Gerrard

[WellRedPhil]

However, I do think we have at least one world class player. Like him or loathe him, I think Ashley Cole is one of the top 3 left backs in the world and would get into my "World squad".

The best for me. Good going forward and outstanding at the back.

[InCider]

Firstly i dont have a "second" team. , You assume because i dont rate Gerrard i like his rival team:yawn: get real.

Fair enough.

Its getting like the Evander Sno situation with Gerrard, people always making excuses for him about playing in the wrong position etc etc, a top class player midfielder would be able to adapt to anywhere in midfield.

So Pirlo is equally adept as a left winger? Can Xavi play just behind a lone striker or out wide? I wasn't making excuses for Gerrard, as I thought he had a really good game anyway. However, I would prefer to see him in the centre of midfield, as that's his best position. All players have a preferred position.

My problem with Gerrard is the amount of times he gives the ball away. He did it countless times again yesterday and against better teams they will punish us. If you want to be blinkered and only comment on the times he does well than thats up to you, but i would prefer a someone who gets at least 80% of his passes ok than Gerrard who is on about 50%.

Yes, he will give the ball away occasionally. Partly, as he is always looking to play a killer ball. Again, to compare him with the two above. They will hardly ever give the ball away. However, they are not likely to burst into the box or score many goals. They are different types of player. We probably don't have the players to retain the ball, the way Argentina, Brazil and Spain do. We have to play to the strengths that we do have. That means playing at a higher tempo and that will mean giving the ball away a bit more often. As to being blinkered and only commenting on when he does well. I will admit that he isn't always outstanding, just that he is in the majority of games that he plays. No player in the World is outstanding in every game they play, although Messi isn't far off! If your argument was that English players are less technically able in comparison to our Continental neighbours and the South Americans, then you have a valid point. However, I still can't see why you are picking Gerrard out for special mention, when there were very few England players playing anywhere near their potential in the first two games.

And if you want to call me the new Robbered go ahead, i dont really give a fudge. Its my opinion.

Sorry, that probably was below the belt.

As i said before, Premier League player not international player.

World class is for players who can dictate International games, he cant.

Its paper talk re Real Madrid, the spanish league is about keeping the ball, which Gerrard doesnt do.

Gerrard may be fine on a wet tuesday night against Wigan but that is far far away from playing International football.

Wigan on a Tuesday night? What about Milan in a Champions League final, or the countless other European games that he has dragged Liverpool through (some seemingly single-handed)? I would argue that some of the football in the Champions' League is as high in quality as International football, if not higher. Maybe the Real rumours are just that. However, Mourinho has long been an admirer of Gerrard and he does seem to know what he's talking about. He did put in a bid for him when Chelsea manager.

[GrahamC]

The best for me. Good going forward and outstanding at the back.

He may be a vile human being but Ashley Cole is actually our only world class player, no-one else in the England squad is one of the best 3 in the world in their position, he is.

[Portland Bill]

I rest my case! Gerrard, international class....No.

[fka dagest]

Gerard: absolutely abysmal. He tried, but even when he completed a pass it was often the wrong decision. Quite simply no where near good enough.

[GrahamC]

Gerard: absolutely abysmal. He tried, but even when he completed a pass it was often the wrong decision. Quite simply no where near good enough.

But he does have loads of mates who are commentators/summarisers, etc, namely Lawrenson and Hansen, which explains why he is normally spared the criticism that others get.

I thought he'd morphed into Carl Hutchings at times today, kicking the ball aimlessly to places where we didn't have anyone near at all.

[Southport Red]

Yeah, Gerrard was rubbish and the other 10 were worldd beaters right?

Lost 4-1, could easily have been 9-3 and our goalkeeper was our MOM

We need a goal and so 'one England goal every three games' Crouch is kept on the bench and on comes Emile 'one England goal...'

Right at the detah when it was really **** or bust just tear into them for the sake of a bit of pride, we bring on Shaun Wright-Phillips.

Capello said we played well (so he is satisfied) and everyone else is off the hook because it was Gerrard's fault.

Did I miss anything out?

[InCider]

I rest my case! Gerrard, international class....No.

You rest your case based on one game. About sums up your logic. Gerrard was nowhere near good enough today (despite your completely unfounded accusation of myself being blinkered and only mentioning when he plays well). However, not one of our players was anywhere near the standard required to win today. I put that down to bizarre tactics/squad and team selection, but the players must also shoulder their share of the blame. Based on your bizarre logic, you wouldn't consider any Italian or French players International Class? Who do you think is? When Barca were beaten by Inter in the Champions League and Messi had a poor game, did you rest your case then that Messi wasn't World Class as he couldn't perform in that particular game?

