Premier League Superb ?

[The Red Planet]

I was at Old Trafford last night for the Man U v Arsenal game. I was a corporate guest in what Roy Keane once called the "prawn sandwiches" zone. Actually it was a great three course meal before the game.

First thing to report is, if you have not been there, Old Trafford is an AWESOME 75K capacity seater stadium and the fans in the Stretford End are brilliant.

We stayed at a local hotel which was fully booked out with Man U fans I met there (before and after the game) from Japan, Germany and Poland. Jeez - this club has a massive international appeal. Some of these people had flown in just for the game !

BUT, here is the reason for this post. When you watch highlights of Prem games on MOTD and Sky Sports, of course all you see is the best bits, When you watch a whole game live you see the misplaced passes, the missed-timed tackles etc

Watching that game live last night I kept thinking, OK there are some exceptionally brilliant players here tonight (Nasri, Nani, Ferdinand and a few more come to mind) but actually the level of football skills on display was only marginally better than what we see see in the Championship.week in and week out.

Many on here have talked about BCFC getting to The Prem as the "promised land" etc and I can understand that (and share that ambition) but I have to say, after coming back from Manchester and watching the highlights of our game Sat v Derby on Player, I can say without doubt the game at AG last Sat was more entertaining and passionate than what I saw in the "Theatre of Dreams" (a description of Old Trafford said by MUFC director Bobby Charlton - as I am sure you all know)

Before you remind me, I am well aware that without doubt, Last Sat was easily our best performance this season.

Now let's stuff Hull - if the game is on (weather permitting).,

We owe them one.

[Big Stan Hibbert]

I was there for the Valencia game... I thought exactly the same.

Maybe just 2 bad games though????

[grifty]

I was seeing one of the girls who is a waitress in the Old Trafford VIP lounge thing. She said David Beckham was in there.

[pocketscrot]

I was at Old Trafford last night for the Man U v Arsenal game. I was a corporate guest in what Roy Keane once called the "prawn sandwiches" zone. Actually it was a great three course meal before the game.

First thing to report is, if you have not been there, Old Trafford is an AWESOME 75K capacity seater stadium and the fans in the Stretford End are brilliant.

We stayed at a local hotel which was fully booked out with Man U fans I met there (before and after the game) from Japan, Germany and Poland. Jeez - this club has a massive international appeal. Some of these people had flown in just for the game !

BUT, here is the reason for this post. When you watch highlights of Prem games on MOTD and Sky Sports, of course all you see is the best bits, When you watch a whole game live you see the misplaced passes, the missed-timed tackles etc

Watching that game live last night I kept thinking, OK there are some exceptionally brilliant players here tonight (Nasri, Nani, Ferdinand and a few more come to mind) but actually the level of football skills on display was only marginally better than what we see see in the Championship.week in and week out.

Many on here have talked about BCFC getting to The Prem as the "promised land" etc and I can understand that (and share that ambition) but I have to say, after coming back from Manchester and watching the highlights of our game Sat v Derby on Player, I can say without doubt the game at AG last Sat was more entertaining and passionate than what I saw in the "Theatre of Dreams" (a description of Old Trafford said by MUFC director Bobby Charlton - as I am sure you all know)

Before you remind me, I am well aware that without doubt, Last Sat was easily our best performance this season.

Now let's stuff Hull - if the game is on (weather permitting).,

We owe them one.

your right the prem is only marginally better which is why teams like blackpool and WBA are able to compete. Watched the full man u game as well and it was by no means a classic. But what you have to remember is that good teams put the oposition under pressure which leads to mistakes, so therefor man u v arsenal may not appear to be that much different to watch than a close game in the championship (and there are alot of them!)

[Port Said Red]

I was in a hotel in Leeds watching the game and only saw the first 45 minutes. Like you, I was amazed at how poor the general level of play was, I guess good players can cancel eachother out but that didn't seem to be the problem. At the end of the first half I went back to my room, I sent a text to my brother saying that I was glad I didn't have Sky because I would hate to be paying for that.

