 11 10 57 55 45

5

Aston Villa 38 19 6 13 78 52 44

6

Bolton Wanderers 38 18 8 12 59 47 44

7

Woolwich Arsenal* 38 20 4 14 66 59 44

8

Manchester United 38 17 8 13 53 56 42

9

Birmingham 38 15 8 15 52 52 38

10

Sunderland 38 14 9 15 65 66 37

11

Middlesbrough 38 15 6 17 56 63 36

12

Blackburn Rovers 38 14 7 17 56 59 35

13

Sheffield Wednesday 38 12 11 15 49 60 35

14

Preston North End 38 14 7 17 44 57 35

15

Liverpool 38 13 7 18 64 65 33

16

Bury 38 13 6 19 58 68 32

17

Manchester City 38 10 12 16 53 77 32

18

Notts County 38 8 15 15 46 50 31

19

Derby County 38 9 9 20 41 59 27

20

Stoke 38 8 10 20 41 64 26

Source: http://www.footballs...Div11906-07.htm

[SC_Red]

Another one of those fans who thinks we should be grateful for what we get. Patronising claptrap.

Well I'm sorry, but I think ALL supporters, the club and the club's employees and playing staff should be aspiring to be the best we can be, not simply accepting it as "our lot and be grateful for it".

Supporters and fans "moan" (I prefer "criticise") because they desperately want the club to be successful and get frustrated by what they see as things not being done correctly within the club.

For all the diatribe that is constantly wheeled out about the knowledge and experience of the incumbent club management, in general most supporters and fans ARE NOT STUPID, and can see when something is wrong and not working.

Here's another cliche for you - when the incumbent club management are long gone, the fans will still be here.

It is the fans, and the fans alone, that drive the club forward by demanding of the management, a standard of play that brings success.

How do you know being a competetive championship club isn't the best we can be?

Be careful what you wish for.

[Mr Mosquito]

How come so many posts these days are starting with "I've been supporting City for [iNSERT NO.OF YEARS]"?

The poster that started this thread - first registered on here this January - would surely after supporting this club for 30 years know a fair amount of our club's history. I used to sit down on the terracing years ago before the match reading snippets of our history in the programmes. I was there when we were last in the top flight and I knew from the programmes we'd been in the top flight before. My Grandfather never stopped talking about our first spell in the top flight as well. The post seems to be an attempt to prop up the relative underachievement of the current management - given the money spent so far I'd expect us to be challenging for auto promotion if the management was competent. Against Cardiff and during spells against Coventry we looked like we were in a relegation fight.

[PFree]

So you think moaning and critising the Club, players and management at this stage of the season will help matters?

Obviously things are not going to plan down at the Gate. But, when did throwing toys out of the pram, and venting frustrations in such negative manners win any football matches.

Steve Lansdown, knows what's going on. Making a knee jerk reaction can only hinder proceedings.

However much supporters dislike what is happening at our Club right now, booing, abusing the players and management isn't going to help win games.

Yes it's hard to be positive when the going gets tough, and we all want to vent our frustrations. But what good can it do 'AT THIS STAGE OF THE SEASON'?

You are right...most Supporters are not stupid. But they are stupid if they think Steve Lansdown and his management team aren't working behind the scenes to correct matters.They have everything to lose and not a lot to gain, at this momment in time. Whether GJ is the right man to take us forward is another matter.

The point being...Bringing in another manager now, at this present momment will not help matters.

So whether your for or against GJ...it doesn't matter. The lads need a lift.

Get behind the Club. If they Screw it up, then they can't blame us.

Firstly, well done for putting your honest, well written views on here. The whole idea of the forum is to share thoughts and views.

It's always difficult to assess whether a club is punching above it's weight - is this based on gate sizes? Revenue? Potential? Actual achievement? There are many 'small' clubs that have made it to the Premier League over the last decade or so and quite rightly, we want to make it as well?

The one point I would comment upon relates to whether a lot of what is coming out relates to frustration as opposed to negativity? You have to ask why things have gone flat and whether the GJ era has gone stale? You're dead right that we should all get behind the team and I agree that there have been recent teams where I haven't joined in the vocal support as I too feel flat and uninspired, presumably like many others?

I would make a strong point linked to passion however - I work hard to be able to purchase two season tickets every year and I also travel away on occasions. I am entirely passionate about BCFC and I get extremely frustrated when players who are on THOUSANDS of pounds every week and drive super-cars via mega-earnings can't even pass a ball from A to B, can't seemingly be 'bothered', and have absolutely no desire on the pitch or any sense of pride in wearing the City shirt!!? You can blame this on all sorts of reasons but whichever way you dress it up, it is totally unacceptable in my view and always will be?

GJ recently stated that it would be hard letting players go that he had brought in? You have to ask the question whether it is time for a completely fresh approach with a management team that are capable of building further? GJ has done a great job but can he add too much more?

[Martyn Hocking]

Welcome Spudski - your analysis is spot on.

Ignore the witchhunters - they'd still be moaning about something or other if we were mid-table in the Prem.