[Portland Bill]

One game ???? Read the forum mate.Imo Gerard is NOT international class. Thats all my point is, i am not comparing him with France,Italy,Messi or joe Bloggs.

You dont agree, thats fine, but im not going to change my opinion.

[Donald]

Gerrard's biggest problem for England isn't Steve Gerrard....it's Frank Lampard

To many managers at International Level have tried to play the both of them in the team together, and basically Gerrard can be more flexiable in positions he can play he's the one who's being constantly moved out of position to accomdate Lampard, We've never got to see the Gerrard of Liverpool playing for England because international manager's won't play him correctly.

I'm no liverpool fan, but he's just been wasted for England and would be one of the few players left in the 11 for me.

James - Would have retired regardless.

But Terry, Upson, Lampard, Heskey and SWP would never play again and personally I'd bin a fair few players before the start of the Euro's.

There is a number of players I wouldn't play, but would keep their position unfortunately as htheir is no other options.

I honestly also don't understand the point today in Heskey.....seriously.....with Crouch international record, PLAY THE ******!!!

[marshy]

Personally I don't think Gerrard has ever performed well enough at international level, wherever he has been asked to play. My main problem with his game is poor decision making, lack of vision and the frequency with which he gives the ball away by trying to play the killer pass when it simply isn't on. Against the top sides, it can take you some time to get the ball back. And also, and this is something I thought I'd never say, on to-day's performance, lack of effort. He was asked to play left midfield but consistently failed to track back and give help to a defence that was already struggling and being pulled out of position.

[Riaz]

I rest my case! Gerrard, international class....No.

Yeah, blame gerrard. he's the only one that was'nt good enough.....

who cares if he was the only player played out of position....

[simon uk]

Yeah, blame gerrard. he's the only one that was'nt good enough.....

who cares if he was the only player played out of position....

I Blame Gerrard as much as I blame most of the others, they were almost all appalling, the only good thing is that the myth of the premier league and england players is finally clear for everyone to see. If you want to see a load of headless chickens running around watch the premier league, if you want to see football, watch la liga. The arrogance of the commentators saying there are only 1 or 2 germans who would get in our side is astonishing. They said at the end we have no one like Ozil, what, young, full of pace with fantasic technique, bloody right we dont. We have Lampard and Gerrard, and after 10 years playing together they still havent got a clue, and never will have.

Seeing as the FA runs the premier league and the england team, they have to make the decision to cut foreign player numbers drastically, I have no problem with the better ones coming over, but when you have the blackburns, wigans and birminghams buying rubbish from abroad, and Nicky Maynard playing in the championship it just isnt right.

I would be quite happy to see the likes of Gerrard Lampard, Terry and Rooney booed to high heaven and hounded abroad next season (they arent good enough to play abroad though), they are a joke.

[Riaz]

I'm sorry but I'd still rather watch prem football than that slow shit in spain.

[yardy]

It amazes me all this gerrard hate,are people actually watching the games?

Gerrard was possibly our best player in the 1st two games,which the 2nd was played out of position.

He looks the most likely person to make things happen for us,he plays with a great attitude and is technically the best player we have at the moment.

For me his best position is centre midfield or better still a defensive midfield role where he would see plenty of the ball and control games,if he was to play in this position for england we would see the best of stevie.

To say gerrard isn't international class is just ridiculus,im sure virtually every international manager in the world would have him in their team or atleast on their bench.

All this about gerrard and lampard can't play together is rubbish too,if we was to play with the right formation and players in the right positions they indeed could play together.A 4,2,3,1 would work 2 holding midfielders(gerrard 1 of em) and lamps in 1 of the 3 in midfield which means he won't have to track back and defend which he cant do!

Gerrard is a complete footballer,there is nothing he can't do on the pitch!

[Portland Bill]

It amazes me all this gerrard hate,are people actually watching the games?

Gerrard was possibly our best player in the 1st two games,which the 2nd was played out of position.

He looks the most likely person to make things happen for us,he plays with a great attitude and is technically the best player we have at the moment.

For me his best position is centre midfield or better still a defensive midfield role where he would see plenty of the ball and control games,if he was to play in this position for england we would see the best of stevie.