[Robbored]

The PL has a huge amount of top class players and they do provide some brilliant football at times. Currently we Nasri and Fabrigas at Arsenal, Drogba, Lampard at Chelsea, the likes of Berbatov and Rooney at Man Utd, Modric and Bale at Spurs. The list goes on and on.

In the past we've seen Thierry Henry ( best ever imo) and Denis Berkamp. Alan Shearer and Gazza,Van Nistelrooy and Di Canio all at their best. Fantastic to watch.

Of course not every game is end to end flawless football but overall the PL is the best league in the World imo.

[The Casual Connoisseur]

Maybe it was the nature and style of the game, the pitch was awful and Man Utd tried to stifle Arsenals fluent, slick passing, very rarely is a game good to watch when a team defends so tightly (well)????

[Portland Bill]

The PL has a huge amount of top class players and they do provide some brilliant football at times. Currently we Nasri and Fabrigas at Arsenal, Drogba, Lampard at Chelsea, the likes of Berbatov and Rooney at Man Utd, Modric and Bale at Spurs. The list goes on and on.

In the past we've seen Thierry Henry ( best ever imo) and Denis Berkamp. Alan Shearer and Gazza,Van Nistelrooy and Di Canio all at their best. Fab=ntastic to watch.

Of course not every game is end to end flawless football but overall the PL is the best league in the World imo.

Best league in the world???? seriously your having a laugh. The most hyped league in the world

Answer me this.Name me some players from the Premier League who held there own in the World Cup Finals in South Africa ?

[Robbored]

Best league in the world???? seriously your having a laugh. The most hyped league in the world

Answer me this.Name me some players from the Premier League who held there own in the World Cup Finals in South Africa ?

Its not just me that thinks that the PL is the best in the world. Many international sport journo's think the same. What league is the best in your view?

Judgeing how a leagues quality,tempo and excitement is measured by how well its players did in the World Cup is ridiculous. Torres was carrying an injury. England were crap under a crap manager.

[WellRedPhil]

You can't judge the PL soley on that game. It was a very tight, tactical game and United came out on top, lagely thanks to the way they set themselves up. Fergie knows how to beat Arsenal with an extra man in midfield and that allowed them to exploit Arsenal's defensive frailties and find the space down both sides. Arsenal never really found their passing range and were largely disappointing going forward so no it didn't make for the most entertaining game, although it was compelling nonetheless.

I do believe the quality in the PL has dropped slightly in comparison to other years and likewise some of the "lesser" teams have improved making for a much tighter league. It is still an enormously entertaining division and the standard is high, make no doubt about that. Is it the best league in the world? Well the only other league that is close would be La Liga which is of course nowhere near as open as the PL as only 2 teams ever win it, bar the odd exception such as Valencia a few years ago. Madrid and certainly Barcelona are probably the best 2 teams in the world and if you looked at the best players in the world La Liga would have more of them. They have the two best attackers in Messi and Ronaldo and the two best central midfielders in Xavi and Iniesta. However the "lesser" teams in the division are of a lesser standard than that at the bottom of the PL.

I don't know which is better at the moment, but I'd say the PL is more exciting and certainly more competitive. As Ferguson said the PL table looks very much like a Championship table of the past at the moment! What I would say though is I don't think any English teams would win La Liga, whereas Barca and in my opinion especially Real would ahve an excellent chance in the PL. (Although players such as Messi would obviously not fit into the style of the PL as well as they would in Spain.)

[Portland Bill]

Its not just me that thinks that the PL is the best in the world. Many international sport journo's think the same. What league is the best in your view?

Judgeing how a leagues quality,tempo and excitement is measured by how well its players did in the World Cup is ridiculous. Torres was carrying an injury. England were crap under a crap manager.

Of course you can judge by the World Cup, thats where the best players in the World play there football. The players from the Prem were shown to be 2nd rate.

Arsenal's Fabregas is rated in the top 5 players of the Prem but cant even get in his national side,Englands players comfirmed they are probably 3rd rate.