To say gerrard isn't international class is just ridiculus,im sure virtually every international manager in the world would have him in their team or atleast on their bench.

All this about gerrard and lampard can't play together is rubbish too,if we was to play with the right formation and players in the right positions they indeed could play together.A 4,2,3,1 would work 2 holding midfielders(gerrard 1 of em) and lamps in 1 of the 3 in midfield which means he won't have to track back and defend which he cant do!

Gerrard is a complete footballer,there is nothing he can't do on the pitch!

Yes, watched the games, now tell me what this so called "world class player "contributed ( other than a goal against the USA).

[yardy]

Yes, watched the games, now tell me what this so called "world class player "contributed ( other than a goal against the USA).

Mate ,

Gerrard was virtually the only player in our team that seemed to try and make things happen.

He was the best player on the pitch vs usa,he had a ok game vs algeria and slovenia he was constantly trying his hardest,unlike most of the other players in our team.

He was world class vs usa,defending,passing and attacking the other games he was played out of position and was still better than most of others.

Wether he plays centre midfield or on the left he gets alot of the ball and tries to get involved in the game,which can't be said about our other midfielders that seem to shy away from the ball.

I think we have only 3 world class players in our team,gerrard,rooney and a.cole and none of them had a great tournament,infact rooney was shocking but does that make him not world class too?

[Portland Bill]

Mate ,

Gerrard was virtually the only player in our team that seemed to try and make things happen.

He was the best player on the pitch vs usa,he had a ok game vs algeria and slovenia he was constantly trying his hardest,unlike most of the other players in our team.

He was world class vs usa,defending,passing and attacking the other games he was played out of position and was still better than most of others.

Wether he plays centre midfield or on the left he gets alot of the ball and tries to get involved in the game,which can't be said about our other midfielders that seem to shy away from the ball.

I think we have only 3 world class players in our team,gerrard,rooney and a.cole and none of them had a great tournament,infact rooney was shocking but does that make him not world class too?

I'm sorry mate but calling Gerrard world class is like saying Crouch is a dwarf:whistle2:

[yardy]

I'm sorry mate but calling Gerrard world class is like saying Crouch is a dwarf:whistle2:

Seriously this is shocking,i haven't talked to many people ever that doesn't think gerrard is world class.

A certain jose mourinho who is the most succesfull manager over the past 5-6 years rates him very very highly,and even wants to take him to real madrid the most succesfull football team in europe.

I rest my case.

If you can't see the class in gerrard then there is something seriously wrong.

[Bristol North Red]

He must be the most overhyped over rated player ever. Premier league player yes, international player NO.

What you meant to do when your a central/attacking mid-field player and your told to stick to left wing he had a much better world cup well showed more spirit and will to do good then Rooney the man who was meant to bring the world cup home for us.

[Portland Bill]

Seriously this is shocking,i haven't talked to many people ever that doesn't think gerrard is world class.

A certain jose mourinho who is the most succesfull manager over the past 5-6 years rates him very very highly,and even wants to take him to real madrid the most succesfull football team in europe.

I rest my case.

If you can't see the class in gerrard then there is something seriously wrong.

Hes a premier league player ,completley different from international class.The only shocking part about it is that you obviously have fallen for the hype but not watched what he actually does.

Jose has told you this has he ?. Strange how hes been manager at Chelsea and then at Inter but.....never signed him then isnt it

Hes signed Far far better midfield players for those 2 clubs.

What more proof than the world cup we have just seen do you need, He must have given the ball away to the oppo more times than any other player in the whole tournement.

If you can see class in Gerrard theres something seriously wrong:rolleyes: . I even know Liverpool fans who realise that they need to get rid of him. Strange that Liverpool and England have both struggled over the last decade isnt it:whistle2:

[Portland Bill]

What you meant to do when your a central/attacking mid-field player and your told to stick to left wing he had a much better world cup well showed more spirit and will to do good then Rooney the man who was meant to bring the world cup home for us.

But he didnt stick out left and thats why Ashley Cole was exposed time and time again, Rooney may have had a better world cup if he had some service from midfield....especially from the left. So your saying that a player who plays out of position still isnt capable of passing the ball ten yards to a team mate?. Stop making excuses for him.

[InCider]

I even know Liverpool fans who realise that they need to get rid of him.

I knew you were on a wind-up! Can't wait for your 'Ronaldo isn't World Class' thread next. Afterall, he was non-existent yesterday.