How you can say England have a crap manager is laughable, hes won everything there is to be won in club football, its the players he has to pick from for England that are crap.

The Prem minus Arsenal is full of big strong athletes that lump the ball around imo.

The Spanish league is full of quality players who play the game properly,2 teams dominate much the same as here, but all the other teams have quality the Prem can only dream of.

[Portland Bill]

You can't judge the PL soley on that game. It was a very tight, tactical game and United came out on top, lagely thanks to the way they set themselves up. Fergie knows how to beat Arsenal with an extra man in midfield and that allowed them to exploit Arsenal's defensive frailties and find the space down both sides. Arsenal never really found their passing range and were largely disappointing going forward so no it didn't make for the most entertaining game, although it was compelling nonetheless.

I do believe the quality in the PL has dropped slightly in comparison to other years and likewise some of the "lesser" teams have improved making for a much tighter league. It is still an enormously entertaining division and the standard is high, make no doubt about that. Is it the best league in the world? Well the only other league that is close would be La Liga which is of course nowhere near as open as the PL as only 2 teams ever win it, bar the odd exception such as Valencia a few years ago. Madrid and certainly Barcelona are probably the best 2 teams in the world and if you looked at the best players in the world La Liga would have more of them. They have the two best attackers in Messi and Ronaldo and the two best central midfielders in Xavi and Iniesta. However the "lesser" teams in the division are of a lesser standard than that at the bottom of the PL.

I don't know which is better at the moment, but I'd say the PL is more exciting and certainly more competitive. As Ferguson said the PL table looks very much like a Championship table of the past at the moment! What I would say though is I don't think any English teams would win La Liga, whereas Barca and in my opinion especially Real would ahve an excellent chance in the PL. (Although players such as Messi would obviously not fit into the style of the PL as well as they would in Spain.)

Intrestingly i just looked up the La LIga and Prem winners over the last 15 years. 5 teams have won La liga in that time, Barca,R Madrid,Valencia,Dep La Coruna and A Madrid.

In England its 4, Man Utd,Chelaea,Arsenal and Blackburn.

[Barrs Court Red]

Of course you can judge by the World Cup, thats where the best players in the World play there football. .

You wont find many people agreeing with that statement these days.

[City Ben]

Intrestingly i just looked up the La LIga and Prem winners over the last 15 years. 5 teams have won La liga in that time, Barca,R Madrid,Valencia,Dep La Coruna and A Madrid.

In England its 4, Man Utd,Chelaea,Arsenal and Blackburn.

Boom! I hate it when facts get in the way of received wisdom!

I do think, though, that at the moment there are probably only two real potential winners of La Liga, but that the Prem is a fair bit more open - Arsenal, Man City, Man Utd, Chelsea and even Tottenham are all contenders in my view.

I guess it comes down to what is the "best" league though. Most open? Most exciting until the last day of the season? Biggest attendances? Best quality play? Highest sponsorship or tv income?!

[Nogbad the Bad]

I was at Old Trafford last night for the Man U v Arsenal game. I was a corporate guest in what Roy Keane once called the "prawn sandwiches" zone. Actually it was a great three course meal before the game.

First thing to report is, if you have not been there, Old Trafford is an AWESOME 75K capacity seater stadium and the fans in the Stretford End are brilliant.

We stayed at a local hotel which was fully booked out with Man U fans I met there (before and after the game) from Japan, Germany and Poland. Jeez - this club has a massive international appeal. Some of these people had flown in just for the game !

BUT, here is the reason for this post. When you watch highlights of Prem games on MOTD and Sky Sports, of course all you see is the best bits, When you watch a whole game live you see the misplaced passes, the missed-timed tackles etc

Watching that game live last night I kept thinking, OK there are some exceptionally brilliant players here tonight (Nasri, Nani, Ferdinand and a few more come to mind) but actually the level of football skills on display was only marginally better than what we see see in the Championship.week in and week out.

Many on here have talked about BCFC getting to The Prem as the "promised land" etc and I can understand that (and share that ambition) but I have to say, after coming back from Manchester and watching the highlights of our game Sat v Derby on Player, I can say without doubt the game at AG last Sat was more entertaining and passionate than what I saw in the "Theatre of Dreams" (a description of Old Trafford said by MUFC director Bobby Charlton - as I am sure you all know)

Before you remind me, I am well aware that without doubt, Last Sat was easily our best performance this season.

Now let's stuff Hull - if the game is on (weather permitting).,

We owe them one.

So, awesome ground, big crowd, good meals, many fans from abroad, as were almost all the highly paid players. Scrappy game.

The points relevant to BCFC fans seem to be: was the entertainment, atmosphere, excitement, value for money and all round match experience for the average fan superior to what we get at Ashton Gate in the Championship?

Doesn't sound like it. The key word missing is passion.

[SC_Red]

Of course you can judge by the World Cup, thats where the best players in the World play there football. The players from the Prem were shown to be 2nd rate.

Arsenal's Fabregas is rated in the top 5 players of the Prem but cant even get in his national side,Englands players comfirmed they are probably 3rd rate.

How you can say England have a crap manager is laughable, hes won everything there is to be won in club football, its the players he has to pick from for England that are crap.

The Prem minus Arsenal is full of big strong athletes that lump the ball around imo.

The Spanish league is full of quality players who play the game properly,2 teams dominate much the same as here, but all the other teams have quality the Prem can only dream of.

the players are 2nd rate because there arent enough English lads playing in the premier league.

Spain has the right idea with a lot of the teams fielding teams of Spanish lads so they get the experience at the highest level and get to develop. If we were in Spain theres no way Caulker would be with us. He'd be in the Spurs team and getting enough time on the pitch to develop.

the sooner another league takes over as the one where the money is the better and hopefully we can start seeing teams in the premier league with more than 3 or 4 English lads in them. Maybe the euro exchange rate will persuade a few of them to go elsewhere. We can but hope.

[InCider]

Of course you can judge by the World Cup, thats where the best players in the World play there football. The players from the Prem were shown to be 2nd rate.

Arsenal's Fabregas is rated in the top 5 players of the Prem but cant even get in his national side,Englands players comfirmed they are probably 3rd rate.

How you can say England have a crap manager is laughable, hes won everything there is to be won in club football, its the players he has to pick from for England that are crap.

The Prem minus Arsenal is full of big strong athletes that lump the ball around imo.

The Spanish league is full of quality players who play the game properly,2 teams dominate much the same as here, but all the other teams have quality the Prem can only dream of.

Sorry PB. I have to disagree with that. Giggs has never played in a World Cup (for obvious reasons!). I assume that Bale probably won't either. George Best. I could go on. There are -plenty of quality players who'll never play at that level. IMO, the Champions' League is where you'll find real quality. I don't think you'll be seeing many North Korean or New Zealand players in this year's competition! Fabregas has been the No. 1 target for Barca for a long time, so I wouldn't say that he lacks quality needed for La Liga. I do agree that the Premier League is more physical to the detribute of playing good football at times. It still must be a quality league though, as English teams often progress to the latter stages of the competition.

[The Red Planet]

So, awesome ground, big crowd, good meals, many fans from abroad, as were almost all the highly paid players. Scrappy game.

The points relevant to BCFC fans seem to be: was the entertainment, atmosphere, excitement, value for money and all round match experience for the average fan superior to what we get at Ashton Gate in the Championship?

Doesn't sound like it. The key word missing is passion.

Spot on Nogbad.

Obviously the facilities at Old Trafford are vastly superior to AG but during the game, the massive, three tiered North Stand we were in was prone to polite applause at times and that was it, certainly no passion.

To be fair, as I mentioned in the OP the Stretford End is obviously HQ for the "real" committed passionate Man U fans and without exception, any chants that got going started in there.

Interesting to hear Wenger (in his post-match interview) complaining about what he called a bouncy, slippery pitch. I noticed they had the sprinklers on just before k.o.

For an evening game after light drizzle during the day?