[SyntaxtheRed]

Update on brewing Gerrard scandal.

"Courts held a further 2 week gagging order on steve gerrards private life, turns out he got his wifes sister pregnant (not a 16 year old )

Will hit the newspaper in 14 days, the judge held the gagging order to protect FA while they decide on capello, and the future of English footy..

John terry and the england boys all know about it and JT had a argument with capello because gerrard got to keep the captains armband. the tension in the camp was down to JT and half the team saying gerrard was a disgrace and the other half of the squad backing gerrard..The press conference was related to the tension and JT wanted Gerrard exposed - they hate each other."

[simon uk]

Update on brewing Gerrard scandal.

"Courts held a further 2 week gagging order on steve gerrards private life, turns out he got his wifes sister pregnant (not a 16 year old )

Will hit the newspaper in 14 days, the judge held the gagging order to protect FA while they decide on capello, and the future of English footy..

John terry and the england boys all know about it and JT had a argument with capello because gerrard got to keep the captains armband. the tension in the camp was down to JT and half the team saying gerrard was a disgrace and the other half of the squad backing gerrard..The press conference was related to the tension and JT wanted Gerrard exposed - they hate each other."

nice, where did you get that from?

[SyntaxtheRed]

a music forum where one of the users is apparantly ITK, the user did tell of the Terry scandal before it made the press. The user works in the press apparently.

[The Batman]

Update on brewing Gerrard scandal.

"Courts held a further 2 week gagging order on steve gerrards private life, turns out he got his wifes sister pregnant (not a 16 year old )

Will hit the newspaper in 14 days, the judge held the gagging order to protect FA while they decide on capello, and the future of English footy..

John terry and the england boys all know about it and JT had a argument with capello because gerrard got to keep the captains armband. the tension in the camp was down to JT and half the team saying gerrard was a disgrace and the other half of the squad backing gerrard..The press conference was related to the tension and JT wanted Gerrard exposed - they hate each other."

aint his wife apparently having an affair with Kris Commons??

wouldn't surprise me with regards to unrest in the squad, they dont know the meaning of team, only interested in themselves.

[yardy]

Hes a premier league player ,completley different from international class.The only shocking part about it is that you obviously have fallen for the hype but not watched what he actually does.

Jose has told you this has he ?. Strange how hes been manager at Chelsea and then at Inter but.....never signed him then isnt it

Hes signed Far far better midfield players for those 2 clubs.

What more proof than the world cup we have just seen do you need, He must have given the ball away to the oppo more times than any other player in the whole tournement.

If you can see class in Gerrard theres something seriously wrong:rolleyes: . I even know Liverpool fans who realise that they need to get rid of him. Strange that Liverpool and England have both struggled over the last decade isnt it:whistle2:

I have watched gerrard and liverpool much more than any other Premier League team over the past decade and the guy is class.Technically there isn't a better english player than him right now,if you can think of someone better then i would like to know.

Jose mourinho tried signing gerrard about 3 or 4 seasons ago and he was very very close to leaving liverpool,he decided to stay and try and make things happen with liverpool(big mistake).

Its funny that he has a few average games for england and people think that he isn't world class,does that go the same for torres,rooney,ribery and ronaldo who also had average or poor world cups?

[yardy]

Update on brewing Gerrard scandal.

"Courts held a further 2 week gagging order on steve gerrards private life, turns out he got his wifes sister pregnant (not a 16 year old )

Will hit the newspaper in 14 days, the judge held the gagging order to protect FA while they decide on capello, and the future of English footy..

John terry and the england boys all know about it and JT had a argument with capello because gerrard got to keep the captains armband. the tension in the camp was down to JT and half the team saying gerrard was a disgrace and the other half of the squad backing gerrard..The press conference was related to the tension and JT wanted Gerrard exposed - they hate each other."

source please or bs

[marshy]

Seriously this is shocking,i haven't talked to many people ever that doesn't think gerrard is world class.

Well you obvoiously haven't talked to me.

Gives the ball away far too much at international level.

Too many over-ambitious passes.

Poor tracking back at LM.

I wouldn't even put him in the starting eleven.

When we won the World Cup in '66 we had three players that would have been picked for a world 11.

The magnificent Bobby Charlton,

Bobby Moore

Gordon Banks

That, I'm afraid to say, is the difference between now and then. When you don't have the genuine world class players you have to make up for it with team spirit and organisation. Sadly both of these elements of a successful team were lacking.