Possibly canny tactics aimed at unsettling Arsenal by that wily old Scot Alex Ferguson.

If so, it worked. I thought Arsenal looked uncomforable throughout what some of you have (accurately) described as a scrappy game.

[sodburyred]

I was at Old Trafford last night for the Man U v Arsenal game. I was a corporate guest in what Roy Keane once called the "prawn sandwiches" zone. Actually it was a great three course meal before the game.

First thing to report is, if you have not been there, Old Trafford is an AWESOME 75K capacity seater stadium and the fans in the Stretford End are brilliant.

We stayed at a local hotel which was fully booked out with Man U fans I met there (before and after the game) from Japan, Germany and Poland. Jeez - this club has a massive international appeal. Some of these people had flown in just for the game !

BUT, here is the reason for this post. When you watch highlights of Prem games on MOTD and Sky Sports, of course all you see is the best bits, When you watch a whole game live you see the misplaced passes, the missed-timed tackles etc

Watching that game live last night I kept thinking, OK there are some exceptionally brilliant players here tonight (Nasri, Nani, Ferdinand and a few more come to mind) but actually the level of football skills on display was only marginally better than what we see see in the Championship.week in and week out.

Many on here have talked about BCFC getting to The Prem as the "promised land" etc and I can understand that (and share that ambition) but I have to say, after coming back from Manchester and watching the highlights of our game Sat v Derby on Player, I can say without doubt the game at AG last Sat was more entertaining and passionate than what I saw in the "Theatre of Dreams" (a description of Old Trafford said by MUFC director Bobby Charlton - as I am sure you all know)

Before you remind me, I am well aware that without doubt, Last Sat was easily our best performance this season.

Now let's stuff Hull - if the game is on (weather permitting).,

We owe them one.

I had hospitality their for a game last season and thaught very similar to you. All I could think was replace Rooney with Maynard and there wouldnt be any difference to the Man Utd team. I know there has to be hence the price tags. But I just couldnt see 22million pounds worth of difference. Such a fine line between being a pro and not, the line must be even finer between being a pro and being the best.

[Bris Red]

Best league in the world???? seriously your having a laugh. The most hyped league in the world

Deffinetly. La Liga for me every time. If your basing it on purely football alone and not sponosorship tv revenue and all that crap then La Liga wins hands down.

Top players have only been coming to England over the last 10/15 years for one thing and that is money. England has never been a fashionable place to play football (similar to the Bundesliga) but players have been drawn by the stupid amounts of money on offer. Spain or Italy imo is where the vast majority of world class players want to be playing there football.

[Portland Bill]

Sorry PB. I have to disagree with that. Giggs has never played in a World Cup (for obvious reasons!). I assume that Bale probably won't either. George Best. I could go on. There are -plenty of quality players

who'll never play at that level. IMO, the Champions' League is where you'll find real quality. I don't think you'll be seeing many North Korean or New Zealand players in this year's competition! Fabregas has beenthe No. 1 target for Barca for a long time, so I wouldn't say that he lacks quality needed for La Liga. I do agree that the Premier League is

more physical to the detribute of playing good football at times. It still must be a quality league though, as English teams often progress to the latter stages of the competition.

George Best I agree with,Giggs has always been over rated IMO and Bale had had 4 or5 good games and has been hyped because of that.You mention New Zealand, well Ryan Nelson was one of very very few Prem players who stood out in the last World cup.

Spain's league requires players who have technique, that's why its the best league and why no English players are good enough to play in it!

[Donald]

la liga best without doubt.

German league is very under-rated by many and has many strong points....crowd passion best in Europe

Italian football Zzzzz

Preimer league.....it's where the rich, greedy and sleazy play but not the best

Personally, I care little for premier league football, the odd season won't be too bad, but it's not important.

I'd rather be a west brom yo-yoing than a west ham, Blackburn or Bolton who have little to celebrate each season. Apart from the odd lucky win over the top few

[MC Risk]

Its not just me that thinks that the PL is the best in the world. Many international sport journo's think the same. What league is the best in your view?

Judgeing how a leagues quality,tempo and excitement is measured by how well its players did in the World Cup is ridiculous. Torres was carrying an injury. England were crap under a crap manager.

are you joking you fool......its not the manager its the players, no one would have won the world cup for england...capello has won absolutely everything in europe and in the strongest league in the 90's the italian league, and in the spanish league, if you think he is crap, it reaffirms my thoughts going on your track record that you really do know nothing about football......who would you rather have in charge with a better track record.....allardyce/redknapp/hodgson....get real and have some respect that the man has a proven track record

The fact im half italian has nothing to do with my bias in this post

[Donald]

Agreed.

Manager isnt the problem, despite what the press tell us.

Over paid, over rated and under achieving players with inflated egos like, Terry, cole, glen Johnson, lampard, Rooney, wasters the lot of them

[Jordan Tansley]

personally I find La Liga dull, predictable and stale. Yes, I love to see a delightful ball from Alonso/Iniesta to Ronaldo/Messi, But the rest of the game is spent passing it around the back four, No tackles, No closing down.

Give me a league where players get stuck in, make challenges, fight for the ball...

THE CHAMPIONSHIP!!!

But, in all seriousness, the Standard of football in the Prem is improving vastly! more teams are capable of winning games against the apparent "big four" and I dont think any of those teams have got particularly worse....

I understand the resentment toward the selfish financially motivated League (a mirror image of our capitalist political landscape) as it has taken the game away from the fans, Lord knows players like Mohamed Sissoko or any other Muscle bound "athlete" wouldn't have had any chance of playing in the top division back in the seventies, when skill alone could earn you a career... Now the game is focussed on athletisism and fitness, on percentages rather than flair... thus, there is less excitement for the fans! Never again will we see a Matt le Tissier or Paul Merson.

However, that is the world we now live in. The League is what it is and unfortunately we as fans have no power to change any of that, So in that respect we as a football club must strive to be all that we can be. The Premier League then, is "the promised land"

[Barrs Court Red]

I don't understand how Man U can have the best away fans in England, but Old Trafford always seems dull. Surely their away fans are all season ticket holders?

[simon uk]

i agree with the majority on here, the only people who say the prem is the best league is sky, and journalists who have to try to keep their place on the gravy train by bulling up the product they report on. there are barely any world class players over here (tevez, vidic, torres and fabregas?), certainly none who are english, and the league is chock full of second rate foreign players who offer very little, like pascal chimbonda, who are millionaires, but contribute very little, and will retire and be off home as soon as they can.

the other thing is, unless you have a sound knowledge of football around the world, how can you have a view on the quality of the english league in comparison? The german, spanish, russian, portugese, Brazilian and argentinian leagues may be fantastic, but we dont get to see it!

[Tins]

La Liga is easily the best now,

They have the best players by far, someone mention Nasri and Fabrigas at Arsenal, Drogba, Lampard at Chelsea, the likes of Berbatov and Rooney at Man Utd, Modric and Bale at Spurs. The list goes on and on.

Real Madrid: Casillas, Ramos, Kaka, Ronaldo, Alonso, Hihuain, di Maria, Ozil

Barca: Daniel Alves, David Villa, Iniesta, Messi, Busquets, Xavi

can anyone honestly say that postition wise any players from the prem are better??

Rooney or Messi? Messi

Fabrigas or Xavi? Xavi

Bale or Ronaldo? Ronaldo

[Portland Bill]

I don't understand how Man U can have the best away fans in England, but Old Trafford always seems dull. Surely their away fans are all season ticket holders?

Probably because it's all Mancs who go away,whereas at home it's full of Cornish,Cockneys,Japs,scandanavians etc etc!

[dezgimed]

I can't believe people are deluded enough to think the gulf in class isn't much.

I'm sure Man U would go and get beat at Ipswich and Derby year after year.

Remember that Man U reject Eagles, who pissed over the league with Burnley?

Or JET the Arsenal reserve player who scored 2 and embarrassed us at home last season?

Just an example!